Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Field Marshal Dr. Opti on 06 April 2011, 11:24:45
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I have my MV6 booked in for an oil and filter change tomorrow at.....ahem....cough ..cough.....Kwik Fit. :-X :-X :-X :-X
Six litres of Mobil 1 0w/40......plus a filter for £44.95.... :-/ :-/
Apparently .......even when cold this oil has the consistency of warm piss. A big help with sub- zero winter start up. This significantly reduces engine wear and cold start up clatter.......so I'm told. :y
Whatever happened to the oil we all put in our Mini's......Austin 1100/1300.....Ford Anglia .... Cortina.......Corsair.....etc...etc...A proper 20/50 oil like Castrol GTX which was thick like treacle.... :y :y :y :y
They don't make oil like they used to...... :'( :'( :'(
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To thin for a V6
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and is one of the worst oils for causing 'mayo' in certain places.
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.... Six litres of Mobil 1 0w/40......plus a filter for £44.95.... :-/ :-/ .......
You could buy 4 x 5 litres of semi-skimmed from Vauxhall (on TC) for that money ....... but you might have to get your hands a bit dirty if you want an oil change with it. ;)
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Hmm. I smell a rat straight away. That sounds too cheap.
£47.77 inc VAT for 5 litres at Opie. Are you sure that's what they are using? :-? More likely to be whatever bulk oil they have in the tank, IMHO. :-/
You don't need to get into exotic oils like that to give adequate performance in an Omega anyway, IMHO. The GM 10w40 is plenty good enough although it'll have a much shorter useful life (not an issue if you change it regularly anyway). Even GM's 5w30 fully synthetic oil is only about £50 on trade club for 20L.
I think I'd only go to Mobil 1 in an engine that would be cripplingly expensive to replace and used in such anger that it's likely to stretch the capabilities of a regular oil (i.e. on the track). Even then, I'm sure most of the extra cost is paying for their marketing budget!
You can strip down engines that have done 6 figure road mileages on main dealer service schedules and main dealer oil these days and find barely any significant wear so, IMHO, spending too much on oil is a false economy.
Kevin
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What are the implications of 5w30 over 10w40 oil, as I think GM are now recommending 5w30 across the board?
Will it find it's way out of failing cam cover gaskets easier, for example?
Just curious more than anything :y.
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What are the implications of 5w30 over 10w40 oil, as I think GM are now recommending 5w30 across the board?
Will it find it's way out of failing cam cover gaskets easier, for example?
Just curious more than anything :y.
Well, it's a little thinner, so it might find its' way out of any existing leaks at a slightly quicker rate, but a leak's a leak. ;)
If the engine is well worn already it might consume a little more oil.
It has better flow during cold start and a longer life. Double the cost and maybe double the life, so, in reality, it just saves you crawling under the car as much. ;D
EDIT: And GM are recommending it because they put the schedules up to 20k changes, and they don't want to stock more than one spec of oil!
Kevin
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its like putting in Baboons piss. ;D ;D ;D ;D
DONT DO IT!!!
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Hmm. I smell a rat straight away. That sounds too cheap.
£47.77 inc VAT for 5 litres at Opie. Are you sure that's what they are using? :-? More likely to be whatever bulk oil they have in the tank, IMHO. :-/
You don't need to get into exotic oils like that to give adequate performance in an Omega anyway, IMHO. The GM 10w40 is plenty good enough although it'll have a much shorter useful life (not an issue if you change it regularly anyway). Even GM's 5w30 fully synthetic oil is only about £50 on trade club for 20L.
I think I'd only go to Mobil 1 in an engine that would be cripplingly expensive to replace and used in such anger that it's likely to stretch the capabilities of a regular oil (i.e. on the track). Even then, I'm sure most of the extra cost is paying for their marketing budget!
You can strip down engines that have done 6 figure road mileages on main dealer service schedules and main dealer oil these days and find barely any significant wear so, IMHO, spending too much on oil is a false economy.
Kevin
That's what I was told Kevin. He showed me in the book. As for what they actually put in it.........well....your guess is as good as mine.We are talking about Kwik Fit after all..... :-/ :-/ :-/ :-/
My( very limited) understanding is that a 0w/40 oil protects better at both higher and lower temperatures than a 5/30 or 10/40 oil. Is that correct?
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Is there any reason why you're not doing the work yourself Opti?
