Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Varche on 06 December 2009, 13:24:01
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They will probably be subject to some blanket windfall tax but to my mind this is more government official incompetence like we had with Sir Fred ex RBS boss and his pension.
In the banks case they should have had strings attached to lending them our billions. So my vote goes for sacking some useless Whitehall officials. Of course it won't happen
Varche
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If the bright ones at RBS dont get paid what they know their market value is they will go to work for other banks so it will be harder for us to get our billions back from the profits.
If gormless had his way and put tight limits on all bonuses in London,the talented people in London would move to New York/Hong Kong/Moscow etc,so the country would lose the best talent from the only industry which has made the country any serious money in the last 20 years.
Which is why Gormless tried to get his ideas implemented globally.unfortunately for him the other countries concerned saw how dumb his idea was and laughed at him.
I think we have discussed this once or twicw before. :)
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If the bright ones at RBS dont get paid what they know their market value is they will go to work for other banks so it will be harder for us to get our billions back from the profits.
If gormless had his way and put tight limits on all bonuses in London,the talented people in London would move to New York/Hong Kong/Moscow etc,so the country would lose the best talent from the only industry which has made the country any serious money in the last 20 years.
Which is why Gormless tried to get his ideas implemented globally.unfortunately for him the other countries concerned saw how dumb his idea was and laughed at him.
I think we have discussed this once or twicw before. :)
"Talented" ??? It's their "talent" that stirred all the sh1t in the first place.
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Nope,when wall st. sneezed,London caught a cold,thats how it works.Its all about confidence.The fact is that the boom that we have all enjoyed for the last decade has been purely due to the money being made in the city,which allowed a lot of cheap borrowing.Gormless telling everyone that it would last for ever as he had abolished boom and bust is what caused people to borrow money they couldnt afford to pay back. He also used his influence to lean on people in the banks to keep lending in such a manner even though many of them had reservations about it.
It was always going to happen,it was just a matter of when,and how bad it would be,but when it did happen it was his handling of the economy which made it a lot worse in this country than almost every other country.
He said we would be the first out of recession,fact is most other countries are now out of recession but we are still in it up to our necks.
Anyone who doubts that it takes talent to make millions in profit for an financial institution should go and try it,if it was that easy we would all be doing it. ;)
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If the bright ones at RBS dont get paid what they know their market value is they will go to work for other banks so it will be harder for us to get our billions back from the profits.
If gormless had his way and put tight limits on all bonuses in London,the talented people in London would move to New York/Hong Kong/Moscow etc,so the country would lose the best talent from the only industry which has made the country any serious money in the last 20 years.
Which is why Gormless tried to get his ideas implemented globally.unfortunately for him the other countries concerned saw how dumb his idea was and laughed at him.
I think we have discussed this once or twicw before. :)
"Talented" ??? It's their "talent" that stirred all the sh1t in the first place.
Totally agree.....I'am against the death penalty.......but I believe that an exception should be made for greedy ...incompetent .....inept bankers. :y :y
Liberal Domocrat Vince Cable has said.."let them walk".......and I agree .The Taxpayer (that is you and I) should not be held to ransom by these parasites.
There are plenty of "properly talented"people to take their place.
Bankers need to join the real world. >:( >:( :y
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you really dont have the slightest clue what you are talking about optimist. Politics of envy coupled with absolutely no knowledge of the subject whatsoever. ::)
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I was going to log off, but if there's going to be unpleasantness..................... ::) ;D
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I agree that it takes talent to make millions ---- but also feel that greed did get the better of many --- high risk equals the potential for high return ---- but when it went t*ts up we all started to pay for it except the bankers. In this credit crunch economy ( of whatever making) most of us are facing nil or even negative pay agreements this year, mass job losses..... yet the bankers get mucho grande bonus payments!!!
Yes, it was all handled badly by the govt. but the banks are hardly blameless.
I will allso freely admit to knowing b. all about the subject --- doesn't alter my gut feelings though!
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Nope,when wall st. sneezed,London caught a cold,thats how it works.Its all about confidence.The fact is that the boom that we have all enjoyed for the last decade has been purely due to the money being made in the city,which allowed a lot of cheap borrowing.Gormless telling everyone that it would last for ever as he had abolished boom and bust is what caused people to borrow money they couldnt afford to pay back. He also used his influence to lean on people in the banks to keep lending in such a manner even though many of them had reservations about it.
