Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Lizzie_Zoom on 08 February 2010, 15:28:47
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According to our local news that covers where Vulcan XH558 is based, RAF Lynham, "hundreds of thousands of pounds" are required by the end of the month or her flying days could be permantly over! :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Apparently there has been a big drop in donations and sponsorship to keep this Vulvan flying, and even staff are being laid off at the end of this month! :o :o :o :o :o
Desperate times it seems :'( :'( :'( :'(
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Sadly yes....I try to do my bit (I have donated a tenner a month for the last 18 months)
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i also have donated but i think its throwing money into a bottom less pit .we can give money away but our goverment cant look after its own history
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It will be a shame if she is grounded. :'(
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/kjwood/Farnborough/IMGP2066.jpg)
Kevin
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It will be a shame if she is grounded. :'(
(http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w63/kjwood/Farnborough/IMGP2066.jpg)
Kevin
A great photograph of a beautiful aircraft 8-) 8-) :y
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If you can help ... please do .....
http://www.vulcantothesky.org
Information ..
http://www.site.vulcantothesky.org/
:(
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i also have donated but i think its throwing money into a bottom less pit .we can give money away but our goverment cant look after its own history
Yep, preservation of large machines is like that! I know with steam railway engines they constantly require thousands to keep them running, with full overhauls that they must have for reasons of insurance and HM regulations every ten years at the latest - earlier tests are carried out every year, major tests on 5 and 7 years, then the full boiler strip down on 10 - cost well into 6 figure amounts :'( :'( :'(
Aircraft have got the same problems, although if they go wrong they crash, whilst steam engines can blow up!! ::) ::) ::) Both can result in loss of life. :'( :'(
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Beautiful and historic aircraft
I have contributed in the past on many occasions but as mentioned its a bottomless pit and without that major corporate sponsor it always will be the same.....every year a battle to keep her in the air.....
If only the Government of this hole (that GB has become) would make withdrawals from the Treasury for the benefit of the people instead of filling their own pockets all the time......
Sad to see her go if it does happen, but to be honest, I can see no other way of it ending.....
:'( :'( :'(
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Very sad news. I think it's well worthy of lottery funding unlike quite a few worthless projects the lottery has thrown money at in the past.
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Very sad news. I think it's well worthy of lottery funding unlike quite a few worthless projects the lottery has thrown money at in the past.
HLF have poured a lot of money into worthwhile things including part of the Vulcans restoration.
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Despite not having worked for some time, I've pledged a tenner.
How much have the clowns in westminster diddled us via their expenses ?. How long would that keep the Vulcan going for ?.
We need value for money, and I am coming to the opinion that government is always too late with it's decisions, ineffective in what it does, ignores potential geese capable of laying golden eggs, and hence we are in the mess we are. Can't we dump them and get somebody in who knows what they are doing ?.
Ken
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I know that the airframes have to be maintained and constantly inspected, but is the real cost of keeping her flying those Olympus engines?
Concorde was grounded in the end due to the huge costs (even for BA and AF, especially after the Paris crash) and I seem to remember the engines taking the blame with huge maintenance costs and a shortage of spare parts as it was no longer being manufactured. Is it the same for the Vulcan?
I reckon the only way to keep aircraft of this complexity flying in retirement is to have a major sponsor in that field use it for advertising - Virgin Airways for instance - but there again a nuclear bomber designed for mass destruction is probably not PC for a company like Virgin!! ::) ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D
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Virgin did try to buy the Concordes, as some clause said they could be sold for £1 each if BA stopped using them. But BA found a loop hole >:(
Shame, Concord in Virgin colours would have looked very nice, and he would have kept them running for much longer.
couple i took from Bournemouth Air Show...
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/AirShow/DSC_0541.JPG)
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/AirShow/DSC_0565.JPG)
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Any chance of it doing 1 last bombing run before she retires??? Like the Houses of parliment??? ::) ::)
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I know that the airframes have to be maintained and constantly inspected, but is the real cost of keeping her flying those Olympus engines?
There is no support for the engines from Rolls Royce other than the requirements of routine maintenance AIUI. Once the engines they have are out of hours that will be the end of it.
I reckon the only way to keep aircraft of this complexity flying in retirement is to have a major sponsor in that field use it for advertising
In view of its' only role in active combat maybe Fray Bentos or Hormel foods? ;)
In seriousness, it will be a real problem for every historic aircraft of this era and beyond.
Firstly, because the engineering has gone beyond what can be supported by a dedicated team of craftsmen plus a little professional support.
Anyone who can rebuild an engine for a Cessna can do the same on a Merlin engine and keep a Spitfire in the air. Parts are around and, even where they aren't, it's not beyond the capabilities of a team of enthusiasts to get a new piston cast, or get other parts machined, etc.
