Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: feeutfo on 12 November 2010, 12:13:29
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Anyone got them fitted? Front or back. If so what's your opinion of them. I guess what we all want to know is are they too harsh...?
Plus anything else you can tell us good or bad. Price, supplier etc... Ta.
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Doesn't seem any harsher - possily a little but nothing to worry about
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A little harsher maybe but not a great deal :y
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...oh, so not recomended then? :-?
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...oh, so not recomended then? :-?
Feels more planted and less loose at the front
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Done doughnut bushes & front wishbone bush on both our cars & i would recommend them to anyone. I made up front wishbone bush over 3 years ago on swmbo's car cos they were not availble then & i pressed them into cheap wishbones £50 a pair jobbies, also it was only 1 of 2 cars that passed at the WIM meet & iirc 13 out of 15 failed that day & Tony couldn't set the geometry cos so many standard bushes were shot, never had an advisory or fail on them & saves me a fortune in tyres.
Just a thought maybe we could get some of those who poly the wishbones to another WIM meet & see what the success rate is second time around. If i got another Omega i wouldn't hesitate to do it all again, even mentioned it to my local MOT tester & he is thinking of offering poly bushes for wishbones to his customers as so many standard bushes fail after a while.
Chris, just do it you know you want to & if your diving is a bit on the enthusiastic side even better, just to add i was advised by the people who know not to poly the rear bush on the front wishbone as it would cause too much vibration through the steering but i am gonna make up a set & see what happens :y
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Done doughnut bushes & front wishbone bush on both our cars & i would recommend them to anyone. I made up front wishbone bush over 3 years ago on swmbo's car cos they were not availble then & i pressed them into cheap wishbones £50 a pair jobbies, also it was only 1 of 2 cars that passed at the WIM meet & iirc 13 out of 15 failed that day & Tony couldn't set the geometry cos so many standard bushes were shot, never had an advisory or fail on them & saves me a fortune in tyres.
Just a thought maybe we could get some of those who poly the wishbones to another WIM meet & see what the success rate is second time around. If i got another Omega i wouldn't hesitate to do it all again, even mentioned it to my local MOT tester & he is thinking of offering poly bushes for wishbones to his customers as so many standard bushes fail after a while.
Chris, just do it you know you want to & if your diving is a bit on the enthusiastic side even better, just to add i was advised by the people who know not to poly the rear bush on the front wishbone as it would cause too much vibration through the steering but i am gonna make up a set & see what happens :y
That should be interesting. As far as I know, polybushes for the rear of the front wishbone do not yet exist.
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Done doughnut bushes & front wishbone bush on both our cars & i would recommend them to anyone. I made up front wishbone bush over 3 years ago on swmbo's car cos they were not availble then & i pressed them into cheap wishbones £50 a pair jobbies, also it was only 1 of 2 cars that passed at the WIM meet & iirc 13 out of 15 failed that day & Tony couldn't set the geometry cos so many standard bushes were shot, never had an advisory or fail on them & saves me a fortune in tyres.
Just a thought maybe we could get some of those who poly the wishbones to another WIM meet & see what the success rate is second time around. If i got another Omega i wouldn't hesitate to do it all again, even mentioned it to my local MOT tester & he is thinking of offering poly bushes for wishbones to his customers as so many standard bushes fail after a while.
Chris, just do it you know you want to & if your diving is a bit on the enthusiastic side even better, just to add i was advised by the people who know not to poly the rear bush on the front wishbone as it would cause too much vibration through the steering but i am gonna make up a set & see what happens :y
That should be interesting. As far as I know, polybushes for the rear of the front wishbone do not yet exist.
Word on the other thread (from Powerflex, IIRC) was that with standard poly bushes they'd seen the bushes tend to tear themselves apart, but had now designed some kind of spherical poly-mounted bearing that could possibly be made to work in our application - they just hadn't made a bush set out of it yet..
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Word on the other thread (from Powerflex, IIRC) was that with standard poly bushes they'd seen the bushes tend to tear themselves apart, but had now designed some kind of spherical poly-mounted bearing that could possibly be made to work in our application - they just hadn't made a bush set out of it yet..
