Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: TheBoy on 24 June 2017, 20:54:08
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Changing centre sections, unsurprisinging 3 or the 4 bolts sheared. As always, drilling is not really playing the game, these bolts are like bloody diamond to get through.
Worth removing the cats, to do on the bench? Will it need new gaskets (2 left in UK warehouses, so ordered them, but unlikely to be here before Wed, as the order wont actually get processed until Monday)? Sods law, car is needed this week :(
Query number 2. Should I, when looking down the Irmscher backbox, be able to see all the way through?
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Changing centre sections, unsurprisinging 3 or the 4 bolts sheared. As always, drilling is not really playing the game, these bolts are like bloody diamond to get through.
Heat them up to red hot with the oxy-acetylene, and knock them out with a drift.
Easy, for those of who can be trusted with compressed gases ;D
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Strangely enough, no oxy here ;D
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When I dropped the cats on my 1994 2.5 I think one of the manifold bolts sheared :-\
My advice is to carry on and drill out the bolts in the flanges. Use freshly sharpened drill bits and lots of cutting oil / fluid / water (choose your favourite method of keeping the drill bit cool)
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Patience is key with this. Not too fast drill speed and not too much pressure on the drill. Otherwise drill bit overheats and goes blunt pretty quickly. It takes as long as it takes, theres no hurrying it.
Start with a smallish bit (3mm rings a bell) and work up from there. Good quality (Cobalt) drill bits are a must.
The higher up you can get the car to give yourself some working room the easier it is on the arms / shoulders/ back etc.
I'm pretty sure I didn't use new gaskets when I did it, but it was a while ago. :-\
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Changing centre sections, unsurprisinging 3 or the 4 bolts sheared. As always, drilling is not really playing the game, these bolts are like bloody diamond to get through.
Worth removing the cats, to do on the bench? Will it need new gaskets (2 left in UK warehouses, so ordered them, but unlikely to be here before Wed, as the order wont actually get processed until Monday)? Sods law, car is needed this week :(
Query number 2. Should I, when looking down the Irmscher backbox, be able to see all the way through?
Too late now. My technique is to heat the bolt and threaded end of downpipe to red heat with a blow torch, allow to cool, then gingerly apply torque with spanner. Hopefully it will yield a bit. If not, heat it again. Once it turns a bit spray it with penetrating oil, and turn it a bit clockwise, then anti clockwise, slowly working it loose. Spray with more oil occasionally, and slowly work it right out. It may sound tedious, but it's much easier than drilling it out
The Senator had simple holes in both sections, and used a nut and bolt, much better arrangement. Then all one needed to do was tighten it until the nut broke.
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The irmy boxes are not free flowing, so no you cant see down them
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The exhaust on mine needs doing very soon as its blowing quite badly. and going by the replies it looks like another bloody awkward job that I don't really want to do.
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I had with my old 2.5 a couple of pinholes after the cats, fixed them with steel putty and pennies.
They made the most annoying buzzing and hissing whenever I drove past buildings and walls lol
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Patience is key with this. Not too fast drill speed and not too much pressure on the drill. Otherwise drill bit overheats and goes blunt pretty quickly. It takes as long as it takes, theres no hurrying it.
Start with a smallish bit (3mm rings a bell) and work up from there. Good quality (Cobalt) drill bits are a must.
The higher up you can get the car to give yourself some working room the easier it is on the arms / shoulders/ back etc.
I'm pretty sure I didn't use new gaskets when I did it, but it was a while ago. :-\
yes that's how i got mine out, 135 degree split point cobalt bits, slow speed , spray some cutting fluid, or water at least. cobalt bits are more brittle than normal do not break one off in the bolt or your problems will be much worse, so only point i might differ on is starting with a 3mm bit - more likely to break. agreed do not be tempted to push on the drill.
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Carefully slot the outer edge of the flange in to the bolt/stud, apply heat and smack it out with a suitably sized hammer.
On reassembly, use bolts and washers. Done :y
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Carefully slot the outer edge of the flange in to the bolt/stud, apply heat and smack it out with a suitably sized hammer.
