Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: stuvaux on 19 January 2007, 08:48:54
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hello guys
this problem started two days ago and is now getting worse
at first the car started to run badly at idle speed
then the problem went as quickly as it had appeared
then it came back again! when it happens, sometimes it stalls. then i restart it. it stalls....restart....stalls....
also, it seems there is a lack of power as you pull away. the revs take a while to pick up, then it seems flat for a bit, under 3000 revs
any ideas on where to start looking would be very much appreciated!
thanks, stu
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Any EML, if not, does EML come on with ignition?
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no EML, but light does come on with ignition, and go off as normal
i'm sorry about the explanation of the problem - its just a tricky one to put into words!!
i did clean the IAC valve the other day - it was fine for two days after that - then the problem started - could that be related?
thanks, stu
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no EML, but light does come on with ignition, and go off as normal
i'm sorry about the explanation of the problem - its just a tricky one to put into words!!
i did clean the IAC valve the other day - it was fine for two days after that - then the problem started - could that be related?
thanks, stu
How did you clean (carb cleaner)? Did you oil afterwards?
The power loss could be related to multirams, check they work properly as well...
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yes, cleaned with carb cleaner, but didn't oil afterwards - should i have, and what with/how?
how do i check the multiram is working properly?
stu
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yes, cleaned with carb cleaner, but didn't oil afterwards - should i have, and what with/how?
how do i check the multiram is working properly?
stu
A light oil, 3-in-1 etc...
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When it stalls, is it a sudden stall, or does the engine hunt a bit?
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yes, engine hunts for a while, then stalls if i dont,t rev/pull away
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is wd40 any good on the IAC valve?
dont think i've got any 3 in 1 oil
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is wd40 any good on the IAC valve?
dont think i've got any 3 in 1 oil
WD40 is not a true lubricant.
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Is your problem happening when you're running on petrol or LPG?
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its happening with both fuels
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is wd40 any good on the IAC valve?
dont think i've got any 3 in 1 oil
Not really. A light oil is what you are after, and just 2 or 3 drops...
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ok i'll try that
how about the multiram? whats the best way to check if it is working as it should be?
thanks
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The multiram won't cause stalling, but will affect power at different rpm. Fix the stalling issue first...
Also, air intake leak may also give stalling/uneven idle symptoms...
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ok thanks
could the seal around the IAC valve cause a leak?
it doesn't seem to fit as well as before i removed it
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ok, i've oiled the IAC valve - drove the car, problem seemed fine - but now it is back again!
when the car starts to run badly, at tickover, the instant consumption is at 0.8 gal/hr, where it is normally only about 0.3 gal/hr
also, there is a strong smell of bad eggs(!), which i know is the cat
any ideas?
thanks, stu
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could this mean one of the cats is knackered?
or could it be excess fuelling causing the smell?
any help on what to check next woulb be appreciated
thanks
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still no joy!
not really sure what to look at now
someone said it might be a blockage in the exhaust?
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please help....
any ideas would be very much appreciated!
i want my miggy back!
thanks, stu :-?
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...have you checked for any stored fault codes?
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i haven't yet
as there was no EML, i didn't think the ecu had picked up a fault
i will try anyway...
thanks
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there are 2 codes coming up -
19 & 135
according to my code list, this is RPM signal (crankshaft sensor) - incorrect signal & `Check engine` lamp - low voltage
does this mean its likely to be the crankshaft sensor?
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19 = knackered cranksensor (31 is normal crank sensor fault when engine not running)
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so definitely a knackered crank sensor then?
where is the best place to get one of these from
autovaux quote £28.17 for the oval type, and £46.83 for the square type
which is the most likely one for mine, a 1999 2.5V6
also, what does the 135 code mean?
thanks
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The 135 code was posted a bit above, EML light. I've got a 135 but I disconnect the battery with the ignition on and I bet that's where I got it from.
I think the oval one is the latter type, I also need one. I think the square type also needs a new seal. I'm hoping that by removing the scuttle I'll be able to see what type of plug it is.
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thanks mate
according to the haynes manual, you should be able to see the connector once the scuttle is off
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fitted new crank sensor yesterday
car was running fine until today
the stalling problem has started again
it is still showing fault codes 19 & 135
can anyone suggest where i should look next???!
thanks, stu :o
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fitted a working IAC valve today
worked fine for a bit
problem is now back again!!
really not sure what to check next now - HELP!!!!!!
stu :(
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Sorry I have not replied before......
Can you try something.....when it idles badly, can you give the EGR a clonk with a hammer on the metal body.....