It was always going to happen,it was just a matter of when,and how bad it would be,but when it did happen it was his handling of the economy which made it a lot worse in this country than almost every other country.
He said we would be the first out of recession,fact is most other countries are now out of recession but we are still in it up to our necks.
Anyone who doubts that it takes talent to make millions in profit for an financial institution should go and try it,if it was that easy we would all be doing it. ;)
I simply don't accept your premise that these guys are "talented" Albitz.....
Why have these so called "talented individuals"had to rely on the members of the general public....cooks ...cleaners...shop workers ...labourers ....etc etc....to help get them out of the sh#t.
The are and always have been a "talentless" bunch.
Do you wear red braces ....by any chance. ::) ::) ;)
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why should they get what they want ? they get paid hundred k or more a year for doing a job they applied for !they say they will go and work for another bank .how can they there is not any jobs out there !they :-/ :-/need to get off their high horses and come down to the real world .they don't have to worry about where thier next mortgage paynents coming from or the gas or lecy bill .brown is a coward and dare not say boo to anyone .what a laugh
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I agree that it takes talent to make millions ---- but also feel that greed did get the better of many --- high risk equals the potential for high return ---- but when it went t*ts up we all started to pay for it except the bankers. In this credit crunch economy ( of whatever making) most of us are facing nil or even negative pay agreements this year, mass job losses..... yet the bankers get mucho grande bonus payments!!!
Yes, it was all handled badly by the govt. but the banks are hardly blameless.
I will allso freely admit to knowing b. all about the subject --- doesn't alter my gut feelings though!
A lot of truth in what you say HC, but the banking industry has paid very heavily indeed,tens of thousands of people have lost their jobs,bonuses are much lower (unless you read the mirror)and everyone is nervous about their future.
I was having a meal at canary wharf a few weeks ago and it was noticable that there were far fewer people around than there was a couple of years ago,the hustle and bustle seemed to have disappeared,and several of the shops and restaurants had closed,due to a lack of business.I was quiet surprised at how obvious the effect of the credit crunch was tbh.
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Nope,when wall st. sneezed,London caught a cold,thats how it works.Its all about confidence.The fact is that the boom that we have all enjoyed for the last decade has been purely due to the money being made in the city,which allowed a lot of cheap borrowing.Gormless telling everyone that it would last for ever as he had abolished boom and bust is what caused people to borrow money they couldnt afford to pay back. He also used his influence to lean on people in the banks to keep lending in such a manner even though many of them had reservations about it.
It was always going to happen,it was just a matter of when,and how bad it would be,but when it did happen it was his handling of the economy which made it a lot worse in this country than almost every other country.
He said we would be the first out of recession,fact is most other countries are now out of recession but we are still in it up to our necks.
Anyone who doubts that it takes talent to make millions in profit for an financial institution should go and try it,if it was that easy we would all be doing it. ;)
I simply don't accept your premise that these guys are "talented" Albitz.....
Why have these so called "talented individuals"had to rely on the members of the general public....cooks ...cleaners...shop workers ...labourers ....etc etc....to help get them out of the sh#t.
The are and always have been a "talentless" bunch.
Do you wear red braces ....by any chance. ::) ::) ;)
May I refer you to my answer to your previous post. ::)
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The talented few seem to also have short memories. It was only a year or so ago that they were all suicidal as their banks (and their fat cat jobs) were going to go under after almost unrestricted lending. Even I could make loads of money doing that if I was confident that when the bubble burst the government would step in and ring fence my bad debts.
The French don't seem to be suffering very much. Their banks lent wisely so their talent could keep on making billions behind closed doors.
V
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why should they get what they want ? they get paid hundred k or more a year for doing a job they applied for !they say they will go and work for another bank .how can they there is not any jobs out there !they :-/ :-/need to get off their high horses and come down to the real world .they don't have to worry about where thier next mortgage paynents coming from or the gas or lecy bill .brown is a coward and dare not say boo to anyone .what a laugh
If they have a good reputation they will walk into another job.A bank will simply elbow someone with a not so good reputation to make room for them.Its dog eat dog,levels of pressure and stress that most of us couldnt contemplate.which is why 3 young traders in their 20,s in the last 3 or 4 years ,have gone to the top of the building they worked at and threw themselves off.