It's a totally different ball game with a much more complex aircraft like the Vulcan. Materials and techniques used were state of the art and rare at the time, never went into common use and are now obsolete and unsupportable.
Secondly, quite apart from the correct functioning of the aircraft we have the paperwork required to make it fly.
European airworthiness requirements now call on an aircraft to receive "type support" from the manufacturer or a competent body able to fully support the aircraft in operation.
For a relatively simple aircraft one could set oneself up as such a body. The complexity behind being able to tick that box for a complex aircraft along with the potential liabilities if something goes pear shaped are enormous. I bet Airbus breathed a sigh of relief when the last Concorde touched down and they could tear up that particular bit of paper! They won't be persuaded to dig it out of the wastepaper basket for anyone, believe me, and without that, it doesn't fly.
So, there are huge hurdles to clear to achieve a project like this. Credit to the TVOC for finding sufficient loopholes and pledges to manage it with this aircraft, for now, but I'll be very surprised if many more types follow it into preservation other than as a museum piece. :'(
Kevin
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I know that the airframes have to be maintained and constantly inspected, but is the real cost of keeping her flying those Olympus engines?
There is no support for the engines from Rolls Royce other than the requirements of routine maintenance AIUI. Once the engines they have are out of hours that will be the end of it.
I reckon the only way to keep aircraft of this complexity flying in retirement is to have a major sponsor in that field use it for advertising
In view of its' only role in active combat maybe Fray Bentos or Hormel foods? ;)
In seriousness, it will be a real problem for every historic aircraft of this era and beyond.
Firstly, because the engineering has gone beyond what can be supported by a dedicated team of craftsmen plus a little professional support.
Anyone who can rebuild an engine for a Cessna can do the same on a Merlin engine and keep a Spitfire in the air. Parts are around and, even where they aren't, it's not beyond the capabilities of a team of enthusiasts to get a new piston cast, or get other parts machined, etc.
It's a totally different ball game with a much more complex aircraft like the Vulcan. Materials and techniques used were state of the art and rare at the time, never went into common use and are now obsolete and unsupportable.
Secondly, quite apart from the correct functioning of the aircraft we have the paperwork required to make it fly.
European airworthiness requirements now call on an aircraft to receive "type support" from the manufacturer or a competent body able to fully support the aircraft in operation.
For a relatively simple aircraft one could set oneself up as such a body. The complexity behind being able to tick that box for a complex aircraft along with the potential liabilities if something goes pear shaped are enormous. I bet Airbus breathed a sigh of relief when the last Concorde touched down and they could tear up that particular bit of paper! They won't be persuaded to dig it out of the wastepaper basket for anyone, believe me, and without that, it doesn't fly.
So, there are huge hurdles to clear to achieve a project like this. Credit to the TVOC for finding sufficient loopholes and pledges to manage it with this aircraft, for now, but I'll be very surprised if many more types follow it into preservation other than as a museum piece. :'(
Kevin
Thanks Kevin :y :y :y
I think you have summed it all up nicely there and basicly confirmed what I was thinking ;) ;)
The Vulcan will end up being grounded permantly, either this time round, or the next :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
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Virgin did try to buy the Concordes, as some clause said they could be sold for £1 each if BA stopped using them. But BA found a loop hole >:(
Shame, Concord in Virgin colours would have looked very nice, and he would have kept them running for much longer.
couple i took from Bournemouth Air Show...
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/AirShow/DSC_0541.JPG)
(https://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/AirShow/DSC_0565.JPG)
Great photos Tunnie! :-* :-* :-* :y
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I would be more inclined to stump up a bit of cash if they threw the bloody thing about a bit more at air shows like they used to do. A lot of people contributed to its restoration fund in the belief that future displays would be worth watching, sadly that has not been the case and I think the 'kid glove policy' has backfired :(
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I would be more inclined to stump up a bit of cash if they threw the bloody thing about a bit more at air shows like they used to do. A lot of people contributed to its restoration fund in the belief that future displays would be worth watching, sadly that has not been the case and I think the 'kid glove policy' has backfired :(
It's a trade off between throwing it about and fatiguing it so that it costs more to maintain and will run out of airframe and engine life quicker, or establishing limits which will allow it to continue for a worthwhile display life.
It is not like a steam locomotive or classic car where it can be used at ten tenths and then restored to perfection by just throwing money at it (if the money were there). It does have a very finite life left as an airworthy aircraft and once that's gone, there is no way it can be restored given all the money in the world.
It is also, I would imagine, operating on a very much more restricted placard than it would have been in RAF days, so the pilot is simply not permitted to fly it to the limits that would once have been permissible.
Kevin