Done :y
smack out a threaded stud with a hammer??? piece of piss i'm sure, can be done quicker than writing it up.
not. ::)
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Carefully slot the outer edge of the flange in to the bolt/stud, apply heat and smack it out with a suitably sized hammer.
Done :y
smack out a threaded stud with a hammer??? piece of piss i'm sure, can be done quicker than writing it up.
not. ::)
If you read the full post instead of being an argumentative twit you would have realised that the advice was sound.
I think it's unlikely TuBy will go that way however because he will want to tap the holes and use bolts again.
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Carefully slot the outer edge of the flange in to the bolt/stud, apply heat and smack it out with a suitably sized hammer.
On reassembly, use bolts and washers. Done :y
From experience, the flange on these aren't strong enough then going forward :'(
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Changing centre sections, unsurprisinging 3 or the 4 bolts sheared. As always, drilling is not really playing the game, these bolts are like bloody diamond to get through.
Worth removing the cats, to do on the bench? Will it need new gaskets (2 left in UK warehouses, so ordered them, but unlikely to be here before Wed, as the order wont actually get processed until Monday)? Sods law, car is needed this week :(
Query number 2. Should I, when looking down the Irmscher backbox, be able to see all the way through?
Too late now. My technique is to heat the bolt and threaded end of downpipe to red heat with a blow torch, allow to cool, then gingerly apply torque with spanner. Hopefully it will yield a bit. If not, heat it again. Once it turns a bit spray it with penetrating oil, and turn it a bit clockwise, then anti clockwise, slowly working it loose. Spray with more oil occasionally, and slowly work it right out. It may sound tedious, but it's much easier than drilling it out
The Senator had simple holes in both sections, and used a nut and bolt, much better arrangement. Then all one needed to do was tighten it until the nut broke.
I was using heat when trying to remove, after attempting to remove cold.
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Just a thought about the doctor cutting a slot in the flange. Could you not take the slot passed the flange and cut through the bolt releasing the grip?
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yes that would cut out the hammer bit
so DG you have a flange which bolts screw into, the bolts seize on and rather than simply drill them out you want to take a grinder to the flange, remove a large slot in each side, bash out the bolts (as robson says why not simply keep going with the grinder and grind them away) and then try and fix on the new exhaust to the remains of the flange. which has been weakened with two large slots and is technically no longer a flange. two half flanges if you like. have anyone ever seen a fitting designed with two half flanges instead of a flange? does that tell you something?
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Just a thought about the doctor cutting a slot in the flange. Could you not take the slot passed the flange and cut through the bolt releasing the grip?
Cut upto the bolt using a dremmel rather than an angle grinder. Then open the slot with a flat blade and tap the bolt out. Replace with a size smaller bolt, washers and lock nut.
Carefully slot the outer edge of the flange in to the bolt/stud, apply heat and smack it out with a suitably sized hammer.
On reassembly, use bolts and washers. Done :y
From experience, the flange on these aren't strong enough then going forward :'(
Done on both my estates and neither had the exhaust fall off. Wouldn't have suggested it otherwise. ;)
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yes that would cut out the hammer bit
so DG you have a flange which bolts screw into, the bolts seize on and rather than simply drill them out you want to take a grinder to the flange, remove a large slot in each side, bash out the bolts (as robson says why not simply keep going with the grinder and grind them away) and then try and fix on the new exhaust to the remains of the flange. which has been weakened with two large slots and is technically no longer a flange. two half flanges if you like. have anyone ever seen a fitting designed with two half flanges instead of a flange? does that tell you something?
I think you misunderstod DocG. He suggested one cut for each bolt, in from the outside as far as the bolt, then prising open the flange slightly to allow the bolt to be bashed out. Robson suggested continuing the cut throught the blot as well, releasing it as 2 halves. Either way, enought flange remains to do the job.
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He didn't misunderstand. Rather being deliberately obtuse :-X
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yes that would cut out the hammer bit
so DG you have a flange which bolts screw into, the bolts seize on and rather than simply drill them out you want to take a grinder to the flange, remove a large slot in each side, bash out the bolts (as robson says why not simply keep going with the grinder and grind them away) and then try and fix on the new exhaust to the remains of the flange. which has been weakened with two large slots and is technically no longer a flange. two half flanges if you like. have anyone ever seen a fitting designed with two half flanges instead of a flange? does that tell you something?