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The talented few seem to also have short memories. It was only a year or so ago that they were all suicidal as their banks (and their fat cat jobs) were going to go under after almost unrestricted lending. Even I could make loads of money doing that if I was confident that when the bubble burst the government would step in and ring fence my bad debts.
The French don't seem to be suffering very much. Their banks lent wisely so their talent could keep on making billions behind closed doors.
V
Most of the banks in London are still making decent profits and havent taken any money from the taxpayer.its only 3 or 4 who have iirc. ;)
Also,the French economy doesnt rely on the finance sector like ours does,they still have a good manufacturing base - cars for example.Finance is responsible for over 20% of the UK economy.
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you really dont have the slightest clue what you are talking about optimist. Politics of envy coupled with absolutely no knowledge of the subject whatsoever. ::)
Thanks for................. your kind comments Albitz ::) ;) :y :y
Much as I would love to continue this debate....I'am unable ........... as I have a 3.00pm appointment.....to give an amful...(well 470ml actually)...of my finest peasant blood....
however.....from this point in time ....I will try and ensure that it is not used........... in order to prolong the lives of greedy bankers... :D :D ;D ;)
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i dont follow politics i think theyre all 2 faced hypocrits and these bankers and their bonuses is a joke theyre just doin the job theyre paid to do so whats wrong with a company christmas meal and a few drinks off yer boss(not thousands of pounds)and this business of walking out id open the door for em :)
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The bankers bonuses are now neither here nor there in the scheme of things and are just a side issue. What is of greater relevance is what a future government will have to do to reduce and erradicate, over many years, the £40,000 of debt that each and every family in this country now carries.
It is the future billions of pounds of public cost cuts in defence, security, health, education, transport, and public building expenditure to come that concerns me more than a tiny percentage of a few self-abusers, sorry bankers, getting a bonus, which will be taxed anyway. ;) ;)
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The bankers bonuses are now neither here nor there in the scheme of things and are just a side issue. What is of greater relevance is what a future government will have to do to reduce and erradicate, over many years, the £40,000 of debt that each and every family in this country now carries.
It is the future billions of pounds of public cost cuts in defence, security, health, education, transport, and public building expenditure to come that concerns me more than a tiny percentage of a few self-abusers, sorry bankers, getting a bonus, which will be taxed anyway. ;) ;)
.......perhaps Lizzie.........but surely ...we could hang a few of them anyway .
They bring nothing worthwhile to society... :y :y
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Independant - let them keep their bonuses but tax at the usual income tax rate.
Bailed out - limit them and use the money to repay us who had to bail them out >:( >:(
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The government had the opportunity to attach whatever conditions they liked to the aid they paid to the banks. It's a bit late the batten down the hatches now, IMHO.
Personally, rather than engineering mergers that caused things like the Lloyds / HBOS debacle, they could have carved them up into units that were "small enough to fail" and made it quite plain to the bankers that if they ended up in the sh1t again, all they would get from the government is a shovel.
The problem is, the banking indusrty knows the country has precious little else that'll generate wealth these days.
Kevin
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The bankers bonuses are now neither here nor there in the scheme of things and are just a side issue. What is of greater relevance is what a future government will have to do to reduce and erradicate, over many years, the £40,000 of debt that each and every family in this country now carries.
It is the future billions of pounds of public cost cuts in defence, security, health, education, transport, and public building expenditure to come that concerns me more than a tiny percentage of a few self-abusers, sorry bankers, getting a bonus, which will be taxed anyway. ;) ;)
True to a point but it is the principle. The government should have nailed this when they bailed them out. But as usual no one will get sacked.
It is a few years since I worked in the dog eat dog world but whatever happened to people being rewarded justly for doing a good job. If you achieved one year your targets got raised the next year so a bonus was harder to achieve.
