Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: JamesV6CDX on 27 January 2017, 21:35:32
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I've created this thread to record and share the progress of my BMW 530 repair, mainly in pictures.
I must start by saying that I don't have any experience of working on BMW's whatsoever, I don't have so much as a Haynes book, and am working from instinct only - so sorry if anything I write is wrong - and don't rely on it being correct!
The car is my trusty W plate 2000 e39 BMW 530d with 175,000 on the clock. It's the 3 litre straight 6 commonrail diesel.
The turbo began whining a few weeks ago, it's got steadily worse, and the turbo is now throwing oil into the inlet at quite a rate, so it's had to be taken off the road for repair.
Yes most folk are saying just scrap it, but A) It's an absolutely solid car, I've spent a lot on getting suspension etc up to scratch, and I think it's worth saving. It makes more financial sense to spend, say £500 fixing it, as opposed to buying a replacement with a whole list of unknowns.
Additionally, I need a challenge, and to broaden my mechanical horizons away from Omegas, and learn new things. And I've nothing to lose by learning on this one!
The problem with the car, is the turbo. The project is to strip stuff down, replace the turbo with a new one, and also the exhaust manifold whilst it's stripped, and to carry out a swirl flap removal procedure. I also at the same time will investigate why it's losing coolant. (It never overheats).
So, armed with a toolbox I opened the bonnet, and was faced with something that looked like this. (Note, this is a stock photo, as I forgot to take a picture before removing the engine cover. Apart from the first one, all other pictures are mine, taken today:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/01.jpg)
Then, I removed the cosmetic engine cover, and it looked like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/1.jpg)
Next step was to remove the inlet manifold, which needs to come off for both the exhaust manifold change, and in order to change the swirl flaps. Note the kitchen roll in all of the inlet ports. You have to be very careful getting the manifold off, because there are several rubber washers mounted on the underside of it, with metal inserts, that can easily fall into the inlet ports. Note the kitchen roll in the inlets, as soon as I had access to them:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/2.jpg)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/3.jpg)
Next step was the removal of the pipe which goes from the air filter assembly to the turbo. The job of this pipe is to carry ambient air after it's been through the air filter, to the turbo, ready for cooling and compressing:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/4.jpg)
Next, off with the charge pipe, which carries compressed air from the turbo, into the intercooler:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/5.jpg)
Now, I remove the radiator cowling and viscious fan. I don't think this is scrictly necessary, but for five minutes work it seemed like a good idea to get much better access to stuff. I found that by removing the two turbo pipes first, I could let my viscious spanner rest against the metal casing of the vacuum pump, which then nicely locked the water pump and gave me two hands to grunt off the fan (The thread of which is reverse to most bolts):
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/6.jpg)
This is the offside cabin filter, needed to remove the air filter assembly and rocker cover:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/7.jpg)
Now all of that rubbish is out of the way - we can start to at least see the turbo, and where it lives:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/9.jpg)
Next job is to remove the top cover for the air filter, as below. Just a few alan key type bolts, and it lifted off:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/10.jpg)
And with the cover removed, you now see the air filter:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/11.jpg)
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And, here is the view with the air filter removed. If you look carefully, there are three rubber bungs at the bottom, which begin to provide access to the three male spline bolts which hold the turbo to the manifold:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/12.jpg)
And here is the view, with the rubber bungs removed:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/14.jpg)
Close up:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/13.jpg)
There is then a metal heatsheild under the holes, which just clips in. When this heatsheild is removed, it looks like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/16.jpg)
Now, you COULD if you were just changing the turbo, drop the catalytic converter, a few pipes and clips, and you'd have access to remove the turbo from below.
In my case, however, I am also changing the exhaust manifold, because I am convinced it's cracked (common issue looking at forums).
What this means, is that I have to do further work to get to the manifold bolts, as follows.
Firstly unclip the electrical connectors to each of the 6 diesel injectors, and rest the loom out of the way, like so:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/17.jpg)
Then remove the diesel leak off pipes from each of the injectors, like so. You can just unclip it from each injector, and remove it as one, to make things easier and tidier. Also rest this, out of the way:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/18.jpg)
Now we have to remove the High Pressure fuel rail (known also as the "common rail" - where this type of diesel engine gets it's name)
Just undo the unions to each injector, and the one union on the high pressure fuel pump, which feeds the rail. There are then three 6mm Alan key bolts, and the rail lifts away as such:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/19.jpg)
Then, you have to remove all six diesel injectors, before you can remove the rocker cover.
To do this, there is an mm nut either side of the injector. Once you undo these, the injector will usually just wiggle out. Gently remove it, and you will be faced with this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/20.jpg)
It's important to realise that the nozzles on these injectors are VERY fragile and the slightest knock will render it useless, same for dirt ingress. Therefore it's important to protect it, and put it somewhere safe, as soon as it's removed, before you move on to the others.
I placed mine in sandwich bags, like so:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/21.jpg)
I actually found that my rocker cover was leaking into the number 5 injector orifice, which was full of oil as a result, in the same way Omega ones fail.
I had a complication in as much as, injector 6 is stuck solid (all the others came out without much fuss). It's currently soaking in a bath of plus-gas, and I'll replenish this a few times before a further attempt to remove.
This took me the best part of the day - it would have usually only taken me a couple of hours, but I stopped at the point my back told me to.
I'm not complaining about this, I feel blessed that I can still tinker, even if it's much more slowly :y
More updates to follow next time I fancy working on it again. Thankfully there is no rush, having the Omega.