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cheers mark
i'll go and try it now
stu
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it does seem to smooth back out after hitting EGR
could that be the problem then?
stu
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Ok...remove the EGR valve (two torx headed bolts) and make a plate the same shape as the EGR base from a tin can or pepsi/coke can (these are easier to use as you can cut it with scissors, careful though, its sharp) and use this (along with the origainal gasket, place the gasket on the bottom of the stack so you haev gasket, blanking plate and EGR valve) to blank the EGR off..(you only need to put two holes in the blanking plate for the securing screws, no others are required).
If it works, speak to Issunaz and get one of his high quality blanking plates...
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ok thanks mark
i'll do that mate
would it be better later on to buy a new EGR valve, or just blank it off better?
stu
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Blank it off and forget it was ever there...its only required for initial approvals and not part of any MOT test.....help the throttle response slightly to following constant speed cruising.
It does still need the electrical connection to keep the ecu happy.
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ok thanks mate
i just hope this finally does cure it!!!
i'll let you know how i get on
thanks again, stu
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Worth adding my theory for completeness.
The EGR allows the ECU to add an inert gas (in this case exhaust fumes because in theory there is no oxygen or fuel) into the inlet system. This in turn dilutes the air/fuel mix, this can be considered as alomst a way of reducing the cc of the engine and as a result less heat is produced during the combustion cycle. This in turn reduces NOx..... (it does not affect engine temp significantly or efficiency as you still need the same fuel air mix to produce the required power)
This valve only opens at part throttle and constant speed driving (its variable via PWM to allow different openings to be supported with feedback to the ECU on its position).
Its should not be open at all at idel or full throttle.
If it is open at idle it causes poor running because it dilutes the fuel/air mix to much...(there i very little any way at idle!).
Given that it is a solenoid it is possible for it to get stuck (possibly due to carbon build up) hence why hitting it can cause it to pop shut again and you get an intermittent poor idle.....
Lets hope a 40p drinks can fixes it for you!
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thanks for the explanation mark
reading that makes it sound very possible that it is the problem
i'm just waiting for my brother now to bring the right torx bit, then i'll get on with it
oh, and it will be from a 60p beer can.........
thanks , stu
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oh, and it will be from a 60p beer can.........
A fine choice.....I approve! :y
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thank you... :y
i've fitted the blanking `plate` now
car seems to run fine....just have to wait and see how long for
it seems to just keep coming back......!
thanks mark,
stu 8-)
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If nothing else, it rules it out of the equation....
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i guess that rules it out then....
it started again last night......
the instant consumption goes to around 0.8 gal/hr instead of the usual 0.2/0.3 gal/hr at tickover if thats any help
also the exhaust smells of bad eggs, though i suppose this is because of too much fuel/not enough air in the mix
any more ideas mark?
thanks, stu
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Any recorded fault codes?
Is it doing in this on LPG or Petrol or both....
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the problem is there on both lpg and petrol
the fault codes are 19 & 135, but i changed the crank sensor and that has made no difference
stu
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Idle valve is seated nice and tightly in the plenum, no hissing noise evident from anywhere?
Any recent work carried out?
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Could a partially blocked cat be contributing have read stories it can cause problems. :-/
Only you mention eggy smells
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the idle valve does seem a little loose since i cleaned it
the problem did start two days after i cleaned the IAC valve
could it be the seal then? there is sometimes a short hissing sound after switching off the car - but it stops before i get chance to check it.....
stu
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someone else has mentioned it could be a blocked exhaust...
the problem is very intermittent as well there is no real pattern to when it starts
also, while the idle problem is there, it seems very flat up to 3000 rpm
stu
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someone else has mentioned it could be a blocked exhaust...
the problem is very intermittent as well there is no real pattern to when it starts
also, while the idle problem is there, it seems very flat up to 3000 rpm
stu
Its a strange one, I personally wouldn't know what to best suggest other than checking the breather system which from the sounds of it you already have.
Your saying its gutless as in no pressure felt through the accelerator till over 3k rpm is that right.
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Next step is to check the inlet and vaccum system......is the plenum loose, is the large brake servo vac pipe all ok with no holes rubbed through it (check where it passes close to the aircon pipe).
Are the smaller vac pipes all ok.....
Are the breathers that connect to the rear of the plenum all there and without damage.
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i swapped the IAC valves back over today - with the old one on there, the car would not start at all
i then put the other one back on, put some sealant round where the valve enters the inlet - seemed to cure it for a bit, then it came back
does this mean its somehow linked to the IAC valve still?
stu
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yes, its like there is no pressure hardly until 3000 rpm, its just flat
breathers on back of plenum all fine, no damage
vacuum pipes all connected and seem in good condition
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I know you have reseated the ICV could it be possible the connector isn't connected properly, usually there is some kind of clip that holds the connector on.
