Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: TheBoy on 18 August 2007, 23:20:02
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We attempted the engine swap today, started at about 10:30ish by time we got there. Took a little longer than planned to remove, but was out by 1:30. By time we got it to Brackley, and unloaded, it was about 2:30.
Quickly pulled out my old engine, changed a couple of bits over and removed loom from donor engine, started to put new engine in around 4ish.
Could we get the bastard to line up on the gearbox? Could we heck. After 5 and a half hours, sucess, we got the engine bolts to gearbox. What an absolute bastard >:(
So, jobs left to do - everything really. Bolt on PAS, Bolt on oil cooler pipes, bolt on compressor, fit electric fans, consdensor, rad, hoses, airbox, turbo pipes, exhaust, a/c pipes, hbv, expansion bottle, loom, and plenty more. Must removed to fit TC bolts as well! Lots and lots still to do.
I had hoped to be not far off getting it to run today, but that bloody car is jinxed. We were all wet and cold, and very tired by 10pm, after being on it all day. Good job my neighbour is away, as there was plenty of bad language towards the end ::)
Still, decent progress has been made due to the perseverence of my fellow conspirators, to whom I owe a huge debt of gratitude:
So a massive thankyou to Omegatoy, Kevin Wood, LFF64, Bo Bo, and Tunnie, for your time, your effort, your skills, and your commradeship today. Personally, despite the fact the rather car is possessed by some evil spirit, I had a very enjoyable day. Bloody knackered now though.
Thank you :y
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Good Work Everyone :y :y
Hope This Engine Works Ok TB and its not possessed
So by tomorrow afternoon you should have her running ::)
What is it with The Dev Gear Box it was a pain when you replaced it last time
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Good Work Everyone :y :y
Hope This Engine Works Ok TB and its not possessed
So by tomorrow afternoon you should have her running ::)
With the tractor, i make no promises on timescales!
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Well done all concerned..It WILL be worth it in the end..
Have a beer.. [smiley=beer.gif] :y
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Well done all concerned..It WILL be worth it in the end..
Have a beer.. [smiley=beer.gif] :y
I'm that knackered, I'd rather have a nice cup of tea.
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Well done all concerned..It WILL be worth it in the end..
Have a beer.. [smiley=beer.gif] :y
I'm that knackered, I'd rather have a nice cup of tea.
Cup of tea with a whisky.. :y
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Sounds like a f*nny of a job...... Always keep in mind that its a chunk of ferrous and does not have a brain or cunning plan. You guys do. Well done on whats accomplished thus far. Time now for beer, bed and an unwind. Then give it a razz on Sunday and have it running in time for Tea and Medald and a Sunday Roast! :y
Well done all!
B
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Well done all concerned..It WILL be worth it in the end..
Have a beer.. [smiley=beer.gif] :y
I'm that knackered, I'd rather have a nice cup of tea.
Cup of tea with a whisky.. :y
If thats the case, remember (please) to use the cooking whisky. Keep the malt for a time when you can really appreciate it!!
B
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Even if Spongebob is buying...? ;D
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Well done all concerned..It WILL be worth it in the end..
Have a beer.. [smiley=beer.gif] :y
I'm that knackered, I'd rather have a nice cup of tea.
Cup of tea with a whisky.. :y
If thats the case, remember (please) to use the cooking whisky. Keep the malt for a time when you can really appreciate it!!
B
Most definately in the wrong frame of mind to enjoy a whisky.... :(
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Cup of tea with a whisky...
...and hold the tea ;D
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Good Work Everyone :y :y
Hope This Engine Works Ok TB and its not possessed
So by tomorrow afternoon you should have her running ::)
With the tractor, i make no promises on timescales!
Yep, hope you'll see it running tomorrow!
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Good Work Everyone :y :y
Hope This Engine Works Ok TB and its not possessed
So by tomorrow afternoon you should have her running ::)
With the tractor, i make no promises on timescales!
Yep, hope you'll see it running tomorrow!
The way my back is feeling (I suffer from muscular back pains, probably due to amount of time I spent up wet, cold telegraph poles in a former life), I suspect I'll be doing sod all tomorrow...
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PICS!? :)
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Start the day with a BIG cooked breakfast :y
Then you will be in the frame of mind to tackle the tractor
Followed by Yippee up and running then you can get the Stellas flowing.. :y
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PICS!? :)
Hmmm, I think if I had got a camera, and asked Omegatoy to say cheese, when if was holding the engine up, with that annoying sharp piece of bodywork digging in his arm, I think it is very possible he would have lumped me :o
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Well done to all on the transplant even if it was timely and a challenging day for you all :y
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Really wish I could have joined in on this one :(
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What did you do, leave the TC in the gearbox, and then put the bolts through the drive plate into the TC after the bellhousing was mated?
Or did you leave the TC bolted to the driveplate?
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Sounds like OOF members are at it again ;D.....good job folks...good luck today Jaime :y
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first time the engine went in the bloody adaptor plate had somehow got bent in transit and we didnt notice!! so out it came again plate swapped for the original one which was only slightly bent >:( but engine and box would then line up but not the plate, then box and plate would line up but not to the engine then engine and plate would line up but not the box and so on and such forth :'( however it did finally give in but next time the engine and box come out as one lump!!!!! hint hint!!
yeh was a bit of a day but all good fun even when the gazebo gave up tring to hold a gallon of water an dropped it on someone repeatedly all day, think everyone got it at some point, yep we left TC in box as its the best way to avoid snagging the seals on the box, in spite of acheing all over and having a road map of europe tattoed up my arm from the various sharp bits of metal sticking into it :-?, it was a good laugh and an enjoyable day, great tomeet some of the guys and thanks to mrs the boy for making gallons of tea :y and in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
Omegatoy
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
I take it he was the one that kept getting soaked ;D ;D........Tunnie, you should always keep a fimbles brollie handy in the boot of the car :y ;D
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
I take it he was the one that kept getting soaked ;D ;D........Tunnie, you should always keep a fimbles brollie handy in the boot of the car :y ;D
Bo Bo was in charge of the brolly to keep tunnie dry, but within half a second of opening it, he broke it, much to the amusement of everyone else ;D
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
I take it he was the one that kept getting soaked ;D ;D........Tunnie, you should always keep a fimbles brollie handy in the boot of the car :y ;D
Bo Bo was in charge of the brolly to keep tunnie dry, but within half a second of opening it, he broke it, much to the amusement of everyone else ;D
[smiley=vrolijk_1.gif] [smiley=vrolijk_1.gif]
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
I take it he was the one that kept getting soaked ;D ;D........Tunnie, you should always keep a fimbles brollie handy in the boot of the car :y ;D
Actually, whilst Tunnie got pretty wet, it was LFF64 who spent most of the day laying in a puddle in the rain trying to align gearbox. That must have been cold and uncomfortable.
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Only pics, taken by Mrs TheBoy...
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2167.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2168.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2169.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2170.JPG)
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right, I'm off out to continue tinkering with the tractor...
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right, I'm off out to continue tinkering with the tractor...
Have a good one ;) and im off to BO BO's, HBV again :-/
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SOunds like a right nightmare - good luck for your next go at it :y
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We attempted the engine swap today, started at about 10:30ish by time we got there. Took a little longer than planned to remove, but was out by 1:30. By time we got it to Brackley, and unloaded, it was about 2:30.
Quickly pulled out my old engine, changed a couple of bits over and removed loom from donor engine, started to put new engine in around 4ish.
Could we get the bastard to line up on the gearbox? Could we heck. After 5 and a half hours, sucess, we got the engine bolts to gearbox. What an absolute bastard >:(
So, jobs left to do - everything really. Bolt on PAS, Bolt on oil cooler pipes, bolt on compressor, fit electric fans, consdensor, rad, hoses, airbox, turbo pipes, exhaust, a/c pipes, hbv, expansion bottle, loom, and plenty more. Must removed to fit TC bolts as well! Lots and lots still to do.
I had hoped to be not far off getting it to run today, but that bloody car is jinxed. We were all wet and cold, and very tired by 10pm, after being on it all day. Good job my neighbour is away, as there was plenty of bad language towards the end ::)
Still, decent progress has been made due to the perseverence of my fellow conspirators, to whom I owe a huge debt of gratitude:
So a massive thankyou to Omegatoy, Kevin Wood, LFF64, Bo Bo, and Tunnie, for your time, your effort, your skills, and your commradeship today. Personally, despite the fact the rather car is possessed by some evil spirit, I had a very enjoyable day. Bloody knackered now though.
Thank you :y
Dunno about that bit! ;D
I did'nt really do much, was more of a learning experience for me really first ever engine change. Learned at though, like if another one is done, remove the gearbox and attach that to the engine outside the car, then put it all in one go!
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fantastic efforts in one day guys :)
However, ;) , whilst what gaping hole was showing in the engine bay did you not think to fit something like a proper engine ;D I hear Lexus V8`s (supercharged) go well in said engine bay :D Hmmm supercharged Tractor ...
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fantastic efforts in one day guys :)
However, ;) , whilst what gaping hole was showing in the engine bay did you not think to fit something like a proper engine ;D I hear Lexus V8`s (supercharged) go well in said engine bay :D Hmmm supercharged Tractor ...
Yep. I mentioned that that hole was gagging for a V8. :y
Kevin
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I have now managed to get clean warm and dry at last :) I think I learnt a few things yesterday besides some swear words :o As for pictures I think BO BO may have a few :-[ it was a good day and I would not hesitate to do it again hopefully in the dry though :y
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It occurred to me on the way home..TB now has a knackered tractor engine with a working turbo on it.
Maybe it could be turned into something to stop the cold and the wet next time?
Something like a turbocharged wood burning stove? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfDr-XXuvmo
Or something to make a round of golf more interesting? http://www.nickhaddock.co.uk/jetgolfbuggy.htm
.. or to keep the beer cold? http://www.asciimation.co.nz/beer/
;D
Kevin
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Right, managed to get that barsteward loom that bolts to block in. Oil cooler pipes on. PAS on (after retrieving bracket from old engine as the donor one had broken. A/C compressor back on, after swapping mounting brackets over (BMW saw fit to change the compressor design at some stage, bloody typical of them). Driveplate to torque convertor bolts in, and torqued up. Starter motor in. Turbo to intercooler pipe.
So, lots of sensors to connect up, coolant hoses, gearbox wiring, HBV, vac pipes (these were all wrong before, so if anyone has a TD vac pipe layout, I need one!), electric fans, condensor, rad, exhaust, airbox, and all the intake stuff, and everything else I've forgotten.
Just chucked a couple of those burgers that I bought for bbq yesterday that never happened due to time weather. Bloody lovely.
Back out again in a minute once I've had a cuppa.
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Right, managed to get that barsteward loom that bolts to block in. Oil cooler pipes on. PAS on (after retrieving bracket from old engine as the donor one had broken. A/C compressor back on, after swapping mounting brackets over (BMW saw fit to change the compressor design at some stage, bloody typical of them). Driveplate to torque convertor bolts in, and torqued up. Starter motor in. Turbo to intercooler pipe.
So, lots of sensors to connect up, coolant hoses, gearbox wiring, HBV, vac pipes (these were all wrong before, so if anyone has a TD vac pipe layout, I need one!), electric fans, condensor, rad, exhaust, airbox, and all the intake stuff, and everything else I've forgotten.
Just chucked a couple of those burgers that I bought for bbq yesterday that never happened due to time weather. Bloody lovely.
Back out again in a minute once I've had a cuppa.
I would have joined you but, I had to fix the garage door which i broke.
Glad to say its all working now, although the door is a slightly different shape now! ::)
Just had a massive clearance in the garage too, so depending how this all goes, might pop down later to inspect progress ;)
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Right, managed to get that barsteward loom that bolts to block in. Oil cooler pipes on. PAS on (after retrieving bracket from old engine as the donor one had broken. A/C compressor back on, after swapping mounting brackets over (BMW saw fit to change the compressor design at some stage, bloody typical of them). Driveplate to torque convertor bolts in, and torqued up. Starter motor in. Turbo to intercooler pipe.
So, lots of sensors to connect up, coolant hoses, gearbox wiring, HBV, vac pipes (these were all wrong before, so if anyone has a TD vac pipe layout, I need one!), electric fans, condensor, rad, exhaust, airbox, and all the intake stuff, and everything else I've forgotten.
Just chucked a couple of those burgers that I bought for bbq yesterday that never happened due to time weather. Bloody lovely.
Back out again in a minute once I've had a cuppa.
I would have joined you but, I had to fix the garage door which i broke.
Glad to say its all working now, although the door is a slightly different shape now! ::)
Just had a massive clearance in the garage too, so depending how this all goes, might pop down later to inspect progress ;)
I may need a 'gadget hand' to plug gearbox loom back in if you have a mo....
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Sorry to hear that things did`nt go smooth for you all yesterday :-/
can imagine the language must have been quite "Foreign" by late evening ;D
and as for the weather >:( >:(
sounds like it`s going to take a while before you can close the case on this job :-/
I really thought that you would get to the enjoyable things of such a meet at about 8 o`clock :o :o
hope you manage to finish the other jobs without to much trouble :y :y
please keep us updated :y :y
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
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Oh, did get a 19 when it stalled, hasn't reoccured. Don't think it is crank sensor, although that did take a beating yesterday.
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Once it's run a bit, glow plugs shouldn't make any odds? :-/
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Once it's run a bit, glow plugs shouldn't make any odds? :-/
If glow plugs don't work, you'll struggle to get that cylinder to fire....
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I tend to agree with James, did you purge/bleed the fuel system???? Once it is running the glow plugs don't do anything :-/
Good luck, and i look forward to the continuing story :y
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
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I tend to agree with James, did you purge/bleed the fuel system???? Once it is running the glow plugs don't do anything :-/
Good luck, and i look forward to the continuing story :y
Its quite cold, so without glow plugs, you cant get the heat in to get that cylinder running. The amount of dirty smoke leads me to think it is fuelling ok :-/
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Hows the fuel pump on the engine, is it worth using the old one
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Hows the fuel pump on the engine, is it worth using the old one
Do you know waht a PITA they are to change on old tractor engines?
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
Plus woulda thought tech2 would tell you about duff glowplugs.......if theres not a warning light on the dash like on old merc....telling you duff glowplug/s
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
Plus woulda thought tech2 would tell you about duff glowplugs.......if theres not a warning light on the dash like on old merc....telling you duff glowplug/s
Not sure BMW designers have the necessary intelliigence to be able to design something that warns drivers of such failures.
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Maybe a silly question but, Are all fuel lines sealed and not leaking otherwise air will get in to the system and give the appearance of running lumpy and missing.. :y
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Maybe a silly question but, Are all fuel lines sealed and not leaking otherwise air will get in to the system and give the appearance of running lumpy and missing.. :y
They seem tight. Those not familiar with this lump, there is a fuel line from the pump for each injector. Did wonder about an airlock in on or 2, but it normally clears quickly in my experience.
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Hows the fuel pump on the engine, is it worth using the old one
Do you know waht a PITA they are to change on old tractor engines?
No - only seeen new ones
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Hows the fuel pump on the engine, is it worth using the old one
Do you know waht a PITA they are to change on old tractor engines?
No - only seeen new ones
runs of the chains, so all those covers off, cams/cranks locked, retiming afterwards... :'(
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
Plus woulda thought tech2 would tell you about duff glowplugs.......if theres not a warning light on the dash like on old merc....telling you duff glowplug/s
Not sure BMW designers have the necessary intelliigence to be able to design something that warns drivers of such failures.
Well there easy to check anyway.......pull the plugs off em.....and shove a meter on them to ground.....open circuit there knackered.....i got 3 ohms to ground on my merc for good one :y
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
Plus woulda thought tech2 would tell you about duff glowplugs.......if theres not a warning light on the dash like on old merc....telling you duff glowplug/s
Not sure BMW designers have the necessary intelliigence to be able to design something that warns drivers of such failures.
Well there easy to check anyway.......pull the plugs off em.....and shove a meter on them to ground.....open circuit there knackered.....i got 3 ohms to ground on my merc for good one :y
Except, being designed by an imbeccile, all the rather intake has to come off to get to the little beggers. >:(.
Have I mentioned how much I hate BMW?
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you hate bmw? :o
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rather BMW. I hate them. I really hate them. Why oh why oh why do you change the size of the pulleys you stupid people >:(.
Right, swapped the crank pulleys over, got belts on, all the inlet, turbo all connected, airbox on, rad and condensor all in, along with leccy fans, a/c all connected up, fuel pipes in, vac pipes possibly wrong. Tunnie came round, so I let him do the gearbox loom and attach exhaust to turbo.
Ign on, then a quick Tech2. Only engine code was an old 96 that I was getting (most likely due to the vac all being rubbish), so cleared that out. So, ye of little faith, Omegatoy, the connectors must all be 'TheBoy proof' (except the one from the injector back to loom had a different connector - typical rather BMW, changing it for the hell of it >:() ;)
So, with everything done, it was time to start.
It starts (just), and runs (poorly), so that is a start. It is most definately a misfire short of a full engine. It needs throttle to help it start, it will idle (very lumpy) and won't rev beyonds 1500rpm. It is noisy, and boy does it smoke - they is a huge soot mark on the drive behind it.
I think it is so close, just needs an expert to help me with the final step.
The final step - changing the burnt out valves in the new lump? [smiley=evil.gif]
In all seriousness, if there's anything I can lend a hand with....
Any new codes since it's been run?
If not, I suspect the fault to be fuel related... managed to bleed it?
I've got a gut feeling about glow plugs...
Im impressed you've got so far with it TB :y
Tho dont think it will be glowplugs causing the prob.....my old merc diesel used to start on the button in this weather......used to struggle a tad in winter....and that had 3 duff glowplugs....
Plus woulda thought tech2 would tell you about duff glowplugs.......if theres not a warning light on the dash like on old merc....telling you duff glowplug/s
Not sure BMW designers have the necessary intelliigence to be able to design something that warns drivers of such failures.
Well there easy to check anyway.......pull the plugs off em.....and shove a meter on them to ground.....open circuit there knackered.....i got 3 ohms to ground on my merc for good one :y
Except, being designed by an imbeccile, all the rather intake has to come off to get to the little beggers. >:(.
Have I mentioned how much I hate BMW?
Oh dear :( On my old merc take the engine cover off and there are the little darlings 8-)
Think you right......dont buy a tractor BMW >:(
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you hate bmw?
:o
Is that Big Masculine Women ;D ;D
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Have I mentioned how much I hate BMW?
No - tell us
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you hate bmw?
:o
Is that Big Masculine Women ;D ;D
I always thought that stood for summat else ;D ;D
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you hate bmw?
:o
Is that Big Masculine Women ;D ;D
I always thought that stood for summat else ;D ;D
I take it you have never been to the Bavarien Beer festival in October
loads of BMW`s there, they serve you the beer ;D ;D ;D
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you hate bmw?
:o
Is that Big Masculine Women ;D ;D
I always thought that stood for summat else ;D ;D
BMW?
Well in Jaimes case: Barely Moving Wreck ;)
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you hate bmw?
:o
Is that Big Masculine Women ;D ;D
I always thought that stood for summat else ;D ;D
I take it you have never been to the Bavarien Beer festival in October
loads of BMW`s there, they serve you the beer ;D ;D ;D
No.....i was refering to summat else.... ;D ;D
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Jaime. I am sending you a full set of new glow plugs with laidback. A little something for that knackered gearbox - feel i owe you one.
Also, I am digging out my pics of the vacuum pipes. From memory you just have the big servo pie down the middle of the block then one spur off to the right and the one to the front of the engine. I will find the pics.
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Sorry to hear you are still having problems, it sounds as if you are nearly there. As far as testing the glowplugs, from what you say its a pain to get to them to check them. Is it not possible to check them from elsewhere, where the drive signal is derived from ?. Where do the glowplugs get their volts from?, is it a common line?. A bit long winded, but if you could get access to the wires that feed them, you could use a clipon ammeter to check if each is drawing current, which might save a lot of dismantling. best of luck. :y
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Glowplugs are best accessed by removing the inlet manifold. 12 13mm nuts. Supply is common wire and the plugs themselves are very easy to change. As I am sending a set anyway, i would leave alone until they arrive with dave.