That was my point. ;) IIRC They could possibly do this if there was enough interest. It will be interesting to see what comes of this. :y
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last time i cut the rear bush out of a wishbone it looked solid rubber, nothing spherical or bearing wise so can't see why a poly bush the same dimensions would not work as a replacement but please feel free to prove me wrong
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this is actually quite difficult.
on the front, the horizontal bush is easy to change, but wouldn't gain that much from being changed without the vertical bush, which because of its design can't be made in a "poly" material. Actually, a harder horizontal bush could shorten the life of the vertical bush, but that's no real problem.
The lower wishbone is designed to flex, with the rear of the wishbone moving across the car whilst pivoting around the front bush. This increases comfort ( the front wheel likes to have a low stiffness in the front-to-rear plane ). So, you can see that the front bush is already quite hard - it would be the rear one that you'd need to improve.
On the Lotus Carlton, the vertical bush was re-made in a harder rubber.
on the rear, there are two sets of bushes to consider.....
subframe bushes.
some gains to be made from changing to stiffer donuts I think, but at some cost to comfort. Probably worth noting that the Holden manages to dispense 400HP with no rear end bush problems.
wishone bushes.
Don't change the wishbone bushes for poly ones. simple. The geometry is such that the inner bush flexes a lot becuse the camber/track correction bar needs it to. Stiffer bushes will prevent the wishbone moving properly.
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Those that have them swear by them, albeit with a little coaxing ::) maybe just shy ?
But in fiddling around with wishbones in the past, they do flex it seams as said. :-/
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this is actually quite difficult.
on the front, the horizontal bush is easy to change, but wouldn't gain that much from being changed without the vertical bush, which because of its design can't be made in a "poly" material. Actually, a harder horizontal bush could shorten the life of the vertical bush, but that's no real problem.
The lower wishbone is designed to flex, with the rear of the wishbone moving across the car whilst pivoting around the front bush. This increases comfort ( the front wheel likes to have a low stiffness in the front-to-rear plane ). So, you can see that the front bush is already quite hard - it would be the rear one that you'd need to improve.
On the Lotus Carlton, the vertical bush was re-made in a harder rubber.
on the rear, there are two sets of bushes to consider.....
subframe bushes.
some gains to be made from changing to stiffer donuts I think, but at some cost to comfort. Probably worth noting that the Holden manages to dispense 400HP with no rear end bush problems.
wishone bushes.
Don't change the wishbone bushes for poly ones. simple. The geometry is such that the inner bush flexes a lot becuse the camber/track correction bar needs it to. Stiffer bushes will prevent the wishbone moving properly.
Generally, I would hope, that the Polly bush design would be fractionally firmer than stock, but most importantly not degrade at all over time/miles covered....?
And have often wondered if a n other subframe design complete from another GM car would serve better...?
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this is actually quite difficult.
on the front, the horizontal bush is easy to change, but wouldn't gain that much from being changed without the vertical bush, which because of its design can't be made in a "poly" material. Actually, a harder horizontal bush could shorten the life of the vertical bush, but that's no real problem.
The lower wishbone is designed to flex, with the rear of the wishbone moving across the car whilst pivoting around the front bush. This increases comfort ( the front wheel likes to have a low stiffness in the front-to-rear plane ). So, you can see that the front bush is already quite hard - it would be the rear one that you'd need to improve.
On the Lotus Carlton, the vertical bush was re-made in a harder rubber.
on the rear, there are two sets of bushes to consider.....
subframe bushes.
some gains to be made from changing to stiffer donuts I think, but at some cost to comfort. Probably worth noting that the Holden manages to dispense 400HP with no rear end bush problems.
wishone bushes.
Don't change the wishbone bushes for poly ones. simple. The geometry is such that the inner bush flexes a lot becuse the camber/track correction bar needs it to. Stiffer bushes will prevent the wishbone moving properly.
Generally, I would hope, that the Polly bush design would be fractionally firmer than stock, but most importantly not degrade at all over time/miles covered....?
