Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Varche on 14 July 2019, 09:00:19
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Saw an item on Euronews on the future , except it is now.
China is a country well covered with cctv cameras. Couple this with AI and it is very powerful. Misdemeanours like jaywalking get a mark against your profile and can be used to deny you access to public places like railway stations. It doesn't take a genius to realise how else it could be used.
I thought being able to identify a person by facial recognition, at a crowded football stadium was impressive.
Imagine trying to appeal . It wasn't me in the high street outside the kebab shop. Will there be a healthy black market in latex masks so you can be someone else
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Big brother is watching us
we're all law abiding citizens on the OOF though ???
I , for one, refuse to wear a gimp mask ;D
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I would be one of the first to be refused entry to railway stations and so on. No room for common sense in big brother world.
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Big brother is watching us
we're all law abiding citizens on the OOF though ???
I , for one, refuse to wear a gimp mask ;D
In 2019 it could well be Big Sister Dave :D :D ;)
Anyway, it will only get worse; facial recognition, voice recognition, fingerprint recognition, embedded micro-chips, full DNA registration, and so it will go on well beyond what we can imagine now. ::) ::)
Welcome to the 21st century - where is that hearse, I want to get off!! :o :o :o :D ;)
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Big brother is watching us
we're all law abiding citizens on the OOF though ???
I , for one, refuse to wear a gimp mask ;D
In 2019 it could well be Big Sister Dave :D :D ;)
Anyway, it will only get worse; facial recognition, voice recognition, fingerprint recognition, embedded micro-chips, full DNA registration, and so it will go on well beyond what we can imagine now. ::) ::)
Welcome to the 21st century - where is that hearse, I want to get off!! :o :o :o :D ;)
People use Hitachis and Rabbits for that nowadays :D
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Big brother is watching us
we're all law abiding citizens on the OOF though ???
I , for one, refuse to wear a gimp mask ;D
In 2019 it could well be Big Sister Dave :D :D ;)
Anyway, it will only get worse; facial recognition, voice recognition, fingerprint recognition, embedded micro-chips, full DNA registration, and so it will go on well beyond what we can imagine now. ::) ::)
Welcome to the 21st century - where is that hearse, I want to get off!! :o :o :o :D ;)
People use Hitachis and Rabbits for that nowadays :D
;D :D
it's BIG brother
nothing to do with gender neutral Bullsh!t ( or Cowsh!t ) dunno what cross dress gay cows like to be called :-\
and if you want an Omega hearse, you'd best be quick Lizzie
they are rusting away fast :(
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If your picture is on Arsebook, where the facial recognition features are process by a Macau based corporation with links to Russian & Chinese intelligence agencies your mug shot will be in their facial recognition databases, so don't look at the camera Pike. ::) ::) ::)
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Big brother is watching us
we're all law abiding citizens on the OOF though ???
I , for one, refuse to wear a gimp mask ;D
In 2019 it could well be Big Sister Dave :D :D ;)
Anyway, it will only get worse; facial recognition, voice recognition, fingerprint recognition, embedded micro-chips, full DNA registration, and so it will go on well beyond what we can imagine now. ::) ::)
Welcome to the 21st century - where is that hearse, I want to get off!! :o :o :o :D ;)
People use Hitachis and Rabbits for that nowadays :D
;D :D
it's BIG brother
nothing to do with gender neutral Bullsh!t ( or Cowsh!t ) dunno what cross dress gay cows like to be called :-\
and if you want an Omega hearse, you'd best be quick Lizzie
they are rusting away fast :(
Yes indeed. Any that were around these parts have now gone. All Mercs it often appears. Probably due to the fact that of course both Vauxhall and Ford ceased building big saloons, but Merc do so with relish! 8) 8) ;)
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Oh yes, Chinas system is infallible..
https://www.theverge.com/2018/11/22/18107885/china-facial-recognition-mistaken-jaywalker
The face of Dong Mingzhu, a president of China’s top air-conditioning company, flashed on a large screen displayed to the public listing nearby jaywalkers caught by cameras. A line of text captioned her photo, saying she had broken the law. It also listed part of her government ID number and her name, but misidentified her surname as “Ju.”
But what the camera actually saw was an ad featuring Dong’s face on the side of a bus.
;D
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Ha ha , that is really funny.
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Back down to earth with a bump. Watched a chilling documentary on the industrial scale of minority repression in China last night “ undercover : inside China’s digital gulag” . Might be available on catch up.