Going for a bath and a beer :y
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I'm glad that you are taking it gently, James, but don't wait for your back to tell you when to stop - it might be too late by then! PLEASE stop earlier than that and rest well before starting again. We don't want to lose you..... :)
Ron.
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Think you,ve done well to get so far. :y
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The car is a keeper. It's the longest I've had any car in my life, I can't bear to part with it.
So I might tackle the timing chain(s), given the mileage :-X :-X
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You forgot to mention that the diesel injectors are coded to the ecu and it's critical they go back where they came from ;)
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The car is a keeper. It's the longest I've had any car in my life, I can't bear to part with it.
So I might tackle the timing chain(s), given the mileage :-X :-X
If they use plastic lined guides in this engine (as they do in the petrol of this vintage) then you might have to. They're brittle as pensioners bones at 16yrs old :(
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You forgot to mention that the diesel injectors are coded to the ecu and it's critical they go back where they came from ;)
See the numbers, on the bags ;)
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You forgot to mention that the diesel injectors are coded to the ecu and it's critical they go back where they came from ;)
See the numbers, on the bags ;)
I did. But someone who actually needs this useful guide because they don't already know might appreciate the heads up ;)
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You forgot to mention that the diesel injectors are coded to the ecu and it's critical they go back where they came from ;)
See the numbers, on the bags ;)
I did. But someone who actually needs this useful guide because they don't already know might appreciate the heads up ;)
Fair enough, although the disclaimer at the top did say nothing I write can be relied on ;D This isn't so much of a guide, more of a blog at how I'm getting on :y
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And, re coding - my understanding was, the later (E60) BMW 530d with the same M57 engine (but slightly later engine management) had to have the injectors individually coded.... and there is a number on each injector, which defines the factory parameters, and is needed to program the ECU...
Whereas, on the older e39 like mine - the injectors are all DDE4, and all that's required if an injector is swapped is a "reset of adaptation values" in IPNA?
That's what most of the forums suggest anyhow :-\
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And, re coding - my understanding was, the later (E60) BMW 530d with the same M57 engine (but slightly later engine management) had to have the injectors individually coded.... and there is a number on each injector, which defines the factory parameters, and is needed to program the ECU...
Whereas, on the older e39 like mine - the injectors are all DDE4, and all that's required if an injector is swapped is a "reset of adaptation values" in IPNA?
That's what most of the forums suggest anyhow :-\
Do ya gots INPA? :D No, well put it back where you found it then. Just like you were gonna anyway :)
In all seriousness, I wasn't criticising. Just adding what is obvious to us but may not be obvious to others. Sods law will dictate it will play up if mixed up and waste half a day over something that *shouldn't* matter.
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And, re coding - my understanding was, the later (E60) BMW 530d with the same M57 engine (but slightly later engine management) had to have the injectors individually coded.... and there is a number on each injector, which defines the factory parameters, and is needed to program the ECU...
Whereas, on the older e39 like mine - the injectors are all DDE4, and all that's required if an injector is swapped is a "reset of adaptation values" in IPNA?
That's what most of the forums suggest anyhow :-\
Do ya gots INPA? :D No, well put it back where you found it then. Just like you were gonna anyway :)
In all seriousness, I wasn't criticising. Just adding what is obvious to us but may not be obvious to others. Sods law will dictate it will play up if mixed up and waste half a day over something that *shouldn't* matter.
I have access to INPA :y
I do totally agree with you, though. The reason I asked the question, is because no6 is stuck as a stuck thing, and should anything happen to it during removal, and I have to get a replacement, I want to know where I stand coding wise :y
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Number 6 injector is now out :y
Reason it was such a pain: water ingress. Had pretty much rusted itself to the chamber inside the head.
Does anyone know what the water jacket layout is like on this car?
I'm struggling to believe it's possible but there appears to be coolant seepage around the head to block join
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There's a pressurised heat exchanger across the bulkhead, could it have seeped down to the head/block :-\
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Number 6 injector is now out :y
Reason it was such a pain: water ingress. Had pretty much rusted itself to the chamber inside the head.
Does anyone know what the water jacket layout is like on this car?
I'm struggling to believe it's possible but there appears to be coolant seepage around the head to block join
Well if you google "head gasket 530d" their is a distinct lack of results, so I'm guessing that of all the things to go wrong on this engine (swirl flaps/the three fuel pumps etc) the headgasket isn't a common one :-\
Can't even find an image of the block of an e39 530d quickly.
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Bit more work today.
Firstly I removed the seized injector on number 6, annoyingly it had to be the one right at the back. This sounds like a quick job but it actually took up most of my time, because it was still solid (despite an overnight bath in plusgas) - but I got there.
Next job was removal of the rocker cover - at which point, the engine bay looked a bit like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/1.jpg)
Here we also get a first glimps of the timing chain:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/2.jpg)
Once the rocker cover was off, next job was to remove the turbo itself. I started by removing the vacuum tank and actuator (not pictured). I then had to remove the turbo oil feed and return lines and a couple of brackets, and it was ready to unbolt.
The removed turbo looks like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/4.jpg)
And with the turbo removed, the engine bay now looks like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/3.jpg)
Next job - remove the exhaust manifold. Total of 12 M8 fastners, 6 up top, 6 underneith. All easily accessible with a deep socket on a short 3/8 extention bar.
These were quite tight, and it involved bending around to get to them all, so again this took me ages compared to what it usually would have - but I got there.
