Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: cruisetopoland on 29 October 2009, 10:03:39
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I was wondering what everyone thought of driver training in the UK and whether one test in a lifetime is enough with so many changes happening.
We all sat round and did the theory test recently for fun (!)and I was surprised how many seasoned drivers amongst us failed.
Many new tech systems on cars leave most drivers baffled too; a simple one is ABS-you deal with an ABS braked car differently in an emergency braking situation than a non-ABS-most of the group had no idea about this, which is now part of the driving test.
There are many views to consider, but one of the key points is the onus being on you to KEEP your licence by keeping to a required standard, not keeping going regardless until reported.
Consider the pressure of the family doctor who has to betray trust by reporting a driver to the DVLA if they think they are no longer able to drive safely-many older drivers would not want to face a retest and would volunteer to relinquish the licence after years of having a blemish free licence, rather than chance failing.
I have taken numerous category tests (moped, bike, car, automatic bus, manual coach) and each time have found updates I would not have known about, in the Highway Code-this meant that I was up to date compared to others in the group.
So what would help?
a/ stay as is
b/ periodic Highway Code and ongoing training
c/ compulsory periodic retests
Many thanks :y
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some kind of refresher every 10 years obviously should be free, this would then poss cut down on accidents
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I voted for periodic updates. I think a complete retest is OTT unless indicated. However, renewal at,say, 70 plus should be dependant upon a strict medical exam.
There should also be a reversal of the destruction of the alternative transport infrastructure. More elderley, or otherwise infirm, drivers are forced to keep driving and to hang on to their licences regardless because there is no longer a viable alternative.
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Good points-especially in a rural area. :y
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I think some sort of regular check is sensible. As a glider pilot I can draw an analogy with flying.
Regular checks and training, currency, (un)fitness to fly (medical, alcohol/drugs, tiredness, stress, etc.) and the like are part of the deal for pilots, and very few fly without considering exactly where they stand on each of the above counts and seeking the required help or abstaining where sensible.
In that theatre, you would be regarded as very foolish by your peers if you didn't jump into an aircraft with an instructor for a check as regularly as your flying experience dictates, whether mandated to by law or not.
Problem is, most pilots fly because they enjoy it and take pride in their skill. For drivers, their "skill" is just a means to an end, more so with the decline in public transport, a skill which they are not interested in improving and honing. Either that or they regard themselves as being beyond further improvement.
I am ashamed to say that I am one of the many, no doubt, who has not driven under the guidance of anyone qualified to comment on my skills since I passed my test more than 20 years ago.
So, some sort of regular check would be good IMHO. It would need to be compulsory and, perhaps, as an incentive, drivers should be rated according to their skills and this used to determine their insurance premiums?
Kevin
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All good points, cheers :y
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Personally I would like to see retesting every 2 years for drivers aged 17-30. then 5 yearly retesting for 30-55 then no more retesting is needed.
Yes some people moan about older drivers and they may have a few small accidents, but they rarely cause deaths (yes it can happen)
Younger drivers are far more agressive and intolerant to other road users, bikes cyclist and especially pedestrians.
30-50 age group drivers think they no everything (I am in this category) and also tend to speed more in the wrong situations.
Of the following list who would you most like to be following you down the road ?
20 year old in saxo with blaring music and not concentrating.
40 year old in 5 series sat 2 inches from your bumper.
70+ in small car concentrating but slower reactions but leaving a much bigger gap between himself and you.
I no what my choice would be.
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In Spain once you reach a certain age which I believe is 50, you have to have (and pay handsomely for it) health checks to be able to retain your licence.
They do have a category of driver that I don't believe exists in Britain. That is young or old (or indeed any age in between though it tends to be just the young or old) where you haven't passed a test and are unlikely to but you can drive an Aixam car (simple small car). They don't go very fast and when you see one you give the driver some respect. They are absolutely great for the elderly. far better than the 3 or 4 wheel scooters in Britain. It wouldn't work in Britain of course as people have no time for "slow" motorists!
varche
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Interesting re: Aixams-we saw these on the roads in France and French drivers terrorised them....
No crash protection :o
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I for one know that if i was faced with taking a complete driving exam at todays pass standard that i would fail. The reason is, because how many of us actually drive they way we're taught?