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What are the implications of 5w30 over 10w40 oil, as I think GM are now recommending 5w30 across the board?
Will it find it's way out of failing cam cover gaskets easier, for example?
Just curious more than anything :y.
Well, it's a little thinner, so it might find its' way out of any existing leaks at a slightly quicker rate, but a leak's a leak. ;)
If the engine is well worn already it might consume a little more oil.
It has better flow during cold start and a longer life. Double the cost and maybe double the life, so, in reality, it just saves you crawling under the car as much. ;D
EDIT: And GM are recommending it because they put the schedules up to 20k changes, and they don't want to stock more than one spec of oil!
Kevin
Well, I seem to be doing about 4k miles a year and the oil gets changed annually anyway so 10w40 sounds like it's good enough.
Just need to check the dipstick periodically and not rely on the check control :y.
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My( very limited) understanding is that a 0w/40 oil protects better at both higher and lower temperatures than a 5/30 or 10/40 oil. Is that correct?
Maybe. ;)
Oil is naturally thicker at lower temperatures. In the old days, oil used to be monograde, so you'd go out and buy a 40 viscosity oil. It would be like treacle at room temperature and quite fluid at running temperature (say 100 degrees C for argument's sake).
Such an oil was OK ish for cars of the time, but a modern engine won't cope with oil like treacle because the clearances between the mechanical parts won't allow adequate oil flow when cold, and the engine will be damaged at cold start.
So, all modern engine oils are "multigrade" in that their grade changes with temperature. This means we have effectively a much thinner "base" oil, but it's made thicker at high temperatures by viscosity improvers (VIs). In layman's terms, a 10W40 oil can be considered to behave like a 10 viscosity oil at low temperature (the so-called "winter" rating - hence 10w) and a 40 viscosity at high temperature.
So, a 0w40 is different to a 10w40 in that it's thinner at low temperatures and about the same at operating temperature. You will have a thinner oil at cold start and this might help it circulate earlier and save some engine wear at startup, so this is indeed a possible benefit to choosing this oil. Probably the only possible benefit unless you're going to leave it in there for 20k and take a chance on its' long life! I can't see how a 0w40 would be different to a 10w40 when hot, although if you really do cook the oil, maybe Mobil 1 would survive better. You won't do that in an Omega that sees road use, though.
Remember that a multigrade oil is made out of a very thin base oil with VIs added to thicken it up. VIs lose their effectiveness over the life of the oil, so the oil could become too thin where it's important (at full working temperature) with age. A 0w40 will rely more on VIs than a 10w40, as it will have a thinner base oil. Being a quality fully synthetic oil the Mobil will probably have good quality VIs that last well, but a warning not to trust poor quality oils that have a wide spread of winter-to-hot rating.
Of course, all this theory is meaningless unless you can see inside the engine and watch the oil working - we can't!
We can only perhaps wonder about the effects of oil when stripping engines for repair - hence my post that modern engines really don't wear that significantly, so oil choice is not a big issue. Whatever oil you choose, barring a catastrophic failure, your car bodywork will have rotted away before the engine wears out anyway. ;)
Kevin
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My concern has always been regarding the cold worn engine parts and a cold thin oil.....
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My concern has always been regarding the cold worn engine parts and a cold thin oil.....
Yes, probably not the best option for an engine that's getting on, as most Omegas are.
Doesn't make financial sense, anyway, as most of the wear you're allegedly preventing has already happened!
Kevin
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Oil thread?
;D ;D
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Oil thread?
;D ;D
Oops! :-[
I don't think anyone else noticed.... :-X
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Ignore the nay sayers!!
I use Mobil 1 0w/40 in my 2.5 V6 and my 3.2 V6 plus used it in my old 3ltr V6 and my 2ltr Vectra, 1.8 Cavalier and 2ltr Mondeo before that without any issues! At a guess close on 400k in total on 15-180k engines so well used, with no horror stories or premature explosions
It can be bought for FAR FAR less than Opie charge - Costco is £20 and a few pennies plus the VAT for 5 ltrs
I personally have found since using fully synthetic oil i don't get the mayo on the oil cap/ oil neck. It used to be quite bad on the Signum now its changed, not had an issue since.
But what do i know
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As a newbie I would like to add a few questions while on the subject.