With the exhaust manifold removed, we are now getting quite a bit of space in the engine bay:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/5.jpg)
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Looking into the turbo from the exhaust side, there is far too much play in the shaft, and as per the pic below, you can see one of the blades has chipped off - (i'd imagine it's hit the casing, as a result of the excess play).
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/day2/6.jpg)
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That engine mount looks like it's seen better days eh. :(
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That engine mount looks like it's seen better days eh. :(
Shhhhhhh!!!
This is the problem when one goes digging in their engine bay on such an old car .... :-X ;D
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That engine mount looks like it's seen better days eh. :(
Shhhhhhh!!!
This is the problem when one goes digging in their engine bay on such an old car .... :-X ;D
;D ;D Don't worry, she didn't hear me. Denial isn't just a river in egypt James ;) :D
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That engine mount looks like it's seen better days eh. :(
Shhhhhhh!!!
This is the problem when one goes digging in their engine bay on such an old car .... :-X ;D
Yeah... things can... escalate... quite quickly. One minute you're wiping oil off the filler cap then this happens... ;D
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt133/011011011/Disco%20V8%20aka%20Aurora/20170127_161330_zpseyips5h1.jpg)
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Yeah... things can... escalate... quite quickly. One minute you're wiping oil off the filler cap then this happens... ;D
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt133/011011011/Disco%20V8%20aka%20Aurora/20170127_161330_zpseyips5h1.jpg)
It's a Rover, so you must have known the camshaft was knackered before you removed the oil filler cap?
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LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!! James, save me a seat in Denial ;D ;D
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LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!! James, save me a seat in Denial ;D ;D
;D
Ref the engine mount, they are vacuum controlled, and having just had a look at a closer-up pic, it's not split, it's like there is an inner / outer section to it, with water sitting on the rim between the two, which may give the impression it's split...
How's that for denial? :-*
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LA LA LA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!! James, save me a seat in Denial ;D ;D
;D
Ref the engine mount, they are vacuum controlled, and having just had a look at a closer-up pic, it's not split, it's like there is an inner / outer section to it, with water sitting on the rim between the two, which may give the impression it's split...
How's that for denial? :-*
meehhhhh. I'll get ya... there's a long way to go yet :) ;D
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:y
On a serious note, I am considering taking the head off. Everything is very badly coked up, I think a de-coke, and a relap of the valves, and a new set of chains and guides, would go a long way for this car
Interestingly, it looks like you can replace the two timing chain tensioners without having to actually remove the outer timing cover, as there are access holes to put the tools in, etc, and the guides come out from the top. Seems like a bodge to me though, as you can't get the chain out this way, and, If replacing some parts, , I'd replace all.
That said, and I know you can't tell something strength by looking, but the chain and guides all look and feel fine.
Only timing chain's I've done from memory are 1.2 Corsa and 1.2 Fabia, of 2003 era!
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Anyone think the missing bit off the blade is where the whistle's coming from?
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Anyone think the missing bit off the blade is where the whistle's coming from?
No. I'm thinking 'where is it?" ;D
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I misread.
It's in the exhaust ;D
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Anyone think the missing bit off the blade is where the whistle's coming from?
Probably
It is what knackered turbos do (whistle). I thought it was more to do with the blades scraping around inside the casing than any fancy aerodynamics though :-\
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:y
On a serious note, I am considering taking the head off. Everything is very badly coked up, I think a de-coke, and a relap of the valves, and a new set of chains and guides, would go a long way for this car
Interestingly, it looks like you can replace the two timing chain tensioners without having to actually remove the outer timing cover, as there are access holes to put the tools in, etc, and the guides come out from the top. Seems like a bodge to me though, as you can't get the chain out this way, and, If replacing some parts, , I'd replace all.
That said, and I know you can't tell something strength by looking, but the chain and guides all look and feel fine.
Only timing chain's I've done from memory are 1.2 Corsa and 1.2 Fabia, of 2003 era!
If you're going to get ya know... anal... about it (and it seems you are ;) )... you might want to drop the sump and check the the oil pump chain is tight. My 740 top chains were relatively tight (despite afor mentioned plastic guides emmigrating to the sump), however the oil pump chain had an inch of play side to side. I doubt it could have ever skipped a tooth/fallen off, but it must have been rattly as all frig.
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Currently on hold awaiting arrival of the timing setting / locking kit
Need to also give my neck chance to recover. *
*I didn't overdo it. I passed out in an awkward position on the sofa after rolling in pissed ;D
Definitely going to do a top-end decoke. Can't decide whether to change the chains or not.
I'm not sure I can justify the several hundreds in bits for items which are meant to be lifetime components and appear fine.
I'd also have to either pull the engine out, or drop the subframe to do the job.
Cylinder head has to come off to change chains, looking at workshop manuals
I can get a helper (which I will need to cope with lifting the head on and off and torquing the bolts) so I have to now factor my physical (loss of) ability :(
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Currently on hold awaiting arrival of the timing setting / locking kit
Need to also give my neck chance to recover. *
*I didn't overdo it. I passed out in an awkward position on the sofa after rolling in pissed ;D
Definitely going to do a top-end decoke. Can't decide whether to change the chains or not.
I'm not sure I can justify the several hundreds in bits for items which are meant to be lifetime components and appear fine.
I'd also have to either pull the engine out, or drop the subframe to do the job.
