Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Lizzie_Zoom on 28 March 2011, 19:42:57
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From 1935 to 1939 there was a tremendous movement within the transport industry to streamline. With Steam locomotives, and the trains that went with them, they were streamlined to gain a speed advantage and to look futuristict.
First came the streamliners of the LNER in 1935; Nigel Gresley's A4 Pacific passenger express locomotives.
This is one example of a preserved A4, LNER No. 4464, BR 60019 Bittern built in 1937at Doncaster
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/A4_60019_Bittern.jpg)
Also preserved A4 Mallard LNER 4468, BR 60022, built in 1937/38 at Doncaster, set the world speed record for a steam engine at 126 mph on 3rd July 1938 (my father was on the train!)
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/Mallard4468_in_York.jpg)
Not to be outdone William Stanier, CME at the LMS introduced the Coronation Class of Pacific passenger express locomotive in 1937 to complete with the LNER expresses to the North.
This beauty is the preserved example LMS 6229, BR 46229, Duchess of Hamilton, built in 1938 at Crewe, rebuilt into a non-streamliner in 1947, but has now been restored into streamline status by the National Railway Museum - beautiful!! :-* :-* :-* 8-) 8-) 8-)
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/DuchessofHamilton6229.jpg)
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/DuchessofHamiltonstreamlineloco.jpg)
The GWR mounted a feeble attempt at streamlining in 1935 after Gresley had introduced his version, on one Castle and one King class of locomotives; but they are not worth talking about!
Well, what do you think?! GWR Castle 5005 Manorbier Castle after emerging from the Swindon works in 1935 ;D ;D
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/CastleStreamlined.jpg)
Now streamlined road vehicles also started to appear:
A Piece Silver Arrow Car 1933 (well the USA was always ahead of us on this 'science'!! ::) ::) ::))
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Transport/PieceSilverArrowCar1933.jpg)
A Lancia Aprilia 1938:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Transport/LanciaApriliaSport1938.jpg)
Well what can you add to the "Streamline" story pre-WW2 - or later?! :D :D :D ;)
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So the subject of streamlining engineering history on locomotives, cars, etc attracts no comments? :o :o :o :o
Oh well, fair enough, I will stay clear of "engineering" subjects on this Car Forum!! ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :y :y
Funny old world!! :P :P ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
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Lizzie, I'll come to your rescue!
You're obviously interested in early streamlining attempts and engineering in general, so you'll probably already be aware of the maverick American designer and engineer Buckminster Fuller.
His 'Dymaxion' car, a 20 foot long teardrop shaped aerodynamic wonder, is in the following youtube video....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlLZE23EJKs
P.S - Is the Duchess of Hamilton at York Railway Museum?
When I was there last (early 2008), I'm sure it wasn't, because if it had been, I'd have spent hours just staring at it! That is FABULOUS! :)
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Lizzie, I'll come to your rescue!
You're obviously interested in early streamlining attempts and engineering in general, so you'll probably already be aware of the maverick American designer and engineer Buckminster Fuller.
His 'Dymaxion' car, a 20 foot long teardrop shaped aerodynamic wonder, is in the following youtube video....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlLZE23EJKs
P.S - Is the Duchess of Hamilton at York Railway Museum?
When I was there last (early 2008), I'm sure it wasn't, because if it had been, I'd have spent hours just staring at it! That is FABULOUS! :)
Thanks Tony! :y :y :y :y
I thought somebody must want to contribute on this interesting subject, and you have come up with an early beauty!! 8-) 8-) 8-) :y
No, I must admit I knew nothing about Buckminster Fuller, but his car has intrigued me and I must research him further! :D :D Thanks again! :y :y :y
As for the Duchess of Hamilton I understand she is back in York as a star exhibit, as in the picture I posted, following her re-streamlining. Is she not beautiful and stunning?! As you say she IS FABULOUS, and like you I just kept on looking at the pictures I could find on her. All my 1930 photographs of these wonderful streamliners are in black and white, so to see her in the form she is in in full LMS crimson lake is quite something! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* ;)
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A lot of the early streamlining attempts were really not much more than guesswork, as later drag co-efficient tests confirmed.
As stylistic exercises go though, I love 'em.
Always liked the Chrysler Airflow -
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.thelincolnstudio.com/1934_Airflow_Chrysler.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.thelincolnstudio.com/Short_Stories_by_Our_Own.html&h=600&w=799&sz=86&tbnid=wA9BVm5GJ2bJeM:&tbnh=107&tbnw=143&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dchrysler%2Bairflow%2Bpictures&zoom=1&q=chrysler+airflow+pictures&hl=en&usg=__qkhereSUnXyWC9QDKfiQCJfAjxA=&sa=X&ei=2k2TTdnMN4eXhQeujJGVDw&ved=0CB0Q9QEwAA
I beleive they were built in Britain for a while, too.
