Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: bob.dent on 12 January 2011, 09:54:30
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
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that has always pi$$ed me off ,tax on tax >:(
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makes me really angry how this goverment are making sooo much from the british motorists,and all company fleet vehicles,lorries etc, i put £1250 p week in the artic and the company has 200 vehicles so lets hope this fuel hike isnt going to close such companies down!! >:(
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makes me really angry how this goverment are making sooo much from the british motorists,and all company fleet vehicles,lorries etc, i put £1250 p week in the artic and the company has 200 vehicles so lets hope this fuel hike isnt going to close such companies down!! >:(
:o :o :o
I can't imagine what Eddie Stobbart's total weekly fuel bill must be! :-/
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makes me really angry how this every goverment are making sooo much from the british motorists,and all company fleet vehicles,lorries etc, i put £1250 p week in the artic and the company has 200 vehicles so lets hope this fuel hike isnt going to close such companies down!! >:(
Corrected for you! :y
I personaly dont buy this 'companies going out of buisness' talk. There all in the same boat and all paying the same prices.
They will only dissappear if
1) They are not upto the job and inefficent
2) There is drop in haulage traffic.
If they are savvy then the same amount of stuff still needs moving from a to b.
Ultimately, the fuel cost will impact on the cost of finished goods and hit you and me.
But, as we have said so many times, we are paying the price of terrible fiscal management over the last 10+ years.
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Quite agree but, as always it seems to be us "honest joes" who are the soft target, and are hit first and hit hardest.
I would like to see the Govt. take its foot off the neck of the motorist and average working man just a little bit, and do sooooo much more to dismantle the enormously expensive machinery of the so called welfare state, which grew into a bottomless money pit during the last administration.
I dont mind taking my turn when it comes, but I dont think I should be at the front of the queue - again. ;)
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how about we start a protest group on facebook...pick a date say sept 1st...and in protest..everybody sends there tax discs to swansea and declares there vehicles sorn..but still drives em...if we can get a millionfacebookers in on it they can't fine us all..imagine the chaos at swansea with a million refunds.. :y
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how about we start a protest group on facebook...pick a date say sept 1st...and in protest..everybody sends there tax discs to swansea and declares there vehicles sorn..but still drives em...if we can get a millionfacebookers in on it they can't fine us all..imagine the chaos at swansea with a million refunds.. :y
Nice idea in theory, but all you would end up with is a criminal record and a nice big fine! Some of us cannot afford to obtain either.
Let's face it, you either stop driving due to the cost, or you accept that petrol is dearer for all kinds of reasons and just pay it ;) ;)
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don't think driving offences are on a criminal record..and how are they going to fine a million plus people
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how about we start a protest group on facebook...pick a date say sept 1st...and in protest..everybody sends there tax discs to swansea and declares there vehicles sorn..but still drives em...if we can get a millionfacebookers in on it they can't fine us all..imagine the chaos at swansea with a million refunds.. :y
Nice idea in theory, but all you would end up with is a criminal record and a nice big fine! Some of us cannot afford to obtain either.
Let's face it, you either stop driving due to the cost, or you accept that petrol is dearer for all kinds of reasons and just pay it ;) ;)
Unfortunately, that just the problem with us Brits, we just accept it without so much as a whimper. :( The French wouldn't stand for it, there would be road and port blockades and probably riots!
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tell me why...2 years ago when oil prices went through the roof and it was about $145 a barrell fuel went up to 1.29 per litre....price right now is $91.12 per barrel...fuel is 1.29 ?? ok add 5% vat ...but somebody is really taking the piss here >:(
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tell me why...2 years ago when oil prices went through the roof and it was about $145 a barrell fuel went up to 1.29 per litre....price right now is $91.12 per barrel...fuel is 1.29 ?? ok add 5% vat ...but somebody is really taking the piss here >:(
Simple, the dollar:pound exchange rate is poor at the moment and the real cost of the fuel is a small percentage of teh total paid
Simples :y
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don't think driving offences are on a criminal record..and how are they going to fine a million plus people
No, minor ones are not, but serious ones are. Once you start depriving HM Government due tax, driving your car without the insurance cover that would be withdrawn once you start refusing to tax your car, and be part of a mass movement doing the same, then rest assured it will become quickly a criminal offence!
As for protesting, yes fine, but the UK Government, like most in the western world, is in no position to reduce taxation as it is required to fight the huge deficit the country has. If they did then it would only go on other commodities that you and I need.