Cylinder head has to come off to change chains, looking at workshop manuals
I can get a helper (which I will need to cope with lifting the head on and off and torquing the bolts) so I have to now factor my physical (loss of) ability :(
In the words of john mcenroe... you cannot be serious?! :o
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Radiator out, two bolts, and you can almost stand at the front of the engine... Access should be fine unless the anti roll bar fouls the bottom pulley :-\
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Radiator out, two bolts, and you can almost stand at the front of the engine... Access should be fine unless the anti roll bar fouls the bottom pulley :-\
That is exactly what I thought, by looking at it! :y
The manuals all bang on about the need to remove the sump, though, which doesn't clear unless engine lifted quite a bit / subframe dropped :(
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Aside of more basic jobs such as swirl flaps, etc, there doesn't seem to be a great amount of people undertaking major DIY on these engines, most of the posts on the forums are from folk asking about what are the best garages to use, etc.
I felt reasonably confident working on it, but I hope I wasn't overestimating my abilities, and that I haven't bitten off more than I can chew :-\
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Aside of more basic jobs such as swirl flaps, etc, there doesn't seem to be a great amount of people undertaking major DIY on these engines, most of the posts on the forums are from folk asking about what are the best garages to use, etc.
I felt reasonably confident working on it, but I hope I wasn't overestimating my abilities, and that I haven't bitten off more than I can chew :-\
I hope you have a good memory for putting it back together. Lord only knows how many spare parts I'm gonna have from the 740 when it finally gets reassembled after 6 months in bits :-\
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James great to see you back in the swing of things after what happened :y most people wouldn't undertake jobs like this at all....let alone doing it injured :y
You've gone a lot further in to bimmer engine work than I have. Though I have replaced a turbo on one. That stupid little heat shield below the air box just would not clip back in for me >:( ;D I can't remember if it was the bimmer turbo or summat else but I remember one being a bitch to line up with the holes and getting the gasket to sit in right. :-\
Clutches are easy on these though ;D
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Radiator out, two bolts, and you can almost stand at the front of the engine... Access should be fine unless the anti roll bar fouls the bottom pulley :-\
That is exactly what I thought, by looking at it! :y
The manuals all bang on about the need to remove the sump, though, which doesn't clear unless engine lifted quite a bit / subframe dropped :(
I am at this point with mine... sump gasket needs renewing. In your case, I would pull and refit the head (if you're still doing that), then support the engine whilst dropping the subframe for clearance. No point actually pulling the engine, as that would involve dropping the exhaust and gearbox... unless you really want to ;) If you need the sump off for chain access, then so be it :-\
If, however, they're saying sump off in order to remove the oil pump, then I suggest this...
Undo and remove the front six/eight sump bolts, then remove the oil pump/front cover, same as you can on an Omega ;)
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Radiator out, two bolts, and you can almost stand at the front of the engine... Access should be fine unless the anti roll bar fouls the bottom pulley :-\
That is exactly what I thought, by looking at it! :y
The manuals all bang on about the need to remove the sump, though, which doesn't clear unless engine lifted quite a bit / subframe dropped :(
I am at this point with mine... sump gasket needs renewing. In your case, I would pull and refit the head (if you're still doing that), then support the engine whilst dropping the subframe for clearance. No point actually pulling the engine, as that would involve dropping the exhaust and gearbox... unless you really want to ;) If you need the sump off for chain access, then so be it :-\
If, however, they're saying sump off in order to remove the oil pump, then I suggest this...
Undo and remove the front six/eight sump bolts, then remove the oil pump/front cover, same as you can on an Omega ;)
Al, we have clearly been thinking along the same lines! :)
Looking at forums, the box can come out attached to the engine, so it's just prop / etc to come off, without the need to separate the tranny.
I guess I'll cross the bridges as I come to them. I'm wondering if going to these lengths just to replace a chain that may not need replacing, and cost £400, is actually a pointless exercise....
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At least the slam panel comes away, making light work of actually getting the engine out ;) relatively speaking...
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You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
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You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
As per the opening post... it's largely a learning experience for me to broaden my skills and confidence. What better way to practice than on old car which I own, owes me nothing, with nothing to lose :y
It's for those reasons, and my enjoyment, as opposed to need :y
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You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
Where are you going to find a better one these days? They're 17yrs old... they'll all be the same or made into bean cans by now :(
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You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
Where are you going to find a better one these days? They're 17yrs old... they'll all be the same or made into bean cans by now :(
I meant to say... I don't want a newer e61. I like the e39. And mines as good an example as you'll find for its age.
I want to keep this one. So I don't think considering changing the timing gear on a 175k mile car, whilst I have the chance to do so, is tooooo mad... certainly no more unstable than I usually am ;D :y
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You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
Where are you going to find a better one these days? They're 17yrs old... they'll all be the same or made into bean cans by now :(
I meant to say... I don't want a newer e61. I like the e39. And mines as good an example as you'll find for its age.
I want to keep this one. So I don't think considering changing the timing gear on a 175k mile car, whilst I have the chance to do so, is tooooo mad... certainly no more unstable than I usually am ;D :y
The mad part will be lifting an astonishingly heavy engine above head height to get it out of the car and then trying to drag it into your warm dry garage to work on it ;)
I have an engine crane and stand you are quite welcome to borrow (but you might be able to find something a bit closer to home..........)
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Sump only needs to clear the lower crossmember ;)
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I hope you have a good memory for putting it back together. Lord only knows how many spare parts I'm gonna have from the 740 when it finally gets reassembled after 6 months in bits :-\
I put my 300ZX back together (front end of the engine - cam pulleys, timing belt, covers, cooling system, intake etc) after more like 6 years in bits and still managed to not end up with bits left over - I was amazed..