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Glowplugs are best accessed by removing the inlet manifold. 12 13mm nuts. Supply is common wire and the plugs themselves are very easy to change. As I am sending a set anyway, i would leave alone until they arrive with dave.
When is dave arriving?
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Sorry to hear you are still having problems, it sounds as if you are nearly there. As far as testing the glowplugs, from what you say its a pain to get to them to check them. Is it not possible to check them from elsewhere, where the drive signal is derived from ?. Where do the glowplugs get their volts from?, is it a common line?. A bit long winded, but if you could get access to the wires that feed them, you could use a clipon ammeter to check if each is drawing current, which might save a lot of dismantling. best of luck. :y
Easier to get to plugs than the loom that sits just below the plugs! Bloody BMW.
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Jaime. I am sending you a full set of new glow plugs with laidback. A little something for that knackered gearbox - feel i owe you one.
Also, I am digging out my pics of the vacuum pipes. From memory you just have the big servo pie down the middle of the block then one spur off to the right and the one to the front of the engine. I will find the pics.
Ronnie, I have the plugs from old engine, which I will change over if others think thats the problem. Really just looking for ideas on the poor running at the moment.
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Jamie tell me to shut up if you like but. Are you 100% sure theres no air in the system, was it bled from the pump first then the injectors also is the fuel stop valve stuck half way..I am not familier with the BMW td fuel pump but i was a diesel fitter for 11 years and have had the same problems, especially with lots of smoke being pumped out i think i read earlier..
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Jamie tell me to shut up if you like but. Are you 100% sure theres no air in the system, was it bled from the pump first then the injectors also is the fuel stop valve stuck half way..I am not familier with the BMW td fuel pump but i was a diesel fitter for 11 years and have had the same problems, especially with lots of smoke being pumped out i think i read earlier..
No, I haven't.
Under impression, these were self bleeding - I was expecting air in, but before on old engine, this was cleared fairly quickly. No obvious bleed near pump or injectors?
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Jamie tell me to shut up if you like but. Are you 100% sure theres no air in the system, was it bled from the pump first then the injectors also is the fuel stop valve stuck half way..I am not familier with the BMW td fuel pump but i was a diesel fitter for 11 years and have had the same problems, especially with lots of smoke being pumped out i think i read earlier..
No, I haven't.
Under impression, these were self bleeding - I was expecting air in, but before on old engine, this was cleared fairly quickly. No obvious bleed near pump or injectors?
I take it is a rotory pump if so slacken off 2 injector pipes on pump just to get air out of pump then 2 on injectors while turning over. you might get air out of it with hand pump if fitted..Always works for me on diesel engines..Does it have a fuel solenoid if so make sure power is going there or give it a light thump with spanner.. Of course as i said im not used to these engines and things have come a long way since i played with things. ECU controlled nightmares.. :y
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Jamie tell me to shut up if you like but. Are you 100% sure theres no air in the system, was it bled from the pump first then the injectors also is the fuel stop valve stuck half way..I am not familier with the BMW td fuel pump but i was a diesel fitter for 11 years and have had the same problems, especially with lots of smoke being pumped out i think i read earlier..
No, I haven't.
Under impression, these were self bleeding - I was expecting air in, but before on old engine, this was cleared fairly quickly. No obvious bleed near pump or injectors?
I take it is a rotory pump if so slacken off 2 injector pipes on pump just to get air out of pump then 2 on injectors while turning over. you might get air out of it with hand pump if fitted..Always works for me on diesel engines..Does it have a fuel solenoid if so make sure power is going there or give it a light thump with spanner.. Of course as i said im not used to these engines and things have come a long way since i played with things. ECU controlled nightmares.. :y
:y
Not sure what bleeding method is needed, hopefully someone will be able to tell me soon :)
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well apparently the procedure is:
Remove
Remove engine cover.
Loosen closure plug on fuel filter approx. two turns.
Actuate starter until fuel escapes free of bubbles at closure plug. Seal closure plug. Collect escaping fuel.
Inspect
Whilst the starter is actuated, loosen all injection lines in sequence at the injection nozzle holder with Line Wrench KM-812, until fuel escapes at the injection lines.
Seal injection lines again – tightening torque 25 Nm / 18.5 lbf. ft.
Collect escaping fuel.
Install engine cover.
... can be found in a certain program (ahem ;))
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well apparently the procedure is:
Remove
Remove engine cover.
Loosen closure plug on fuel filter approx. two turns.
Actuate starter until fuel escapes free of bubbles at closure plug. Seal closure plug. Collect escaping fuel.
Inspect
Whilst the starter is actuated, loosen all injection lines in sequence at the injection nozzle holder with Line Wrench KM-812, until fuel escapes at the injection lines.
Seal injection lines again – tightening torque 25 Nm / 18.5 lbf. ft.
Collect escaping fuel.
Install engine cover.
... can be found in a certain program (ahem ;))
Thanks, will try later :y
TBH, as it was getting really wet, and the light was going, and my back was killing me, and the backs of my legs were finding muscles not used since I was little, I was more than willing to stop and have another look today. Its all back together (seemingly correctly!), which was my target for yesterday, so I was pleased with that :)
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PICS!? :)
Hmmm, I think if I had got a camera, and asked Omegatoy to say cheese, when if was holding the engine up, with that annoying sharp piece of bodywork digging in his arm, I think it is very possible he would have lumped me :o
I have a few pics on my phone ::) I'll try & post them tomorrow.
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in spite of all the problems and setbacks I would do it again!! :-[
:o - I'm sure there is some therapy group for people who can't resist spending their Saturdays in the wet and cold trying to get engines in and out...
I bet next time, you will stick by your guns and bring the box out with the motor - I wish we had now ;)
Seriously, I agree with Omegatoy, a good day, I giggle was had by all, obviously mainly at Tunnies expense ;D
I take it he was the one that kept getting soaked ;D ;D........Tunnie, you should always keep a fimbles brollie handy in the boot of the car :y ;D
Bo Bo was in charge of the brolly to keep tunnie dry, but within half a second of opening it, he broke it, much to the amusement of everyone else ;D
[smiley=vrolijk_1.gif] [smiley=vrolijk_1.gif]
Well there was a huge gust of wind ::)
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So a massive thankyou to Omegatoy, Kevin Wood, LFF64, Bo Bo, and Tunnie, for your time, your effort, your skills, and your commradeship today. Personally, despite the fact the rather car is possessed by some evil spirit, I had a very enjoyable day. Bloody knackered now though.
Thank you :y
I agree, despite being cold & wet I enjoyed the whole day (well apart from the drive home, boy was I cold :().
Was great to meet LFF64 & Omegatoy (that's one fast tractor :y) & I learnt a few things :)
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So a massive thankyou to Omegatoy, Kevin Wood, LFF64, Bo Bo, and Tunnie, for your time, your effort, your skills, and your commradeship today. Personally, despite the fact the rather car is possessed by some evil spirit, I had a very enjoyable day. Bloody knackered now though.
Thank you :y
I agree, despite being cold & wet I enjoyed the whole day (well apart from the drive home, boy was I cold :().
Was great to meet LFF64 & Omegatoy (that's one fast tractor :y) & I learnt a few things :)
Sometimes it helps with understanding to see a car stripped like that. Makes things easier in the future I reckon. For instance, no way would I have attempted removal of, for example, PAS pump. Having seen it now, it is so easy. I'm glad you got some new knowledge from it, although I know we spent most of the afternoon/evening getting the box on :(
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Still waiting for some strip-down pics to add to my collection.... ;)
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Still waiting for some strip-down pics to add to my collection.... ;)
None taken, but plan is to lift old engine on hoist, and take some from all angles.... ....but need to wait until someone strong enough to help move to where I can get hoist on it...
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Still waiting for some strip-down pics to add to my collection.... ;)
Here's one to keep you going....
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2172.JPG)
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Engine in...
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2171.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2173.JPG)
TheBoy in...
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2174.JPG)
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Added to the collection and will be re-used as needed... ;)
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I think I would have moved the hammer ;D I have just emptied the water out of my toolbox and just spent the last hour drying the tools out :)
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Where there some fuel pipes mising from the donor as there look to be some missing off the old engine ?
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Where there some fuel pipes mising from the donor as there look to be some missing off the old engine ?
No, had to remove to get the loom out, as the stupid BMW designers obviously somehow thought it would be a marvellous idea to trap the cable box under them....
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I think I would have moved the hammer ;D I have just emptied the water out of my toolbox and just spent the last hour drying the tools out :)
You mean my delicate adjustment tool....
Yes, my tools are all in a mess and strewn all over the place. I think I may have found your 12mm rachet spanner.
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OK, Omegatoy, our resident TD expert has had a look. "something aint running right there" is the conclusion.
I've run the oil flush through, and got it to idle properly, and rev a bit more freely. However, its very noisy, and smokes no end still. I'm currently draining the oil and flush, as well as cooling system. Then need to put some nice fresh oil in, along with some lifter treatment.
Need to change the starter, which is fubar (Tunnie and I suspected that last night), and the alternator (fubar). Also, we suspect the pump in the tank is fubar as well.
As said, this rather car is jinxed.
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OK, Omegatoy, our resident TD expert has had a look. "something aint running right there" is the conclusion.
I've run the oil flush through, and got it to idle properly, and rev a bit more freely. However, its very noisy, and smokes no end still. I'm currently draining the oil and flush, as well as cooling system. Then need to put some nice fresh oil in, along with some lifter treatment.
Need to change the starter, which is fubar (Tunnie and I suspected that last night), and the alternator (fubar). Also, we suspect the pump in the tank is fubar as well.
As said, this rather car is jinxed.
I hope thats diesel smoke and not oil smoke.....if you see what i mean :-/
If it is diesel smoke......could it just not be sooted up engine......blowing it all out....or does it smoke a lot an idle as well?
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OK, Omegatoy, our resident TD expert has had a look. "something aint running right there" is the conclusion.
I've run the oil flush through, and got it to idle properly, and rev a bit more freely. However, its very noisy, and smokes no end still. I'm currently draining the oil and flush, as well as cooling system. Then need to put some nice fresh oil in, along with some lifter treatment.
Need to change the starter, which is fubar (Tunnie and I suspected that last night), and the alternator (fubar). Also, we suspect the pump in the tank is fubar as well.
As said, this rather car is jinxed.
I hope thats diesel smoke and not oil smoke.....if you see what i mean :-/
If it is diesel smoke......could it just not be sooted up engine......blowing it all out....or does it smoke a lot an idle as well?
Its unburnt diesel smoke we think.
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Did you hear the donor lump running before you took it out?
If not - try putting the known good diesel injectors from the other car in it...
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Engine in...
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2171.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2173.JPG)
TheBoy in...
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2174.JPG)
TB POWER!! :y :D
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Where there some fuel pipes mising from the donor as there look to be some missing off the old engine ?
No, had to remove to get the loom out, as the stupid BMW designers obviously somehow thought it would be a marvellous idea to trap the cable box under them....
All connected up to the right injectors.....
I assume this engine was good and running very recently before the swap?
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Where there some fuel pipes mising from the donor as there look to be some missing off the old engine ?
No, had to remove to get the loom out, as the stupid BMW designers obviously somehow thought it would be a marvellous idea to trap the cable box under them....
All connected up to the right injectors.....
I assume this engine was good and running very recently before the swap?
Managed to get loom into donor engine without too much injector pipe removal.
Engine was in use until July, when gearbox failed.
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When i got there today engine was struggling to start , wasnt on all cylinders, attmpted to bleed filter no go, :'( cracked injector pipes, very little if amy there either, ok removed fuel filter, to find it nearly empty!! anyway cranked engine to check fuel delivery, and nothing came out of the fuel pipe!!! Ok easy way to stop the boy worrying is to remove my fuel filter and fill his up, replace on engine, crank it starts :y bleed injector pipes and it ticks over on all 6, :y great except for the noise!!! it hellishly loud diesel knock, having seen the smoke coming out of the exhaust combined with the heavy diesel knock im reasonably convinced the injectors are pouring fuel in like buckets, I may be wrong!! but this is an early engine mated to a late management system, and the centre injector which carries the pieco lead, may have to be changed as they were different plugs which may signify differnt values to the pump!! any thoughts guys???
If its not that it either stuck injectors, or the vave lifters are gummed up and need freeing off or a combination of both!!
Omegatoy
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Just a thought how is the fuel pump driven, it does not need to be timed to the engine does it that could be causing problems if the timing is out slightly. Not too worried about the spanner for now :y
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When i got there today engine was struggling to start , wasnt on all cylinders, attmpted to bleed filter no go, :'( cracked injector pipes, very little if amy there either, ok removed fuel filter, to find it nearly empty!! anyway cranked engine to check fuel delivery, and nothing came out of the fuel pipe!!! Ok easy way to stop the boy worrying is to remove my fuel filter and fill his up, replace on engine, crank it starts :y bleed injector pipes and it ticks over on all 6, :y great except for the noise!!! it hellishly loud diesel knock, having seen the smoke coming out of the exhaust combined with the heavy diesel knock im reasonably convinced the injectors are pouring fuel in like buckets, I may be wrong!! but this is an early engine mated to a late management system, and the centre injector which carries the pieco lead, may have to be changed as they were different plugs which may signify differnt values to the pump!! any thoughts guys???
If its not that it either stuck injectors, or the vave lifters are gummed up and need freeing off or a combination of both!!
Omegatoy
Loud is an understatement ;D
By time engine had cooled and I'd had my tea, it was getting dark. Drained oil and put fresh in. Not done oil filter yet, as I need to get one. Found out why the air filer didn't fit - it ain't an Omega one! Hell knows why I bought that then. Bit like the oil filters for 2.2DTi I got!
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Just a thought how is the fuel pump driven, it does not need to be timed to the engine does it that could be causing problems if the timing is out slightly. Not too worried about the spanner for now :y
Pump driven off cam cahin I believe, but does have a couple of degrees adjustment...
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When i got there today engine was struggling to start , wasnt on all cylinders, attmpted to bleed filter no go, :'( cracked injector pipes, very little if amy there either, ok removed fuel filter, to find it nearly empty!! anyway cranked engine to check fuel delivery, and nothing came out of the fuel pipe!!! Ok easy way to stop the boy worrying is to remove my fuel filter and fill his up, replace on engine, crank it starts :y bleed injector pipes and it ticks over on all 6, :y great except for the noise!!! it hellishly loud diesel knock, having seen the smoke coming out of the exhaust combined with the heavy diesel knock im reasonably convinced the injectors are pouring fuel in like buckets, I may be wrong!! but this is an early engine mated to a late management system, and the centre injector which carries the pieco lead, may have to be changed as they were different plugs which may signify differnt values to the pump!! any thoughts guys???
If its not that it either stuck injectors, or the vave lifters are gummed up and need freeing off or a combination of both!!
Omegatoy
Loud is an understatement ;D
By time engine had cooled and I'd had my tea, it was getting dark. Drained oil and put fresh in. Not done oil filter yet, as I need to get one. Found out why the air filer didn't fit - it ain't an Omega one! Hell knows why I bought that then. Bit like the oil filters for 2.2DTi I got!
::) ::) ::) - They may come in handy
The garage should be sorted next weeked, your welcome to pop it by in the evenings. Parents tend to be away during the week :y
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When i got there today engine was struggling to start , wasnt on all cylinders, attmpted to bleed filter no go, :'( cracked injector pipes, very little if amy there either, ok removed fuel filter, to find it nearly empty!! anyway cranked engine to check fuel delivery, and nothing came out of the fuel pipe!!! Ok easy way to stop the boy worrying is to remove my fuel filter and fill his up, replace on engine, crank it starts :y bleed injector pipes and it ticks over on all 6, :y great except for the noise!!! it hellishly loud diesel knock, having seen the smoke coming out of the exhaust combined with the heavy diesel knock im reasonably convinced the injectors are pouring fuel in like buckets, I may be wrong!! but this is an early engine mated to a late management system, and the centre injector which carries the pieco lead, may have to be changed as they were different plugs which may signify differnt values to the pump!! any thoughts guys???
If its not that it either stuck injectors, or the vave lifters are gummed up and need freeing off or a combination of both!!
Omegatoy
Loud is an understatement ;D
By time engine had cooled and I'd had my tea, it was getting dark. Drained oil and put fresh in. Not done oil filter yet, as I need to get one. Found out why the air filer didn't fit - it ain't an Omega one! Hell knows why I bought that then. Bit like the oil filters for 2.2DTi I got!
::) ::) ::) - They may come in handy
The garage should be sorted next weeked, your welcome to pop it by in the evenings. Parents tend to be away during the week :y
Oh yes, I remember how I got them now - I'd forgotten the sequence of events (told you my memory was poor). My own fault for getting an ex-studen to sort it out ;D
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It may be worth checking the timing of that then, I have a 2.8 Pajero and that was smoking badly (unburnt deisel) and that was suggested it may be pump timing or possiblly the pump seals which is apparently common on these Pajero that is not sure about omegas I may be talking out of my bottom :-/ but its a thought :y
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It may be worth checking the timing of that then, I have a 2.8 Pajero and that was smoking badly (unburnt deisel) and that was suggested it may be pump timing or possiblly the pump seals which is apparently common on these Pajero that is not sure about omegas I may be talking out of my bottom :-/ but its a thought :y
Omegatoy did hint at that, but want me to try some other things first, namely get some injector cleaner through it, and get the lifter treatment in...
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It may be worth checking the timing of that then, I have a 2.8 Pajero and that was smoking badly (unburnt deisel) and that was suggested it may be pump timing or possiblly the pump seals which is apparently common on these Pajero that is not sure about omegas I may be talking out of my bottom :-/ but its a thought :y
yep suggested that to the boy, its definetly unburnt diesel,and the 2.8 paj does hace a history of pump probs mate :y
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The old oil did look pretty rancid (but then I know nothing about tractors).
Is the old engine ECU available to try? Might be worth a quick swap just in case? Is the Tech 2 showing sensible values for the temperature sensors, etc?
Worth trying a bit of lifter treatment and maybe some fuel additive perhaps. Although it hasn't been standing for long it's a fair while in comparison to regular use.
Excuse my complete lack of experience with diesels but if the ECU was over / under fuelling wouldn't it just affect the engine speed (at idle, at least. On boost it would be a different matter, obviously)? Surely if unburnt fuel is escaping as smoke it's the quality of the injector spray pattern or lack of compression, perhaps due to sticking lifters, etc?
Anyway, glad to hear it at least does run. Hopefully it will come good with a little more tinkering.
Kevin
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The old oil did look pretty rancid (but then I know nothing about tractors).
Is the old engine ECU available to try? Might be worth a quick swap just in case? Is the Tech 2 showing sensible values for the temperature sensors, etc?
Worth trying a bit of lifter treatment and maybe some fuel additive perhaps. Although it hasn't been standing for long it's a fair while in comparison to regular use.
Excuse my complete lack of experience with diesels but if the ECU was over / under fuelling wouldn't it just affect the engine speed (at idle, at least. On boost it would be a different matter, obviously)? Surely if unburnt fuel is escaping as smoke it's the quality of the injector spray pattern or lack of compression, perhaps due to sticking lifters, etc?
Anyway, glad to hear it at least does run. Hopefully it will come good with a little more tinkering.
Kevin
I have donor ECU, but it requires loom change....
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Not as stupid as I look then ::)
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Not as stupid as I look then ::)
No, the rain and cold has not turned your brain to mush... ...yet!
;D
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:) It may be worth you having a look at the pajero owners club site uk POCUK Sorry cant do links ect :-[ as nearly all of them are deisel someone on there may be able to offer some advice on what to look for ;)
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Hi TB just a thought if your running later pump with early software or vise versa a common fault is with the injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in. Check on the engine/pump youve taken out as it will be easier to see. You should be able to swop over and it doesn't matter which way round the wires go for refitting. Just that what your describing is heavy deisel knock. You may even find one pump has it and the other doesn't. In which case you'll have to swop pumps back over to match software originally in car/ecu.
Other than timing you'll need to be checking and comparing compressions. :( Good luck mate
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Hi TB just a thought if your running later pump with early software or vise versa a common fault is with the injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in. Check on the engine/pump youve taken out as it will be easier to see. You should be able to swop over and it doesn't matter which way round the wires go for refitting. Just that what your describing is heavy deisel knock. You may even find one pump has it and the other doesn't. In which case you'll have to swop pumps back over to match software originally in car/ecu.