The country could save a lot by spending less on "defence". Defence from what? We should get out of Germany (that would save 25,000 troops a year) and stop the Trident replacement. That would save N (where n is a number bigger than anyone imagined or forecast due to "unforseen" overuns) billions. Instead we could just get in line and have protection from the EU "defence". Like it or not we are IN the EU and should just participate and not lead if we are truly as poor a country as we say we are.
One final thought is that while all these bankers pocket their millions in bonuses for speculating, spare a thought for your Joe Public reaching retirement age and excercising his private annuity at the rubbish rates currently on offer.
Varche
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.
Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.
Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
One observation I might make regarding the creation of jobs --- the newly created ones all appeat to be at high, seemingly non- productive, levels, whilst the minions on the front line (so to speak) are being radically cut back, having rewards in real terms slashed and being expected to do unrealistic amounts of work in unreallistically shorter times ( targets, targets, targets). The result being --- half the job actually getting done, for which they also get it in the neck from "Joe Public".
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sounds about right HC. :y..........although some would argue that you can never have too many diversity co-ordinators. ::) >:(
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
It sounds almost as if.................. you are talking about a "new breed of super humans" Albitz .......who all us poor people should be so grateful to have around.......... to help us with our finances...............rather than a bunch of arrogant......selfish .......greedy.......city boys .....who would not piss on us if we caught fire.
The British taxpayer............will be paying for decades to try and correct the damage these bastards have caused..............and now senior RBS bosses .....say they will walk .....if they are not allowed to pay huge bonuses ......Unbelievable.... :( :( :(
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I was going to log off, but if there's going to be unpleasantness..................... ::) ;D
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D.
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
It sounds almost as if.................. you are talking about a "new breed of super humans" Albitz .......who all us poor people should be so grateful to have around.......... to help us with our finances...............rather than a bunch of arrogant......selfish .......greedy.......city boys .....who would not piss on us if we caught fire.
The British taxpayer............will be paying for decades to try and correct the damage these bastards have caused..............and now senior RBS bosses .....say they will walk .....if they are not allowed to pay huge bonuses ......Unbelievable.... :( :( :(
Fact 1. RBS bosses "walked" quite some time ago,it is run by different people now.
Fact 2.The bonuses are rarely paid in just money,usually the biggest proportion is paid in share options which cant be taken up for several years.
Fact 3. They pay 50% tax on the bonuses so half of what they get is already redistributed to you and I.
If you applied for a job in the city and were by some fluke succesful,Im sure you wouldnt last 5 minutes,they have no time for whingers in the sqaure mile.
I dont like to be confrontational on the forum but I have spent the last 2 days reading about how you would like to see my daughter strung up from the nearest lampost.
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
It sounds almost as if.................. you are talking about a "new breed of super humans" Albitz .......who all us poor people should be so grateful to have around.......... to help us with our finances...............rather than a bunch of arrogant......selfish .......greedy.......city boys .....who would not piss on us if we caught fire.
The British taxpayer............will be paying for decades to try and correct the damage these bastards have caused..............and now senior RBS bosses .....say they will walk .....if they are not allowed to pay huge bonuses ......Unbelievable.... :( :( :(
Fact 1. RBS bosses "walked" quite some time ago,it is run by different people now.
Fact 2.The bonuses are rarely paid in just money,usually the biggest proportion is paid in share options which cant be taken up for several years.
Fact 3. They pay 50% tax on the bonuses so half of what they get is already redistributed to you and I.
If you applied for a job in the city and were by some fluke succesful,Im sure you wouldnt last 5 minutes,they have no time for whingers in the sqaure mile.
I dont like to be confrontational on the forum but I have spent the last 2 days reading about how you would like to see my daughter strung up from the nearest lampost.
I sympathise, Albs. Remember that there are many, many, people who have the nous to realise that the City brings us in huge revenue and it is partly such revenue that enables the state to finance social programmes such as health and education. The banks pay the market rates. If they cannot (through decree), the employees will go elsewhere, simple.
Even libertarians like DK note this:
http://www.devilskitchen.me.uk/2009/12/oh-look.html
There are some odious comments made on here, but you just need to rise above them and know that there are also many (I hope) who support you and your daughter. :y
It should also be noted that the genesis of the credit crunch was not the direct fault of bankers. Mind you, it takes some multi-coloured thinking to realise that and sometimes it just gets too monochrome on here. >:(
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
It sounds almost as if.................. you are talking about a "new breed of super humans" Albitz .......who all us poor people should be so grateful to have around.......... to help us with our finances...............rather than a bunch of arrogant......selfish .......greedy.......city boys .....who would not piss on us if we caught fire.