Another impossible to ignore early streamliner would be Hans Ledwinka's Tatra T77.....
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://files.conceptcarz.com/img/Tatra/38-Tatra_T77a_Limo-DV-08-CC_0005.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.conceptcarz.com/view/photo/281975,873/1938-tatra-t77_photo.aspx&h=680&w=1024&sz=225&tbnid=Noxye-gUjUkgqM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3DTatra%2BT77%2Bpictures&zoom=1&q=Tatra+T77+pictures&hl=en&usg=__oNCRZshLSg1XyF_opDbiIUWwZeE=&sa=X&ei=bU-TTYbhDIu54gaUm-CUAg&sqi=2&ved=0CB4Q9QEwAQ
A mighty V8 sits beyond the rear axle! ;D
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Some of those trains are BEAUTIFUL..!!!
If looks could kill......(they probs did if you got hit at 130mph!!! :o)
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something about 30's design I really like, my flat was built in 1935, massive rooms and celling, much better than modern builds.
Office builds are the same, where I work we used to have this:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/bd1ddf98-1500-42b6-9afa-7379.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/1314d0ca-e2fd-412d-b9d2-9a91.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/23c55ec8-fdbb-4a75-a11c-67ba.jpg)
But they demolished it, the day before it was due to be listed. A bank holiday Monday no less!
Now got this 80's pile of poo where I work:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/sky.jpg)
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Cannot believe they demolished that.....
Criminals.
So obviously done just in time for them to get permissions for that piece of 80's blandness.
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Some of those trains are BEAUTIFUL..!!!
If looks could kill......(they probs did if you got hit at 130mph!!! :o)
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Well 4468 Mallard wrecked destroyed its motion in its 126 mph run!! ::) ::) ::) :D :D :D :y
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something about 30's design I really like, my flat was built in 1935, massive rooms and celling, much better than modern builds.
Office builds are the same, where I work we used to have this:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/bd1ddf98-1500-42b6-9afa-7379.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/1314d0ca-e2fd-412d-b9d2-9a91.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/23c55ec8-fdbb-4a75-a11c-67ba.jpg)
But they demolished it, the day before it was due to be listed. A bank holiday Monday no less!
Now got this 80's pile of poo where I work:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/sky.jpg)
That was criminal Tunnie!! :o :o :o :'( :'( :'( :'(
To destroy a 1930s building of such magnificent architecture and pure artwork is just not right, but thank God some of those buildings have been saved. It is such a pity that your Firestone was not so lucky. So close, yet so far! :'( :'( :'( :'(
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A lot of the early streamlining attempts were really not much more than guesswork, as later drag co-efficient tests confirmed.
As stylistic exercises go though, I love 'em.
Always liked the Chrysler Airflow -
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.thelincolnstudio.com/1934_Airflow_Chrysler.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.thelincolnstudio.com/Short_Stories_by_Our_Own.html&h=600&w=799&sz=86&tbnid=wA9BVm5GJ2bJeM:&tbnh=107&tbnw=143&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dchrysler%2Bairflow%2Bpictures&zoom=1&q=chrysler+airflow+pictures&hl=en&usg=__qkhereSUnXyWC9QDKfiQCJfAjxA=&sa=X&ei=2k2TTdnMN4eXhQeujJGVDw&ved=0CB0Q9QEwAA
I beleive they were built in Britain for a while, too.
Another impossible to ignore early streamliner would be Hans Ledwinka's Tatra T77.....
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://files.conceptcarz.com/img/Tatra/38-Tatra_T77a_Limo-DV-08-CC_0005.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.conceptcarz.com/view/photo/281975,873/1938-tatra-t77_photo.aspx&h=680&w=1024&sz=225&tbnid=Noxye-gUjUkgqM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=150&prev=/images%3Fq%3DTatra%2BT77%2Bpictures&zoom=1&q=Tatra+T77+pictures&hl=en&usg=__oNCRZshLSg1XyF_opDbiIUWwZeE=&sa=X&ei=bU-TTYbhDIu54gaUm-CUAg&sqi=2&ved=0CB4Q9QEwAQ
A mighty V8 sits beyond the rear axle! ;D
What beauties they are! What style! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :y :y
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Flipping through a friends pictures from the 2008 Amelia Concours D'Elegance in Florida and saw this:
(http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/180722_10150102308587460_618167459_6207408_2773618_n.jpg)
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Flipping through a friends pictures from the 2008 Amelia Concours D'Elegance in Florida and saw this:
(http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/180722_10150102308587460_618167459_6207408_2773618_n.jpg)
Smashing!! 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-) 8-)
That is streamlining in the full Aaron!! Well found :y :y :y :y
Anyone know the history of that car? :-? :-? :-?