Other than timing you'll need to be checking and comparing compressions. :( Good luck mate
Oh rather hell :(. I will have to ask Omegatoy how 'doable' this is :'(
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Hi TB just a thought if your running later pump with early software or vise versa a common fault is with the injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in. Check on the engine/pump youve taken out as it will be easier to see. You should be able to swop over and it doesn't matter which way round the wires go for refitting. Just that what your describing is heavy deisel knock. You may even find one pump has it and the other doesn't. In which case you'll have to swop pumps back over to match software originally in car/ecu.
Other than timing you'll need to be checking and comparing compressions. :( Good luck mate
Are you talking from experience of this particular engine?
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Hi TB just a thought if your running later pump with early software or vise versa a common fault is with the injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in. Check on the engine/pump youve taken out as it will be easier to see. You should be able to swop over and it doesn't matter which way round the wires go for refitting. Just that what your describing is heavy deisel knock. You may even find one pump has it and the other doesn't. In which case you'll have to swop pumps back over to match software originally in car/ecu.
Other than timing you'll need to be checking and comparing compressions. :( Good luck mate
Are you talking from experience of this particular engine?
More of experience of the Bosch deisel system many years playing around with their systems, its a good system and in my opinion more reliable than the lucas/delphi system. Lots of different manufacturers use the same deisel or petrol injections systems. e.g. fords TDci is basically the same as the merc. system just a few minor software changes to suit the application :y
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Off topic, but I do also believe the bosch pump is much stronger than lucas/cav
If the cylinder compressions/leakdown test are all fine, It can only really be timing/injector related I guess
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Off topic, but I do also believe the bosch pump is much stronger than lucas/cav
If the cylinder compressions/leakdown test are all fine, It can only really be timing/injector related I guess
Yes and a good test of injectors is a leak off test for the injectors done from the leak off tube connections. run engine on idle for 2 mins with 4 tubes, 1 on each injector leak off connection and see 1st how much air is comming through and also all pipes ( preferable into its each own bottle/collector ) should deposit roughly the same amount of fuel.
Add all the measured amounts in each bottle together divide by 4 and this will give you an average your amounts should be. The bottle with the least amount if a lot different will be the faulty injector thats leaking. i.e if the excess fuel is not going into the bottle its going into the cylinder, easy eh! :y
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But, going back to basics.......this engine was supposidly a good runner until it was removed.....so in theory it should be ok....... I wouldn't bugger around with anything thats not been touched during the refit until all the bits have been confirmed as ok first.
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But, going back to basics.......this engine was supposidly a good runner until it was removed.....so in theory it should be ok....... I wouldn't bugger around with anything thats not been touched during the refit until all the bits have been confirmed as ok first.
Totally agree Marks, i was just thinking if engine and pump were swopped as a unit or if old pump was fitted to new engine, possible software difference issues. But your right basic timing checks etc....
Was engine left standing in the open without manifolds or injectors exposing cylinders to the weather for a month or so...??? Are the electrical plugs on the pump the same, Have you confirmed glow plug system working okay, Simple 12V test lamp onto glowplug when switched on and see how long it stays on, some systems keep the glow plugs on after lamp on dash has gone out and engine started to aid cold running, just a thought :)
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A few more pics;
Engine mod :D
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/paulmccristall/engine%20change/6d38e58d.jpg)
Ready for replacement
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/paulmccristall/engine%20change/68429ad8.jpg)
Shelter
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/paulmccristall/engine%20change/9bb06ba4.jpg)
Tunnie getting wet
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/paulmccristall/engine%20change/dafc6a9e.jpg)
Into the night
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g251/paulmccristall/engine%20change/be210b11.jpg)
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The diesel injector pump is from donor. In fact, pretty much everthing is from donor, except:
A/C compressor and its mounting
PAS pump
Engine management and loom.
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as i hinted yesterday, starter and alternator are fubar, so off with all the intake (fiddly on a tractor). Replaced starter motor, took about 1.5hrs, due to being fiddly, and kept dropping spanner and having to retrieve from under car. Started removing alternator. All unbolted, and belt off, but can I work out how to get it out? No room to slide backwards, no room forwards, not enough room upwards, and no room to drop (even with pas removed). I hope the engine doesn't have to come out to do this >:(
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OK, so my toys came out the pram earlier - one or two of you may have noticed.
I reckon a good nights sleep, then reattempt alternator tomorrow night (if it stays dry - fat chance). Then just need to get the engine not so sound like a bag of nails and smoke like a 60-a-day man.
I am reluctant to touch the injector pump, as I know nothing about them, and have heard that you can really mess things up by setting it wrong. The pump was presumably set right when it was in donor car, so why should it need adjusting now?
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Thats the way The Boy..Another day tomorrow and maybe you will see this problem sorted.. :y
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for the cars I dunno too much but for coding - in case of a hard problem its good idea to have a break and rest..
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OK, so my toys came out the pram earlier - one or two of you may have noticed.
I reckon a good nights sleep, then reattempt alternator tomorrow night (if it stays dry - fat chance). Then just need to get the engine not so sound like a bag of nails and smoke like a 60-a-day man.
I am reluctant to touch the injector pump, as I know nothing about them, and have heard that you can really mess things up by setting it wrong. The pump was presumably set right when it was in donor car, so why should it need adjusting now?
That's the spirit. :) As a very wise man said on here the other night, 'It's just a lump of metal'. There is an answer you just have to find it. :y
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Hi Jaime,
I completely agree that a night off (or two), maybe a couple of stella's and doing something completely different is a huge help when things start to look a bit gloomy. You've worked your balls off on this car recently, so have a break from it.
When you return however, I would say that
1) The alternator must have some way of coming out, without engine removal. BMW are stupid, but not that stupid (one would hope!). Does your software give any indications as to the procedure?
2) The injector pump. you're right that, if you don't have experience in this area, you can cause more trouble than it's worth, by adjusting. I've done the job on Peugeots using the book of lies, but I certainly wouldn't take on the task light heartedly of doing this on a TD omega, specially with a BMW lump. I guess in answer to your question, the only way that the problem could be caused, is if the pump on the donor engine is different to the original, and requires a different set of ECU values/instructions to make the engine perform? I may be way off scale, but I know little about the modern TD.
3) I read that Omegatoy filled the diesel filter with diesel, and it started and ran on all six. Does it now run on all six using the fuel from your tank - or is there still an issue with delivery?
4) Is the Tech2 reporting any present engine management codes?
5) Is the air intake/turbo etc all connected securely and happily?
6) (and totally no offence intended here) - How much do you trust the seller that the engine is good?
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Burn the rather thing! That car is the twin of the Elite LPG I had. Fix one thing and..............
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as i hinted yesterday, starter and alternator are fubar, so off with all the intake (fiddly on a tractor). Replaced starter motor, took about 1.5hrs, due to being fiddly, and kept dropping spanner and having to retrieve from under car. Started removing alternator. All unbolted, and belt off, but can I work out how to get it out? No room to slide backwards, no room forwards, not enough room upwards, and no room to drop (even with pas removed). I hope the engine doesn't have to come out to do this >:(
Not worked on one of these but would removing engine mount work then jacking the lump over a bit. Like you said a good nights rest and you go back and see the problem staight away :y Usually a few cold tinnys while your working helps mellow the mood ;D
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6) (and totally no offence intended here) - How much do you trust the seller that the engine is good?
Im sure the engine is sound.....but how come the starter and alternator are knackered if the engine has only stood for a month :-/ Alternator maybe, if it got a good soaking on Saturday but the starter is buried isnt it?
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Burn the rather thing! That car is the twin of the Elite LPG I had. Fix one thing and..............
I entirely agree. If only I could find a can of petrol.
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Got the effing useless alternator out, new one in. Possible to remove from front if you disconnect all aircon pipes there. Ideally rad out, else you will likely damage the rad. The guy who wrote the procedure in TIS (out the top) must have been smoking the same happy baccy as the stupid german who designed the engine. Probably possible if you cut off battery tray, and reweld afterwards.
Refitting the aux belt, the bloody idler snapped, taking most of my knuckles with it >:( - The rest of my knuckles went when I thumped the garage wall. So, had to swap that over with my old engine.
Oil filter and air filter changed, fuel filter filled with diesel magic (filter was full, so fuel delivery OK when running).
Turn the key, same bloody problem - starter not disengaging once it fires. Wonder if thats what killed the alternator? 2 starters with same problem? I am 99% certain I have wired the same as old one, but it doesn't match the book of lies...
So, jobs to do:
1) work out this starter issue
2) work out why it sounds like a bag of nails and smokes so bad.
Or:
1) buy 5 gallons of petrol and a match
May go off to Machine Mart at the weekend and treat myself to a new Sammy.
>:(
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
All help appreciated.
Starter seems to work exactly as it should, until engine is running, then it seems to stay engaged (as if feed from alternator is going back to starter solenoid). If it is sticking, thats 2 starter motors thats got same issue...
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
All help appreciated.
Starter seems to work exactly as it should, until engine is running, then it seems to stay engaged (as if feed from alternator is going back to starter solenoid). If it is sticking, thats 2 starter motors thats got same issue...
Would either of you medium thickness wires fit on the battery terminal post instead of the 10mm post. Thinking alternator feed wire is powering up solenoid intead of charging battery.
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
All help appreciated.
Starter seems to work exactly as it should, until engine is running, then it seems to stay engaged (as if feed from alternator is going back to starter solenoid). If it is sticking, thats 2 starter motors thats got same issue...
Would either of you medium thickness wires fit on the battery terminal post instead of the 10mm post. Thinking alternator feed wire is powering up solenoid intead of charging battery.
I need to double check some wiring, but I don't believe the haynes wiring diagram. I am 99% sure I have wired up as per how it was before. Not sure that thick wire on 10mm bolt will fit the 13mm one.
I would have got the meter out when it showed same symptoms, but means the rather intake all has to come off again, stupid bloody BMW design >:(
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
All help appreciated.
Starter seems to work exactly as it should, until engine is running, then it seems to stay engaged (as if feed from alternator is going back to starter solenoid). If it is sticking, thats 2 starter motors thats got same issue...
Would either of you medium thickness wires fit on the battery terminal post instead of the 10mm post. Thinking alternator feed wire is powering up solenoid intead of charging battery.
I need to double check some wiring, but I don't believe the haynes wiring diagram. I am 99% sure I have wired up as per how it was before. Not sure that thick wire on 10mm bolt will fit the 13mm one.
I would have got the meter out when it showed same symptoms, but means the rather intake all has to come off again, stupid bloody BMW design >:(
And i thought beemers were the nuts, Maybe the engineers didn't like the fact they were told to build an oil burner so made it 'kin hard to work on!!! Still i admire your perseverance lesser mortals would have flogged it by now saying "oh yeah just needs a new starter was running perfect till then" ;D have you checked at battery to see if charge is getting to it with engine running, or do a continuity test from alternator wire at rear of alternator to battery connection might be quick easy test. If no continuity then alt wire is not joined to battery wire at starter. Just out of interest do they use 2 wires from back of alternator to starter or just 1
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Anyone with a tractor check the connections to starter? I have main feed straight from battery going to large middle bolt, the small wire going to the 8mm bolt, and 2 wires, medium thickness, to the 10mm bolt...
Could you not test wires to starter using 12v test lamp, one of the small wires sounds like a perm ign on feed.. When you key on ignition swtich to ign lamps on does the starter solenoid try to engage i.e clicking from solenoid if keyed on and off. If so remove wires one at a time till this stops then fit that that wire to the other post. Or! you have a sticking starter relay not disengaging starter once engine fired. Without wiring diagram hard to tell which one it is, but if you have tis send me pm a copy of wiring daigram of starter system and i'll check for you. also early and late pump wiring diags. Hope you don't mind if it sounds like i'm telling you to suck eggs but sometimes another pair of eyes and all that :)
All help appreciated.
Starter seems to work exactly as it should, until engine is running, then it seems to stay engaged (as if feed from alternator is going back to starter solenoid). If it is sticking, thats 2 starter motors thats got same issue...
Would either of you medium thickness wires fit on the battery terminal post instead of the 10mm post. Thinking alternator feed wire is powering up solenoid intead of charging battery.
I need to double check some wiring, but I don't believe the haynes wiring diagram. I am 99% sure I have wired up as per how it was before. Not sure that thick wire on 10mm bolt will fit the 13mm one.
I would have got the meter out when it showed same symptoms, but means the rather intake all has to come off again, stupid bloody BMW design >:(
And i thought beemers were the nuts, Maybe the engineers didn't like the fact they were told to build an oil burner so made it 'kin hard to work on!!! Still i admire your perseverance lesser mortals would have flogged it by now saying "oh yeah just needs a new starter was running perfect till then" ;D have you checked at battery to see if charge is getting to it with engine running, or do a continuity test from alternator wire at rear of alternator to battery connection might be quick easy test. If no continuity then alt wire is not joined to battery wire at starter. Just out of interest do they use 2 wires from back of alternator to starter or just 1
I think on of the wires on starter is wrong.
As you suggested, and as I thought, I reckon alternator is provide power to starter solenoid. That would explian why it stays engaged when running, and why it appeared last alternator wasn't working (wasn't connected to battery). I think I need to move one of the wires from 10mm bolt on starter (solenoid feed) to 13mm bolt (batt feed) - I bet that is wire from alternator.
I'll get meter out tomorrow, once I get that effing intake off again >:(
I bet there is sod all wrong with starter or alternator >:( - so thats 2 evenings wasted >:( >:(
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And i thought beemers were the nuts
You must be joking! Their warranty claims are some of the highest in the industry ;)
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For those who suggested modifying pump timing, using a ruler to measure distanace from top of pump to block, original engine 89mm, donor 88.5mm, and I would guess that 0.5mm may just be the accuracy of trying to measure it...
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Good luck with it TB, sounds like another trip to the offy for another 6 pack. Forget the matches and petrol this is good get your teeth into stuff. Frustrating as hell (ah how i remember my first job on my v6 that flaming exhaust manifold) but in a few weeks time you'll look back and laugh................ Don't you hate it when people say that >:( ;D
I look forward to the next post :y
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Keep your pecker up, TB. :y
Remember you can always have the last laugh on the chunk of tin thats causing you grief - weigh it in and get a hundred quid at the scrappies or break the bu**er into its components and make a reasonable return.
Or do not accept defeat and ensure you get the upper hand, thanks to the help and encouragement of others on here.... ;)
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Just make sure if you do scrap it it dies completely. I remember seeing and reading "Christine" That scared the shit out of mechanics even when squashed by tractor the thing still kept on going ;) :y
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I seem to recall the starter setup on these being a bit odd.
I 'think' there is an extra wire which connects to the glow plugs (or one of the other diesel engine ancillaries) from the starter. I will check this evening and work it through.
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And i thought beemers were the nuts
You must be joking! Their warranty claims are some of the highest in the industry ;)
BMW UK I have issues with after the way they mistreated Gloucesters dealer >:(
The bastards put a whole garage out of work because they were so good at fixing problems that Cheltenham was losing work too them.
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I seem to recall the starter setup on these being a bit odd.
I 'think' there is an extra wire which connects to the glow plugs (or one of the other diesel engine ancillaries) from the starter. I will check this evening and work it through.
Found what I did wrong, my mistake when I reassmebled. Could have sworn I had it right, but sitting down with a meter and a bit of logic, it was obviously wrong.
Starter motor now working as expetcted, as is alternator.
Fuse for the fuel pump now replaced ::) (Fuse 18).
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I seem to recall the starter setup on these being a bit odd.
I 'think' there is an extra wire which connects to the glow plugs (or one of the other diesel engine ancillaries) from the starter. I will check this evening and work it through.
Found what I did wrong, my mistake when I reassmebled. Could have sworn I had it right, but sitting down with a meter and a bit of logic, it was obviously wrong.
Starter motor now working as expetcted, as is alternator.
Fuse for the fuel pump now replaced ::) (Fuse 18).
So it's now running fine?
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So it's now running fine?
Trust me, if it was running right, this forum would be under no doubt about it.
Its 'running' like a bag of shite - a bugger to start, clattery, smokes like a steam train, stalls a lot, lumpy idle, slow to build up revs.... ...need i go on?
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So it's now running fine?
Trust me, if it was running right, this forum would be under no doubt about it.
Its 'running' like a bag of shite - a bugger to start, clattery, smokes like a steam train, stalls a lot, lumpy idle, slow to build up revs.... ...need i go on?
Torch it
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Couldn't be something stupid like a leaking fuel delivery pipe could it?
Thinking a leaky pipe/union could be letting the pump draw air along with the fuel and give simptoms of the pump requiring bleeding.
Or I could just be talking crap again. ;D
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
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You could try a can of clean fresh deisel support it above the engine for gravity feed and plumb in using rubber/plastic hoses to the pump intake pipe from the filter to the pump. If it runs okay youv'e got a fuel delivery prob. if still the same pump onwards. Have know filter housing itself to cause problems even though bled out and full of fuel:)
Ah chance anyone can pm wiring diagram for early and late pumps/starting system just to have a butchers, cheers ;)
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
Does that mean the ecu may be different for the two engines or could it be a different sw version is needed?
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You could try a can of clean fresh deisel support it above the engine for gravity feed and plumb in using rubber/plastic hoses to the pump intake pipe from the filter to the pump. If it runs okay youv'e got a fuel delivery prob. if still the same pump onwards. Have know filter housing itself to cause problems even though bled out and full of fuel:)
Ah chance anyone can pm wiring diagram for early and late pumps/starting system just to have a butchers, cheers ;)
only wiring diag i have is haynes.
so the error code, know what that means?
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
hooray!!! that concurs with the running problems!!!! simply put the injectors are putting to much fuel in amd the ecu cant back it off!!! got to be pump sensor, or pieco lead injector!!! :y
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Only time i've seen this is when pump timing solenoid failed on the bottom of pump, but when i got full story was due to pump/engine being churned over for hours without any deisel so cam shoe roller in pump had broken up leaving metal particles in fuel as evidence. But i digress, If your sure And no offence meant that engine was okay before and you haven't removed pump then basic pump timing okay. Advance and retard on pump controlled by ecu/software taken from MAP or MAF and temp sensor readings. So either your current sw as CaptainZok says is wrong, could try loading earlier software or pump is not compatible due to different internal make up ie maybe no timing solenoid. Are part no's for ecu the same for original system and donor engine. If the same internal board and pin no's for inputs/outputs the same just a software programming issue. :(
JUst a thought crossed my mind ( i know a very short journey ) Does your system use a water temp controlled cable to advance/retard pump for cold start. Old and basic but it works. If so is cable adjusted on pump correctly and does lever on pump move okay. As i said this is old school and would be suprised if your beemer engine has it :y
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Only time i've seen this is when pump timing solenoid failed on the bottom of pump, but when i got full story was due to pump/engine being churned over for hours without any deisel so cam shoe roller in pump had broken up leaving metal particles in fuel as evidence. But i digress, If your sure And no offence meant that engine was okay before and you haven't removed pump then basic pump timing okay. Advance and retard on pump controlled by ecu/software taken from MAP or MAF and temp sensor readings. So either your current sw as CaptainZok says is wrong, could try loading earlier software or pump is not compatible due to different internal make up ie maybe no timing solenoid. Are part no's for ecu the same for original system and donor engine. If the same internal board and pin no's for inputs/outputs the same just a software programming issue. :(
JUst a thought crossed my mind ( i know a very short journey ) Does your system use a water temp controlled cable to advance/retard pump for cold start. Old and basic but it works. If so is cable adjusted on pump correctly and does lever on pump move okay. As i said this is old school and would be suprised if your beemer engine has it :y
The ECU is different, hence why I had to swap over loom. My one had MAF etc, not present on earlier one. The software is not flash updatable.
The guy said the engine was running fine 'with a small amount of top end noise' about a month ago when the gearbox failed.
Omegatoy had heard the engine running previous to that.
The piezo electrical connector on on eof the injectors had a different plug, so I modified to fit. Could these be different?
The ECU gets coolant temp from a electrical coolant sensor in head, alongside the dash one.
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
hooray!!! that concurs with the running problems!!!! simply put the injectors are putting to much fuel in amd the ecu cant back it off!!! got to be pump sensor, or pieco lead injector!!! :y
Is there a sensor in the pump then?