We should take a driving test every ten years or so, not to drive to the current standard, but to prove that we are compitant to drive. There are many people that think they're good drivers, but are terrible.
If we are expected to pass the full test again then we would all need tuition at todays standard. Who would pay for said tuition? You & i!!!! I'm suprized the government haven't come up with this before now. Just think of the billions they could rip us all off for make in revenue.
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A good point-each time I have gone for a new category I have been updated, so I have kept fresh and at pass standard.
I am sure the government don't equate that the £1m cost of a road death could be used better with free training ;)
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I think that a hazard awareness course and a practical drive with an instructor every 5 years would/could be feesable if they can do it for PSV/HGV drivers and call it a drivers cpc it should be done for all drivers
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We need something.... :y
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Personally I would like to see retesting every 2 years for drivers aged 17-30. then 5 yearly retesting for 30-55 then no more retesting is needed.
Yes some people moan about older drivers and they may have a few small accidents, but they rarely cause deaths (yes it can happen)
Younger drivers are far more agressive and intolerant to other road users, bikes cyclist and especially pedestrians.
30-50 age group drivers think they no everything (I am in this category) and also tend to speed more in the wrong situations.
Of the following list who would you most like to be following you down the road ?
20 year old in saxo with blaring music and not concentrating.
40 year old in 5 series sat 2 inches from your bumper.
70+ in small car concentrating but slower reactions but leaving a much bigger gap between himself and you.
I no what my choice would be.
Have you ever tried to keep up with an OAP that has just treated them selves to a new 16 valve hatch back.
They feel like teenagers again and zip every where at 60.70 mph ;D ;D
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To do a re-test you would have to be banned/barred from the road each time to do the re test.
Insurance for example
16
17
18
21
25
and 30 I noticed a big drop in premiums as I was considered to be a better driver at each of these ages.
I look forward to getting a better discount at 50.
So maybe a tiering insurance structure.
Hype up the insurancefrom 17 (as they allreay do) but discount it more and more depending on the level of advanced driving that has been done.
Rather than just the standard advanced test. Tier it to say 10 levels.
Then by passing each one of these you get to keep your licence at certain ages and if you take them earlier than that age, then you get insurance discounts as a bonus.
But if you get points on your licence, you lose a level on the asvanced level and get stung on insurance.
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Have you ever tried to keep up with an OAP that has just treated them selves to a new 16 valve hatch back.
They feel like teenagers again and zip every where at 60.70 mph
Isn't it usually 39mph, all roads, all conditions? ;D
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Have you ever tried to keep up with an OAP that has just treated them selves to a new 16 valve hatch back.
They feel like teenagers again and zip every where at 60.70 mph
Isn't it usually 39mph, all roads, all conditions? ;D
Especially lane 3 of your nearest motorway ;D ;D ;D
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I think its called Hat Control-like cruise control but hat activated and set at 39mph ;D
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When I lived in Worthing we had a well kknown retired vicaar who drove his car everywhere at a constant 5 mph. He'd start off at the beginning of his journey, get to the magic 5 and keep it there until he arrived wherever he was going -- this included junctions, roundabouts, level crossings etc !!! I believe it was only Divine Intervention that stopped him having to cross a railway crossing at a crucial time !!!!!
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I think its called Hat Control-like cruise control but hat activated and set at 39mph ;D
Oh I had to laugh when I read that. My father is 70 wears a hat and just bought a car with cruise control.
Sorry, it don't mean a lot to you lot but really described my father to a T.
;D ;D ;D
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My Mum's a vicar and one of the other vicars she used to work with was treated both the accelerator and brake pedals as on/off switches when driving.
I had never been so scared in my life-accelerating hard towards a stationary car, emergency stop, flat out again, screech, grind, roar, screech, grind, roar etc. When we nearly hit a bus, I braced and shouted JESUS CHRIST!!
to which he replied "Is our Lord and Saviour".
I had never though of churchgoing as an exteme sport...
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re tests at various ages, license state and health should be related to weather or not your allowed to continue. The general standard of driving amongst the old especially is appalling imo! Sight tests should take into account periferal vision not just reading a number plate from 60 yards.
Above all, a motorway test. Nobody in this country has been trained for that.
