Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: omega2.2CDX on 31 July 2008, 00:02:39
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hi guys, i wonder if someone could help, I have a 2.2 omega CDX w reg. a couple of weeks ago it rained really heavily, next morning i noticed the carpet on the passenger side is soaked and took sometime to dry it up , checked my coolant tank, water level seemed unchanged. 10 days later the engine gauge was reaching a 100 which's never happened before and it touched the red lines at one occasion, checked the water levels again unchanged, no noticeable water leak, no oil in water. heating and air con are working with no problems. Drove on motorway for 2 hours with no bother, but once stationary or in traffic jam temp climbs up again.
i've been to three garages and everyone tells me a different diagnosis. one said its the radiator, second said its the heater matrix , last one (which sounded more sensible to me although am not an expert) said its probably the thermostat....I am totally lost and dunno what to do and who to believe......any advice is much appreciated ....thanks in advance
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Alright mate welcome to the oof :y :y you'll get alot more advice tomorrow when there will be alot more people on to help you :y
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The wet carpet after heavy rain is more then likely a blocked scuttle drain. Look in the maintenence guides on where and what to do ;)
Are your cooling fans kicking in when the temp rises?????
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yes cooler fan is working fine
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If fans are working and levels are fine etc.....the my best guess would be to start with the thermostate too ;)
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do you think its easy enough to do it myself, i mean changing the thermostat, if so where can i find it
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Firstly clean out the scuttle, see the guide in the Maintenance section.
Overheating, probably thermostat, or the rad needs a good flush.
Get yourself a Haynes manual, it doesn't cover the 2.2, but as the layout of the 2.0 and the 2.2 are pretty much the same, it covers most things.
Are you sure the fan in front of the rad. cuts in?
If you do change the thermostat, give the rad a good flush out, and only fill it up with genuine Vx antifreeze (50/50 mix).
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hi guys, i wonder if someone could help, I have a 2.2 omega CDX w reg. a couple of weeks ago it rained really heavily, next morning i noticed the carpet on the passenger side is soaked and took sometime to dry it up , checked my coolant tank, water level seemed unchanged. 10 days later the engine gauge was reaching a 100 which's never happened before and it touched the red lines at one occasion, checked the water levels again unchanged, no noticeable water leak, no oil in water. heating and air con are working with no problems. Drove on motorway for 2 hours with no bother, but once stationary or in traffic jam temp climbs up again.
i've been to three garages and everyone tells me a different diagnosis. one said its the radiator, second said its the heater matrix , last one (which sounded more sensible to me although am not an expert) said its probably the thermostat....I am totally lost and dunno what to do and who to believe......any advice is much appreciated ....thanks in advance
Right, the water is east as that is the scuttle drain!
As for the over heating, heres some food for thought which will give you an idea how crap at least two of the garages are!
1) The heater matrix is not part of the engine cooling setup so will have no affect on the temp at all!. In fact, the flow through it can be shut off by the heater bypass valve when max chill is selected on the climate.
2) The thermostat is designed to fail open, so if it was failed I would expect the car to take an age to heat up. If it failed shut then there would be no/limited flow through the radiator and it would over heat even at speed.
3) The radiator is a possible but, they should have checked the surface temperature with a laser temp probe to see if there is any sign of blockages. Such radiator issues tend to come on over time rather than suddenly
My next simple step would be to check the fuses in the under bonnet ECU box (triangle shaped thing on the inner wing), one of these is for the front fan setup!
As for reaching 100 degrees, in this weather and in slow moving traffic, its quite normal, did you hear the cooling fans kick in at all?
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yes the cooling fan is kickin in at about 100 degrees
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yes the cooling fan is kickin in at about 100 degrees
Fans seem to be kicking in a little late ---- Mark ... do these have a sensor or other way to set when they operate ???
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Excuse me whislt I get onto my hobby horse again.
If the fuses are OK, when the temperature gauge is reading high (after a run) try carefully touching the thick brown -ve battery cable (0V) close to the terminal clamp. Does it seem overly hot?
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yes the cooling fan is kickin in at about 100 degrees
Fans seem to be kicking in a little late ---- Mark ... do these have a sensor or other way to set when they operate ???
Yes but, there are two cooling fans which come on at various points at different speeds......hence check the fuses as only one fan might be working!
