Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: addy on 23 December 2017, 16:00:57
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Well finally managed to put new Cranksensor in, was getting Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected error code, before doing the Crankshaft sensor. I took it out for a test drive today and now have got Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected and Cylinder 2 Misfire Detected. Does this seem to point to the coil pack being bad, I undid it to check the condition of it, when I fitted it back on the plugs it seemed to be rocking (if that makes sense), I tightened the two torx bolts down and checked it too see if it still rocked, there wasn't any? The person I bought the car off had a new coil and plugs fitted, due to a Cylinder Misfire Detected error code he said that the missfire was sorted. I have got new plugs to put in it. Ready to scrap the thing, it is a love hate relationship.
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Congratulations on changing the crank sensor, presumably without removing the engine mounting. You will have read in my 2014 thread Fuse 19 advising 'Horrible job. Take it to a garage'.
Now it's misfiring on 1 & 2. You say it's had a new plug pack and new plugs. What a nightmare! Head gasket leaking between 1 & 2? Does it rev cleanly?
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Some sort of plum to have replaced the plugs and not bothered to refit the coil pack bolts :o (if I read that right :-\)
Bolt it down and report back ;)
Same bolts as V6 if that helps sourcing...
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No I did bolt the coil pack back down after checking it.
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Hi terry paget, no I did remove the engine mount, took the heat sheild connected to it off first, to make a bit more space. I couldn't get the dipstick tube out so worked around it. Lost the Cranksensor bolt, but got replacement today from local Vauxhall. Put everything back together took it for a test drive, it seemed OK, all of a sudden the car shuddered slightly then eml came on(not the spanner light). Checked code cylinder 1 missfire, took the coil out to check everything. Couldn't see any oil in the wells, seen the gasket failure on the wifes 2ltr Omega and the oil in wells, so knew what to look for. When I went to put the coil back in it didn't seem to sit right, rocking when you pushed on the end that is plug 1, looked and couldn't see anything causing this so tightened down both Torx bolts not over tight, checked the coil and there was no rocking. Tried driving it again and now got missfire on both 1 and 2 cylinder. Before this all happened and just starting it first time after the work, it revved and sounded sweet. The previous owner had the missfire error code, so he changed the coil and plugs and said the problem went. It has only just raised its ugly head, so now thinking the coil is gone, or going. Have one on order, hope it gets here before 3rd Jan as the MOT runs out on the 3rd, so need to test drive before then. No Camshaft or Crankshaft error codes now, just this. I have had this car since this September and have had nothing but problems with it, there is a love hate relationship with it, but if this keeps on it will go to the big car park in the sky, which is a shame as engine has lots of work done on it, and has had an new cat and manifold recently. :(
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Oil in plug wells means failed cam cover gasket. I was considering failed cylinder head gasket. Compression test would check that
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No symptoms of HG failure, or oil or water in the plug wells just this missfire error code. It runs sweet apart from this problem. >:(
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No symptoms of HG failure, or oil or water in the plug wells just this missfire error code. It runs sweet apart from this problem. >:(
Is it starting well and running sweetly, just throwing up spurious codes?
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It started and run sweeter than when I first got it, revved up no problem. It is now to the point where it moves about a foot then dies, checking the codes, brings up the two I have said. I did check everything was where it should be after putting everything back together, after fitting Cranksensor and before the initial startup. So hopefully just looking at Coil pack, gone due to the sensor going bad. If it isn't raining tomorrow will check spark plugs again and put in the New ones, as recommended on here in the maintenance guide, I recently purchased. Just incase a plug has gone but nothing to see, from a visual check.
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If the head gasket has gone between 2 cylinders there would be no evidence other than poor compression on those two cylinders. Worth a check before purchasing any more parts on the offchance. It would be unusual for two neighbouring coils to fail at exactly the same time.
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It started and run sweeter than when I first got it, revved up no problem. It is now to the point where it moves about a foot then dies, checking the codes, brings up the two I have said. I did check everything was where it should be after putting everything back together, after fitting Cranksensor and before the initial startup. So hopefully just looking at Coil pack, gone due to the sensor going bad. If it isn't raining tomorrow will check spark plugs again and put in the New ones, as recommended on here in the maintenance guide, I recently purchased. Just incase a plug has gone but nothing to see, from a visual check.
Does it start well, run sweetly and rev well with car stationery; then engine stops once you move the car? Is gearbox automatic or manual?
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It revved OK yesterday, when stationary just caused the missfire code, when trying to drive even a little bit. Went out to it this morning 24/12/17. It started up straight away,tick over was fine no EML on and was even able to drive it about 30ft, without any problems or EML coming on. I parked up and switched it off as it was 6.30am, so didn't want to do to much to it. It is a Auto. Just got to find out how to do a compression test on it, to check cylinders, only got the manual for a 2ltr. Also got to find out the what the value should be and the allowable tolerance.
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Are you sure you haven’t damaged the plugs? ???