AI played a big part. The programme was set to ethnic minorities and flagged people with angry facial expressions for example. Then police from “Stations” located as little as 200 metres apart could go and arrest them and if need be send to a correction centre. Quite frightening that normal Jan Chinese are ignored by the programme. Those normal Chinese people when interviewed all seemed to agree that the minorities didnt have human rights.
Why isn't the UN protesting and demanding access?
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Why isn't the UN protesting and demanding access?
Because the UN knows China could crush it without breaking a sweat?
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I also watched the documentary and found it very chilling indeed. It could happen here if we don't retain our healthy mistrust of the authuorities.
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i saw it too .... Big Brother at its best/worse :(
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China is a country of 1.4 billion people covering the third largest country in the World.
It is one of the oldest civilizations, and has been ruled by many hereditary monarchies, or dynasties, with ruling Emperors who ruled, often very brutally, over many, many centuries, in an attempt to keep a rather fractious peoples together as one, especially after the First Emperor, Qin Shi Huang (Chin), of the seven unified states of China, that he brought together from 259 to 210 BC.
It is a country that has a great, tumultuous, history, with much war and death, whilst enjoying a great trading tradition, and of course infamously attacked by Japan during the lead up and during WW2. It has gone through many political upheavals as it's leaders still try and keep the population together in political thought and obeying "the system" of a particular time. It has been through the Great Famine under Chairman Mao that killed, it is estimated, 36 million in 1959-62, that is after losing 20 million during WW2.
Now, I am certainly no expert on Chinese history, but it is hard to judge their political system, that wants to control it's people in anyway it can, with ours. The history of our, small, Island, with a population of now about 66+ million, covering 209,000 square kilometres, has been shaped by Emperors, Kings Queens and one Lord Protector, then progressively, often via quiet 'revolution' of the people, fighting and striving for the democracy, that we have now. It has taken almost 2,000 years to get there.
Now with China, with that aforementioned population of 1.4 billion, over almost 10,000,000 square Kilometres the struggle for democracy has, and will, take much longer than for the UK. Change is coming, their World is changing, and they are becoming far more open and capitalist than ever before. Little old Hong Kong may well just help that process, but like with our country, it will still be a long and painful road to self fulfillment for the individual Chinese. We, the West, MUST NOT intervene in anyway in this natural process, until the Chinese themselves request our help, as Great Britain did, with the Dutch in particular.
What the Chinese do is, and will continue to, disturb us but this is a foreign country, and we should all respect that, United Nations, or any other involvement would be totally wrong and do no good at all. They will find their own path,
Also do not forget that, once everything is taken into account, the USA debt with China is around $22 Trillion!! ;)
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I guess you didn't watch it Lizzie ::) ::)
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Just for you Lizzie .... ;)
https://www.itv.com/hub/undercover-inside-chinas-digital-gulag/2a6366a0001
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Lizzie. Locking up the biggest amount of people since the second world war occurred is a funny way of developing democracy.
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China is merely avoiding terrorism by educating people. And Trump hasn't got a racist bone in his body.
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I guess you didn't watch it Lizzie ::) ::)
:-X
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China is merely avoiding terrorism by educating people. And Trump hasn't got a racist bone in his body.
I am sure that is it in a nutshell. The uneducated minorities that do not fit the mould for religous or other reasons no doubt kicked off with terrorism. There was mention of an incident where over 50 people died from memory. An authoritarian regimes approach is just to beat anyone stepping vaguely out of line into submission. Re educate , indoctrinate call it what you will.
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Limiting each family to one child clearly doesn't work...
Their population growth simply isn't sustainable, so something needs doing one way or tother. Rightly or wrongly, minorities tend to bear the brunt of such measures, that's just they way it goes.
Besides, is influencing peoples' behaviour in order to force them to think before they do anything and have to take responsibility for their actions such a bad thing? I'm not convinced that it is given that most people nowadays seem to be incapable of either :-\
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Just for you Lizzie .... ;)
https://www.itv.com/hub/undercover-inside-chinas-digital-gulag/2a6366a0001
This is China, with it's own rules, just as Russia and the USA have. What they do may be very disturbing, as this is, but the Chinese authorities are only doing what I stated in my post; controlling 1.4 billion people who have many identities and cultures going back many centuries, with various political formats over that time.