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just re-checked breathers etc.
all seem fine, connected, none split/rubbed through
plenum tight
stu ::)
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its the rubber part going into the plenum - it seemed a bit loose when i re-fitted it
there is no connector on there
i put some instant gasket on it to try and make a tighter seal
stu
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its the rubber part going into the plenum - it seemed a bit loose when i re-fitted it
there is no connector on there
i put some instant gasket on it to try and make a tighter seal
stu
My mistake regards the connector I thought the V6 ICV would have one just like the 2.0 :-[
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its a pity it doesn't - might make for a better seal.......
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can't see any problems with the breathers
vac pipes def all seem connected ok
what else could it be now???!
thanks, stu
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mark, will i need to strip down the inlet etc. now to make sure the breathers etc. are all as they should be?
or is there some other possibility?
it definitely happens on both lpg and petrol
the car does not only stall when stopped, revs drop very low and it has cut out at around 20mph
power is definitely down below 3000rpm when the problem starts
its never happened when the car is cold - only after at least ten minutes of driving
does any of the above help? i am literally pulling my hair out now with this one!!!
help!!!....................
stu
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I would certainly consider removing the plenum to allow inspection of the injector connections, plenum Orings and the fuel rail etc....
Worth removing the breather bridge etc from the plenum to check its clean and clear and that the seals are all in good nick.
I assume there are no splits in the inlet pipe work.....can you pinpoint the hiss whilst the engine is running....
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looks like the stripdown will be a job for sunday morning! (I work nights wed-sat, so not a lot of time till then!)
as far as the hiss goes, it only seems to do that occasionally, and only when i turn the engine off
it lasts for a couple of seconds at most
there are no splits in the inlet pipes
maybe i've loosened/damaged one of the vacuum pipes while messing with the IAC valve.......
stu
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If you look at the rubber piep that connects to the idle valve there shoudl be a smaller pipe which branches off and runs under the plenum......this connects to a small fuel pressure regulator on the fuel rail....is this all intact?
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the small pipe that branches off does have a very small split in it, which i have put some tape over for now...
as far as i can see, it is still connected to the fuel rail
stu
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Hi take a look at the brake vacum pump pipe mine had a hole in it. this was cause with my car idling poor
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ok thanks mate
i'll check that properly when i strip the engine on sunday....
thanks, stu
p.s. the problem has not appeared in the last 2 days, doing only short journeys to and from work..... but i'm expecting it back anytime soon!........
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i stripped the car yesterday, and cleaned all the breathers, checked vacuums etc.
all were intact and connected properly
problem is still there......
on a paperclip test, i am now getting codes 57 & 73
i did clean the iac valve again today though, and left the wiring disconnected when i tested it - so that would explain the 57 code (IAC valve - interruption)
code 73 relates to air flow sensor - low voltage
is this easy to check, or is it possible to clean it?
thanks, stu
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the 73 may be genuine, or may be a false caused by air leak...
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thanks for all of your help
i've now changed the air flow sensor
there was also a small split in one of the gas pipes that go into the top of the engine, into the inlets
i have also sealed this for now
at the moment the car is running fine again.....i'll just wait and see what happens!........
stu
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hi guys
there is now a leak from the black breather box on top of the engine, causing a strong smell of gas
is it possible to buy the round seal that goes into the plenum
if yes, does anyone know what the part number is?
thanks, stu
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mark, do you know the part number for the rubber seal for where the breather box on top of the engine goes into the intake?
also, the seals that go into the throttle body?
i've phoned three vauxhall dealers and they don't seem to understand what i'm going on about......no surprise there then....!
thanks, stu
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As it happens....yes I do.
Breather bridge to plenum seal (1 off) 90467543 90p+VAT each, retail
Breather bridge to throttle O ring (2 off) 90500983 43p+VAT each. retail
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thanks a lot mark
i have now ordered them from a dealer, i have to pick them up tomorrow
the car is now running fine on petrol, but on gas it has a bad misfire
i think this is due to the air leak from the breather box - as the gas is fed directly through the top of the inlet, so the gas is also leaking from there!
thanks again, stu
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The MAF fault code is spot on for an airleak....the engine knows its using a quantity of air but, the MAF is reporting a lower quantity (and hence a lower voltage)
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i have already changed the MAF anyway now - this has definitely made it run better on petrol
once the seals are changed, it should run on gas again (much better, same power, but only 37p a litre!)
problem solved....finally!....i hope...
thanks, stu
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Finally.....the car is running perfectly again!
Thanks a lot to all of you who posted your advice.....particularly Mark, who was very helpful....is there anything he doesn't know about Omegas?
Yesterday, I replaced the breather box seals
The problem on gas was actually some sealant which had set inside the pipe that feeds the gas to each port (of which there are six in total, obviously!), so the car was only running on five cylinders in effect.
Thanks again, stu 8-)
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Great news :y
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Great news :y
Thanks mate :y
Now I can spend my money on more important things.....like 3.0 cams....... ;)
stu