TIS mentiones something about a needle valve, but no details...
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
hooray!!! that concurs with the running problems!!!! simply put the injectors are putting to much fuel in amd the ecu cant back it off!!! got to be pump sensor, or pieco lead injector!!! :y
Is there a sensor in the pump then?
TIS mentiones something about a needle valve, but no details...
If yous is a late car with earlier engine the new loom off of older car should have had same injector plug, or did you fit your later injectors to engine, if so you'll need to go back and fit original injectors. As this sensor looks for flow through the injector. Try this first. Again i wouldn't mess with pump if all was okay. :y
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
hooray!!! that concurs with the running problems!!!! simply put the injectors are putting to much fuel in amd the ecu cant back it off!!! got to be pump sensor, or pieco lead injector!!! :y
Is there a sensor in the pump then?
TIS mentiones something about a needle valve, but no details...
If yous is a late car with earlier engine the new loom off of older car should have had same injector plug, or did you fit your later injectors to engine, if so you'll need to go back and fit original injectors. As this sensor looks for flow through the injector. Try this first. Again i wouldn't mess with pump if all was okay. :y
Mine is a later car with earlier engine. I currently have the later loom and ecu. Pump and injectors are earlier ones (though look the same, except for the plug on the injector with the electrical plug).
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injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in., if this is the earlier one then it may not be compatible with the later management, equally the centre injector with the wire on may be to different values, it has to be one of them :o
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damn in the time it took me to type on this damn laptop there were two replys!! reckon familyman has a good slant on thing!!! :y
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injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in., if this is the earlier one then it may not be compatible with the later management, equally the centre injector with the wire on may be to different values, it has to be one of them :o
You think changing them over may make a difference? I am not convinced, but will bow to you greater knowledge :-/
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Do I sense the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned back on? :y
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injector pump timing solenoid, usually on the bottom of the pump with 2 black wires on it and 2 torqs screws holding it in., if this is the earlier one then it may not be compatible with the later management, equally the centre injector with the wire on may be to different values, it has to be one of them :o
You think changing them over may make a difference? I am not convinced, but will bow to you greater knowledge :-/
its the only thing i csn think of that could possibly cause it, iassuming every thing else is ok timing etc it can only be something like that, cos there is far to much fuel going in at tickover
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Worth swapping back to donor loom and ecu?
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Do I sense the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned back on? :y
As long as its not a train coming this way ...... :)
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Do I sense the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned back on? :y
not from where I'm standing :'(
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Worth swapping back to donor loom and ecu?
that seems a lot of work?
have a look at old engine pump and you should see the timing solenoid on the bottom of pump 2 wire jobbie, would be worth swapping it to try its only 2 torx bolts if thats set for the old loom it may be giving the wrong signals?
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Worth swapping back to donor loom and ecu?
that seems a lot of work?
have a look at old engine pump and you should see the timing solenoid on the bottom of pump 2 wire jobbie, would be worth swapping it to try its only 2 torx bolts if thats set for the old loom it may be giving the wrong signals?
I don't recall plugging anything in pump apart from large multiplug on loom tray and single wire on the top?
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As I feared.....the donor is the early engine and there are differences as of 1996 such as:
Map controlled EGR
MAF sensor control
Characteristic maps in ECU for pump tolerances
Internal engine measures.
Cylinder head combustion chamber shape changed and glow plug shroud altered to lower smoke production
Injector nozzles changed to radius type
Worth checking EPC as I suspect the pump changed, also, the schematis are in TIS under Service information-New Technical Features-Model Year 1996 1/2-Item 26
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As I feared.....the donor is the early engine and there are differences as of 1996 such as:
Map controlled EGR
MAF sensor control
Characteristic maps in ECU for pump tolerances
Internal engine measures.
Cylinder head combustion chamber shape changed and glow plug shroud altered to lower smoke production
Injector nozzles changed to radius type
Worth checking EPC as I suspect the pump changed, also, the schematis are in TIS under Service information-New Technical Features-Model Year 1996 1/2-Item 26
Should I put old loom and ECU on then? And if so, what about immobiliser to ECU coding (don't think the early immobilisers are coded in same way)
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Worth swapping back to donor loom and ecu?
that seems a lot of work?
have a look at old engine pump and you should see the timing solenoid on the bottom of pump 2 wire jobbie, would be worth swapping it to try its only 2 torx bolts if thats set for the old loom it may be giving the wrong signals?
I don't recall plugging anything in pump apart from large multiplug on loom tray and single wire on the top?
The black wires normally run from bottom of pump to the top and back inside the pump, with just the main multi plug on the pump. You may, in fact i'm sure you'll have to cut these wires on both pumps to remove solenoids then resolder your original solenoid back onto the donor pump. Doesn't matter which way round the black wires are soldered. But i think reading Marks post you may have more problems, might be better to swop looms and ecu.s to match your engine :)
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Worth swapping back to donor loom and ecu?
that seems a lot of work?
have a look at old engine pump and you should see the timing solenoid on the bottom of pump 2 wire jobbie, would be worth swapping it to try its only 2 torx bolts if thats set for the old loom it may be giving the wrong signals?
I don't recall plugging anything in pump apart from large multiplug on loom tray and single wire on the top?
The black wires normally run from bottom of pump to the top and back inside the pump, with just the main multi plug on the pump. You may, in fact i'm sure you'll have to cut these wires on both pumps to remove solenoids then resolder your original solenoid back onto the donor pump. Doesn't matter which way round the black wires are soldered. But i think reading Marks post you may have more problems, might be better to swop looms and ecu.s to match your engine :)
That may lead to immobiliser issues...
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Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......... Trouble is if your ecu is also looking for MAF signals etc.. from your loom which aren't present on old engine then you may never get it to perform well. Youv'e come this far try swopping injector 1st see how it runs then swop pump soleniod :y
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Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......... Trouble is if your ecu is also looking for MAF signals etc.. from your loom which aren't present on old engine then you may never get it to perform well. Youv'e come this far try swopping injector 1st see how it runs then swop pump soleniod :y
I have fitted MAF...
So change the injector with the piezo sensor, and then the solenoid? Do I have to remove pump to swap solenoid, and not sure if that needs the cam/timing chains locked :-/
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Worth checking EPC as I suspect the pump changed
Pumps are all the same according to epc
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As for the starter connections...
Big red cable to main screw lug (obvious)
2.5mm2 cable in Black red to connector 50
0.5mm2 cable in Black/Green to connector 38H
The last connection goes to the fuel filter heater relay.
As for the control solenoid on the pump, the wiring diagram sudgests that both pumps have them.
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As for the starter connections...
Big red cable to main screw lug (obvious)
2.5mm2 cable in Black red to connector 50
0.5mm2 cable in Black/Green to connector 38H
The last connection goes to the fuel filter heater relay.
As for the control solenoid on the pump, the wiring diagram sudgests that both pumps have them.
And the forth cable, not mentioned in haynes wiring diags goes to the big connector as well, as its the alternetor output - connecting to the start3er relay has obvious effects ::)
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just meant to say don't forget all 4 injectors as they different nozzles and flow rates not just the centre one with the connector. Dont know set up of Omega pump, but normally you can get to them with a bit more cursing and stripping bits off like engine mounts etc....
Look forward to hearing how it goes. Sorry have to log off now SWMBO is dragging me upstairs and not just to sleep me thinks!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wehey :y :y. Didn't realise is was that time of year already ;D ;D ;D
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now getting code 34 (no rather eml though - thats why beemer owners think their heap of crap is so reliable, it never brings on warning light)
34 - injector timing out of range
bugger.
hooray!!! that concurs with the running problems!!!! simply put the injectors are putting to much fuel in amd the ecu cant back it off!!! got to be pump sensor, or pieco lead injector!!! :y
According to EPC, the solenoid is the same on both engines. ALL the injectors are different, reading between the lines in TIS, they have a different spray pattern.
Anyone know where I can get a removal tool for the injectors?
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just meant to say don't forget all 4 injectors as they different nozzles and flow rates not just the centre one with the connector. Dont know set up of Omega pump, but normally you can get to them with a bit more cursing and stripping bits off like engine mounts etc....
Look forward to hearing how it goes. Sorry have to log off now SWMBO is dragging me upstairs and not just to sleep me thinks!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wehey :y :y. Didn't realise is was that time of year already ;D ;D ;D
you mean all 6 ;)
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just meant to say don't forget all 4 injectors as they different nozzles and flow rates not just the centre one with the connector. Dont know set up of Omega pump, but normally you can get to them with a bit more cursing and stripping bits off like engine mounts etc....
Look forward to hearing how it goes. Sorry have to log off now SWMBO is dragging me upstairs and not just to sleep me thinks!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wehey :y :y. Didn't realise is was that time of year already ;D ;D ;D
you mean all 6 ;)
Of course sorry mind was on other things ;D ;D :y :y
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just meant to say don't forget all 4 injectors as they different nozzles and flow rates not just the centre one with the connector. Dont know set up of Omega pump, but normally you can get to them with a bit more cursing and stripping bits off like engine mounts etc....
Look forward to hearing how it goes. Sorry have to log off now SWMBO is dragging me upstairs and not just to sleep me thinks!!!!!!!!!!!!!! wehey :y :y. Didn't realise is was that time of year already ;D ;D ;D
you mean all 6 ;)
Of course sorry mind was on other things ;D ;D :y :y
So, to clarify, as pump and solenoid in pump have same part numbers, I just need to change injectors over.
If that doesn't cure it, do I then need to adjust the pump timing?
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Definately change injectors over. if pump which comes with solenoid is the same part no. for early and late then you don't need to swop solenoid. Do injectors and see what happens. Like i said before if engine was running okay before i wouldn't start playing with pump timing just yet. :)
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Definately change injectors over. if pump which comes with solenoid is the same part no. for early and late then you don't need to swop solenoid. Do injectors and see what happens. Like i said before if engine was running okay before i wouldn't start playing with pump timing just yet. :)
Need to find a tool to remove injectors with - looks like a big, deep socket. And the one with the electric connector, how does tha come off?
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I need to have a further look at the wiring info as there was one slight difference I noted on the scms between the two pumps which could be changed in the loom setup.....it could also be nothing more than error on the pump symbol.
It was related to the pump feedback sensors (potentiometers), it looked like there could be a difference......may be nothing but, I will check anyway.
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The socket is more like a ring spanner at the bottom, half the tube part of the socket is missing with a full 1/2"" connection in the top. Would lend you mine but its out on loan at the mo. and as usual can't get hold of the "mate" whose borrowed it. :-[ looks a bit like this from the side: [ . Laser do a good socket and their tools have been good quality lately :y
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The socket is more like a ring spanner at the bottom, half the tube part of the socket is missing with a full 1/2"" connection in the top. Would lend you mine but its out on loan at the mo. and as usual can't get hold of the "mate" whose borrowed it. :-[ looks a bit like this from the side: [ . Laser do a good socket and their tools have been good quality lately :y
Where can I get one - Brackley Autosave won't sell it.
Know what size it is?
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I need to have a further look at the wiring info as there was one slight difference I noted on the scms between the two pumps which could be changed in the loom setup.....it could also be nothing more than error on the pump symbol.
It was related to the pump feedback sensors (potentiometers), it looked like there could be a difference......may be nothing but, I will check anyway.
If you could, that would be appreciated. I was really hoping to get this going this weekend, as need it for Wales meet, but currently, I can't see a resolution :'(
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Must confess been a while since i bought the socket so can't remember what size it is. But http://www.lasertools.co.uk/tools.aspx?cat=197 is the web site for laser go to automotive then diesel then injector sockets, but you'll need to know the size don't know if tis can help you or epc. Sorry don't know how to set up links :-[ hope this helps :)
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Any diesel experts passing Brackley this weekend, feel free to drop in :P
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Omegatoy is popping round for a couple of hours around midday :D
Today could be make or break day for the tractor :-/
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Omegatoy is popping round for a couple of hours around midday :D
Today could be make or break day for the tractor :-/
Fingers crossed, you deserve a result out of this :)
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Omegatoy is popping round for a couple of hours around midday :D
Today could be make or break day for the tractor :-/
Fingers crossed, you deserve a result out of this :)
Thanks - I'm hoping luck will turn with this project....
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Why couldnt the weather have been like this last weekend :) How is it going today any luck or do you want Smithys numder yet ;D
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dunno where the boy is or what he is doing but we reset pump timing and got rid of all smoke and the heavy diesel knock!!! this was after changing the injectors which made absolutey no difference to the way it ran :'( so bit the bullet and played with injector pump timing, had it running with no inlet manifold on and no throttle body and blanking the egr pipe by holding some tissue over it, lo and behold it run well,then had to fly and leave the boy to reassemble the engine, and since then havent heard!!!
Omegatoy
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Well, it would appear the tractor lives :D
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Still noisy, not sure if still diesel knock, or tappety....
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Well, it would appear the tractor lives :D
Yippee at last :y Have a beer :y [smiley=beer.gif]
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Good news at last TB, you've earnt it. :y
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Still noisy, not sure if still diesel knock, or tappety....
I thought all tractors were noisy ...... much prefer the purr of the V6 :)
but glad its runing at last .. a noisy engine is better than a dead engine ... :)
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Still noisy, not sure if still diesel knock, or tappety....
what compared to how it was or after we did pump timing? full explanation required!!! :-/
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Glad the old girls running at last :-X pump timing I was fairly close then :o so its not going to smithys then ;) Bugger I was going to ask for the boot spoiler and grille for mine :D Seriously glad its going now :y its taken a fair amount of work to get there but I bet its a weight off your mind now :y
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Omegatoy popped bround earlier, as he has said, and after swapping 5 of the injectors (would have done 6, but Mr Strongman broke my brand new tool ;D) and finding that made no difference, we decided to mess with diesel injection pump.
Undone the 2 bolts, but we couldn't shift it. So we undone the hidden 3rd bolt ::) and we could adjust. Move about 1mm, big improvement. Quieter, started on the button (this is with intake off as well!). So we decided to move more. Another 1mm, and it was better again. So another 1mm, slightly better again.
At this point Omegatoy really did need to go - only 2hrs after his original curfew time :o - I hope he didn't get in too much trouble. If he now speaks in a high pitched voice, I'll assume Mrs Omegatoy was not best pleased.
Put it all back together.
We then had people around, and had a BBQ, so left it for a few hours.
Just been out for a test drive, very noisy at first, including a strange rattle until it warmed up. Took it round the country lanes first, then for a thrashing up the A43 to towcester, obviously keeping to 70mph ::). Temp stayed low, and little pressure in system when I returned (after stopping at Tunnie's for a chinwag). No obvious water loss. Little bit of noise still when foot down, unsure if diesel noise, or tappety :-/. Little down on power as well I think, but then I've been using the MV6 for 2 weeks, which will always be more powerful....
So still a bit more to do on the engine to get it right, but its much, much, much closer. Any diesel experts who know how to adjust pumps fancy a little look - now it goes, I can drive it places? Not sure we can get it perfect by trial and error (I'm not as good as Mr DTM!).
Sassanach also turned up today, which as a pleasant surprise :y
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Still noisy, not sure if still diesel knock, or tappety....
what compared to how it was or after we did pump timing? full explanation required!!! :-/
Under load, its a loud tickety noise, but I would need someone who knows about such things to confirm...
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hmm kind of expected that >:( when we moved the pump the extra mm and it didnt improve it any further, should have reset it to the second or third position it was best there i think, did you try a hot start? was it ok? how much smoke now? damn i can see me going round again to get it dead right!!!
mrs Omegatoy wasnt to mad really :o as she informed me that i had bought her a new phone!!!! :-* for being so late, fancy hurting a guy in his wallet? thats only just slightly better than the ear bashing i was expecting!!! :'(
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Still noisy, not sure if still diesel knock, or tappety....
what compared to how it was or after we did pump timing? full explanation required!!! :-/
Under load, its a loud tickety noise, but I would need someone who knows about such things to confirm...
wouldnt mind betting its something to do with the wired injector not being as tight as it should!!!
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hmm kind of expected that >:( when we moved the pump the extra mm and it didnt improve it any further, should have reset it to the second or third position it was best there i think, did you try a hot start? was it ok? how much smoke now? damn i can see me going round again to get it dead right!!!
mrs Omegatoy wasnt to mad really :o as she informed me that i had bought her a new phone!!!! :-* for being so late, fancy hurting a guy in his wallet? thats only just slightly better than the ear bashing i was expecting!!! :'(
Stopped at Tunnie's for about 30mins, started fine then. It was dark, but could see a little smoke as I passed the streetlights when caning it.
Shall I get that broken socket replaced so we can do piezo injector up, or see about refund and try and get Draper set from somewhere?
The strange rattle when I first went on test drive went after while. Hopefully the lifter treatment will start to work if it is tappets. I'm not sure if its tappet or diesel knock noise?
On the driveway, if I revved it, bit get a fair bit of smoke - it disappeared under MV6 and appeared behind that. Probably too much smoke...
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Under load, its a loud tickety noise
If the rattle is sensitive to load it's unlikely be tappets I'd say. More likely timing related or an exhaust blow perhaps?
Kevin
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Under load, its a loud tickety noise
If the rattle is sensitive to load it's unlikely be tappets I'd say. More likely timing related or an exhaust blow perhaps?
Kevin
Take your foot off at 70mph ::), and its nearly quiet.
Oh, and Omegatoy, guess who forgot to put the wipers on ::) - you try washing your windscreen at silly speeds, only to find there is nothing to wipe the screen ;D. I should know better - I did the same to MaxV6 earlier this year :-[
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hmm kind of expected that >:( when we moved the pump the extra mm and it didnt improve it any further, should have reset it to the second or third position it was best there i think, did you try a hot start? was it ok? how much smoke now? damn i can see me going round again to get it dead right!!!
mrs Omegatoy wasnt to mad really :o as she informed me that i had bought her a new phone!!!! :-* for being so late, fancy hurting a guy in his wallet? thats only just slightly better than the ear bashing i was expecting!!! :'(
Stopped at Tunnie's for about 30mins, started fine then. It was dark, but could see a little smoke as I passed the streetlights when caning it.
Shall I get that broken socket replaced so we can do piezo injector up, or see about refund and try and get Draper set from somewhere?
The strange rattle when I first went on test drive went after while. Hopefully the lifter treatment will start to work if it is tappets. I'm not sure if its tappet or diesel knock noise?
On the driveway, if I revved it, bit get a fair bit of smoke - it disappeared under MV6 and appeared behind that. Probably too much smoke...
Think we should tighten the piezo injector but also think you should put a few hundred miles on it before we go doing anything else to see if it settles down after clearing its throat so to speak, slight power loss could be down to extremely flat inlet gaskets allowing a small boost bleed off? also think should blank egr off to see if it restores your performance ;D but all that can be done later just good to see you driving the thing without causing a water shortage again :y
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hmm kind of expected that >:( when we moved the pump the extra mm and it didnt improve it any further, should have reset it to the second or third position it was best there i think, did you try a hot start? was it ok? how much smoke now? damn i can see me going round again to get it dead right!!!
mrs Omegatoy wasnt to mad really :o as she informed me that i had bought her a new phone!!!! :-* for being so late, fancy hurting a guy in his wallet? thats only just slightly better than the ear bashing i was expecting!!! :'(
Stopped at Tunnie's for about 30mins, started fine then. It was dark, but could see a little smoke as I passed the streetlights when caning it.
Shall I get that broken socket replaced so we can do piezo injector up, or see about refund and try and get Draper set from somewhere?
The strange rattle when I first went on test drive went after while. Hopefully the lifter treatment will start to work if it is tappets. I'm not sure if its tappet or diesel knock noise?
On the driveway, if I revved it, bit get a fair bit of smoke - it disappeared under MV6 and appeared behind that. Probably too much smoke...
Think we should tighten the piezo injector but also think you should put a few hundred miles on it before we go doing anything else to see if it settles down after clearing its throat so to speak, slight power loss could be down to extremely flat inlet gaskets allowing a small boost bleed off? also think should blank egr off to see if it restores your performance ;D but all that can be done later just good to see you driving the thing without causing a water shortage again :y
Yeah, need to flush coolant through a few times - donor car probably didn't have much antifreeze in by look of things. Don't want to do another oil change until that lifter treatment has had chance to work - or should I consider putting more in?