No, the only way to fight it is to use your car less, or purchase a 'noddy', low mpg / 'green' vehicle, and so deprive quiet legally HM Government of their fuel tax income ;) ;)
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makes me really angry how this every goverment are making sooo much from the british motorists,and all company fleet vehicles,lorries etc, i put £1250 p week in the artic and the company has 200 vehicles so lets hope this fuel hike isnt going to close such companies down!! >:(
Corrected for you! :y
I personaly dont buy this 'companies going out of buisness' talk. There all in the same boat and all paying the same prices.
They will only dissappear if
1) They are not upto the job and inefficent
2) There is drop in haulage traffic.
If they are savvy then the same amount of stuff still needs moving from a to b.
Ultimately, the fuel cost will impact on the cost of finished goods and hit you and me.
But, as we have said so many times, we are paying the price of terrible fiscal management over the last 10+ years.
Sorry Mark but I would have to disagree with you there. I posted in the other topic about fuel prices and its effect on my job. All the big companies i.e. The supermarket fleets, Stobarts etc have their own fuel bunkering so they are buying in bulk and saving a fair bit and can buy in ahead of the rise in price. Now, particularly the supermarkets, have put up the prices on the shelf claiming they have to do this because their transportation costs have gone up due to the fuel price rise so it is costing them more to deliver the loads to their shops but what about all the companies that deliver ALL the goods to those distribution depots, we dont get paid any more and the supermarkets wont pay us any extra to compensate for the rise. So we still get paid the same as we did this time last year but our fuel costs have risen 50% so hauliers are JUST keeping their heads above water with the fuel costs. On top of that, my gaffer just got his renewal for his insurance cover, which is three different policies, one for goods in transit, one for the vehicle and another for the employees, the new policies have nearly doubled, partly because the policies have went up as they always do, but also because the govment has slapped MORE tax on the insurance!
As for the likes of Stobart, they dont bother with transport costs as that is not how they make their money. They make all their money in warehousing so the tranport costs dont matter to them, basically the motors break even on the runs and because of the warehousing Stobarts can go in and cut the rates on runs with any company to get the work and still wont affect their transport costs. Thats why hauliers cant get good work these days! Also Stobarts have their own rail network which nets them a very high turnover
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Lets be realistic, your not competing with Stobarts and the big boys hence its a level playing field in your sector.
So, either ALL the SME's in that field go bust or something gives.
Reality is, its the weaker and more poorly run ones that go and hey, thats the capitalist world!
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
I have to agree. Charging value added tax on duty is simply immoral. They haven't added value, just slapped a duty on it, so there is, in principle, no justification for applying vat to that element. :(
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don't think driving offences are on a criminal record..and how are they going to fine a million plus people
Slowly, but with great deliberation BB. :y
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don't think driving offences are on a criminal record..and how are they going to fine a million plus people
It's all computerised as soon as you go past an ANPR machine (which of course, not all million+ people will do) so all that happens is they send a lot of letters and fine a lot of people.
Or crush a lot of cars..
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bobdent - any you forgot that you are taxed when you earn it as well....
But the standing government need all that tax, and more, to pay for the cash wasted into the ineffective, inefficent large departments such as NHS and Schools over the past 13yrs.
Also remember, the Tory/LD plans do not go far enough - the actual deficit (not amount we owe, but amount we annually overspend by) will be 'only' £135bn a year in 5yrs. To balance that in five years would still need an extra £2,250 for every man, woman and child, working or not, a year extra tax.
We are paying approx £25m an hour in interest payments on our debt. £600m a day. £219bn a year. Thats 'wasted' tax that the last 12yrs of mismanagement have caused. Thats about £3,500 from every man, woman and child per year.
To pay off our debt tomorrow, even man, woman and child, whether working, retired, at school, lazy blood sucking breakwit, or in a cot, would need to pay £23,000
It seems that the current governement cannot get the scale of this problem over to the masses, as it would appear than most of the population cannot see a problem :o
Maybe something dramatic, such as closing the NHS entirely which no decrease in NI payments, is needed to show people the scale of the issue. Even closing that down, and ignoring the burden that would generate on the welfare system, would only half our annual deficit (NHS is £90bn-£110bn - the department is so inffective, it doesn't know!!).
Unfortunately, its also not a simple case of taxing the rich... ...there aren't enough of them. EVERYBODY is going to have to take a significant hit on this one, to pay for the gross incompitence of the previous 12yrs of government. I know I'm just the stupid kid from the local comprehensive, but even I know to save money during the boom years, and borrow during the bust years..... .....maybe Mr Brown and Mr Blair believed their own BS about 'the end of boom and bust economy'. Retards.
The only solution is higher tax in parallel with massively reduced spending. I just hope the governement have the balls to do it, else we are only heading towards bankrupcy.