Why are the best most advertised oils not recommended? Surely they don't spend all that money on marketing just to sell us....baboons pesh?
Castrol and mobil one are the best oils, I don't understand.
Do I need Fully synth?
I would like to try BMW's oil, it's £120 pounds a litre so must be good....?
Why have I got an ice-cream capachino in my filler neck? Is my head gaskit gone, or is it this oil cooler thing I keep hearing about?
Where is the "dip stick".....?
Sorry for the all the q's I am new to all this.
Love to all,
Chris. :-*
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As a newbie I would like to add a few questions while on the subject.
Why are the best most advertised oils not recommended? Surely they don't spend all that money on marketing just to sell us....baboons pesh?
Castrol and mobil one are the best oils, I don't understand.
Do I need Fully synth?
I would like to try BMW's oil, it's £120 pounds a litre so must be good....?
Why have I got an ice-cream capachino in my filler neck? Is my head gaskit gone, or is it this oil cooler thing I keep hearing about?
Where is the "dip stick".....?
Sorry for the all the q's I am new to all this.
Love to all,
Chris. :-*
OH MY GOD!!!
If you dont know mate, then your in trouble.
And by the way, baboons dont pesh, they pish :y
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To thin for a V6
yep.. tried mobil 1 0-40 some years ago.. in winter its ok, lifter noise is nearly none.. but when summer hit , engine started to moan.. :-/
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Ignore the nay sayers!!
I use Mobil 1 0w/40 in my 2.5 V6 and my 3.2 V6 plus used it in my old 3ltr V6 and my 2ltr Vectra, 1.8 Cavalier and 2ltr Mondeo before that without any issues! At a guess close on 400k in total on 15-180k engines so well used, with no horror stories or premature explosions
It can be bought for FAR FAR less than Opie charge - Costco is £20 and a few pennies plus the VAT for 5 ltrs
I personally have found since using fully synthetic oil i don't get the mayo on the oil cap/ oil neck. It used to be quite bad on the Signum now its changed, not had an issue since.
But what do i know
It does not mean its the correct oil or even the ideal oil.....its certainly not the best oil at the best price (even at costco).
It amazes me the way some class as the holy grail almost Mobil 1 0W-40 yet they are totaly unaware that it is also available in 5W-30, 5W-50 and 15W 50 (and the 5W-30 would be much better suited to the Omega)
My Omega has had fully synthetic (vx which is Fuchs oil) since day one.....much cheaper :y
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A point in case:
http://www.mobil1.com.au/products/product_5W30.aspx
The Mobil 1 5W-30 grade delivers the viscosity recommended for most General Motors vehicles and many Japanese car makers
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As a newbie I would like to add a few questions while on the subject.
Why are the best most advertised oils not recommended? Surely they don't spend all that money on marketing just to sell us....baboons pesh?
Castrol and mobil one are the best oils, I don't understand.
Do I need Fully synth?
I would like to try BMW's oil, it's £120 pounds a litre so must be good....?
Why have I got an ice-cream capachino in my filler neck? Is my head gaskit gone, or is it this oil cooler thing I keep hearing about?
Where is the "dip stick".....?
Sorry for the all the q's I am new to all this.
Love to all,
Chris. :-*
OH MY GOD!!!
If you dont know mate, then your in trouble.
And by the way, baboons dont pesh, they pish :y
Seems a perfectly reasonable question, from a new member!
And what about kwick fit, are they a reputable company? They seem very popular :)
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It amazes me the way some class as the holy grail almost Mobil 1 0W-40 yet .......
Go to the The Roadster.net then. You're pilloried for even thinking of not using Mobile 1 especially if you 'only' use Vauxhall's fully synthetic in your Smart. ;D ;D ;D
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since been advised I have used Castrol magnatec as its suitable for my current mileage. Is this right or is mobil1 10w 40 better for a 98. :question
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even the best quality oil looses its properties within 2.5-3k miles.. so no need to invest expensive oil.. standard 10-40 semi synthetic(vx/gm) and frequent changes like 5K miles(some prefer 3500 miles) (less for turbo diesels as its more critical for them) is appropriate :y
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since been advised I have used Castrol magnatec as its suitable for my current mileage. Is this right or is mobil1 10w 40 better for a 98. :question
I have never been a great fan of Castrol stuff and it does have a habit of creating Mayo
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Thanks mark and cem. I also posed the question if there is a suspicion oil being burnt or engine worn. my thoughts were and hence decision was for the best way to protect engine (2.0l r reg). Does this change decision relating best oil to use from here on/what is the best one:question
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Thanks mark and cem. I also posed the question if there is a suspicion oil being burnt or engine worn. my thoughts were and hence decision was for the best way to protect engine (2.0l r reg). Does this change decision relating best oil to use from here on/what is the best one:question
thinner oils are designed for specific engines and their clearences..