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There was only the one shot of that car, sadly, and no title to tell what it may be..
I just realised he goes every year, though, so have some more streamliner pictures:
From 2005:
'Type 57 C' owned by Ralph Lauren:
(http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/180117_10150102335947460_618167459_6207969_3628980_n.jpg)
(http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/180447_10150102336187460_618167459_6207973_366118_n.jpg)
(http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/181965_10150102315292460_618167459_6207563_41865_n.jpg)
Scarab:
(http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/179885_10150102322427460_618167459_6207725_2011497_n.jpg)
(http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/168710_10150102323062460_618167459_6207744_3778034_n.jpg)
No clue what this is!
(http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/181633_10150102323412460_618167459_6207756_7556357_n.jpg)
(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/168068_10150102323537460_618167459_6207759_8083348_n.jpg)
2009:
(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/181560_10150102288692460_618167459_6206936_1965106_n.jpg)
Not 'streamlining' but I have to include it since they're one of my all time favourite cars:
(http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/181930_10150102289827460_618167459_6206977_6098422_n.jpg)
(I'm building the new garage purely so I can build a replica, though I think pictured is a slab-side 289, and I'd rather a 427 S/C replica)
The decade that aerodynamics forgot:
(http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/180844_10150102290692460_618167459_6207002_6389681_n.jpg)
(http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/182729_10150102297947460_618167459_6207218_1080910_n.jpg)
And from 2010:
(http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/180181_10150102272817460_618167459_6206558_4454131_n.jpg)
(http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash1/168605_10150102271912460_618167459_6206533_4077135_n.jpg)
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Wow Aaron! :o :o :o :o
Now you are finding some even more beautiful beauties!! :D :D :D :y :y :y :y :y :y :y
What style and elegance most of them have 8-) 8-) 8-)
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love the aero car or whatever you want to call it.
crazy. :D
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I'm glad you said 'most' Lizzie ;D Some of them are .. not attractive (the Scarab and that red & white bus thing..)
And yeah - the car with the prop, can't see that getting Type Approval these days, can you? Pedestrian impact testing would have to be renamed! ;D
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I'm glad you said 'most' Lizzie ;D Some of them are .. not attractive (the Scarab and that red & white bus thing..)
And yeah - the car with the prop, can't see that getting Type Approval these days, can you? Pedestrian impact testing would have to be renamed! ;D
............and the car to The Shredder! :D :D :D ;)
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Lizzie, if Aaron's postings are producing desirable stirrings within you :o, then check out the coachbuilders Figoni et Falaschi; they're French, operated mainly in the 30's, and made some outrageous bodies, most notably for Talbot / Talbot-Lago.
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Lizzie, if Aaron's postings are producing desirable stirrings within you :o, then check out the coachbuilders Figoni et Falaschi; they're French, operated mainly in the 30's, and made some outrageous bodies, most notably for Talbot / Talbot-Lago.
Thanks Tony! :y :y :y
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Well Tony I have started the research and very quickly found this ; that company's 1939 contribution to streamlining!! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* :-*
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/Delahaye165M-1939-FigonietFalaschi.jpg)
Now look at Duchess of Hamilton again!:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/DuchessofHamiltonstreamlineloco.jpg)
Car mimicking the locomotive?! :D :D :D :-* :-* :-* ;)
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...............and again:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/delahaye-1936-12239.jpg)
Not sure if Aaron hasn't shown another view of this, but it is a 1936 Delahaye 135 Competitione Coupe
:-* :-* :-* :y :y :y :y
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World War II stopped streamlining on many forms of transport, but of course aeroplanes!!
On the railways it has always remained doubtful that streamling on steam locomotives had any beneficial effect on performance, and thus costs, but it was certainly a great PR exercise for the two main Big Four railway rivals.
However, as the LNER and LMS were dismantling the streamlined casings on their loco's due to the need to save on maintenance costs, and help counteract a sudden shortage of labour, which were heightened by so much panelling in the way of parts requiring servicing, my hero, the Chief Mechanical Technician*** of the Southern Railway was about to launch his version of streamlining!
That great man was Oliver V.Bulleid. :y :y :y
In February 1941 he managed to get approval to use vital war steel for a new revolutionary class of locomotive. It was the Merchant Navy Class, Pacific locomotive, of which 30 would eventually be built, including an initial batch of 10 in March 1938, which were actually built during 1941/2 at Eastleigh.