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thanks guys for your input, i'll check the fuses and let you know
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yes the cooling fan is kickin in at about 100 degrees
Fans seem to be kicking in a little late ---- Mark ... do these have a sensor or other way to set when they operate ???
Yes but, there are two cooling fans which come on at various points at different speeds......hence check the fuses as only one fan might be working!
had a similar problem recently of heating very quickly in traffic. It turned out that the fuse for the "1st" fan had gone (maxi 30amp - green in compartment next to battery). Basically the rad. has 2 fans - 1st kicks in at about 95 degrees and you can barely hear it, the 2nd kicks in at c100 degrees. It would be worth checking the fuse. Good luck
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i had a look at the fuses box, they look so different from the usual electrical fuse...am i looking in the right place( its the triangular box just next to the battery)!! however i opened the green ones which has got a circuit inside and they all looked very similar , couldn't tell whether they are faulty.
any comments?
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sure that's not a relay you've pulled out? The fuses have a coloured see through housing with the rating marked in white on top.
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When the temp gauge hits 100 how many of the three fans were rotating and at what speed, slow or fast ?
Note: at that temp all three should be at fast, should have kicked in at 98 degrees.
regards
richard a
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Have a look at this post. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215079466/22#22 there is a picture half way down of the fuse most likely to give a problem. You should be able to see if it has blown from above but pull it anyway and make sure it is intact. There will be a gap in the metal of the fuse when looking at it from the side (through the clear colured plastic) if it has blown. Probably blackening of the plastic too. (http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll62/jonlew5/IMG_1290.jpg)
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thanks for your clarification , i checked the fuses and they looked intact. what seems strange that i've driving the car for last few days with average temp of 90-95 no more spikes to over 100 !!!! cant explain this , whether its just the whether cooling down a bit i dunno..
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guys i just want to thank you all for this great forum, i am very impressed with the quick responses, accurate problem solving, and the effort to explain in simple words for inexperienced guys like myself :y
the water problem on the passenger side was actually caused by 2 blocked drains as you all suggested, and the illustration provided by x25xe was very helpful to locate the drains.
it is very amazing how your explanations guys reveals the garages stupidities , they were suggesting water coming from the radiator, heater matrix, air conditioning and they were trying to convince me changing these parts which was ganna cost me hundreds, but i am very fortunate to find this great forum.. :)
The heating issue is not as bad as before i shall keep in eye for the next few days and see what happens, if the problem exacerbates i will come back for your invaluable advice again. ;)
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Glad you found the advice useful. There are a lot of really helpful and experienced folk on here.
I had a very similar 'overheating' problem myself which took a long time to trace. I hinted at it above but this is the link to my previous posting http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1215079466/22#22. The bottom line is that as long as the coolant doesn't boil then it is probably nothing to worry about. It is very difficult to convince yourself of this fact if the gauge is going into the red and your sitting in traffic on the Motorway or alike.
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back again , temp was sky high yesterday after half an hour drive, going into the red lines again and again, put the air con on and temp settled down, then i realised that i have been using the air con for the last few days when i thought the problem is sorted . i switched air con off and temp climbed up again , had a look at the earth lead on the battery, it felt very hot to touch, looked at the coolant and tried to open the coolant tank but i noticed there was a lot of pressure in there and water was ganna slash out everywhere if i continued, but surely i didnt....
now not sure where to start with this problem , shall i change the thermostat for a starter???
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Pretty sure when the thermostat fails it sticks open meaning your temp would be low rather than high. Need someone to confirm that though.
Edit - just read previous posts and Marks DTM suggested that the thermostat fails open. If there is anyone to trust on this matter it be him!
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Still don't believe you've checked the correct fuses. The fuses you need to check are under the steering wheel not in the engine bay. I'll have a look in my Haynes manual and see if I can find the exact fuses for you to check.
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Marks DTM mentioned recently that they fail open so this should not be the problem. Not a good idea to ever open the coolant cap when the engine is hot. It will boil as soon as you release the pressure and likely to spray all over you so don't go near it until it has cooled down.
A little surprised to hear the temperature goes down when you put the air con on. My theory about the negative connection would suggest that if you put it on it would get worse. However you did say it was hot. Was it too hot to touch? If so I would suggest checking it with a voltmeter as I suggested in the link above and report back your findings. Do you have a multimeter. If not you can buy them for under a tenner from Maplin amongst others. It needs to be tested with the engine running and when you are seeing the overheat, not when it is cold.