You're mad turning a turbo change(which, even on something as horrible to work on as a BMW, is basically a service job on an old diesel) into a costly engine out strip-down. Bear in mind that the straight sixes are huge and heavy things to deal with when not in a car.
Bung a turbo on it, and drive the thing. Or put the money and time into a better one.
What he said - there's keen and there's keen .. and I get that it's a learning exercise while you're recovering, but I can't help feel there are better ways to mess with that kind of thing in a simpler easier environment than trying to haul 300Kg of straight six out of an E39..
Still, more power to you and good luck! :y
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That engine mount looks like it's seen better days eh. :(
Shhhhhhh!!!
This is the problem when one goes digging in their engine bay on such an old car .... :-X ;D
Yeah... things can... escalate... quite quickly. One minute you're wiping oil off the filler cap then this happens... ;D
(http://i605.photobucket.com/albums/tt133/011011011/Disco%20V8%20aka%20Aurora/20170127_161330_zpseyips5h1.jpg)
Standard, the timing chain will be stretched, the timing gears will be worn, the camshaft will be worn, the followers will be worn and chances are the head gaskets are blowing into the valley....
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Nope. It's all fine. They like not having their oil changed in god knows how many years. It's good for them. 8) < rose tinted spectacles FIRMLY ON ;)
I'm contemplating inspecting the timing gear... can't figure how to lock the crank pulley to undo the bolt though. Suggestions?
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Nope. It's all fine. They like not having their oil changed in god knows how many years. It's good for them. 8) < rose tinted spectacles FIRMLY ON ;)
I'm contemplating inspecting the timing gear... can't figure how to lock the crank pulley to undo the bolt though. Suggestions?
Jam a hefty bit of wood between a crank journal and the crankcase. Apply an impact wrench to the bolt. Loosen the flywheel/flex plate bolts while you're at it.
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Standard, the timing chain will be stretched, the timing gears will be worn, the camshaft will be worn, the followers will be worn and chances are the head gaskets are blowing into the valley....
Looks like a late block minus the outside row of head bolts, so there's a chance the head gasket is OK, at least.. maybe? ;D
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Standard, the timing chain will be stretched, the timing gears will be worn, the camshaft will be worn, the followers will be worn and chances are the head gaskets are blowing into the valley....
Looks like a late block minus the outside row of head bolts, so there's a chance the head gasket is OK, at least.. maybe? ;D
.. in which case it got that shitty without the aid of any exhaust gases. :o
Then again, that piston in No. 7 look suspiciously clean... ::)
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Standard, the timing chain will be stretched, the timing gears will be worn, the camshaft will be worn, the followers will be worn and chances are the head gaskets are blowing into the valley....
Looks like a late block minus the outside row of head bolts, so there's a chance the head gasket is OK, at least.. maybe? ;D
Trouble is they went composite on the Thors so they rot out instead of being unevenly clamped.......you fix one bit, you screw the other up.....its the 'Over' way on the V8
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Nope. It's all fine. They like not having their oil changed in god knows how many years. It's good for them. 8) < rose tinted spectacles FIRMLY ON ;)
I'm contemplating inspecting the timing gear... can't figure how to lock the crank pulley to undo the bolt though. Suggestions?
Jam a hefty bit of wood between a crank journal and the crankcase. Apply an impact wrench to the bolt. Loosen the flywheel/flex plate bolts while you're at it.
Yep or fab up a bit of bent metal to lock the flywheel having removed the starter.
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Would it be possible for an Admin to un-threadjack James's thread and move this into a new thread purlease? :-*
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Having considered, I'm going for a half way house. I will slowly work through a de coke and rebuild of the top end, (all pretty straightforward) but, I'm not doing the chains. It's a disproportionate amount of money to spend on the parts, and I feel I'm not yet at the point in my recovery I would cope with heavier work.
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Not too much work lately. Been busy with medical appointments and such and the weather has been grim.
I noticed that the no5 glow plug was broken off (not my doing) - that'll account for why I've always had a "glow device" fault code, then!
This has confirmed my decision to pull the head off, having got this far, as I will also sort this out at the same time and fit a set of 6 new glow plugs.
I bought a locking kit for this engine. It's simply a case of locking the flywheel at TDC using a pin (I say simply, it's a bastard to locate it!) - and then fitting a tool over the cams to which must sit flush with the head. You can then remove the top chain guide, rotate the exhaust camshaft carefully clockwise a small amount to release tension, and insert another pin into the tensioner in order to lock it off.
Here we are with the sprockets off, and camshafts out:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/chain.jpg)
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I should have added - before removal and refitting of cams, it's necessary to turn the crank back 45 degrees to make certain you don't get any piston / valve contact :y
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(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/1.jpg)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/2.jpg)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/3.jpg)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/4.jpg)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/5.jpg)
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Get some wd40 on those cams :P
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Not too much work lately. Been busy with medical appointments and such and the weather has been grim.
I noticed that the no5 glow plug was broken off (not my doing) - that'll account for why I've always had a "glow device" fault code, then!
This has confirmed my decision to pull the head off, having got this far, as I will also sort this out at the same time and fit a set of 6 new glow plugs.
I bought a locking kit for this engine. It's simply a case of locking the flywheel at TDC using a pin (I say simply, it's a bastard to locate it!) - and then fitting a tool over the cams to which must sit flush with the head. You can then remove the top chain guide, rotate the exhaust camshaft carefully clockwise a small amount to release tension, and insert another pin into the tensioner in order to lock it off.