no one can claim that a semi synthetic standard oil has same quality like expensive mobil 1 (talking about 10-40) but if you use mobil 1 for longer distances its benefits will decrease radically..
so if you want to protect your engine, frequent changes is the best approach..
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thanks cem :y
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I can only think of one possible benfit of using ester based fully synthetic oil - it has good detergent properties and flows well when cold, so if you are looking to do a slow engine flush in the winter, robert's your fathers' brother, otherwise use the GM10/40, and change it regularly (I do mine every 5K because I run on LPG so not much carbon contamination, and I use the car 95% on motorways so it's not under stress), it's cheaper than milk, or the 5/30 longlife. If you don't have a trade club card, you can always either a) get one, or b) use neo brothers, I think they sell the 10/40 for 12 quid / 5L and the 5/30 for 19 quid. They are a saab agent - GM in other words.
Oil is cheap, way cheaper than a broken engine, change the oil and filter regularly and use what the engine maker recommends for use in it, they probably know best. It'll last you forvever.
I've just had much work done on mine (due to age mostly) it needed, lambda sensors, plugs, cam box gaskets (no, the breather wasn't blocked, they just got old and went hard) and unfortunately both coil packs as they got mullered by the oil that they got cooked in for the last 2k miles. Anyway the point is that when the cam covers came off I was curious to see what the cams, tappets, etc all looked like and the good news for me is that they look absolutely fine and with no significant wear, still have honing marks on. The metal surfaces everywhere were also clean, not gooey or clogged with any goo or blackness.
I also did a compression test (and cam splash feed test just to see if everything was OK - bit messy!) and all cylinders are within 2PSi across the 6, so no real problems anywhere. How many miles - 135,000 so far and it runs like new. The 5K oil and flter changes clearly haven't hurt it.
Also now I have new O2 sensors and plugs, and coils, it does about 3 MPG more at 33MPG average, and over the weeks mileage - around 700 I manage an average speed of about 60 miles per hour, so it's not idling either!
ACEA A3 is a decent spec and if it gets B4 it's about the same as the GM long life spec anyway.
Cheers
Paul
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I've just gobbled all my stock of crispy popcorn :'( :'(
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Sorry ::) just could'nt resist ;D
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seriously Mobil 1 over the years has proved itself to me when treatment is started on low mlge engines and as of yet I've got to see my 1st mayo or get blocked breathers :y
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I've just gobbled all my stock of crispy popcorn :'( :'(
Now.. What type of oil did you pop it in? Vegetable? rapeseed? Nut? Lard? ;D
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Olive Oil of course Kevin :-* ::)
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Olive Oil of course Kevin :-* ::)
Oooh! Surprised at that. Doesn't handle high temperatures well... ;)
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Why, before the advent of synthetic & semi-synth were high performance engines run on Castor oil (Castrol R)?
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Why, before the advent of synthetic & semi-synth were high performance engines run on Castor oil (Castrol R)?
I think it was because it is relatively stable at high temperatures and good under extreme pressures. It doesn't last well, though, and is prone to forming deposits in engines so it's no good for road use.
Oh, and then there's the smell. :-*
Kevin
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Changed the oil on my car and a friends 2.2DTi yesterday - 8k since mine was done and it was a bit dark, but not too bad.. apparently two years (and I don't know how many miles) since Mark changed his:
(http://i52.tinypic.com/2web9t1.jpg)
If you slopped it up the side of the bucket .. it just stayed there and stained it black! It looks more like the evil entity that swallowed Tasha Yar (for any Star Trek fans out there) than oil. Not that Mark cares - that's twice in 4 years & 60k he's changed the oil and the car gets run on all sorts of things (veg oil mix, old engine oil, etc) and amazingly all he's had to change is a set of rear pads and the exhaust. I wish I had his luck, I really do..
I don't think even fully synth could save him, though ;D