And have often wondered if a n other subframe design complete from another GM car would serve better...?
Not that many RWD GM's available now to choose from :'(
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this is actually quite difficult.
on the front, the horizontal bush is easy to change, but wouldn't gain that much from being changed without the vertical bush, which because of its design can't be made in a "poly" material. Actually, a harder horizontal bush could shorten the life of the vertical bush, but that's no real problem.
The lower wishbone is designed to flex, with the rear of the wishbone moving across the car whilst pivoting around the front bush. This increases comfort ( the front wheel likes to have a low stiffness in the front-to-rear plane ). So, you can see that the front bush is already quite hard - it would be the rear one that you'd need to improve.
On the Lotus Carlton, the vertical bush was re-made in a harder rubber.
on the rear, there are two sets of bushes to consider.....
subframe bushes.
some gains to be made from changing to stiffer donuts I think, but at some cost to comfort. Probably worth noting that the Holden manages to dispense 400HP with no rear end bush problems.
wishone bushes.
Don't change the wishbone bushes for poly ones. simple. The geometry is such that the inner bush flexes a lot becuse the camber/track correction bar needs it to. Stiffer bushes will prevent the wishbone moving properly.
Generally, I would hope, that the Polly bush design would be fractionally firmer than stock, but most importantly not degrade at all over time/miles covered....?
And have often wondered if a n other subframe design complete from another GM car would serve better...?
Plus, to add, the front wishbone bush design strikes me as flawed(admittedly as a layman with no education on the matter, and with so many failures, no prizes for saying ::). ) the main block of the bush internals sits vertical :-? Where as the stress from the road wheel is delivered to it on a horizontal plain, so it's twisted continually by suspension movement, and forced in and outboard by breaking forces... No wonder the centre block splits away from the bush outer!
But what to do about it...? If Polly are a solid lump then I guess that would be concerning and over harsh, I'm guessing ...? There must be some give, which I'm told there is. :-/
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this is actually quite difficult.
on the front, the horizontal bush is easy to change, but wouldn't gain that much from being changed without the vertical bush, which because of its design can't be made in a "poly" material. Actually, a harder horizontal bush could shorten the life of the vertical bush, but that's no real problem.
The lower wishbone is designed to flex, with the rear of the wishbone moving across the car whilst pivoting around the front bush. This increases comfort ( the front wheel likes to have a low stiffness in the front-to-rear plane ). So, you can see that the front bush is already quite hard - it would be the rear one that you'd need to improve.
On the Lotus Carlton, the vertical bush was re-made in a harder rubber.
on the rear, there are two sets of bushes to consider.....
subframe bushes.
some gains to be made from changing to stiffer donuts I think, but at some cost to comfort. Probably worth noting that the Holden manages to dispense 400HP with no rear end bush problems.
wishone bushes.
Don't change the wishbone bushes for poly ones. simple. The geometry is such that the inner bush flexes a lot becuse the camber/track correction bar needs it to. Stiffer bushes will prevent the wishbone moving properly.
Generally, I would hope, that the Polly bush design would be fractionally firmer than stock, but most importantly not degrade at all over time/miles covered....?
And have often wondered if a n other subframe design complete from another GM car would serve better...?
Not that many RWD GM's available now to choose from :'(
Indeed, but maybe 2woodys Holden experience can help.... Short of just buying a vxr8 of course, each time I see one on the road the more I melt. :-*
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Surely, Mr Gixer, you could try it? If its hopeless, what have you lost except some time, £50(?) for bushes, and geo?
If you don't, you'll always wonder, if you do and its no good, you'll know
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Drop links won't affect handling. They just knock within the play.
Could the wheel baring/hub issue be bad enough to cause outside edge ware? :-/
Otherwise typically track rod play, but you would spot that I'm sure.
Tyres getting low on tread?
Is the random sensation noticeable through the steering? Can it be felt through the steering wheel?
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Drop links won't affect handling. They just knock within the play.
Could the wheel baring/hub issue be bad enough to cause outside edge ware? :-/
Otherwise typically track rod play, but you would spot that I'm sure.