I'll get that socket replaced tomorrow if Motorserv are open, so any time you have 10mins, drop me a text :y. An experienced ear on the remaining noise, and perhaps a test drive?
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Under load, its a loud tickety noise
If the rattle is sensitive to load it's unlikely be tappets I'd say. More likely timing related or an exhaust blow perhaps?
Kevin
Take your foot off at 70mph ::), and its nearly quiet.
Oh, and Omegatoy, guess who forgot to put the wipers on ::) - you try washing your windscreen at silly speeds, only to find there is nothing to wipe the screen ;D. I should know better - I did the same to MaxV6 earlier this year :-[
note to self, if the boy offers to fit a part on my car, go round behind him and tighten everything he does up!!!!!! ;D
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Under load, its a loud tickety noise
If the rattle is sensitive to load it's unlikely be tappets I'd say. More likely timing related or an exhaust blow perhaps?
Kevin
Take your foot off at 70mph ::), and its nearly quiet.
Oh, and Omegatoy, guess who forgot to put the wipers on ::) - you try washing your windscreen at silly speeds, only to find there is nothing to wipe the screen ;D. I should know better - I did the same to MaxV6 earlier this year :-[
note to self, if the boy offers to fit a part on my car, go round behind him and tighten everything he does up!!!!!! ;D
After everything I said, you can imagine what a dork I felt when I realised :-[
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Oh, and Omegatoy, guess who forgot to put the wipers on ::) - you try washing your windscreen at silly speeds, only to find there is nothing to wipe the screen ;D. I should know better - I did the same to MaxV6 earlier this year :-[
;D ;D ;D ;D
Glad you're getting there TB :y
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Under load, its a loud tickety noise
If the rattle is sensitive to load it's unlikely be tappets I'd say. More likely timing related or an exhaust blow perhaps?
Kevin
Take your foot off at 70mph ::), and its nearly quiet.
Oh, and Omegatoy, guess who forgot to put the wipers on ::) - you try washing your windscreen at silly speeds, only to find there is nothing to wipe the screen ;D. I should know better - I did the same to MaxV6 earlier this year :-[
;D ;D done that before - quick test drive of Bob Dents old estate after dis pack swap saw me caught in a down pour and no blades...
Good news at last on this one.....maybe next weekend we have a double celebration - perfect running tractor and Vectra v6 :D
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Ha ha so Tunnie has competion in breaking things ;D
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Good news at last on this one.....maybe next weekend we have a double celebration - perfect running tractor and Vectra v6 :D
I think thats pushing the truth a little ;D
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Glad to hear its running at last ;) Have you tried running Forte via the filter?? This should reduce the smoke a fair bit.
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Glad to hear its running at last ;) Have you tried running Forte via the filter?? This should reduce the smoke a fair bit.
Half filled the fuel filter with Diesel Magic (as recommended by Omegatoy). Could possible do with another dose once I've done a few miles.
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happy to hear its working ok :y
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Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
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Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
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Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
cant be a fluke....you had it running well, consistantly....thats no fluke...chin up, beer down the neck and try another day ;)
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Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
Actually, its currently got all the air intake off, which disconnects the egr (diesels run pretty much the same with the intake on or off, and it has to be off for adjusting the pump (and yes, same with intake on).
What is a poppet valve seat?
Still running 5 newer type injectors (1 with piezo lead), and one older type - as I was yesterday when it was working.
Yes, I wish you were nearer as well, as I simply do not know what to try now :'(
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Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
cant be a fluke....you had it running well, consistantly....thats no fluke...chin up, beer down the neck and try another day ;)
Simply do not know what to try next though. I am entirely out of ideas. Need this going for the weekend to go to Wales, as won't have the MV6 for then.
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
cant be a fluke....you had it running well, consistantly....thats no fluke...chin up, beer down the neck and try another day ;)
Simply do not know what to try next though. I am entirely out of ideas. Need this going for the weekend to go to Wales, as won't have the MV6 for then.
I would lend you the Elite, but i need the crows foot for the oil cooler pipes, which i don't have.
If this buyer does not purchase the Senny, you can borrow that :)
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
cant be a fluke....you had it running well, consistantly....thats no fluke...chin up, beer down the neck and try another day ;)
Simply do not know what to try next though. I am entirely out of ideas. Need this going for the weekend to go to Wales, as won't have the MV6 for then.
I would lend you the Elite, but i need the crows foot for the oil cooler pipes, which i don't have.
If this buyer does not purchase the Senny, you can borrow that :)
Very kind, but not required. Hopefully I can still make Wales somehow.
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
cant be a fluke....you had it running well, consistantly....thats no fluke...chin up, beer down the neck and try another day ;)
Simply do not know what to try next though. I am entirely out of ideas. Need this going for the weekend to go to Wales, as won't have the MV6 for then.
I would lend you the Elite, but i need the crows foot for the oil cooler pipes, which i don't have.
If this buyer does not purchase the Senny, you can borrow that :)
Very kind, but not required. Hopefully I can still make Wales somehow.
I know of a Taxi that could pick you up ;D ;)
-
Got to admit after yesterday when it was running perfectly i thought we had put this one to bed, but having gone round there today and helped put the new inlet manifold gaskets on the boy turned the key and the heavy diesel knock was back!! :'( we checked the position of the pump and it was exactly where i had set it , so that hadnt moved but the symptoms are exactly the same as they were when we first started it!!! tried adjusting pump again but no matter where we set it now it still runs as if there is to much fuel delivery, am beginning to believe the boy is right and the car is jinxed!! the only thing i can think of now is the pump is knackered? biut the seller assures us the engine was fine when in his car,and indeed i had sen him driving around in it a few months before,
what i cant get my head round is the fact that there is once again to much fuel going into the chambers, have run out of ideas on this one now, so somebody anybody give us a clue please!!!
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try disconnecting the wired injector,when my sprinter vans wired injector failed it produced huge volumes of smoke, when unplugged the symptoms reversed ie no smoke but gutless as hell.
-
try disconnecting the wired injector,when my sprinter vans wired injector failed it produced huge volumes of smoke, when unplugged the symptoms reversed ie no smoke but gutless as hell.
I was toying with that, in case wire got damaged when we nipped it back up...
Further ideas welcomed - need to get it going tomorrow.
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try disconnecting the wired injector,when my sprinter vans wired injector failed it produced huge volumes of smoke, when unplugged the symptoms reversed ie no smoke but gutless as hell.
we changed it :-[ mind you apart from the i.manifold gaskets change we did actually tighten th piezo lead injector!!! couldnt be that simple could it???
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try disconnecting the wired injector,when my sprinter vans wired injector failed it produced huge volumes of smoke, when unplugged the symptoms reversed ie no smoke but gutless as hell.
I was toying with that, in case wire got damaged when we nipped it back up...
Further ideas welcomed - need to get it going tomorrow.
almost cetain we didnt but unplug it anyway!!!! try it!!!!
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try disconnecting the wired injector,when my sprinter vans wired injector failed it produced huge volumes of smoke, when unplugged the symptoms reversed ie no smoke but gutless as hell.
I was toying with that, in case wire got damaged when we nipped it back up...
Further ideas welcomed - need to get it going tomorrow.
almost cetain we didnt but unplug it anyway!!!! try it!!!!
Yup, job for morning. Waaaayyy too pissed now.... :-[
-
when it failed on me there was no warning, it ran perfectly one minute......then not the next, simply unplug the wires and see.
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Sorry......know the basics...but the prob you have TB i dont know....but question? coz im lost on the thread....is the replacement lump on the orig ecu.....or have you changed it? for the one for the donor engine....coz how i see it...with the probs your having....either engine is fubared and seller is telling porkies.....or ecu is incorect :-/
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I know naff-all about diesels .. but some google searching has found this :
on about diesel hummers ....
We talked to a tech at Stanadyne. He said too many tech's change injector pumps when the problem is really the injector itself. If the injector itself is bad it won't always show up in the ODB II codes. The tech recommended we put the motor back together and find 4 injectors off of a truck that is running Ok and swap out one bank at a time to see if this fixes the "running rough/misfire" problem before tearing into the motor further.
Got the truck together last night; except for setting the timing more accurately, seems to run quite well with 4 new injectors in, rather than putting in an injector pump and who knows what else. Guess it was the injectors all along
and on a golf :
Possible Symptoms
* Loss of Power at high Engine Speeds
* Engine difficult to Start
Possible Causes
* Start of Injection Timing Regulation not OK
* Injection Pump Control Range blocked/dirty (e.g. by Metal Particles)
* Engine has stalled / ran out of Fuel recently
* Wiring/Connectors from/to Injection Valve (N108) faulty
Possible Solutions
* Check/Adjust Injection Start
* Check Fuel Supply
* Check/Replace Fuse(s)
* Check/Repair Wiring/Connectors from/to Injection Valve (N108)
another site .. not sure which marque .. talks about "pump advance/retard stuck in a fixed position"
probably you have already considered all these points .. just trying to throw ideas in .. :( good luck
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Sorry......know the basics...but the prob you have TB i dont know....but question? coz im lost on the thread....is the replacement lump on the orig ecu.....or have you changed it? for the one for the donor engine....coz how i see it...with the probs your having....either engine is fubared and seller is telling porkies.....or ecu is incorect :-/
Running my original ECU on the donor engine.
-
I know naff-all about diesels .. but some google searching has found this :
on about diesel hummers ....
We talked to a tech at Stanadyne. He said too many tech's change injector pumps when the problem is really the injector itself. If the injector itself is bad it won't always show up in the ODB II codes. The tech recommended we put the motor back together and find 4 injectors off of a truck that is running Ok and swap out one bank at a time to see if this fixes the "running rough/misfire" problem before tearing into the motor further.
Got the truck together last night; except for setting the timing more accurately, seems to run quite well with 4 new injectors in, rather than putting in an injector pump and who knows what else. Guess it was the injectors all along
and on a golf :
Possible Symptoms
* Loss of Power at high Engine Speeds
* Engine difficult to Start
Possible Causes
* Start of Injection Timing Regulation not OK
* Injection Pump Control Range blocked/dirty (e.g. by Metal Particles)
* Engine has stalled / ran out of Fuel recently
* Wiring/Connectors from/to Injection Valve (N108) faulty
Possible Solutions
* Check/Adjust Injection Start
* Check Fuel Supply
* Check/Replace Fuse(s)
* Check/Repair Wiring/Connectors from/to Injection Valve (N108)
another site .. not sure which marque .. talks about "pump advance/retard stuck in a fixed position"
probably you have already considered all these points .. just trying to throw ideas in .. :( good luck
All ideas welcomed :y
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
Actually, its currently got all the air intake off, which disconnects the egr (diesels run pretty much the same with the intake on or off, and it has to be off for adjusting the pump (and yes, same with intake on).
What is a poppet valve seat?
Still running 5 newer type injectors (1 with piezo lead), and one older type - as I was yesterday when it was working.
Yes, I wish you were nearer as well, as I simply do not know what to try now :'(
[/quote
Sorry poppet valve is the type of valve in the egr. and the seat is the same as inlet/exh valves and these seats are prone to wearing the same as engine valves so bad sealing to much air leaked so loss of boost pressure black smoke etc...... but as it makes no difference with it or manifold for that matter on or off hmmmmmmmm......... :(
What were the injector seals and if fitted the thermo seals at base of injectors like. ( theoretically crush type seals/washers and should be replaced every time but....) To much air and it will alter the crack off pressure for the injector, !st stage injection will be okay as light pressure only but 2nd stage requires higher compression pressure from cylinder, If this happens once piston has passed optimum point of injection due to air leaks poor starting and smoke etc.... I wouldn't worry about smoke visible in car headlights behind to much as it seems amplified in the headlights at night, all diesels do this to a greater or lesser degree
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
Actually, its currently got all the air intake off, which disconnects the egr (diesels run pretty much the same with the intake on or off, and it has to be off for adjusting the pump (and yes, same with intake on).
What is a poppet valve seat?
Still running 5 newer type injectors (1 with piezo lead), and one older type - as I was yesterday when it was working.
Yes, I wish you were nearer as well, as I simply do not know what to try now :'(
[/quote
Sorry poppet valve is the type of valve in the egr. and the seat is the same as inlet/exh valves and these seats are prone to wearing the same as engine valves so bad sealing to much air leaked so loss of boost pressure black smoke etc...... but as it makes no difference with it or manifold for that matter on or off hmmmmmmmm......... :(
What were the injector seals and if fitted the thermo seals at base of injectors like. ( theoretically crush type seals/washers and should be replaced every time but....) To much air and it will alter the crack off pressure for the injector, !st stage injection will be okay as light pressure only but 2nd stage requires higher compression pressure from cylinder, If this happens once piston has passed optimum point of injection due to air leaks poor starting and smoke etc.... I wouldn't worry about smoke visible in car headlights behind to much as it seems amplified in the headlights at night, all diesels do this to a greater or lesser degree
when we changed yesterday, a couple of the copper seals were suspect, so we put better ones from old ones on. After pump adjustments yesterday, it was pretty good (with intake on or off), and test drive was great.
-
..............
All ideas welcomed :y
A gallon of 4 star & a box of Swanvestas? ;D ;D
There's a reasonable looking facelift (X reg?) 2.5 TD near me for £2500 (bit basic though - it has windy handle things on the back doors ) ;D ;D
:y :y :y :y :y
-
..............
All ideas welcomed :y
A gallon of 4 star & a box of Swanvestas? ;D ;D
Oh, believe me, the thought has crossed my mind several times ;)
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
Actually, its currently got all the air intake off, which disconnects the egr (diesels run pretty much the same with the intake on or off, and it has to be off for adjusting the pump (and yes, same with intake on).
What is a poppet valve seat?
Still running 5 newer type injectors (1 with piezo lead), and one older type - as I was yesterday when it was working.
Yes, I wish you were nearer as well, as I simply do not know what to try now :'(
[/quote
Sorry poppet valve is the type of valve in the egr. and the seat is the same as inlet/exh valves and these seats are prone to wearing the same as engine valves so bad sealing to much air leaked so loss of boost pressure black smoke etc...... but as it makes no difference with it or manifold for that matter on or off hmmmmmmmm......... :(
What were the injector seals and if fitted the thermo seals at base of injectors like. ( theoretically crush type seals/washers and should be replaced every time but....) To much air and it will alter the crack off pressure for the injector, !st stage injection will be okay as light pressure only but 2nd stage requires higher compression pressure from cylinder, If this happens once piston has passed optimum point of injection due to air leaks poor starting and smoke etc.... I wouldn't worry about smoke visible in car headlights behind to much as it seems amplified in the headlights at night, all diesels do this to a greater or lesser degree
when we changed yesterday, a couple of the copper seals were suspect, so we put better ones from old ones on. After pump adjustments yesterday, it was pretty good (with intake on or off), and test drive was great.
Just an idea but it could just be that all injectors need retightening, Engine was okay when warm so seals cyl.head metals etc all expanded nicely to seal, But next day when cold a few air leaks appeared???
Also is delivery of tank to pump via filter okay. If poor delivery pump will alter timing to overcome offer biggest quantities of fuel but without the fuel there the bugger wont run no matter how much fuel it THINKS is going through. Same as in a petrol if it wont start what do you with the throttle push it to the floor and as anybody who knows of carbs with a fuel evaporation will know it will run like a bag of well you know. ( not suggesting your's is fuel evap but poss air leak in supply system)
-
It's just taken me fifteen minutes to read this thread from start to finish. I feel personally involved :o
I do hope it works out Jaime, it would be one of the greatest success stories to date.
-
..............
All ideas welcomed :y
A gallon of 4 star & a box of Swanvestas? ;D ;D
Oh, believe me, the thought has crossed my mind several times ;)
;D ;D ;D Sorry I couldn't be more constructive! ::)
We always seem to have a problem or two orthree or four .... with our Vauxhalls. My Astra has behaved impecably since I put it back on the road, but today for no apparent reason it has decided to show the airbag light :( It was OK when I went into Tesco but lit when i started it on my return! :'(
-
..............
All ideas welcomed :y
A gallon of 4 star & a box of Swanvestas? ;D ;D
Oh, believe me, the thought has crossed my mind several times ;)
;D ;D ;D Sorry I couldn't be more constructive! ::)
We always seem to have a problem or two orthree or four .... with our Vauxhalls. My Astra has behaved impecably since I put it back on the road, but today for no apparent reason it has decided to show the airbag light :( It was OK when I went into Tesco but lit when i started it on my return! :'(
You didn't put your shopping under the passenger seat? ::)
-
Unfortunately, the rather thing is jinxed.
Yesterday was obviously just a fluke.
If you can start the heap, it runs awful, lumpy, smokey, noisy. No amount of pump adjustment dials it out today.
Both Omegatoy and I are entirely out of ideas now.
Time to call the local scrappy for collection methinks.
Glad you got the old girl running, Omegatoy well on the ball. Have you tried blanking egr off or just cleaning it and check poppet valve seat. Wish i was nearer to pop round and listen and have a play :(
Are you still running 5 of 1 type of injector and then an odd 1 :-?
Actually, its currently got all the air intake off, which disconnects the egr (diesels run pretty much the same with the intake on or off, and it has to be off for adjusting the pump (and yes, same with intake on).
What is a poppet valve seat?
Still running 5 newer type injectors (1 with piezo lead), and one older type - as I was yesterday when it was working.
Yes, I wish you were nearer as well, as I simply do not know what to try now :'(
[/quote
Sorry poppet valve is the type of valve in the egr. and the seat is the same as inlet/exh valves and these seats are prone to wearing the same as engine valves so bad sealing to much air leaked so loss of boost pressure black smoke etc...... but as it makes no difference with it or manifold for that matter on or off hmmmmmmmm......... :(
What were the injector seals and if fitted the thermo seals at base of injectors like. ( theoretically crush type seals/washers and should be replaced every time but....) To much air and it will alter the crack off pressure for the injector, !st stage injection will be okay as light pressure only but 2nd stage requires higher compression pressure from cylinder, If this happens once piston has passed optimum point of injection due to air leaks poor starting and smoke etc.... I wouldn't worry about smoke visible in car headlights behind to much as it seems amplified in the headlights at night, all diesels do this to a greater or lesser degree
when we changed yesterday, a couple of the copper seals were suspect, so we put better ones from old ones on. After pump adjustments yesterday, it was pretty good (with intake on or off), and test drive was great.
Just an idea but it could just be that all injectors need retightening, Engine was okay when warm so seals cyl.head metals etc all expanded nicely to seal, But next day when cold a few air leaks appeared???
Also is delivery of tank to pump via filter okay. If poor delivery pump will alter timing to overcome offer biggest quantities of fuel but without the fuel there the bugger wont run no matter how much fuel it THINKS is going through. Same as in a petrol if it wont start what do you with the throttle push it to the floor and as anybody who knows of carbs with a fuel evaporation will know it will run like a bag of well you know. ( not suggesting your's is fuel evap but poss air leak in supply system)
Delivery pump definately working (had injection pump slightly dismantled, and when tunnie switched on ign, I got a good coating in diesel)...
-
It's just taken me fifteen minutes to read this thread from start to finish. I feel personally involved :o
I do hope it works out Jaime, it would be one of the greatest success stories to date.
It would be a bloody miracle ;D
Thanks for the support :y
-
..............
All ideas welcomed :y
A gallon of 4 star & a box of Swanvestas? ;D ;D
Oh, believe me, the thought has crossed my mind several times ;)
;D ;D ;D Sorry I couldn't be more constructive! ::)
We always seem to have a problem or two orthree or four .... with our Vauxhalls. My Astra has behaved impecably since I put it back on the road, but today for no apparent reason it has decided to show the airbag light :( It was OK when I went into Tesco but lit when i started it on my return! :'(
You don't use the same supermarket carparks as AutoAddict do you ;D
-
if all else fails let me know and ill bring marshmallows ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
As said try just tightening injectors. If still poor try leak off test as described earlier in thread. Gives you a much better insight to what the injectors are really doing. Does the engine sound like a misfire on 1or 2 cylinders or does the whole thing run rough vibration poor acceleration? :-/
-
As said try just tightening injectors. If still poor try leak off test as described earlier in thread. Gives you a much better insight to what the injectors are really doing. Does the engine sound like a misfire on 1or 2 cylinders or does the whole thing run rough vibration poor acceleration? :-/
I'd have to bow to Omegatoys greater knowledge, but to me, sounds like all 6 are running rough....