They featured Bulleid Firth-Brown wheels (No spokes, but holes!), and an infamous chain-driven three row crankshaft operating valve gears for each cylinder, in a 40 gallon oil bath that also enclosed the sets of motion between the frames, that regularly caught fire when becoming too hot!! They also had clasp-type brakes, welded steel firbox with thermic syphons, and a boiler pressure of 280lb psi. The whole boiler was clad in streamlined casing right down to the frames.
The first out of the shops in February 1941 was Channel Packet No. 21C1, later BR No. 35001:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/21C1_35001_Channel_Packet-1.jpg)
This is one of her sisters, No 21C4 (later BR 35004) Cunard White Star pulling an Express out of Waterloo:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/Trains%20Planes%20Buses%20%20Cars/35004aidioterloo.jpg)
If you are wondering about Bulleid's unique locomotive numbering system it was simple but clever.
A Pacific class loco has a wheel arrangement of 4-6-2. So Bullied numbered his loco's of the Pacific type 21C; 2 axles on the front bogie, 1 axle on the pony truck (under the footplate) and C for the three main driving axles (a loco with just two would be classed as "B", or one with 5 would be "E"). Then comes the Southern Railway number of the locomotive, in Channel Packets case, "1" or for Cunard White Star, "4". ;) ;)
These wonderful engines, along with most of his later West Country / Battle of Britain class locomotives, which looked almost the same but were lighter, were rebuilt by BR from 1958, the first being BR. No. 35018 British India Line, which I had the pleasure helping to start restoration on in the late 1970s.
This is 35005 (previous SR 21C5) Canadian Pacific on the Mid-Hants Railway in rebuilt form:
(http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk247/lizziefreeman/y1pk176idNrUKOnESud9OLqOb-4lRR53NkA.jpg)
:y :y :y
*** I keep typing "Technician", but that word "Technician" keeps on appearing!! >:( >:( >:(
What the ............!!! >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
EN-GIN-EER!!!!! Hurrah!!! That bloody word filter!!! ::) ::) ::)
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something about 30's design I really like, my flat was built in 1935, massive rooms and celling, much better than modern builds.
Office builds are the same, where I work we used to have this:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/bd1ddf98-1500-42b6-9afa-7379.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/1314d0ca-e2fd-412d-b9d2-9a91.jpg)
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/23c55ec8-fdbb-4a75-a11c-67ba.jpg)
But they demolished it, the day before it was due to be listed. A bank holiday Monday no less!
Now got this 80's pile of poo where I work:
(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/sky.jpg)
The classic Art Deco period. My two favourite buildings from this period are the Empire State building (around 1930).....and The Chrysler building (around 1929)
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(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/1314d0ca-e2fd-412d-b9d2-9a91.jpg)
I like that - I know I'm digressing from Lizzie's post really..
Art Deco architecture is beautiful in my eyes - I used to love some of the buildings that turned up in Poirot, too (yes, yes, I know).
Of course I'm also extremely partial to a bit of brutalist architecture - somewhat of a departure from Art Deco & Streamlining! This being one of my favourites:
http://deliciousghost.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/220a.jpg
(Won't let me embed the image for some reason)
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thats rather different. :o
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(http://dl.dropbox.com/u/803897/Buildings/1314d0ca-e2fd-412d-b9d2-9a91.jpg)
I like that - I know I'm digressing from Lizzie's post really..
Art Deco architecture is beautiful in my eyes - I used to love some of the buildings that turned up in Poirot, too (yes, yes, I know).
Of course I'm also extremely partial to a bit of brutalist architecture - somewhat of a departure from Art Deco & Streamlining! This being one of my favourites:
http://deliciousghost.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/220a.jpg
(Won't let me embed the image for some reason)
To me Art Deco buildings often appear streamlined as their lines are rounded, scultured, and flowing. In fact they reflect that whole period of the 1930swhen everything had to have flowing lines and a graceful appearance. Sculture was the same, soft, flowing, smooth outlines of, typically, nudes! 8-) 8-) ;)
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Ahh so what we're saying then, is that Art Deco buildings and streamliner cars/locos are, basically, naked women.
I knew there was a reason I liked them ;D
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Ahh so what we're saying then, is that Art Deco buildings and streamliner cars/locos are, basically, naked women.
I knew there was a reason I liked them ;D
The similarities are certainly that they are all curvy, shapely, smooth and expertly designed with art, along with beauty, in mind! :D :D :y :y :y