Tyres getting low on tread?
Is the random sensation noticeable through the steering? Can it be felt through the steering wheel?
Can't feel through steering wheel, as if the steering wheel is unattached.... ....which is why I don't think its the normal low Dunlop tramline (though that could be a contributing factor)
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Drop links won't affect handling. They just knock within the play.
Could the wheel baring/hub issue be bad enough to cause outside edge ware? :-/
Otherwise typically track rod play, but you would spot that I'm sure.
Tyres getting low on tread?
Is the random sensation noticeable through the steering? Can it be felt through the steering wheel?
Can't feel through steering wheel, as if the steering wheel is unattached.... ....which is why I don't think its the normal low Dunlop tramline (though that could be a contributing factor)
Back end possibly? ...and I'll be interested as to your next tyre choice btw.
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Word on the other thread (from Powerflex, IIRC) was that with standard poly bushes they'd seen the bushes tend to tear themselves apart, but had now designed some kind of spherical poly-mounted bearing that could possibly be made to work in our application - they just hadn't made a bush set out of it yet..
That was my point. ;) IIRC They could possibly do this if there was enough interest. It will be interesting to see what comes of this. :y
It would be a great idea as ive just had to replace both rear bushes on the front wishbone again the last set were back in July :(
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I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Is the toe OK?
Any play in the steering box? :-/
Kevin
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I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Is the toe OK?
Any play in the steering box? :-/
Kevin
WIM'd earlier this year after a TRE change. Not clouted anything, and managed to avoid all potholes. Haven't had it airbourne either, before you ask ;D
I know MDTM tweaked steering box a couple of years back, so doubt much play developed in it :-/. They all feel a bit sloppy when parked up :-/
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And you won't fall for the placibo effect that many do, being the picky little bugger you are :P
Oi, less of the little! ;)
Your right of course, but it's good to talk, I need to examine omega black yet and see what it needs, but from driving properly for the first time yesterday suspect just wishbone bushes and set up. Hopefully the rear bush is in half decent nik and Polly will be a goer.
But a couple of people on here are due to fit Polly this weekend I believe so interested in their comments.... :y
I wish I could find what the hell is wrong with the MV6 - got some play in both front wheelbearings, but everything else is solid. I did the droplinks a couple of weeks back (one was really knackered after 170k), also did the steering idler out of desperation, but its still like playing russian roulette in a straight line (fine in corners).
Also, go a weird wear on the outside edge of NSF, though if anything, camber looks too much the other way...
Drop links won't affect handling. They just knock within the play.
Could the wheel baring/hub issue be bad enough to cause outside edge ware? :-/
Otherwise typically track rod play, but you would spot that I'm sure.
Tyres getting low on tread?
Is the random sensation noticeable through the steering? Can it be felt through the steering wheel?
Can't feel through steering wheel, as if the steering wheel is unattached.... ....which is why I don't think its the normal low Dunlop tramline (though that could be a contributing factor)
Back end possibly? ...and I'll be interested as to your next tyre choice btw.
Sorry, had a re read, and remember a previous comment "as if something suddenly broke"...? Iirc?
How where the wishbone bushes checked exactly?
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I fitted Powerflex wishbone bushes on Saturday. Very pleased with them so far. The steering is more precise now.
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I fitted Powerflex wishbone bushes on Saturday. Very pleased with them so far. The steering is more precise now.
Well that's worth having on its own....thanks Dave
....but then, the original bushes where buggered anyway, so would hope to see an improvement...
If you see what I mean :D ....I'm going to have to try these by the looks. And no I haven't eaten all the available stock, as someone suggested elsewhere. ;D
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I fitted Powerflex wishbone bushes on Saturday. Very pleased with them so far. The steering is more precise now.
Well that's worth having on its own....thanks Dave
....but then, the original bushes where buggered anyway, so would hope to see an improvement...
If you see what I mean :D ....I'm going to have to try these by the looks. And no I haven't eaten all the available stock, as someone suggested elsewhere. ;D
The old bushes I removed looked fine and where free from damage (before I took a blow torch to them ;D).