All I say is that we must leave them be, as frankly there are too many of them to do anything about - trade restrictions, tarrifs, etc, do not work - and why should we as long as they do not interfere in our country's domestic interests. Let them find their way, which will, as with so many countries of the World, turn to a democratic, capitalist, system as the rewards of doing that are far more attractive to the billionaires and leaders of China than an expensive war, internally (Civil War) or externally (taking on the US and Europe), which gives them nothing but pain. So far, China is following it's historic path of keeping itself within it's own boundaries - perhaps with the exception of THAT new military island, but that is for national defence - and not going for a Hitler or Stalin drive for World domination.
In the meantime their people may go on suffering as they have for centuries, but modern technology will also work for them as much as it is going against them currently. The Genie is out of the lamp; the World's internet and media - by unofficial, non state controlled means - is giving them information once totally withheld from them, even though the authorities will do everything to stop it. Western people visit China and are doing business with then. The previously 'closed' society is now opening up fast. The Chinese authorities are used, as a political and cultural tradition, to "Keeping Control", but now that is slipping.
No, China and what their authorities are doing should be of minor importance to us when compared to the HUGE threat we are facing in the West to our Democracy. The politics of the USA, of Britain, of Europe, is a mess, and when that happens extremes of attitudes and actions show themselves as we are seeing currently.
That concerns me far more than the Chinese people's fight for their future. ;)
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Guessing you haven't watched the programme then.
In a nutshell you are saying so long as they are not using their military might against other countries ( Scarborough shoal excepted ) they can incarcerate and maltreat around an estimated two million humans with impunity.
Does that sound familiar.........
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Apparently not ::)
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Guessing you haven't watched the programme then.
In a nutshell you are saying so long as they are not using their military might against other countries ( Scarborough shoal excepted ) they can incarcerate and maltreat around an estimated two million humans with impunity.
Does that sound familiar.........
Thing is, Varche, there's really not a lot anyone can do about it. The path we took last time is certainly not available to us now.
I'm off to make a 'The end is nigh' sandwich board.
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I don't agree.
There are many bad things going on around the world. Humanity should express strong concerns via the ( toothless )UN and other channels. The Chinese in particular are keen to be perceived as doing the right things. Anyway we could individually boycott products. I for one have stopped playing Chinese checkers and I absolutely refuse to ever use chopsticks again.
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I don't agree.
There are many bad things going on around the world. Humanity should express strong concerns via the ( toothless )UN and other channels. The Chinese in particular are keen to be perceived as doing the right things. Anyway we could individually boycott products. I for one have stopped playing Chinese checkers and I absolutely refuse to ever use chopsticks again.
Give up my chicken chow mein for a couple of million Muslims? Are you fickin sure? ;D
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Guessing you haven't watched the programme then.
In a nutshell you are saying so long as they are not using their military might against other countries ( Scarborough shoal excepted ) they can incarcerate and maltreat around an estimated two million humans with impunity.
Does that sound familiar.........
But Varche, and others, I understand your concerns, but what do you want the West, or anyone else, to do about it? Do you want us to go to war over what the Chinese are doing to THEIR people - yes I did watch the programme thank you all!! ::) ::) - but obviously, unlike others on here I know we can do sweet FA about it. Just like we couldn't with Nazi Germany in the 1930's. It was only when Poland was invaded did we, without the USA, declare war. But, as I have repeatedly said, there is yet to be any evidence of China wishing to invade other countries, let alone take on the US.
So does everyone think we should commit to a war with 1.4 million people, when THE key Western player, Trump and the USA obviously do not want to support such a move - remember, in my post I mentioned the USA debt, overall, with Cina is $22 trillion - when all they WILL do is fight a battle over tariffs. Do you really think China will listen to Britain and Europe over the abuse of those CHINESE people featured in the documentary that has ruffled all your feathers so much. What the hell do you think WE can do about that, an internal matter, in a huge country with a massive military and political system?
Stop buying Chinese products? Well you can try, but as we seem to now be totally reliant on so many of the products we buy coming from China, with no alternatives available from our now non-existent factories that, with Germany and the US, once produced them many years ago, where is that going to lead us? The truth is the majority of people in this country, Europe, and the USA, let alone elsewhere, give not a damn about 2 million Chinese - well actually far more Chinese live under full state control - out of the 1.4 trillion. Frankly, that size of population must find their own way to the type of democracy and freedoms we enjoy, as I clearly stated before. We cannot dictate that progress no more than other countries could when Britains were fighting for the rights we have today. Other countries cannot get involved, and certainly they must not do with China!