-
Just had another lightening thought. Sometimes the flow valve gets stuck on the pump. Sounds daft but try tapping the rear of the pump with a hammer to free it off before you start, or even better do you have a small 2 pin blue or brown connector on rear of pump?
-
....
You didn't put your shopping under the passenger seat? ::)
;D ;D It went ON the passneger seat for safe keeping. The sun was about to go over the yard arm & the sherry cupborad was bare so I'd been requested to buy a bottle on my way home. :y
-
if all else fails let me know and ill bring marshmallows ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D You'll need a very long stick. :y
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Just had another lightening thought. Sometimes the flow valve gets stuck on the pump. Sounds daft but try tapping the rear of the pump with a hammer to free it off before you start, or even better do you have a small 2 pin blue or brown connector on rear of pump?
I presume this is the solenoid in the pump? If so, its underneath, not sure how it comes off, probably needs pump to come off? I think thats the 2 pin connector that comes off seperately.
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if all else fails let me know and ill bring marshmallows ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I'll bring the parafin to get it started well ;D
-
You can't let it beat you!
-
what is this "flow" valve im hearing about? is this the engine stop- start solenoid? :-?
-
You can't let it beat you!
I do not consider beating it to death with Sammy Sledgehammer being classed as it winning...
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what is this "flow" valve im hearing about? is this the engine stop- start solenoid? :-?
No idea, I think its the valve on/in the injection pump?
-
You can't let it beat you!
I do not consider beating it to death with Sammy Sledgehammer being classed as it winning...
I know what you mean - personally I would have stripped the whole engine side fuel system out from the original - as that worked.
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You can't let it beat you!
I do not consider beating it to death with Sammy Sledgehammer being classed as it winning...
I know what you mean - personally I would have stripped the whole engine side fuel system out from the original - as that worked.
If I was to go down the route of changing the injection pump over, I may as well have just changed the head on the original. The injection pump is chain driven off the cam chain, not something I wanted to mess with.
-
have you tried that injector yet?
-
For those with the software, here is the snapshot (needs to be copied to cosids/data/snapshots)
http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/10000002.SUR
The thing that stands out to me is the Actual Injection Start which is 0, and the Desired Injection Start at 1000rpm is 4.1
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have you tried that injector yet?
No, though I have measured the DC resistance - 0.073 ohms, compared to 0.075 ohms on the original injector on the donor engine.
-
have you tried that injector yet?
No, though I have measured the DC resistance - 0.073 ohms, compared to 0.075 ohms on the original injector on the donor engine.
Well seeing as you cant measure resistance to that degree of accuracy I would say thats close enough!
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have you tried that injector yet?
No, though I have measured the DC resistance - 0.073 ohms, compared to 0.075 ohms on the original injector on the donor engine.
Well seeing as you cant measure resistance to that degree of accuracy I would say thats close enough!
Exactly.... ....so not worth swapping out that injector?
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just unplug it and see if it makes any difference to the running of it !!! (dont make me come down there again,)to many gatsos on the a420 and you would have a sore ass after 190 miles on a chelsea tractor :)
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just unplug it and see if it makes any difference to the running of it !!! (dont make me come down there again,)to many gatsos on the a420 and you would have a sore ass after 190 miles on a chelsea tractor :)
The thing is a bugger to start today. Tried unplugging, absolutely no difference, still couldn't start (or keep it running more than a second or 2. Did eventually get it to run (with it plugged in), but badly. Worth unplugging it with it running? The fact that it didn't help the awkward starting made me think that wasn't the issue?
-
Had a pleasant surprise today, Sassanach turned up to lend a hand with the tractor :D. Also Laidback66 made a flying visit to laugh at it. I had the last laugh though, as he left with a face covered in soot ;D
I think Sassanach has come to the same conclusion as I have - the car is jinxed.
He tried it with the fuel line disconnected, and a tube feeding the injection pump in a pint glass of diesel, which rules out an issue with fuel delvery to injection pump. We tried swapping the injector with the feedback over (actually, I may have done that before anyone turned up), tried it with it unplugged (than caused a change in engine note, and brought on EML), played about with pump timing (got it running quiet and smooth, but still smoked badly).
As it was running quiet and smooth, we decided to take it for a drive. I think Sassanach laughed when I put the tow pole in the boot. Fortunately, didn't need the tow pole, as the thing only just made it off the driveway >:(. Those that know my place will appreciate how hard it was to push it back on up the slope >:(.
We could get it to start, but as soon as gear selected, it dies - even if you drop it in gear at 1500rpm.
We decided to call it a day, and think about it....
And to add insult to injury, the tractor has a significant oil leak from the sump plug, and an even more significant one from the gearbox >:(. Words fail.
So a massive thanks to Sassanach for coming to help - it is a significant distance to travel. A fresh set of eyes is welcomed as Omegatoy and I have run out of ideas...
Time to get bladdered now >:(
-
I am no more qualified than anyone else that has already looked at it... but I'll happily spend a weekend with you if you fancy a play (which I doubt you do right now!!)
The oil leaks - sump plug - is this just a case of a crap washer, or is there a thread problem? And where abouts is it coming from, off the gearbox?
I feel really sorry for you... I do know how it feels when a project goes t!ts up...
-
I am no more qualified than anyone else that has already looked at it... but I'll happily spend a weekend with you if you fancy a play (which I doubt you do right now!!)
The oil leaks - sump plug - is this just a case of a crap washer, or is there a thread problem? And where abouts is it coming from, off the gearbox?
I feel really sorry for you... I do know how it feels when a project goes t!ts up...
Leak from sump may be a crap washer. The sump plug is fubar (someone has mashed up the torx), so needs replacing. Trouble is, I don't want to drain it yet, as it has all the lifter treatment in at the moment.
The autobox, not checked, but looks around bellhousing. Defo autobox fluid - a nice red wine colour.
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Hi TB words fail me mate :-[ Flow valve is different from timing solenoid spoke about earlier. Can you let me know what pump you have on now and what was on previous so i can delve into my archives and get an idea of what i'm looking at, cheers. :y
I think compression checks should be next port of call done through glow plugs, as timing etc doesn't appear to make much difference. Trying to persuade SWMBO to let me come up not this weekend but next, not sure how that will pan out as i don't see her or chillblanes as much as i would like now, but hopefully will get car sorted before that :)
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Hi TB words fail me mate :-[ Flow valve is different from timing solenoid spoke about earlier. Can you let me know what pump you have on now and what was on previous so i can delve into my archives and get an idea of what i'm looking at, cheers. :y
I think compression checks should be next port of call done through glow plugs, as timing etc doesn't appear to make much difference. Trying to persuade SWMBO to let me come up not this weekend but next, not sure how that will pan out as i don't see her or chillblanes as much as i would like now, but hopefully will get car sorted before that :)
I don't have my compression tester, its loaned out :'(
I have not changed the pump - so it is the one that came with donor engine. Looks like changing pump needs special tools.
The pump, not sure who makes it, but is the same I believe across all these engines (BMW M51 TDS), as fitted to Omegas, BMW, some Landrovers etc.
I have had 2 people who know diesels (maybe not true 'experts', meaning no disrespect) baffled by this. Both have commented that I'm right about the car being possessed ;D
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Hi TB words fail me mate :-[ Flow valve is different from timing solenoid spoke about earlier. Can you let me know what pump you have on now and what was on previous so i can delve into my archives and get an idea of what i'm looking at, cheers. :y
I think compression checks should be next port of call done through glow plugs, as timing etc doesn't appear to make much difference. Trying to persuade SWMBO to let me come up not this weekend but next, not sure how that will pan out as i don't see her or chillblanes as much as i would like now, but hopefully will get car sorted before that :)
I don't have my compression tester, its loaned out :'(
I have not changed the pump - so it is the one that came with donor engine. Looks like changing pump needs special tools.
The pump, not sure who makes it, but is the same I believe across all these engines (BMW M51 TDS), as fitted to Omegas, BMW, some Landrovers etc.
I have had 2 people who know diesels (maybe not true 'experts', meaning no disrespect) baffled by this. Both have commented that I'm right about the car being possessed ;D
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Cor I think your almost becoming proud of that fact ;D Could you get me pump details from tis not serial no's but model no's Most of my info is not car/manufacturer related but pump type. Also although resistances the same on injector, spray pattern is probably different on later injectors due to redesign of swirl in piston combustion chamber.( I'm assuming its an indirect diesel not a direct injection ) But as misfire not regular and engine generally rough you may be okay to leave for the minute.
Got to go now but will contact tommorrow for any updates. Keep smiling Its only bits of metal and wiring, I hope there is no personal vendetta on the cars part.
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Hi TB words fail me mate :-[ Flow valve is different from timing solenoid spoke about earlier. Can you let me know what pump you have on now and what was on previous so i can delve into my archives and get an idea of what i'm looking at, cheers. :y
I think compression checks should be next port of call done through glow plugs, as timing etc doesn't appear to make much difference. Trying to persuade SWMBO to let me come up not this weekend but next, not sure how that will pan out as i don't see her or chillblanes as much as i would like now, but hopefully will get car sorted before that :)
I don't have my compression tester, its loaned out :'(
I have not changed the pump - so it is the one that came with donor engine. Looks like changing pump needs special tools.
The pump, not sure who makes it, but is the same I believe across all these engines (BMW M51 TDS), as fitted to Omegas, BMW, some Landrovers etc.
I have had 2 people who know diesels (maybe not true 'experts', meaning no disrespect) baffled by this. Both have commented that I'm right about the car being possessed ;D
[/highlight]
Cor I think your almost becoming proud of that fact ;D Could you get me pump details from tis not serial no's but model no's Most of my info is not car/manufacturer related but pump type. Also although resistances the same on injector, spray pattern is probably different on later injectors due to redesign of swirl in piston combustion chamber.( I'm assuming its an indirect diesel not a direct injection ) But as misfire not regular and engine generally rough you may be okay to leave for the minute.
Got to go now but will contact tommorrow for any updates. Keep smiling Its only bits of metal and wiring, I hope there is no personal vendetta on the cars part.
There is very little info on pump in either Vauxhall TIS/EPC or BMW TIS, certainly doesn't say make. Guess its either BMW or Bosch, but do not know, nor know how to find out :(
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TB, please refresh my mind as to why you did not just change the cracked head on you original lump.IS this still not an option to go back to the orig engine. it does sound as if the engine yopu got is a duff unit. is the seller of the engine cosher.poss head off to check internals is looming.Good luck jamie. :y
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Compression tester can be with you pronto!
Can it be used on diesels, though?
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Garry...
It would appear that it was more economical just to hoist a known good lump in - head removal on these isn't easy.. and god knows what would have been found !
I just hope the lump is good :-X
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Yes james all understood, but it would have been better as it turns out, to have gone down that route as this i fear has only one poss outcome. but heres hoping that i am wrong. :-/
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Although I hope not, you may be right.
How about removing the head off the old lump, now it's out the car, and having a gander?
I'm also trying to think where the bloody heck the gearbox could be leaking from!!
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I am beginning to think that the donor engine has issues. Possibly a failed or faulty injection pump, or maybe something wrong with chain, its tensioner (if it has one) and guides - Sassanach and I both heard a rhythmic 'rubbing' noise intermittently, but where unable to pinpoint it, as we were busy trying to unblock the road :-[
Original reason for doing whole engine, is it looked easier, trouble sourcing new head (plenty of bottom ends, heads rarer - what does that say :-?), lack of tools (needs a special locking kit that locks the crank and chain guides), and cost (by time I'd bought all the gaskets and bolts needed for head removal etc)
Plan B is to remove head on original engine. There is evidence of the stuff put in cooling system by previous owner (the copper filing 'hg repair' stuff) on the injectors.
Now, over to the experts - the injectors sit in swirl/precombustion chambers, so if it was just a failed HG, could the copper filings have reached the injectors? Or does this definately prove head is fubar? Additionally, if that is the case, can the head be repaired? Or should I use the head from donor engine?
Problem with Plan B is if the engine is OK, and its an electronic problem (no codes on Tech2 - odd spurious one if it stalls itself), then that will be more expense for nothing :'(
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have now consulted the oracle..... pump is matched to original cars ecu requires attention from b%w to rematch. three options a, change pump so that your original pump is back on the engine or b, change head and reinstall original engine or c, bend over and take some from bmw :( :(
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the oracle has the special tools needed to change pump and i can borrow them ;)
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:y :y :y :y
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I can see light at the end of the tunnel....
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pump is matched to original cars ecu
Blimey! Take up the manufacuting tolerances in software ::) and don't make it self-learning! OK until someone changes one or t'other then it's foobar!
I reckon we're getting warmer, though. Either the pumps need to be swapped or the pump on the new engine has suffered from being left standing...
Kevin
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Pump change looks pretty staright forward and the only major tool required looks to be mounting bracket for the dial gauge to get the static pump stroke set correctly. The othere specials are a couple of locking pins.
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Just sell it to me! I love buying broken things ;D
Seriously though, have you tried giving it an Itallian tune up? with a splash of pump oil? the VP44 doesn't self lubricate like other pumps. Also you could try swapping the pump electrics too and see if this helps.
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have now consulted the oracle..... pump is matched to original cars ecu requires attention from b%w to rematch. three options a, change pump so that your original pump is back on the engine or b, change head and reinstall original engine or c, bend over and take some from bmw :( :(
Read that on the BMW TIS, seems that only affected early ECUs (ie, a new pump needed the ECU to be upgraded) is my understanding....
Omegatoy has just popped round with further info - something that I did consider last night, hence swapping heads and engines....
Picture to follow...
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Could this be same thing?
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/chain.jpg)
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So, whats easier/cheaper - changing chains/spockets/guides or changing heads over and swapping engines back?
Or worth changing pump first? Bit loathed to do that, as I have a working block with pump all timed, just needs head fixed?
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I think you might be better just having a look at the chain etc first before you swap anything else.
Did you hear it running before?
Maybe you would be better off pulling it out and fully rebuilding it?
Sorry, I know it's hard to take on board the worst case scenario but in reality in may be quicker to do and you should see 100k before you get an oil leak. :y
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Both nightmare jobs. Either way, you have to take timing chain off, so my bet is scrap it and call it a day. :(
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A jumping chain would certainly explain why it appeared to run OK and then suddenly developed issues again.
The oil in that engine looked pretty manky. Maybe the chain tensioner didn't operate correctly on initial startup, it jumped a tooth, corrected by your tweaking of the pump timing, only to jump again...
You need to have a look at that chain, methinks.
Kevin
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Both nightmare jobs. Either way, you have to take timing chain off, so my bet is scrap it and call it a day. :(
I feel that way. But I have £1500 tied up in this - more than I can justify writing off - so need to minimise loses now, which I guess means fixing the thing.
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according to oracle, pump is easy to replace as pump has master spline which means it can only go in one way. pulley stays put held by special tool which i can get.BUT my vote is remove engine swap heads and reinstall
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Could this be same thing?
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/chain.jpg)
Dunno if Disco's have the BMW lump in them :-/
But my bro's 2.5 TD did the same as that article......it wasnt the timing chain....it waz summat to do with the pump and had a new one fitted.
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Could this be same thing?
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/chain.jpg)
Dunno if Disco's have the BMW lump in them :-/
But my bro's 2.5 TD did the same as that article......it wasnt the timing chain....it waz summat to do with the pump and had a new one fitted.
Rangie does.
New pump? Ouch!
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Could this be same thing?
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/chain.jpg)
Dunno if Disco's have the BMW lump in them :-/
But my bro's 2.5 TD did the same as that article......it wasnt the timing chain....it waz summat to do with the pump and had a new one fitted.
Rangie does.
New pump? Ouch!
Well it might not have needed one :-/ But thats what you expect when he had it recovered to a main stealer!
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Chains/Sprockets/Guides appear to be dealer only.
Just rang the dealer.... ...assuming tensioners OK, looking around £235 + VAT.... :o
Tensioners an extra £62.50 + VAT each if they are gone.
I'm still hyperventilating.
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Chains/Sprockets/Guides appear to be dealer only.
Just rang the dealer.... ...assuming tensioners OK, looking around £235 + VAT.... :o
Tensioners an extra £62.50 + VAT each if they are gone.
I'm still hyperventilating.
;D ;D :o
is that trade price tho??? it may be cheaper if not, how much is head set??
Omegatoy
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Could this be same thing?
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/chain.jpg)
Dunno if Disco's have the BMW lump in them :-/
But my bro's 2.5 TD did the same as that article......it wasnt the timing chain....it waz summat to do with the pump and had a new one fitted.
Either 4 cyl descended from the early Diesel or the TD5
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Eurocarparts are cheaper......
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Eurocarparts are cheaper......
Going by their website, might be able to nearly save the VAT, though nothing in stock....
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do yourself a favour, how much is a head gasket (not set just head gasket)?
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do yourself a favour, how much is a head gasket (not set just head gasket)?
Won't I need the other stuff, eg rocker gasket etc etc?
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nope you have got all that other stuff already. you have a perfectly sweet lump sat in your garage KNOWN to work with a duff head, swap em and stop doing a balaclava :) :)
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nope you have got all that other stuff already. you have a perfectly sweet lump sat in your garage KNOWN to work with a duff head, swap em and stop doing a balaclava :) :)
That must be a Wiltshire/Avon term for something, coz means nought to me, but think I can guess the meaning....
Just rang the same place I got previous HG set quotes from. HG is around £60/£65, but need to know how many 'notches' it has, which is something to do with thickness?? They are now saying they don't list bolts, which usually mean they are not stretch bolts :o
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Dealer, £120 + VAT for gasket, £59 + VAT for bolts :o
ECP = £60 +VAT for HG, £26 + VAT for bolts... ...again, mentions notches etc. Anyone know what should be fitted to Omega TD?
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It sounds like the gaskets are of different thicknesses and are fitted selectively or perhaps used to compensate for skimmed heads, etc.
You'll probably be able to see the notches on the edge of the gasket somewhere where it emerges from the side of the engine. It may be worth seeing if you have to do any work on the head before getting a replacement.
Kevin
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local factors do a head gasket for £41+vat 3 notch version ie max thickness
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local factors do a head gasket for £41+vat 3 notch version ie max thickness
Blimey, can't get anywhere near that sort of price. Do they do the bolts?
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bolts £33.30+vat but even stretch bolts can be used again provided they havent exceeded there set length however i must admit i always change them
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nope you have got all that other stuff already. you have a perfectly sweet lump sat in your garage KNOWN to work with a duff head, swap em and stop doing a balaclava :) :)
That must be a Wiltshire/Avon term for something, coz means nought to me, but think I can guess the meaning....
Just rang the same place I got previous HG set quotes from. HG is around £60/£65, but need to know how many 'notches' it has, which is something to do with thickness?? They are now saying they don't list bolts, which usually mean they are not stretch bolts :o
Its not one that ive heard of before either
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OK, getting different advice, both publically and privately.
What should I do next, and why it will cure problem....
Even if you have privately or previously suggested something, please post here so we have all info in one place - I'm way beyond my knowledge, and struggling to keep up :-[
I really do need help on this, but really need to control budget on it now.
Wholehearted thanks in advance :y
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Hiya TB. Okay been checkign out some things 'cause this is an old injection system got a bit lost on the electric injector. Right this injector DOES NOT measure flowbut has a lift sensor on it that provides an input to the ECU to enable accurate control of injection TIMING. The different connectors are for different degrees of timing, the resistance will be the same for all injectors. So you need to match injector to pump and ecu. Not saying this is definately the prob, but without it the ecu cant accurately time the injection.
The cylinder head is flat, normally only the swirl chambers crack. An engineering shop should be able to pull swirl chambers out and if ava. fit new ones. Should be able to then skim okay with no affect on compression as this is done in the piston crown.
Different thickness of HG is to accomadate piston protrusion above the block deck measured with dial gauge at tdc. As your not touching bottom end just fit a gasket with same no of notches/holes. Very important . to thick poor low compression no power lots of black smoke. to thin high compression but fuel ignition to early poor power
Hope this helps some :y
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This is what I would do assuming no urgency
Remove replacement engine
Remove head form original
CLean and regrind in valves on bought engine
Fit recon head and new chain and pulleys
Refit
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Hiya TB. Okay been checkign out some things 'cause this is an old injection system got a bit lost on the electric injector. Right this injector DOES NOT measure flowbut has a lift sensor on it that provides an input to the ECU to enable accurate control of injection TIMING. The different connectors are for different degrees of timing, the resistance will be the same for all injectors. So you need to match injector to pump and ecu. Not saying this is definately the prob, but without it the ecu cant accurately time the injection.