If the voltage is OK I can still only think that there is some problem with your fans switching on and off be it a sensor or relay or a blockage in the rad somewhere. How long have you had the car and has the oil cooler ever failed to your knowledge?
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:-? well i followed what has been said before, the fuses next to the battery not the ones under the steering wheel, i am confused now, are those the ones i need to check!!!
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Yes it's the ones under the steering wheel you should be checking. F4 - according to Haynes. The fuses should have a symbol under them anyway so look for the one that resembles a fan if not fuse 4.
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i check the fuses under the steering wheel , they all look intact however i also managed to lock my radio :-[, and now in search for the code, going back to my car papers there is a key replacement code of four numbers is that the same for the radio, and there is also additional audio manual with title ncdc 2013, i will try both and see what happens...
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i check the fuses under the steering wheel , they all look intact however i also managed to lock my radio :-[, and now in search for the code, going back to my car papers there is a key replacement code of four numbers is that the same for the radio, and there is also additional audio manual with title ncdc 2013, i will try both and see what happens...
You're not having a great time of it at the moment are you...
Radio code is on the car pass and should be marked Radio Code and then four numbers. If there are two lots of four numbers split with a "/" it will be the last four you enter.
Still think you've got a split fuse I'd change the cooling fan fuse anyway just so you can be sure.
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none of the above numbers worked, cant find car pass , am screwed now
i will change the fuse as you recommended , but not sure how to get the radio code???
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i check the fuses under the steering wheel , they all look intact however i also managed to lock my radio :-[, and now in search for the code, going back to my car papers there is a key replacement code of four numbers is that the same for the radio, and there is also additional audio manual with title ncdc 2013, i will try both and see what happens...
Give that code a whirl - only once mind. Too many tries and you'll lock it for good.
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Key code is not same as radio code!
You need your carpass.
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are you based in Nottingham guys, i mean do have a garage ??
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are you based in Nottingham guys, i mean do have a garage ??
If you are referring to Marks DTM or I, neither of us are in the motor trade.
Marks DTM live just south of Nottingham, I'm in Brackley, in deepest Northamptonshire....
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i see , i thought you might have a garage so i can bring the car to you guys rather than messing up myself .
reg the radio code i think i found it :D hidden between the papers...i will give a try now..
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I'm in Nottingham quite happy to have a look if you would like me to (though Marks DTM Calib knows way more than I do). I have had a similar problem to yours though (now resolved) so feel reasonably qualified to comment. Only thing is mine is a 2.5 V6 so not familiar with the 4 pot. However the aircon set up is much the same.
The most likely fuses are in the box by the battery.
Where do you live
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i live in Sheffield but i go to Nottingham quite regularly to meet friends
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Well if you are coming down to Nottingham I live 5 minutes away from J25 of the M1. Send me a PM and I can give you details if you want to call in.
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I would really love to hear what happened here. Matter of getting an omega or not for me :-X
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I would really love to hear what happened here. Matter of getting an omega or not for me :-X
What problems do you have?
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the main issue now as i mentioned before is the temp reaching the red lines on occasions, it is happening less frequently now with no particular trend, i can drive it for hours with no problems and next day after driving for only 20 min or so it starts overheating with temp touching the red zone....very strange indeed, not sure what's causing it
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when my 2.2 began to overheat it was found that altho it appeared that the rad was ok it was infact about 80% clogged hence only 20% efficient - needs to be tested by a reputable radiator supplier / manufacturer as just passing water through it doesn't show up rate of flow
2.2's have two fans the one nearest engine is controlled by water temp and he one in front by air con - so as you found air-con on also fan on
See if fan nearest engine is working by running engine (with car stationary and air con off - until temp guage reaches about 90+ ish when fan should come on ( Icant remember exact temp when fan is turned on)
Good Luck
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yes this fan does actually work at around 100 degrees which is a bit late i thought
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yes the cooling fan is kickin in at about 100 degrees
Fans seem to be kicking in a little late ---- Mark ... do these have a sensor or other way to set when they operate ???
Yes but, there are two cooling fans which come on at various points at different speeds......hence check the fuses as only one fan might be working!
Two fans......do all 2.2 have same set up. :o
Looks like im missing a fan.