The British taxpayer............will be paying for decades to try and correct the damage these bastards have caused..............and now senior RBS bosses .....say they will walk .....if they are not allowed to pay huge bonuses ......Unbelievable.... :( :( :(
Fact 1. RBS bosses "walked" quite some time ago,it is run by different people now.
Fact 2.The bonuses are rarely paid in just money,usually the biggest proportion is paid in share options which cant be taken up for several years.
Fact 3. They pay 50% tax on the bonuses so half of what they get is already redistributed to you and I.
If you applied for a job in the city and were by some fluke succesful,Im sure you wouldnt last 5 minutes,they have no time for whingers in the sqaure mile.
I dont like to be confrontational on the forum but I have spent the last 2 days reading about how you would like to see my daughter strung up from the nearest lampost.
This comment is both petulant and unpleasant......and needless to say completely untrue.............I can only assume that your daughter works in banking.
If you wish to defend....what you see as the "God like " status of bankers ......then that is your prerogative......
However ....in a democracy .....people are allowed to disagree. I disagree.
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Untrue :question
One example of how untrue .....
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1260186631/all
If you left out the words and just used some more full stops,your posts would make more sense. >:(
Other examples from your posts on this thread "I am against the death penalty,but would make an exception for bankers".
"I will try to ensure that none of the blood I give, goes to help prolong the lives of greedy bankers".
In reply to lizzy zooms post about bankers "perhaps Lizzie,but surely we could hang a few of them anyway".
Presumably you cant remember the drivel you write the day after you write it.
A well balanced character - a huge chip on each shoulder.
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To return to the topic for a moment, can anyone tell me exactly what it is these bankers do to earn their salary, and, of course, the fabulous bonuses?
Is it just trading on the stock market and other markets, or is there some other activity they indulge in of which we, the Great British Public, are unaware?
After all, insurance companies and pension funds, not to mention hedge funds and investment companies, all employ traders. Do those people get the same sort of bonuses?
OK, carry on squabbling...
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If it wasnt for the speculating bankers, joe public wouldnt have any funds in his annuity as it is they who speculate on behalf of the pension funds.Joe publics annuity would also be considerably more if Gormless hadnt stolen a great lump of it.
One of the first things he did as chancellor was to introduce an absolutely scandalous tax on private pension funds.He had to do it to put it into the pension pot for the hundreds of thousands of useless and worthless government jobs which have been (and still are being) created in the last 12 years.
It sounds almost as if.................. you are talking about a "new breed of super humans" Albitz .......who all us poor people should be so grateful to have around.......... to help us with our finances...............rather than a bunch of arrogant......selfish .......greedy.......city boys .....who would not piss on us if we caught fire.
The British taxpayer............will be paying for decades to try and correct the damage these bastards have caused..............and now senior RBS bosses .....say they will walk .....if they are not allowed to pay huge bonuses ......Unbelievable.... :( :( :(
Fact 1. RBS bosses "walked" quite some time ago,it is run by different people now.
Fact 2.The bonuses are rarely paid in just money,usually the biggest proportion is paid in share options which cant be taken up for several years.
Fact 3. They pay 50% tax on the bonuses so half of what they get is already redistributed to you and I.
If you applied for a job in the city and were by some fluke succesful,Im sure you wouldnt last 5 minutes,they have no time for whingers in the sqaure mile.
I dont like to be confrontational on the forum but I have spent the last 2 days reading about how you would like to see my daughter strung up from the nearest lampost.
I can quite see how this would upset you -- however, I doubt there are many occupations (or "non-occupations") in the world at karge that have not been vilified by some faction of the populace. I myself have been on the receiving end of such emotion in the past --- but, such is life and the goal is to rise above it.
Human nature, however, is to strike out at whatever is causing you pain and grief. At the moment the bankers are the target, next month the MP's will be back in the firing line --- one day, I am sure I will be back there myself ::)