The cylinder head is flat, normally only the swirl chambers crack. An engineering shop should be able to pull swirl chambers out and if ava. fit new ones. Should be able to then skim okay with no affect on compression as this is done in the piston crown.
Different thickness of HG is to accomadate piston protrusion above the block deck measured with dial gauge at tdc. As your not touching bottom end just fit a gasket with same no of notches/holes. Very important . to thick poor low compression no power lots of black smoke. to thin high compression but fuel ignition to early poor power
Hope this helps some :y
Runs equally badly on both injectors....
So I need to remove head to check the HG before buying one, or is it checkable from outside? Assuming I go down the head change route...
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Normally you can check the gasket without removing head. Not sure where it will be but its normally a bit of gasket sticking out of head, not even able to guess where it is but if a factors will let you look at a gasket you should then be able to work where your one is. Your not going to try a pump swop first then, compression test will tell you if anything amis in engine first before ripping apart what could be a perfectly good lump, If timing has jumped you'll get low compression as there is not a lot of room for error on valve timing.
Does this engine use shims on valve lifters or are they hydraulic like the petrol? If shimmed then just check for any valves with huge gaps this'll tell you if any valves are bent :y
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Normally you can check the gasket without removing head. Not sure where it will be but its normally a bit of gasket sticking out of head, not even able to guess where it is but if a factors will let you look at a gasket you should then be able to work where your one is. Your not going to try a pump swop first then, compression test will tell you if anything amis in engine first before ripping apart what could be a perfectly good lump, If timing has jumped you'll get low compression as there is not a lot of room for error on valve timing.
Does this engine use shims on valve lifters or are they hydraulic like the petrol? If shimmed then just check for any valves with huge gaps this'll tell you if any valves are bent :y
Are you suggesting I should try swapping pumps?
I think its hydraulic lifters.
Do you think its likely the chains have slipped, like the photo of article I posted earlier today?
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Normally you can check the gasket without removing head. Not sure where it will be but its normally a bit of gasket sticking out of head, not even able to guess where it is but if a factors will let you look at a gasket you should then be able to work where your one is. Your not going to try a pump swop first then, compression test will tell you if anything amis in engine first before ripping apart what could be a perfectly good lump, If timing has jumped you'll get low compression as there is not a lot of room for error on valve timing.
Does this engine use shims on valve lifters or are they hydraulic like the petrol? If shimmed then just check for any valves with huge gaps this'll tell you if any valves are bent :y
Are you suggesting I should try swapping pumps?
I think its hydraulic lifters.
Do you think its likely the chains have slipped, like the photo of article I posted earlier today?
Personally i would do a comp. test 1st. If you can get pins for checking timing do this as this will tell you if timing has slipped if okay leave. I just think that until you know whats going on inside the lump you may be doing work thats not needed.
Note diesel comp testers normally go higher than one dedicated to petrol, but a mutlipurpose one if it fits in glow plug holes should be okay
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i sure i saw the notches on your old engines headgasket at the back of the head
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i sure i saw the notches on your old engines headgasket at the back of the head
Just make sure the no. of notches match the block your using not the head. your old engine may well be the same but check your new engine first. ;) ;)
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i sure i saw the notches on your old engines headgasket at the back of the head
I will check in daylight.
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i sure i saw the notches on your old engines headgasket at the back of the head
Just make sure the no. of notches match the block your using not the head. your old engine may well be the same but check your new engine first. ;) ;)
Thanks for the tip :y
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Normally you can check the gasket without removing head. Not sure where it will be but its normally a bit of gasket sticking out of head, not even able to guess where it is but if a factors will let you look at a gasket you should then be able to work where your one is. Your not going to try a pump swop first then, compression test will tell you if anything amis in engine first before ripping apart what could be a perfectly good lump, If timing has jumped you'll get low compression as there is not a lot of room for error on valve timing.
Does this engine use shims on valve lifters or are they hydraulic like the petrol? If shimmed then just check for any valves with huge gaps this'll tell you if any valves are bent :y
Are you suggesting I should try swapping pumps?
I think its hydraulic lifters.
Do you think its likely the chains have slipped, like the photo of article I posted earlier today?
Personally i would do a comp. test 1st. If you can get pins for checking timing do this as this will tell you if timing has slipped if okay leave. I just think that until you know whats going on inside the lump you may be doing work thats not needed.
Note diesel comp testers normally go higher than one dedicated to petrol, but a mutlipurpose one if it fits in glow plug holes should be okay
What I'm thinking, rightly or wrong, and I'm open to ideas, is that the original engine has a good bottom end, good pump, and is timed up fine. It just has a knackered head (or possibly gasket).
So would it save a lot of pondering and further dead ends if I just swap the heads, then swap the engines back over?
Am I correct with my thoughts? Or is it a bad idea?
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spot on :y :y :y :y :y :y
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but use the cam and lifters from your original engine.
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but use the cam and lifters from your original engine.
oh break.... ....is that easy?
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YES..... :) :) :) :)
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YES..... :) :) :) :)
Yes, but you think stripping AR35s down and respraying is easy :P
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you have to remove these parts to remove the head!!!!
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OK, I'm having a break from it this weekend, as doing the 'not quite Wales' camping trip, but keen to get it going asap afterwards.
Does anyone else agree this is the right/wrong thing to do?
Additionally, anyone got a locking kit I can borrow for a few days?
Anyone done one before?
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Now jamie,you know what you have to do but are putting it off and in a way i understand, but you have a unit that you have some degree of knowledge about,and one that you know bugger all about. So going on that you need to swap the head and fit new hg and refit into your car. take ssassenachs advice and get it done, as at the moment you are going around in circles chasing your tail to the point that eventually you dont know what to do next. With the engine out it has got to be the best and quickest way forward.Best of luck to you. ;)
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What I'm thinking, rightly or wrong, and I'm open to ideas, is that the original engine has a good bottom end, good pump, and is timed up fine. It just has a knackered head (or possibly gasket).
So would it save a lot of pondering and further dead ends if I just swap the heads, then swap the engines back over?
Have we got any reason to suspect that the new engine is not basically OK?
It was running reasonably well at one point? We can do a compression test to gain some confidence in it.
Personally, I wouldn't go to the pain of swapping the engines again and the expense of rebuilding the old engine without establishing why the new engine is misbehaving. The fact that it ran badly, then OK, then badly again tells me that something slipped, broke, etc. but that it is probably capable of running OK.
I'd be inclined to have a look at the timing chain first, and see if anything odd is going on there WRT the pump timing slipping. If that doesn't solve anything I'd try swapping the pumps over in case the new engine has a knackered pump or it's incompatible with the ECU. Only then would I consider rebuilding the old engine. - or is the pump change / cam chain access so awkward it's a rebuild job anyway?
I agree that if the above two steps don't improve matters it's worth stripping but even then I wouldn't take the bottom end of the new engine out of the car unless it is proven to be duff.
Kevin
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Totally agree with your thinking. Use the known good block and pump, but fit the replacement head, with the original lifters that came with the tractor.
I'll certainly be over to help...
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I would still check the pump timing of the replacement engine before doing anything!
Its interesting that we are all coming round to what I originaly said about this.....off with its head.
Second hand parts are ALWAYS a risk.....better the devil you know!
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I would still check the pump timing of the replacement engine before doing anything!
Its interesting that we are all coming round to what I originaly said about this.....off with its head.
Second hand parts are ALWAYS a risk.....better the devil you know!
The fact that saturday night it was running almost perfect after adjusting pump, then the next day it wasn't leads me to suspect something related to timing slipped. I will, as always, bow to your superior knowledge and experience.
I think to check pump timing, I need the gauge itself, plus a locking kit. I need the locking kit to do the head I suppose though.
To check chains easily, I reckon all the rad and condensor needs to come out again. Once they are out, not much further work (bolt prop, engine and box mounts, few ancillaries) and the engine/box can come out.
I reckon it will be much easier to change head with engine out - access may be restricted in car.
M_DTM - after I had sorted out all the niggles with the cooling system, and it started running cooler, in my heart of hearts, I knew you were right. I naively assumed plonking in a replacement motor would solve all the problems - instead (as with everything else on this jinxed car) I ended up with a new set of problems.
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better the devil you know!
Fast coming to that conclusion....
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If its coming out again I can assist again ;) Could we just aim for a dry day though :y
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If its coming out again I can assist again ;) Could we just aim for a dry day though :y
lol, got over the pnumonia (spelling never my strong point) yet?
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If its coming out again I can assist again ;) Could we just aim for a dry day though :y
seriously, appreciate the offer, may take you up on it, esp as Omegatoy's availability is going to be non existent for a while, lucky sod....
Though may take his advice and take box out with it this time.....
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Its still important to do a timing check on the replacement first (no need to look at chains for this) as you want to know the cause of the poor running and confirm it before reusuing other parts as the final solution.
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Its still important to do a timing check on the replacement first (no need to look at chains for this) as you want to know the cause of the poor running and confirm it before reusuing other parts as the final solution.
I know you are right... ...just anxious to get it going asap - this weekend is out, but I have Monday off, plus a few evenings. Keen to get this knocked on head, been here since March (bit like your LPG project ;D).
Once the engine is sorted, need to sweet talk Sassanach in to borrowing his mates garage so we can find out why the autobox has decided to spring a leak :(
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I am on early shift next week so free in afternoons well after 1400 hrs . If you need a hand let me know :y
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I am on early shift next week so free in afternoons well after 1400 hrs . If you need a hand let me know :y
Thanks :y :y
I need to borrow some stuff first, so it depends when I can get my hands on those bits....
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Just thinking the gearbox leak could be just a shaft seal gone where we we trying to line the engine and box up. It may be something that could be got at when /if the engine comes out . Have you got a drawing of the gearbox to see if there are any seals that could be obtained and replaced if required if we do end up taking it out :question
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Just thinking the gearbox leak could be just a shaft seal gone where we we trying to line the engine and box up. It may be something that could be got at when /if the engine comes out . Have you got a drawing of the gearbox to see if there are any seals that could be obtained and replaced if required if we do end up taking it out :question
I think there are a few things it could be, so probably need to try to investigate once box is off (with engine), then see what parts need buying.
Could also be the sumps, as even with the wood in place, stress would have been put on it...
Unless anyone has a complete seal kit I can 'borrow' and replace the parts I use?
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So what's the next project after this one, Jaime? ::)
As before... offer of assistance is available for the swap, if we can fit it in my shift patterns...
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So what's the next project after this one, Jaime? ::)
As before... offer of assistance is available for the swap, if we can fit it in my shift patterns...
who knows... ...see what comes along. Unlikely to be another BMW engine, as they are horrible to work on. Give me a V6 any day.
Sounds like you've got enough trips to Brackley without me dragging you over....
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If youve decided to swop heads blocks etc make sure they are interchangable, early head/late block etc.
Ask local factors if they can show an early and late gasket to make sure they are the same or check no's on EPC to make sure they are the same. Different thicknesses obviously different no's but should be same no's early and late. also make sure you fit later injectors to go with later block as the combustion chamber will be different. This you can check properly with head removed piston crowns should look different . Don't forget all combustion is done in the piston unlike petrol where it is mostly done in the head.:y
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If youve decided to swop heads blocks etc make sure they are interchangable, early head/late block etc.
Ask local factors if they can show an early and late gasket to make sure they are the same or check no's on EPC to make sure they are the same. Different thicknesses obviously different no's but should be same no's early and late. also make sure you fit later injectors to go with later block as the combustion chamber will be different. This you can check properly with head removed piston crowns should look different . Don't forget all combustion is done in the piston unlike petrol where it is mostly done in the head.:y
Thanks for advice.
If gaskets different, should I go for one that matches block or head?
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If youve decided to swop heads blocks etc make sure they are interchangable, early head/late block etc.
Ask local factors if they can show an early and late gasket to make sure they are the same or check no's on EPC to make sure they are the same. Different thicknesses obviously different no's but should be same no's early and late. also make sure you fit later injectors to go with later block as the combustion chamber will be different. This you can check properly with head removed piston crowns should look different . Don't forget all combustion is done in the piston unlike petrol where it is mostly done in the head.:y
Thanks for advice.
If gaskets different, should I go for one that matches block or head?
Sorry TB if gaskets different you won't be able to swop heads. As heads and blocks won't match:-[
Wife suggests so she won't lose husband in the depths of a far away engine bay How about popping it on a trailer and drop it down to me and leave till its sorted? :y
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If youve decided to swop heads blocks etc make sure they are interchangable, early head/late block etc.
Ask local factors if they can show an early and late gasket to make sure they are the same or check no's on EPC to make sure they are the same. Different thicknesses obviously different no's but should be same no's early and late. also make sure you fit later injectors to go with later block as the combustion chamber will be different. This you can check properly with head removed piston crowns should look different . Don't forget all combustion is done in the piston unlike petrol where it is mostly done in the head.:y
Thanks for advice.
If gaskets different, should I go for one that matches block or head?
Sorry TB if gaskets different you won't be able to swop heads. As heads and blocks won't match:-[
Wife suggests so she won't lose husband in the depths of a far away engine bay How about popping it on a trailer and drop it down to me and leave till its sorted? :y
That is a hugely generous offer...
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If youve decided to swop heads blocks etc make sure they are interchangable, early head/late block etc.
Ask local factors if they can show an early and late gasket to make sure they are the same or check no's on EPC to make sure they are the same. Different thicknesses obviously different no's but should be same no's early and late. also make sure you fit later injectors to go with later block as the combustion chamber will be different. This you can check properly with head removed piston crowns should look different . Don't forget all combustion is done in the piston unlike petrol where it is mostly done in the head.:y
Thanks for advice.
If gaskets different, should I go for one that matches block or head?
Sorry TB if gaskets different you won't be able to swop heads. As heads and blocks won't match:-[
Wife suggests so she won't lose husband in the depths of a far away engine bay How about popping it on a trailer and drop it down to me and leave till its sorted? :y
That is a hugely generous offer...
S'okay she knows how much i love intresting challenges like this. Frustrating i can't be there to help you out. Its a good forum and the people make the forum so as y'all seem a good bunch i would like to help out. Down here as well i can get to tools etc.. May cost a few cans of cold frothy ones at the end. ;D
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As said, hugely generous offer. Which I may take you up on, though possibly not yet due to the fact that I really want to beat this tractor - its become personal now >:(. Very reassuring to have that safety net though, should it beat me :y
Incidentally, know of cheap car transporter if it comes to that?
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Yesish know a guy who knows a guy etc..... can get a car trailer big enough for Omega, and then throw all the spares in boot of my miggy. Would test new rear springs ;D ;D ;D
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Yesish know a guy who knows a guy etc..... can get a car trailer big enough for Omega, and then throw all the spares in boot of my miggy. Would test new rear springs ;D ;D ;D
Err, but I have a spare engine - that wont fit in boot ;D
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Yesish know a guy who knows a guy etc..... can get a car trailer big enough for Omega, and then throw all the spares in boot of my miggy. Would test new rear springs ;D ;D ;D
Err, but I have a spare engine - that wont fit in boot ;D
I've got an estate/tardis Time and relative dimension in space once back seats are down I'm sure it echoes in there;) ;D
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I agree, it's become personal to you!
And.. you must get the better of it.
You've spent way more than usually would be the case on a project.. But I still reckon you'll break even if you can get it running OK and flog it....
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I agree, it's become personal to you!
And.. you must get the better of it.
You've spent way more than usually would be the case on a project.. But I still reckon you'll break even if you can get it running OK and flog it....
May keep it for a while, recover some of the costs on better mpg - currently burn £3k annually just to work and back.
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I agree, it's become personal to you!
And.. you must get the better of it.
You've spent way more than usually would be the case on a project.. But I still reckon you'll break even if you can get it running OK and flog it....
May keep it for a while, recover some of the costs on better mpg - currently burn £3k annually just to work and back.
:o :o About £1100 for me!!
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whats the state of play on the tractor then?
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As said, hugely generous offer. Which I may take you up on, though possibly not yet due to the fact that I really want to beat this tractor - its become personal now >:(. Very reassuring to have that safety net though, should it beat me :y
Incidentally, know of cheap car transporter if it comes to that?
Depending on how well i can get the Elite running, a tow bar and a trailer could do well for me and future projects. I know someware i can get a proffessional double axel trailer with straps for £25 for the weekend....
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whats the state of play on the tractor then?
Sorry, been away at the Wales meeting this weekend. Nothing done since you helped me push it back up the drive.
Unsure what to do next. Either change the chains and pump, or swap the heads over then swap engines?
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I've got the day off tomorrow.... ....might go out and have another poke at it...
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I've got the day off tomorrow.... ....might go out and have another poke at it...
I will drop you a call tomorrow if the dealer has some of the bits in stock i need ;)
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I've got the day off tomorrow.... ....might go out and have another poke at it...
Have you now... I'll see what I'm doing...
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I've got the day off tomorrow.... ....might go out and have another poke at it...
Have you now... I'll see what I'm doing...
Here we go again. Cheltenham to Wakefield to Cardiff to Milton Keynes. What did I say?????
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I've got the day off tomorrow.... ....might go out and have another poke at it...
Have you now... I'll see what I'm doing...
Here we go again. Cheltenham to Wakefield to Cardiff to Milton Keynes. What did I say?????
Er.. that I get about a lot? ;D
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Plus.. an excuse to go out in my new big boys toy ;D
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Oh, well, it's up to you ::)
Anyway, it's been a looooong day..........zzzzzzzzzz
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Hehe, I might not be so keen after about 4 cans of something strong in the bath, and the first time I've not got to be up early in weeks!!!
I'm going out for a fryup before I go anywhere!
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I can't find any 'notches' on the original engine - anyone know where they are on the BMW tractor unit?
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I've set up up a seperate poll to decide next step.
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I've set up up a seperate poll to decide next step.
...and I know how you voted.... ;)
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I've set up up a seperate poll to decide next step.
...and I know how you voted.... ;)
same as you ;)
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I've set up up a seperate poll to decide next step.
...and I know how you voted.... ;)
same as you ;)
They say 'Great minds think alike' :y
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Right, I guess swapping the head over is probably the next step then..... .....anyone ever swapped a tractor head?
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Right, I guess swapping the head over is probably the next step then..... .....anyone ever swapped a tractor head?
Yeeessssss, but it was B&W not BMW.....
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j298/hotel21/BWdiesel.gif)
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Right, I guess swapping the head over is probably the next step then..... .....anyone ever swapped a tractor head?
Yeeessssss, but it was B&W not BMW.....
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j298/hotel21/BWdiesel.gif)
Where's the diagnostic socket on that then? It seems to be getting through AR35's at a high rate!!!!
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Right, I guess swapping the head over is probably the next step then..... .....anyone ever swapped a tractor head?
Yeeessssss, but it was B&W not BMW.....
(http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j298/hotel21/BWdiesel.gif)
Where's the diagnostic socket on that then? It seems to be getting through AR35's at a high rate!!!!
Socket is under the turbo air filter top right. Check size compared to the ladder spacing..... Big bits for little hands with a 35 foot stepladder in the crankcase if required....
Roughly 12 to 14k horse, direct drive to the propellor shaft, 2 stroke 6 cylinder diesel. 110 revs flat out - thats one hundred and ten - and 35 revs at dead slow ahead/astern with compressed air start. Turbo compressor turns circa 150k revs plus, weighing in around the 6 tonne mark.
Happy days! ;D
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take the cylinder head off the original engine and get it pressure tested,you never know it might simply be the head gasket
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take the cylinder head off the original engine and get it pressure tested,you never know it might simply be the head gasket
I need to understand how to do it properly, as the chain must not slip on sprocket, as that chain cover looks to be a pig.
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Right, plan for today is to put the original engine back in. At least its moveable, and the chains and pump should be fine on that (was all OK when we took it out).
Only this time, we are going to try to remove the engine and gearbox as one lump, rather than trying to line it all up in the car.