You know, it was only a short time ago that a massive amount of British citizens complained, with protests, about the West getting involved in Iraq!! What good did that do, either for us, in the West, or the people of Iraq? Now, it seems to me, the same people will get all heated up about native Chinese people, in their country, and expect our leaders to "do something"!!
At the moment us Brits cannot even reach an agreement with Europe, let alone organising action of some type, who knows what, against China. Even the USA cannot get Iran to back down with sanctions over their nuclear missle programme, nor will they ever win a tariff war with China!
So, beat your chests men, call for whatever you want from China, but you are going to be very disappointed. Of course we could always go for WW3 with China, Russia and Iran (an Axis!!) and kill off hundreds of millions of human beings!!
Do you want to gamble and go for that? ::) ::) ::)
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Guessing you haven't watched the programme then.
In a nutshell you are saying so long as they are not using their military might against other countries ( Scarborough shoal excepted ) they can incarcerate and maltreat around an estimated two million humans with impunity.
Does that sound familiar.........
But Varche, and others, I understand your concerns, but what do you want the West, or anyone else, to do about it? Do you want us to go to war over what the Chinese are doing to THEIR people - yes I did watch the programme thank you all!! ::) ::) - but obviously, unlike others on here I know we can do sweet FA about it. Just like we couldn't with Nazi Germany in the 1930's. It was only when Poland was invaded did we, without the USA, declare war. But, as I have repeatedly said, there is yet to be any evidence of China wishing to invade other countries, let alone take on the US.
So does everyone think we should commit to a war with 1.4 million people, when THE key Western player, Trump and the USA obviously do not want to support such a move - remember, in my post I mentioned the USA debt, overall, with Cina is $22 trillion - when all they WILL do is fight a battle over tariffs. Do you really think China will listen to Britain and Europe over the abuse of those CHINESE people featured in the documentary that has ruffled all your feathers so much. What the hell do you think WE can do about that, an internal matter, in a huge country with a massive military and political system?
Stop buying Chinese products? Well you can try, but as we seem to now be totally reliant on so many of the products we buy coming from China, with no alternatives available from our now non-existent factories that, with Germany and the US, once produced them many years ago, where is that going to lead us? The truth is the majority of people in this country, Europe, and the USA, let alone elsewhere, give not a damn about 2 million Chinese - well actually far more Chinese live under full state control - out of the 1.4 trillion. Frankly, that size of population must find their own way to the type of democracy and freedoms we enjoy, as I clearly stated before. We cannot dictate that progress no more than other countries could when Britains were fighting for the rights we have today. Other countries cannot get involved, and certainly they must not do with China!
You know, it was only a short time ago that a massive amount of British citizens complained, with protests, about the West getting involved in Iraq!! What good did that do, either for us, in the West, or the people of Iraq? Now, it seems to me, the same people will get all heated up about native Chinese people, in their country, and expect our leaders to "do something"!!
At the moment us Brits cannot even reach an agreement with Europe, let alone organising action of some type, who knows what, against China. Even the USA cannot get Iran to back down with sanctions over their nuclear missle programme, nor will they ever win a tariff war with China!
So, beat your chests men, call for whatever you want from China, but you are going to be very disappointed. Of course we could always go for WW3 with China, Russia and Iran (an Axis!!) and kill off hundreds of millions of human beings!!
Do you want to gamble and go for that? ::) ::) ::)
Yup.
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Be more resources to go around afterwards :-X
Good for the economy too.
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Just realised in my latest post I stated 1.4 trillion as the population of China. Of course, as I stated prior to this it is 1.4 billion!! A huge figure but not as huge as the former one! :D :D
My mind got carried away with the $22 trillion USA debt! :-[ :-[ ::) ::)
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Guessing you haven't watched the programme then.
In a nutshell you are saying so long as they are not using their military might against other countries ( Scarborough shoal excepted ) they can incarcerate and maltreat around an estimated two million humans with impunity.
Does that sound familiar.........
But Varche, and others, I understand your concerns, but what do you want the West, or anyone else, to do about it? Do you want us to go to war over what the Chinese are doing to THEIR people - yes I did watch the programme thank you all!! ::) ::) - but obviously, unlike others on here I know we can do sweet FA about it. Just like we couldn't with Nazi Germany in the 1930's. It was only when Poland was invaded did we, without the USA, declare war. But, as I have repeatedly said, there is yet to be any evidence of China wishing to invade other countries, let alone take on the US.