Here we are with the sprockets off, and camshafts out:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/chain.jpg)
No time for that, James, get on with the car. ;D
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Get some wd40 on those cams :P
I'll give them a good clean up over the weekend :y
STEMO, sometimes, a man has needs ;D
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Get some wd40 on those cams :P
I'll give them a good clean up over the weekend :y
STEMO, sometimes, a man has needs ;D
It isn't a clean they need - they need industrial strength rust protection.
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(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/headoff/4.jpg)
Are those bearing caps numbered? or otherwise marked so that they go back in their original locations?
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Are those bearing caps numbered? or otherwise marked so that they go back in their original locations?
Of course
Caps are all marked A for Exhaust, and E for Inlet, and number 1 onwards, from the timing chain end.
It's essential they go back in their original places / rotation
You say industrial rust protection - what you can see, wipes off with an oily rag. A quick clean up and they will be fine, especially once back in action.
I am however going to paint them in clean engine oil or similar to protect them, whilst the car is apart.
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Apparently this stuff is ideal for rust protection, James: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/112175365860
Haven't tried it (yet) myself but intend to get some for the lathes that are sat out in the garage.
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Best thing to do with cams while they're out of the car is oil / WD40 them and wrap them in greaseproof paper or cling film. You don't want surface rust to damage the thin hardened surface as they will then wear rapidly.
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Thanks chaps will do :y
Broken off glow plug is proving a mare >:(
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Get it running quickly James, as there's talk of a generous scrappage scheme for older diesels! :)
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Get it running quickly James, as there's talk of a generous scrappage scheme for older diesels! :)
They can prise the keys to my 20mpg Omega, and sooty old straight 6 diesel, from my cold dead fingers ;D >:(
Went to machine shop with the head today.
£250 to extract the glow plugs with 80% success rate. One came out ok. One was already broken clean off before I touched it. And the other 4 just span by hand and the hex nuts broken from the plug at the base
Someone's been in there before :(
Alternatively found a head with 30day guarantee from a low mileage 2002 model for £120 :-\
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Only one outcome there then... ;)
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Only one outcome there then... ;)
Yeah scrappage! :D
Given that I paid £900 for my 530d, I'm going to be watching developments on any scrappage scheme for old diesels with interest! :y
Other than that though I've no plans to get rid. Which is why I'm following Jame's thread with interest! :y
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Only one outcome there then... ;)
Agreed mate, it's on order :y
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I'm following this with real interest-and I own neither a diesel or a BMW!Things like this just fascinate me,I really must get out more ;D
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Only one outcome there then... ;)
Yes, swap it for a proper car with spark plugs. ;)
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So my "as new" head arrived. I had no doubts as to it's condition as it was from a breaker with lots of 100% feedback and glowing reviews. It arrived next day, well packaged, and upon a quick look, looked fine. I had utter confidence. Today was "fitment" day, and I had someone over to help lift it on.
So gave the head a good clean, and once I started looking properly at the mating faces, I was faced with this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/pitting1.jpg)
Upon examination a swirl flap screw on the Donor car, has dropped into ports 5 and 6, and also on one of the others, and has been banging around causing damage to the face of the combustion area in the head. It's confined to within the fire rings.
Here are the two most damaged combustion areas:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/5and6.jpg)
You can tell it's a swirl flap screw, look at this one - you can see the shape !!
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/swirlflapscrews.jpg)
And this one:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/swirlflapscrews2.jpg)
I turned the cams and inspected the valve seats with a light with the valves open. The LOOKED ok but but this didn't convince me.
I poured petrol into the inlet ports, and, on pots 5 and 6, (with cams out, so valves closed) and it immediately emptied the contents straight out of the valves. Bugger. Can't fit that in a million years.
Contacted seller. Full refund given, no questions asked, once I gave them the pictures.
I then decided to remove all the valves in the head, so I could closely inspect the seats and see if it can be salvaged
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/valvesout.jpg)
A couple of the inlet valves were ever so slightly bent which confirms the foreign object theory.
The seats LOOK ok.
The plan is to TRY and make one good head from the two. Nothing to lose given that it's free. So I'm going to really thoroughly grind in the valves from the old head, which are known good, into the new one. And then do the paraffin test again, to see if they are making a good seal.
Watch this space
Interestingly the new HG has arrived. It's huge!!
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/newhg.jpg)
And..... here's some valves!
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/head/valves.jpg)
I should say the valve guides feel ok, no slop etc.
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Niiiiccceeee. Breakers. So called because if it isn't already broken, they'll kindly oblige for an exorbitant fee. >:(
Just finished re-seating the valves on the LR V8. Bloody boring job.
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So long as the valves seat correctly I wouldn't worry about the surface pitting
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Niiiiccceeee. Breakers. So called because if it isn't already broken, they'll kindly oblige for an exorbitant fee. >:(
Just finished re-seating the valves on the LR V8. Bloody boring job.
You needed some tools:
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/zy7aw5pjveoii0n/CylinderHeadTools%5B1%5D.jpg?dl=1)
That's an oscillating lapping tool between a pair of cylinder head stands.
You put the head in the stands with the valves facing up, drop all of them into the correct holes with a healthy smear of coarse paste on the seats, and give each valve 30 seconds with the lapping tool in a small cordless drill. Pull the valves, and if you have a nice even seat on each one repeat the process with fine paste. Takes less than 10 minutes per head including flushing the remains of the paste with your favourite solvent.