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
I have to agree. Charging value added tax on duty is simply immoral. They haven't added value, just slapped a duty on it, so there is, in principle, no justification for applying vat to that element. :(
So your solution? We have to pay more tax. No way around that. Maybe put VAT on food? Put full VAT on energy? Children's cloths?
Somebody, somewhere has to pay for New Labour.
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
I have to agree. Charging value added tax on duty is simply immoral. They haven't added value, just slapped a duty on it, so there is, in principle, no justification for applying vat to that element. :(
So your solution? We have to pay more tax. No way around that. Maybe put VAT on food? Put full VAT on energy? Children's cloths?
Somebody, somewhere has to pay for New Labour.
Exactly right TB! :y :y :y :y
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can someone tell me, how the tories spending plans would have differed from those of the labour government? exactly, not one jot (with the exception that they'd have been even easier on their friends in the city).
funny how you tell a lie often enough it becomes the truth.
dont believe the hype, read Hansard.
thank you.
message ends.
:y
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
I have to agree. Charging value added tax on duty is simply immoral. They haven't added value, just slapped a duty on it, so there is, in principle, no justification for applying vat to that element. :(
So your solution? We have to pay more tax. No way around that. Maybe put VAT on food? Put full VAT on energy? Children's cloths?
Somebody, somewhere has to pay for New Labour.
Only through a growing economy can you hope to pay back the money in good time. These tax hikes will have the affect of slowing the economy and causing unemployment to rise, which in turn leads to higher government spending on welfare. Whilst I agree that wasteful spending should be slashed, tax income must be maximised and, for that, you need to set up a fiscal environment which stimulates the economy. It really is that simple. Too simple for Cameron/Clegg, though.
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bobdent - any you forgot that you are taxed when you earn it as well....
But the standing government need all that tax, and more, to pay for the cash wasted into the ineffective, inefficent large departments such as NHS and Schools over the past 13yrs.
Also remember, the Tory/LD plans do not go far enough - the actual deficit (not amount we owe, but amount we annually overspend by) will be 'only' £135bn a year in 5yrs. To balance that in five years would still need an extra £2,250 for every man, woman and child, working or not, a year extra tax.
We are paying approx £25m an hour in interest payments on our debt. £600m a day. £219bn a year. Thats 'wasted' tax that the last 12yrs of mismanagement have caused. Thats about £3,500 from every man, woman and child per year.
To pay off our debt tomorrow, even man, woman and child, whether working, retired, at school, lazy blood sucking breakwit, or in a cot, would need to pay £23,000
It seems that the current governement cannot get the scale of this problem over to the masses, as it would appear than most of the population cannot see a problem :o
Maybe something dramatic, such as closing the NHS entirely which no decrease in NI payments, is needed to show people the scale of the issue. Even closing that down, and ignoring the burden that would generate on the welfare system, would only half our annual deficit (NHS is £90bn-£110bn - the department is so inffective, it doesn't know!!).
Unfortunately, its also not a simple case of taxing the rich... ...there aren't enough of them. EVERYBODY is going to have to take a significant hit on this one, to pay for the gross incompitence of the previous 12yrs of government. I know I'm just the stupid kid from the local comprehensive, but even I know to save money during the boom years, and borrow during the bust years..... .....maybe Mr Brown and Mr Blair believed their own BS about 'the end of boom and bust economy'. Retards.
The only solution is higher tax in parallel with massively reduced spending. I just hope the governement have the balls to do it, else we are only heading towards bankrupcy.
Stone me Jaime, a lot of political facts and figures in that post :o You really should get out more! ::) ;D
On a serious note though, some good points but I still think it's unethical to tax tax.
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How is it that the government can get away with taxing tax? Well that's exactly what they do with fuel - about 70% of the cost of fuel at the pump is duty and yet the duty is also subject to VAT. In short they are adding tax to tax. >:( It's no different to being mugged!! >:( >:(
I have to agree. Charging value added tax on duty is simply immoral. They haven't added value, just slapped a duty on it, so there is, in principle, no justification for applying vat to that element. :(
So your solution? We have to pay more tax. No way around that. Maybe put VAT on food? Put full VAT on energy? Children's cloths?
Somebody, somewhere has to pay for New Labour.
Only through a growing economy can you hope to pay back the money in good time. These tax hikes will have the affect of slowing the economy and causing unemployment to rise, which in turn leads to higher government spending on welfare. Whilst I agree that wasteful spending should be slashed, tax income must be maximised and, for that, you need to set up a fiscal environment which stimulates the economy. It really is that simple. Too simple for Cameron/Clegg, though.
i agree with Nick :o :o :o
i think i need a lie down now ;)