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good luck jaime and everybody that is helping you!!!! with how this project is going have a feeling you are going to need it!! but god luck don't work too hard and don't drink too much wiil you! :exclamation :exclamation :y :y ::)
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I've lost track now! I thought the original engine had a suspected cracked head.... so won't the head have to come off anyway?
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Its been a long hard day, but LFF64 and I got the donor engine out, and the original back in. It is much easier taking it out with the gearbox attached. Much easier.
Started about 11ish (I overslept!), had the engine in and bolted on its mounts by about 8:30pm. Pretty non stop, as I only decided this morning to do it, so we had to remove all ancillaries and wiring etc.
Just need to put all ancillaries on, wire it all up, get a Tunnie round (coz I forgot to put the bloody wiring on the gearbox again, so need a gadget hand). At least it should then be running as it was a month ago. THEN swap the heads - that is one I am really not looking forward to, though hopefully if its mobile, I have more options in begging someone to help, as have car, will travel ;D
I ache and am tired, as I suspect is LFF64. Dinner is in the oven, but bathtime first, as covered head to toe in oil, kitty litter, and tractor blood.
A huge, huge thanks to LFF64 for is help today :y. Tunnie was going to pop over, but had Elite hassles, so just came over for tools ;D
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Oh, and not sure how it happened, I have a bloody great cut down my leg that keeps bleeding :'(
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And I forgot, we found the autobox leak - one of the unions where pips meet box was loose.... ....thats a relief, thought it was something more serious.
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No problem mate , I dont remember you swearing so not sure how the cut happened :-? Yes much eaiser to take out gearbox and engine I must say :y I am just trying to get clean enough to get in the bath I know you said I had oil on my face but I did not realise just how much :o I have enjoyed today and we both have learnt a few things I think . Oh and thank you very much Mrs TB for looking after us :-*
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At one point this afternoon laying under the tractor (yes it was that far off the ground ::))I thought my luck was in I had a wet tongue in my ear hole :o,and before any one says no it was not Jamie :D it was next doors dog :-* Certainley made me jump :y
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At one point this afternoon laying under the tractor (yes it was that far off the ground ::))I thought my luck was in I had a wet tongue in my ear hole :o,and before any one says no it was not Jamie :D it was next doors dog :-* Certainley made me jump :y
Ah yes, the neighbours dog - about as much use as a guard dog as Tunnie's hound.... ;D
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At one point this afternoon laying under the tractor (yes it was that far off the ground ::))I thought my luck was in I had a wet tongue in my ear hole :o,and before any one says no it was not Jamie :D it was next doors dog :-* Certainley made me jump :y
Actually, good job it wasn't my other neighbours dog - bloody enormous husky. Frequently puts its paws on our 6ft fence to look over :o
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A job well done to you both :y
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Well done guys :y
If I'd known you were going to do this I'd have come down to get in the way lend a hand....
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Getting the engine in and out was the easy bit putting all the bts back on the engine is going to be the worst bit ::) and then there is the worry that original behaves when its time to try strarting it :y I am sure everyone will be willing it to work this time ;)
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Such a nice evening, I managed to get cracking on the ancilliaries...
Got the main loom box in place, fitted and connected alternator, wired up starter motor (properly this time!), fitted PAS pump, reconnected oil cooler pipes, fitted compressor and it mounting plate, and couple of pulleys, hbv and the related coolant pipes, reconnected the ATF cooler pipes at the box end (having an ATF hairwash at the same time :(). Various sensors plugged in.
I did have a problem getting the autobox connectors on, but after a quick phonecall, a Tunnie turns up, and fits them for me.
Thanks Tunnie :y
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stirling work, all of you
When will it be ready to turn the key?
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Such a nice evening, I managed to get cracking on the ancilliaries...
Got the main loom box in place, fitted and connected alternator, wired up starter motor (properly this time!), fitted PAS pump, reconnected oil cooler pipes, fitted compressor and it mounting plate, and couple of pulleys, hbv and the related coolant pipes, reconnected the ATF cooler pipes at the box end (having an ATF hairwash at the same time :(). Various sensors plugged in.
I did have a problem getting the autobox connectors on, but after a quick phonecall, a Tunnie turns up, and fits them for me.
Thanks Tunnie :y
no problemo :y
When will i hear that 6 pot diesel roar?
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Tonight, wire up injection pump, fit the gearbox to exhaust bracket, swap over aux tensioner, fit remaining pulleys and fit belts. Fit cooling fans, condenser, rad, rest of coolant hoses, expansion bottle, airbox, intake etc.
Chucked 6.5l of semi synth and some water in cooling system (needs a few flushes).
Attempted to start.....
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Tonight, wire up injection pump, fit the gearbox to exhaust bracket, swap over aux tensioner, fit remaining pulleys and fit belts. Fit cooling fans, condenser, rad, rest of coolant hoses, expansion bottle, airbox, intake etc.
Chucked 6.5l of semi synth and some water in cooling system (needs a few flushes).
Attempted to start.....
** Sticks head out of window
Yup i can hear you cranking it! ;)
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Sorry, got distracted with the forum performance....
It started after a few attempts, and revved up as expected. After about 10s, the oil light came on :o
Obviously quickly off with engine, and look under car.
Yes, its decided to dump 6.5l of oil all over the driveway >:(
"Oh you are a naughty car, and I am not liking you" was my response ::)
Sent Mrs TheBoy down Tescos for kitty litter to soak it all up - 6.5l of semi is not a small amount >:(
While she was there, I located the leak - oil cooler pipe not refitted - I remember now LFF64 removed the clamp along the pipes a bit, as well as that at bottom of oil filter. Nipped that up.
Put in another 6.5l of semi, started it (and it started on the first flick), now its leaking a clear liquid - I suspect diesel, based on the fact I can't find the jubilee clips for the fuel lines ::)
That should be an easy fix tomorrow. The idle was slightly lumpy, and I had probably better check the autobox fluid, seeing as that has leaked lots...
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Fantastic progress Jaime, it won't have done any harm if you turned it off that quick.
Now you're becoming such a tractor master, get that cylinder head changed over on your next free evening, and it's good to go ;D
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Fantastic progress Jaime, it won't have done any harm if you turned it off that quick.
Now you're becoming such a tractor master, get that cylinder head changed over on your next free evening, and it's good to go ;D
I am not changing that head on my own!
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Fantastic progress Jaime, it won't have done any harm if you turned it off that quick.
Now you're becoming such a tractor master, get that cylinder head changed over on your next free evening, and it's good to go ;D
I am not changing that head on my own!
I'll pop over and help you then....
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Fantastic progress Jaime, it won't have done any harm if you turned it off that quick.
Now you're becoming such a tractor master, get that cylinder head changed over on your next free evening, and it's good to go ;D
I am not changing that head on my own!
I'll pop over and help you then....
You got a tractor locking kit then? ;)
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great progress :) but boy oh boy The Boy that must be one messy drive :D
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great progress :) but boy oh boy The Boy that must be one messy drive :D
I thought it was really messy before, embarrassingly so (esp as I share drive with neighbour), but the mess is shocking now :'(
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Fantastic progress Jaime, it won't have done any harm if you turned it off that quick.
Now you're becoming such a tractor master, get that cylinder head changed over on your next free evening, and it's good to go ;D
I am not changing that head on my own!
I'll pop over and help you then....
You got a tractor locking kit then? ;)
Nope... but I thought you were able to source one? :P
The offer of help is serious, if we can link in :)
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Ah bugger I forgot about them Jamie sorry :-[ The jubilee clips were on the pipes last time I saw them
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Ah bugger I forgot about them Jamie sorry :-[ The jubilee clips were on the pipes last time I saw them
No worries, at least it taught the neighbours some new vocabulary :o
Also shows the oil pump is good ;)
Additionally, as you know, I have some stuff that may help clean the drive :y - do you know if I use neat on tarmac, or dilute?
Can't find jubilees - the oil tray was under there, but I had a good feel in it when looking the a socket a dropped (why does it always fall in the oil >:(), so I'll nip down DIY shop later.
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I have the diesel tools being sent to me......when they can find them.
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Dilute it, its best when a foam I would tip about a cup full in a bucket and fill with water and then use a broom to scrub it
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I have the diesel tools being sent to me......when they can find them.
Much appreciated - I know how busy you've been, so didn't want to badger you about it....
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Jubilee clips put on fuel lines, not curd the leak. I looks like its leak from back of pump, where the 6 injection pipes are attached. I bet I know which one is leaking - what do you reckon LFF64?
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Dilute it, its best when a foam I would tip about a cup full in a bucket and fill with water and then use a broom to scrub it
How much dilution - the bottle says 1:80 for general use, is that too weak/strong? I emphasise again, its tarmac...
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I know its very naughty but the container it is in is not the correct one I forgot to take the label off I have used it on tarmac no problems . That pipe did do up pretty tight in the end have you nipped up the injectors and the pipes to the top of them I think we said they would need to be nipped when it was back in the car. If your unsure about the cleaner I try some tesco or similar washing up liquid the cheap stuff that should be harmless to the tarmac
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I know its very naughty but the container it is in is not the correct one I forgot to take the label off I have used it on tarmac no problems . That pipe did do up pretty tight in the end have you nipped up the injectors and the pipes to the top of them I think we said they would need to be nipped when it was back in the car. If your unsure about the cleaner I try some tesco or similar washing up liquid the cheap stuff that should be harmless to the tarmac
Ah, so I'll ignore the instructions then ;D
It wasn't the one we thought, it was another - still at the bloody bottom though, so had to remove 2.
So fixed the fuel leak (I think - see later), involved obviously all the intake off again (stupid bloody BMW design >:(), topped up the autobox. Whilst doing the autobox, I noticed (again >:() a clear liquid dripping from the front. Thought it was diesel, and at first thought it smelt of diesel (but may have been due to previous fuel leak). Carried on doing the autobox, then went and checked. The liquid was hot, so presumably from the cooling system? Engine too hot to start stripping, but top hose to block connection most likely....
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You are right this car must be the most jinxed car in the world ::)
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Other than the leaks is it actually running though
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If the liquid was hot and the engine was too hot to work on, then it must run and run properly. Surely that's progress? :)
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:-[ I should have engaged brian before asking that last question sorry :-[
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Other than the leaks is it actually running though
Yup, starts on the flick of the key (well would if the battery wasn't flat due to some idiot trying to start it with the pump unplugged ::)) and idles as expected. Haven't tried moving it yet, except up and donw the drive to clear the huge oil slick last night...
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Oh, and to prove its jinxed, seems to have a slight ATF leak near the front, yet to pinpoint.
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:-[ I should have engaged brian before asking that last question sorry :-[
You leave Brian out of this. He's had enough trouble with Jim Davidson. ;D ;D ;D
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Dilute it, its best when a foam I would tip about a cup full in a bucket and fill with water and then use a broom to scrub it
How much dilution - the bottle says 1:80 for general use, is that too weak/strong? I emphasise again, its tarmac...
Im suprised your driveway has melted away by now.....over 6 ltrs oil spilt on it....soaking into tarmac....has gotta make it soft :-/ :(
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Dilute it, its best when a foam I would tip about a cup full in a bucket and fill with water and then use a broom to scrub it
How much dilution - the bottle says 1:80 for general use, is that too weak/strong? I emphasise again, its tarmac...
Im suprised your driveway has melted away by now.....over 6 ltrs oil spilt on it....soaking into tarmac....has gotta make it soft :-/ :(
It is getting soft, even axle stand left an impression today...
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Dilute it, its best when a foam I would tip about a cup full in a bucket and fill with water and then use a broom to scrub it
How much dilution - the bottle says 1:80 for general use, is that too weak/strong? I emphasise again, its tarmac...
Im suprised your driveway has melted away by now.....over 6 ltrs oil spilt on it....soaking into tarmac....has gotta make it soft :-/ :(
It is getting soft, even axle stand left an impression today...
:(
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oooohhh Betty ;D oh not that sort of impression :-[
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Some piccies from Sunday....
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2221.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2223.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2226.JPG)
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/theboy/project_tb2/IMG_2228.JPG)
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Your neighbours must love you.
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Your neighbours must love you.
Their dog loves LFF64 ;D
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Good job I was breathing in when MrsTB took that picture :-[ ;D
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Like the camo effect TB, didn't know you were in the commandos. ;D ;D
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Like the camo effect TB, didn't know you were in the commandos. ;D ;D
He has the full Action Man collection, you know.... Complete with the one with moving eyes and gripping hands...... ;)
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Like the camo effect TB, didn't know you were in the commandos. ;D ;D
He has the full Action Man collection, you know.... Complete with the one with moving eyes and gripping hands...... ;)
Ooerrr missus. ;D ;D
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Fix the top hose coolant leak, and the atf leak at the rad earlier.
Just taken it out for a 50m spin - not caning it, but not hanging around - and no dramas...
So we're just obviously back to the overpressurising - same situation as 5 weeks ago....
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Step at a time, mate, step at a time.
Pity you had to retrace the steps but now back on track.
Off with its head.... ;) :y
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Step at a time, mate, step at a time.
Pity you had to retrace the steps but now back on track.
Off with its head.... ;) :y
But we had a larf doing it. Twice.
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
Is it. :-/....dunno....ive got them upto date thingys called cd's ;D
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
Is it. :-/....dunno....ive got them upto date thingys called cd's ;D
I thought CDs were old hat now, and that you had to have one of those crappy iPod things :-/
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
Is it. :-/....dunno....ive got them upto date thingys called cd's ;D
Most of the taxi drivers round here have them too. They hang em from the rear view mirror.
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
Is it. :-/....dunno....ive got them upto date thingys called cd's ;D
Most of the taxi drivers round here have them too. They hang em from the rear view mirror.
Supposed to stop me and my buddies snapping them on our 'toofasttogetasnap-not' camera's....... ;)
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
No TD, a record is a round black thingy wot you put on a gramophone.
Ask AA I bet he's got loads of em especially 78s.
Is it. :-/....dunno....ive got them upto date thingys called cd's ;D
Most of the taxi drivers round here have them too. They hang em from the rear view mirror.
Supposed to stop me and my buddies snapping them on our 'toofasttogetasnap-not' camera's....... ;)
Amateur photographer too, is there no end to your talents Broocie? ;D
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30 pages on this thread......is that a record :-/
There is a poll on that TD. Sad but true :'(
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Next mission, Project Tractor Head swap - coming soon to a forum near you ;D
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It's been six days - I presume the head is changed? ;)
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It's been six days - I presume the head is changed? ;)
Waiting on being able to borrow a locking kit, esp as the cheap ones on ebay have gone :'(
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You don't need a locking kit until you put it together again, surely? :-X
Kevin
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You don't need a locking kit until you put it together again, surely? :-X
Kevin
Looks like you do - the locking kit holds the tensioners so you can remove the chain to remove head (typical BMW design ;))
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take it you decided to update after my post then tb??? ::) ::) ::)
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whats the score on this saga then?
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whats the score on this saga then?
I have the head gasket (and top end gasket set), and the head bolts....
What I do need is the locking kit (or someone clever enough to improvise), and someone clever enough to assist ;)
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(or someone clever enough to improvise), and someone clever enough to assist ;)
That rules me out then ::)
Seriously though; if you need someone to get in the way lend a hand & I'm free I'll gladly pop down.....
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when is that bl%%dy head coming off!!!
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when is that bl%%dy head coming off!!!
Locking kit arrived at the weekend, so as soon as I can find someone clever to help! Weather looking good from Wed onwards, so if anyone available, I'll take a day off...
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remove the head from the doner engine first and get it pressure tested and if needed skimmed.
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when is that bl%%dy head coming off!!!
Locking kit arrived at the weekend, so as soon as I can find someone clever to help! Weather looking good from Wed onwards, so if anyone available, I'll take a day off...
Monday/Tues/Wed next week i can come and get in the way......need to work the rest of this week.....missed payday weekend this weekend.....coz off bloody blower fan >:(
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remove the head from the doner engine first and get it pressure tested and if needed skimmed.
Apparently, you cannot skim this head!
I was waiting until someone clever was available, so we could 'practice' on donor to see easiest way of removal...
http://images.omegaowners.com/documents/25TD/
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Let me know when it is, I quite fancy helping, if I'm free.
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cant skim the head? i will check that out tomorrow.
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cant skim the head? i will check that out tomorrow.
See PDF a couple of posts above, states cannot be skimmed.
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yup.... page 38 .. item 43 :( ... now thats not good news :(
43. Using a straight edge and feeler gauges, check
cylinder head for distortion along lines shown in
illustration and compare with figures given:
Longitudinal warp A = 0.1 mm (0.004 in)
Lateral warp B = 0.05 mm (0.002 in)
44. Replace cylinder head if figures obtained exceed
those given.
NOTE: Cylinder heads may not be refaced
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yup.... page 38 .. item 43 :( ... now thats not good news :(
43. Using a straight edge and feeler gauges, check
cylinder head for distortion along lines shown in
illustration and compare with figures given:
Longitudinal warp A = 0.1 mm (0.004 in)
Lateral warp B = 0.05 mm (0.002 in)
44. Replace cylinder head if figures obtained exceed
those given.
NOTE: Cylinder heads may not be refaced
I look upon that as a challenge myself - I wouldn't worry over say 10 thou'
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I look upon that as a challenge myself - I wouldn't worry over say 10 thou'
I agree. There's no logic behind it. There should be millimetres of clearance between valves and pistons so a few thou to reface the head won't do a lot. It won't alter the valve timing by any significant degree. It won't affect compression that much, and if it is a concern you can always skim down the pistons to match (although it's a lot more work stripping down, of course).
Sounds like a ploy to make you buy a new head to me.
The Haynes manual for my Zetec engine says no oversize pistons, bearings, etc. available. That wasn't the case when I decided to re-bore it.
However, as the donor engine hasn't had a head gasket failure or been cooked it's unlikely to need a skim.
Kevin
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I look upon that as a challenge myself - I wouldn't worry over say 10 thou'
I agree. There's no logic behind it. There should be millimetres of clearance between valves and pistons so a few thou to reface the head won't do a lot. It won't alter the valve timing by any significant degree. It won't affect compression that much, and if it is a concern you can always skim down the pistons to match (although it's a lot more work stripping down, of course).
Sounds like a ploy to make you buy a new head to me.
The Haynes manual for my Zetec engine says no oversize pistons, bearings, etc. available. That wasn't the case when I decided to re-bore it.
However, as the donor engine hasn't had a head gasket failure or been cooked it's unlikely to need a skim.
Kevin
Nothing to do with head thickness, its down to the inserts of the precombustion chambers, thats why it cant be skimmed
Omegatoy
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Surely the fact the the donor hasn't suffered HG failure, no skimming/machining required?
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Nothing to do with head thickness, its down to the inserts of the precombustion chambers, thats why it cant be skimmed
Ahh! That does make sense actually.
Kevin
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when is that bl%%dy head coming off!!!
Locking kit arrived at the weekend, so as soon as I can find someone clever to help! Weather looking good from Wed onwards, so if anyone available, I'll take a day off...
if you need help over the weekend drop me a PM
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having consulted the oracle as always there is theory and practice,you CAN skim the head if needed.therefore i repeat myself ,remove the doner head and get it checked .do it once, do it right.
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having consulted the oracle as always there is theory and practice,you CAN skim the head if needed.therefore i repeat myself ,remove the doner head and get it checked .do it once, do it right.
But the donor head is good, and has not suffered HG failure?
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you still have to remove the head from the doner engine at some point ! you cant do any damage removing a head, only when you fit it.
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you still have to remove the head from the doner engine at some point ! you cant do any damage removing a head, only when you fit it.
Gonna pull it off on Sat if weather nice... ...and if that goes well, pull the other head off... ...and if still going well, bolt it on...
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What would it cost just to have the donor one checked ?? in time and money .. just to be sure ??
Would avoid tremendous angst if, and I know its a big if, there were actually a problem with it.
Surely worth a day or two to check it ..
my 2.7 p's (inc VAT)
:)
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What would it cost just to have the donor one checked ?? in time and money .. just to be sure ??
Would avoid tremendous angst if, and I know its a big if, there were actually a problem with it.
Surely worth a day or two to check it ..
my 2.7 p's (inc VAT)
:)
I think Tunnie paid around £40 - £50 on a 4pot head recently....
I have driven the donor engine, and have no reason to think the head has a problem.