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Do you mean the spark plugs, or other plugs? It only recently had Cylinder 1 missfire before doing Cranksensor, then yesterday it was missfiring on two cylinders, took coil pack off to check for oil, etc. nothing in the wells. When I put the pack back on, it seemed to be rocking if pressed on each end, if that makes sense but once the two torx bolts were torqued down the pack had no rocking at all. The Previous Owner had changed the plugs and coil pack, due to a missfire problem he said it seemed to have cured it, also the engine has recently had a top end rebuild done, it was in the paperwork which came with the car. I drove it all the way from Darlington to Scotland with no missfires, the engine ran perfect. I had gearbox codes so changed the Camshaft Sensor and put in a new Battery as the one on it was going, cleaned the terminals at the same time. The gearbox has been fine since, just kept getting a camshaft code, so on advice from here I changed the Crankshaft sensor. Now getting missfire codes. And car shudders as if it running only on a couple of cylinders. But as said went to it this morning and started and moved no problem. I am hoping to put the new spark plugs I got for it, in today.
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Do you mean the spark plugs, or other plugs? It only recently had Cylinder 1 missfire before doing Cranksensor, then yesterday it was missfiring on two cylinders, took coil pack off to check for oil, etc. nothing in the wells. When I put the pack back on, it seemed to be rocking if pressed on each end, if that makes sense but once the two torx bolts were torqued down the pack had no rocking at all. The Previous Owner had changed the plugs and coil pack, due to a missfire problem he said it seemed to have cured it, also the engine has recently had a top end rebuild done, it was in the paperwork which came with the car. I drove it all the way from Darlington to Scotland with no missfires, the engine ran perfect. I had gearbox codes so changed the Camshaft Sensor and put in a new Battery as the one on it was going, cleaned the terminals at the same time. The gearbox has been fine since, just kept getting a camshaft code, so on advice from here I changed the Crankshaft sensor. Now getting missfire codes. And car shudders as if it running only on a couple of cylinders. But as said went to it this morning and started and moved no problem. I am hoping to put the new spark plugs I got for it, in today.
If you are still getting camshaft sensor codes it's worth changing the cam sensor for a genuine Vauxhall cam sensor.
You could usefully buy a compression tester (£12 ish) anywhere and check the compression as you change the plugs - all you do is screw it into the plug hole and crank the engine. All cylinders should be the same, about 9.
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Sorry for the misunderstanding, I am not getting any other error codes just the missfire ones. Both Crank and Camshaft sensors are genuine Vauxhall ones. Only ever use genuine sensors for things like these, learned that from having a old Jeep that didn't like aftermarket sensors. I will remove the fuel pump relay, as the 2.0ltr workshop manual says to do it for that engine, when doing the compression test. Is the 9psi the tolerance allowed between each cylinder?
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Sorry for the misunderstanding, I am not getting any other error codes just the missfire ones. Both Crank and Camshaft sensors are genuine Vauxhall ones. Only ever use genuine sensors for things like these, learned that from having a old Jeep that didn't like aftermarket sensors. I will remove the fuel pump relay, as the 2.0ltr workshop manual says to do it for that engine, when doing the compression test. Is the 9psi the tolerance allowed between each cylinder?
I would expect 9bar, or 120psi, on a good cylinder, between 0 and 3bar on a leaky one.
Putting it in context, my 43 year old Westwood lawnmower Tecumseh engine would not start, compression was 3bar. I took the head off, gasket clearly had been blowing. I could not get a new gasket, so I simply cleaned it up and put it back on again. Compression was up to 6bar. Engine roared into life on the second pull of the string. Wonderful! Hopefully good for another 43 years.
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120psi is pretty low for a modern high-compression engine, although if all four are making that then there probably isn't a problem.
If we're honest, a compression test is intended to point your diagnosis in the right direction by highlighting differences rather than looking for hard numbers. A leak down test is more useful, but requires rather more kit.
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I know it is the wrong manual, but for a 2.0 DOHC it says the compression for it is 12-15bar(174-218psi) with a difference between cylinders 1bar(15psi), so will use these as a rough guide and hopefully be near them or higher.
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You have checked the plugs over and the pack......Have you or the ex owner checked or replaced the leads? Could try swapping one lead over see if missfire moves to different plug.
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Unfortunately it is a complete coil pack on a 2.2, so have to change the whole thing. >:(
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Haynes states the compression ratio of the 2.0 is 10:1. As the 2.2 is a detuned version of the 2.0 9-10 bars is still my expectation. As Nick says, what we are looking for is a difference between cylinders rather than the absolute value.
My other lawn mower, a 60 year old Stoic with a Briggs and Stratton engine, 150cc side valve single cylinder vertical crankshaft splash lubricated device, a proper engine, shows a 6bar compression, and still starts on first or second pull.
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If the compression is low enough that 2 adjacent cylinders won't fire, then it'll be obvious from the compression readings without worrying about the odd bar here or there.