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Oh I had to laugh when I read that. My father is 70 wears a hat and just bought a car with cruise control.
Sorry, it don't mean a lot to you lot but really described my father to a T.
My dad is approaching 70....years old not mph....and my Mother wants their next car to be an auto. The current one never gets out of third gear ;D
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re tests at various ages, license state and health should be related to weather or not your allowed to continue. The general standard of driving amongst the old especially is appalling imo! Sight tests should take into account periferal vision not just reading a number plate from 60 yards.
Above all, a motorway test. Nobody in this country has been trained for that.
Yes-agreed. Much more could be done.
Saying that, our newly passed drivers may lack experience, but are far better trained than veterans-and up to date.
Perhaps a probation period for two years after passing to give time to do skid pan training, night driving and motorway tuition before granting a "full" licence".
Like an in-depth Pass-Plus, but mandatory-and with an insurance incentive.
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re tests at various ages, license state and health should be related to weather or not your allowed to continue. The general standard of driving amongst the old especially is appalling imo! Sight tests should take into account periferal vision not just reading a number plate from 60 yards. feet maybe. :y
Above all, a motorway test. Nobody in this country has been trained for that.
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lol my grandad dont fit into any of those groups, he is 84 and past his medical with flying colours, when he had is volvo 940 2.3 damn sure he thought it had bloody wings the way he use to drive it, now has a 1.4 astra auto and drives that the same 70 mph + everywere lol
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
If anyone want's to see how good/bad they are at driving, take the RoSPA advanced driving test, everyone could learn a hell of a lot from that.
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
I never have that sort of luck these days !
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
It is probably your magnetism AA!! ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
It is probably your magnetism AA!! ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
I didn't want to say that LZ ::)
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
It is probably your magnetism AA!! ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
I didn't want to say that LZ ::)
Either that or they're using your boot lid as a make-up mirror. ;D
Kevin
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Young girls get me, they seem to drive right up my boot, in Polos, Corsas and Fiestas. >:(
It is probably your magnetism AA!! ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
I didn't want to say that LZ ::)
Either that or they're using your boot lid as a make-up mirror. ;D
Kevin
Oh i just love winding them up, great fun, esp if i need a new exhaust and bumper re spray. :-)
Differant story if i had irmscher kit fitted though. ::)
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re tests at various ages, license state and health should be related to weather or not your allowed to continue. The general standard of driving amongst the old especially is appalling imo! Sight tests should take into account periferal vision not just reading a number plate from 60 yards.
Above all, a motorway test. Nobody in this country has been trained for that.
Actually they do, Dad has just had to have his eye's tested as he is diabetic and has had laser surgery on the back of the eye.
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Many new tech systems on cars leave most drivers baffled too; a simple one is ABS-you deal with an ABS braked car differently in an emergency braking situation than a non-ABS-most of the group had no idea about this, which is now part of the driving test. .....
I wouldn't say baffled ;)
When in the Omega with ABS I just stand on the brakes & let the ABS sort it. When driving the Astra without ABS you can't and are on the lookout for the brakes locking up so you can have another go if need be.
EBA was developed because Merc (?) realised that people weren't prepared to just stand on the brakes and let the car/ABS sort it.
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Driving is all about common sense at the end of the day, unfortunately it is IMPOSSIBLE to teach common sense (that's just something that you learn as you go).
If you want to teach people how to drive/ride, then you need to give them the controls at the earliest possible oppertunity (3 years & up is a good starting point).
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Many new tech systems on cars leave most drivers baffled too; a simple one is ABS-you deal with an ABS braked car differently in an emergency braking situation than a non-ABS-most of the group had no idea about this, which is now part of the driving test. .....
I wouldn't say baffled ;)
When in the Omega with ABS I just stand on the brakes & let the ABS sort it. When driving the Astra without ABS you can't and are on the lookout for the brakes locking up so you can have another go if need be.
EBA was developed because Merc (?) realised that people weren't prepared to just stand on the brakes and let the car/ABS sort it.
Yeah, that's what I mean-the non-ABS needs a different technique to the ABS car. Out of interest, ask your mates and wives whether their car has ABS-most won't know-let alone know the different technique needed :y
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Any more votes?? Closing tomorrow :y