So does everyone think we should commit to a war with 1.4 million people, when THE key Western player, Trump and the USA obviously do not want to support such a move - remember, in my post I mentioned the USA debt, overall, with Cina is $22 trillion - when all they WILL do is fight a battle over tariffs. Do you really think China will listen to Britain and Europe over the abuse of those CHINESE people featured in the documentary that has ruffled all your feathers so much. What the hell do you think WE can do about that, an internal matter, in a huge country with a massive military and political system?
Stop buying Chinese products? Well you can try, but as we seem to now be totally reliant on so many of the products we buy coming from China, with no alternatives available from our now non-existent factories that, with Germany and the US, once produced them many years ago, where is that going to lead us? The truth is the majority of people in this country, Europe, and the USA, let alone elsewhere, give not a damn about 2 million Chinese - well actually far more Chinese live under full state control - out of the 1.4 trillion. Frankly, that size of population must find their own way to the type of democracy and freedoms we enjoy, as I clearly stated before. We cannot dictate that progress no more than other countries could when Britains were fighting for the rights we have today. Other countries cannot get involved, and certainly they must not do with China!
You know, it was only a short time ago that a massive amount of British citizens complained, with protests, about the West getting involved in Iraq!! What good did that do, either for us, in the West, or the people of Iraq? Now, it seems to me, the same people will get all heated up about native Chinese people, in their country, and expect our leaders to "do something"!!
At the moment us Brits cannot even reach an agreement with Europe, let alone organising action of some type, who knows what, against China. Even the USA cannot get Iran to back down with sanctions over their nuclear missle programme, nor will they ever win a tariff war with China!
So, beat your chests men, call for whatever you want from China, but you are going to be very disappointed. Of course we could always go for WW3 with China, Russia and Iran (an Axis!!) and kill off hundreds of millions of human beings!!
Do you want to gamble and go for that? ::) ::) ::)
We will have to agree to disagree. War as you seem to be suggesting as the only viable solution is not the answer. Dialogue . Shaming, reasoning, perhaps sanctions. I am afraid countries are all too happy to let atrocities go on in other countries. This not giving a damn about what other countries are doing to their people, the planet etc is very yesterday.
PS Chow Mein is back on the menu only because it doesn't come from China but Iceland!
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We will have to agree to disagree. War as you seem to be suggesting as the only viable solution is not the answer. Dialogue . Shaming, reasoning, perhaps sanctions. I am afraid countries are all too happy to let atrocities go on in other countries. This not giving a damn about what other countries are doing to their people, the planet etc is very yesterday.
PS Chow Mein is back on the menu only because it doesn't come from China but Iceland!
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No Varche, that is the last thing I am suggesting. Indeed I made very clear what the terrible consequences of us interfering in Chinese business could be. I am merely pointing out that if so many people "something should be done" about China treating a group, or even more of THEIR citizens as shown in the documentary, very badly there is nor a lot we can do about it. The Chinese authorities are, and have always been their own people, as I explained in my first post, for CENTURIES, controlling THEIR masses in various political ways within the favoured doctrine of the day.
"Dialogue, shaming, reasoning, perhaps sanctions" - you missed out one word, Diplomacy - in China's case have never worked to date because the country is too damned big and now very powerful. The West is now seen as a mere irritant - as I stated before they have always been content with isolation in the past from the West, apart from their highly successful trading- and now they see the West declining in power. Indeed, we are seeing the dominant World power going from the recent historic past of Europe then USA, back to the East with China at it's financial trading heart, and the Chinese know it.
So, without explaining everything again, it is only the Chinese people themselves that can change China from within, not any of us out here no matter how sick and disgusted that programme made us feel. Just remember that the Soviet Union, especially during the Stalin years, did far worse to it's people's than China is currently, with millions (exact or even approximate figures are hard to establish) being killed for political reasons, but that was within their territories, and the West could do nothing. Then the Soviet Union's Red Army 'saved the day' by way of defensive, then offensive action, against an invading German army, pushing them all the way back to Nazi Berlin and they effectively saved the West's arses. So out of much evil came good, with even Russia now being very different than Stalin's era, although it is still not good for all too many of it's people. What are we doing for them, who are state controlled, monitored, ill treated, 24/7?
Nothing, because as in China's case we cannot do anything but chatter away at the unfairness of it all and make some very weak gestures in protest. :( :( :(