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I'm going to have to walk away from this for a bit.
I just realised I didn't really enjoy any of what I did today. It felt like a chore.
Not that anyone enjoys removing 48 valves ::)
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Why oh why do BMW still have this swerl flap problem, I love the way the pistons carried on with the screw in the bore, I wonder how many miles it's been like that?
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Niiiiccceeee. Breakers. So called because if it isn't already broken, they'll kindly oblige for an exorbitant fee. >:(
Just finished re-seating the valves on the LR V8. Bloody boring job.
You needed some tools:
That's an oscillating lapping tool between a pair of cylinder head stands.
You put the head in the stands with the valves facing up, drop all of them into the correct holes with a healthy smear of coarse paste on the seats, and give each valve 30 seconds with the lapping tool in a small cordless drill. Pull the valves, and if you have a nice even seat on each one repeat the process with fine paste. Takes less than 10 minutes per head including flushing the remains of the paste with your favourite solvent.
Yeah. I tried using neodynium magnets to ease the tedium of the suction cup coming loose, along with a cordless drill. If I had to do it again or regularly I'd invest in the proper toolage. Didn't help that some of them were miles from seated. Factory build quality or careless rebuild previously or some other variable... I'm not sure.
Love the freezer / workbench hybrid with customised handle btw :)
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Yeah. I tried using neodymium magnets to ease the tedium of the suction cup coming loose, along with a cordless drill. If I had to do it again or regularly I'd invest in the proper toolage. Didn't help that some of them were miles from seated. Factory build quality or careless rebuild previously or some other variable... I'm not sure.
Love the freezer / workbench hybrid with customised handle btw :)
I scrape the valve clean in the lathe, and polish the heads with coarse scotchbrite. That makes the sucker a lot more effective.
The freezer is about 35 years old, and the plastic handle was broken for years. That handle is the second thing I made when I got my first lathe. I wish I had rounded the ends off the posts ::)
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Yes that would be a better methodology. I was messing about cleaning the valve sealing faces with a brass filament wire brush and cleaning the face with sandpaper. Had I cleaned the shit off the valve seats rather than grinding it off it would have been easier.
That freezer is going to make an excellent horror film prop one day ;D
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Those screw imprints are awesome.
On the head gasket I've got a feeling they need to be matched to the head. There's something about a number of holes in the gasket and on the head.
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Those screw imprints are awesome.
On the head gasket I've got a feeling they need to be matched to the head. There's something about a number of holes in the gasket and on the head.
Yep, got that covered, thanks mate :y
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Been away a few days, and today went to help a member with a cambelt issue, so not much recent progress.
I have, however, now lapped in all of the 24 valves, from the old head, to the new one. I have closely inspected all of the guides. The stems run well in them, with no slop or sticking.
Having lapped in the valves, the seats and valve faces all look fine, too.
Next step is to fit them all. I can't decide whether to buy a special tool to make light work of fitting the collets, or, whether to use a small magnetic screwdriver and a dab of grease ::)
Usually wouldn't hesitate, but not much access to the top of the valve stem once the spring compressor is in situ.....
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Been away a few days, and today went to help a member with a cambelt issue, so not much recent progress.
I have, however, now lapped in all of the 24 valves, from the old head, to the new one. I have closely inspected all of the guides. The stems run well in them, with no slop or sticking.
Having lapped in the valves, the seats and valve faces all look fine, too.
Next step is to fit them all. I can't decide whether to buy a special tool to make light work of fitting the collets, or, whether to use a small magnetic screwdriver and a dab of grease ::)
Usually wouldn't hesitate, but not much access to the top of the valve stem once the spring compressor is in situ.....
https://youtu.be/-zvH7xiU0KQ (https://youtu.be/-zvH7xiU0KQ)
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Ok, so - I fitted the 12 replacement inlet valves I had lapped in. I did the paraffin test again, and some were still leaking - nowhere near the waterfall it was before, but, still far from satisfactory, at least 6 of them had seepage from the valves, with the inlet ports full of paraffin.
It's taken me literally ages, carefully re lapping each one with fine paste. I've gone for the "fit the collets with a small screwdriver and some grease approach" which takes a few minutes per valve, but at least doesn't cost in toolage.
I now have a 100% tight valve seal on all of the 12 inlet valves, and the first exhaust valve, but I had to stop there, the back wouldn't cope with any more lifting and moving the big old straight 6 head, operating the spring compressor etc.
Bit fed up with it again (and depressed at how long stuff like this takes me now) so walking away until Tuesday for a long weekend.
On a bright note, if I can get the exhaust valves to all seal in the same way the inlet ones (finally) have - I'll have a bloody good, free head, aside of elbow grease and grinding paste!
I guess I should have realised valves that have covered 175,000 miles might take some lapping into a foreign head.
I will not settle for anything other than a 100% tight seal on each one, given the lengths I've already gone to with this car :y
Pics to follow :)
Ps - lesson of the day - don't use coarse paste, on a modern ali head. After some careful lapping with that, the leakage was worse than before. It's only the fine paste, and some time and carefulness, that's allowing them to seat correctly. I think the coarse grade is too abrasive for modern heads.......
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Sorry for the lack of updates, I've had a lot of other stuff going on so this has been low on the list.
I finally got all the valves to seat. An overnight leak tests showed them all tight. The only way I could get it to work was some really gentle cutting with fine paste.