I think you misunderstod DocG. He suggested one cut for each bolt, in from the outside as far as the bolt, then prising open the flange slightly to allow the bolt to be bashed out. Robson suggested continuing the cut throught the blot as well, releasing it as 2 halves. Either way, enought flange remains to do the job.
yes thats what I thought. except the 'prising open the flange' bit which is new. so you cut two slots into each flange, one for each bolt, thus considerably weakening the flange. Then you prise open the weakened flange at the two weak points you have just created.
its genius :D
i'm surprised DG didn't design for Vauxhall this is a big improvement on their original flange-with-two-threaded-holes design. a flange with two dremel hewn slots, prised open with a lever. what could be stronger than that? :-X on a system prone to massive temperatures and rust. ::)
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Go fuct yourself.
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OK, Doctor Gollum and migmog, you're both in the last chance saloon. Grow up, FFS >:(
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If the notch bothers you, two minutes to weld it back up.
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If the notch bothers you, two minutes to weld it back up.
so it's
dremel ;D cut flange, prise apart, hammer out bolt, prise back to original position, get welding kit out, weld up the 4 cuts you just made
v
carefully drill out bolts.
hmmm... ::)
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I was talking to TB :-X
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You have a plasma cutter, cut the bolts flush and use the cutter to blast a hole through the middle.
Then gently increase the hole size until the bolt remains fall out.
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You have a plasma cutter, cut the bolts flush and use the cutter to blast a hole through the middle.
Then gently increase the hole size until the bolt remains fall out.
That thought had crossed my mind yesterday.
Would the ECUs need disconnecting, like when welding?
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
Don't use stainless if you ever want to take it apart again. Buy good quality BZP from a proper fastener supplier, the four bolts and nuts you need will give change out of a quid.
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
Don't use stainless if you ever want to take it apart again. Buy good quality BZP from a proper fastener supplier, the four bolts and nuts you need will give change out of a quid.
Watsdatden ?
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
Don't use stainless if you ever want to take it apart again. Buy good quality BZP from a proper fastener supplier, the four bolts and nuts you need will give change out of a quid.
Watsdatden ?
bright zinc plated
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Thanks. :y
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Mine are stainless, never had a problem. If there good enough for oil rigs, in the north sea, I think there more than adequate for omega. 8)
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My options are the likes of shitfix/toolstation/hellfrauds, or retail park DIY stores I'm afraid.
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
i try not to mix metal types especially in a potentially wet exposed environment - the more noble would be fine but the less noble would be sacrificed, i.e. your flange would give up steel to the stainless. zinc should be ok it will give up to both. i put zinc plated jubilee clips round my precat shells to hold them instead of stainless which would have slowly eaten them.
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To nut and bolt it back together, do I use, say SS nuts and bolts, or BZP high tensile etc?
Don't use stainless if you ever want to take it apart again. Buy good quality BZP from a proper fastener supplier, the four bolts and nuts you need will give change out of a quid.
Last time I went to one of them (Anglia Fasteners) it was staffed by the grumpiest man in the world who gruffly told me that they only sell in boxes of 50.. ;D
(To be fair, that's fine, the kit car gets through a metric craptonne of bolts!)
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My options are the likes of shitfix/toolstation/hellfrauds, or retail park DIY stores I'm afraid.
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B-n-q do a far selection of nuts n bolts in stainless. And screwfix do a selection box of stainless nuts/bolts/washers.
http://www.screwfix.com/p/easyfix-mixed-bolts-nuts-washers-pack-a2-stainless-steel-500-pcs/5838k?_requestid=277278
From a fastner specialist, £30 buys a lot of nuts,bolts and washers of various sizes.
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Got some SS nuts and bolts from ShitFix, after (and unsurprisingly at the MK branch) suffering from their shockingly bad stock level management... ...so had to get longer bolts than needed.
Bugger, forgot washers. Better grab some.
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Got some SS nuts and bolts from ShitFix, after (and unsurprisingly at the MK branch) suffering from their shockingly bad stock level management... ...so had to get longer bolts than needed.
Bugger, forgot washers. Better grab some.
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Just use any old m8 washers.