Here is the finished valve job with 24 clean valves, and the head, valve areas etc nicely de coked (note final clean on the head not yet done)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/1.jpg)
Here's the (huge) gasket ready to accept the head
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/2.jpg)
And here's the head, resting in place, nice and shiny
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/3.jpg)
and with the bolts loosely fitted:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/4.jpg)
Lifters, rockers, camshafts, sprockets all fitted. Timing all set and chain fitted and tensioned:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/5.jpg)
New turbo ready to be fitted (and an afternoon beverage for me)
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/6.jpg)
Exhaust manifold in place with new gaskets / studs, and turbo fitted. Note the EGR blanking plate. Heatsheild also to follow:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/7.jpg)
Rocker cover fitted, along new gasket, also refitted the vacuum pump, injectors x 6, high pressure fuel rail, associated pipes and connectors, leakoff pipes, airbox, etc blah blah
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/9.jpg)
New thermostat fitted and both serpentine belts replaced for new contitech items:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/8.jpg)
Inlet manifold, ready to refit. Note I had just removed all the swirl flaps and installed blanking plates in their place to prevent any future failures. Actuator and vacuum pipework still left in place to fool ECU into thinking flaps still present, and thus not log a code. Inlet manifold now fitted (not pictured) and all new bosch glow plugs fitted with a smear of copperslip.
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/10.jpg)
A whole load of stuff, such as viscous fan and cowling, coolant hoses, vacuum hoses, charge and intake pipes, and all the fiddly shite - oh and the pretty covers etc, resulted in a look something like this:
(http://www.uk-chat.co.uk/bmw/final/11.jpg)
Also full of fresh oil and coolant.
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But does it start and run? :D ;D
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Well done mate, excellent job, especially under the circumstances :y :y :y :y
BTW at 20:32 the video is shown as not available
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Yes bleddy good effort! :y
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Wow - that is an impressive amount of work and carefully and properly done.
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Lovely jobley :y
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But does it start and run? :D ;D
I hope it did...but James has gone quiet on that :-\
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Forgot to bleed it or TB stole all its electrickery :D
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I've worked out why you couldn't see the vid ;D
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https://youtu.be/feidiot9Iltg
Video unavailable :-\
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The OOF swear filter is changing the link ;D
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The OOF swear filter is changing the link ;D
:D :D
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https://youtu.be/fet wat9Iltg
Use the above without the space (type don't click) and it will work.
OOF is changing the 4 letter T word in the link to "idiot"
:y
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Still not working :-\
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Still not working :-\
Do a search on youtube for Jamesv6cdx .... soon find it then :y
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I think it must be case sensitive - the WA need to be capital letters
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Still not working :-\
Do a search on youtube for Jamesv6cdx .... soon find it then :y
Yeah do this :y
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That sounds very smooth (for a derv). Well done James.
I actually like the sound of those big diesels. :)
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Well done James, lot of work done there.
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That sounds very smooth (for a derv). Well done James.
I actually like the sound of those big diesels. :)
Pretty much all diesesals with more than 4 cylinders sound good :)
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That sounds very smooth (for a derv). Well done James.
I actually like the sound of those big diesels. :)
Pretty much all diesesals with more than 4 cylinders sound good :)
I'm not keen on buses.
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That sounds very smooth (for a derv). Well done James.
I actually like the sound of those big diesels. :)
Pretty much all diesesals with more than 4 cylinders sound good :)
I'm not keen on buses.
Whats wrong with buses i drive them for a living and there wonderfull piles of S#!T
Anyway james been following with intrest since our conversation when you popped over and all i have to say is well done that man 🎊🎊🎉
Think we may have our own personal ed china with magic hands 🙌🙌🙌 :y :D ;D
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Maiden voyage today. After a good clean drove from Bucks to Cheltenham.
Goes like a song :y bags of power and no more turbo noise :y
2mpg less than before. Maybe linked to swirl flap removal.
Still I'm over the moon with the drive and still does 39mpg :y
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Job jobbed then :y
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Maiden voyage today. After a good clean drove from Bucks to Cheltenham.
Goes like a song :y bags of power and no more turbo noise :y
2mpg less than before. Maybe linked to swirl flap removal.
Still I'm over the moon with the drive and still does 39mpg :y
Nice one, James. Don't 'fix' anything else for a while now, just enjoy it.
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Maiden voyage today. After a good clean drove from Bucks to Cheltenham.
Goes like a song :y bags of power and no more turbo noise :y
.......
Nice job James, well done. :y
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Off to Cornwall for a week, tomorrow.
I could take the 2010 Mondeo. I could take the 2016 Honda CRV. But no. I'm taking my 18 year old 530d. "Just because" it will feel satisfying, having done so much work on it.
All in we will be covering about 1000 miles, along with roofbox, dog, and the kitchen sink. I guess this will be the true test! :y
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Off to Cornwall for a week, tomorrow.
I could take the 2010 Mondeo. I could take the 2016 Honda CRV. But no. I'm taking my 18 year old 530d. "Just because" it will feel satisfying, having done so much work on it.
All in we will be covering about 1000 miles, along with roofbox, dog, and the kitchen sink. I guess this will be the true test! :y
Sure it will pass superbly :y
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Off to Cornwall for a week, tomorrow.
Enjoy the traffic!! I'm dreading goin out
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Off to Cornwall for a week, tomorrow.
Enjoy the traffic!! I'm dreading goin out
I'm in Devon with the tin tent at the moment and it is busy