Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Jay w on 24 January 2008, 21:29:18
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I am off to France again in July with the Omega and have been lookng at prices.
Eurotunnel are a couple of quid cheaper than the ferry, but they will not take cars that are dual fuel/LPG, HOWEVER they will take caravans with LPG containers within them.
I have emailed and asked why, but they cannot give me a sensable answer, modern LPG setups have twin solenoids, they are able to stand higher pressures than an LPG container and have an easier life as they are not manhandled in the same way.
any got any ideas why this rule could be, i have looked on the website but again there is no real conclusive answer
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I guess there's liable to be more LPG in a car than in a caravan but it does seem a bit stupid. There probably isn't a sensible answer and it's just the H&S police.
I prefer the ferry anyway. Better view.
You could also save yourself a lot of driving for a night in the bar getting lashed on a ferry from closer to home, surely? (would cost a bit more, mind, even once you've saved the miles in the Omega)
Kevin
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I am off to France again in July with the Omega and have been lookng at prices.
Eurotunnel are a couple of quid cheaper than the ferry, but they will not take cars that are dual fuel/LPG, HOWEVER they will take caravans with LPG containers within them.
I have emailed and asked why, but they cannot give me a sensable answer, modern LPG setups have twin solenoids, they are able to stand higher pressures than an LPG container and have an easier life as they are not manhandled in the same way.
any got any ideas why this rule could be, i have looked on the website but again there is no real conclusive answer
Seems a silly rule, are you taking a caravan with you and are you staying on British run sites if you are.
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There are big signs saying no LPG. No idea why. Probably too easy to use as a bomb? Or gas leaks could be too dangerous, being confined?
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i get terrible seasickness, so the shorter the trip the better :y
we had thought about dosing me up and doing plymouth - roscoff but its then 300 miles of A roads, some of them are pretty poor as well, followed by the perephique? (paris ring road) and i have done that once.....never again, its worse than the M25!!!
Sister-in-law will be driving to Dover so that takes the strain off me a bit, i then get the french roads from 2 am onwards.....
oh well it's dover/calais again then
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Unrelated but I've always wanted to go into the toilets on the train about half way through the journey and get soaking wet then run down the train screaming WE'RE LEAKING, WE'RE LEAKING!!!!!
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Unrelated but I've always wanted to go into the toilets on the train about half way through the journey and get soaking wet then run down the train screaming WE'RE LEAKING, WE'RE LEAKING!!!!!
ROFL :y
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I am off to France again in July with the Omega and have been lookng at prices.
Eurotunnel are a couple of quid cheaper than the ferry, but they will not take cars that are dual fuel/LPG, HOWEVER they will take caravans with LPG containers within them.
I have emailed and asked why, but they cannot give me a sensable answer, modern LPG setups have twin solenoids, they are able to stand higher pressures than an LPG container and have an easier life as they are not manhandled in the same way.
any got any ideas why this rule could be, i have looked on the website but again there is no real conclusive answer
Seems a silly rule, are you taking a caravan with you and are you staying on British run sites if you are.
No, we are renting a villa in the south, not far from Monte Carlo
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There are big signs saying no LPG. No idea why. Probably too easy to use as a bomb? Or gas leaks could be too dangerous, being confined?
Propane is heavier than air so any leaks will collect at the lowest point. Not sure how they ventilate it, there must be some mechanism.
Saying that, I bet it's not very well enforced. If you have say a dual-fuel Volvo, the filler point is behind the petrol cap, and if you remove the badge there's no exterior sign of it. Only way to check is to look under the boot carpet or know what you're looking for in the engine compartment.
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You can go through if you can show the tank is empty :(
A bit silly with the caravans though :-/
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You can go through if you can show the tank is empty :(
A bit silly with the caravans though :-/
Is it a propane / butane thing? different calorific values. Cars run on propane, most caravans carry butane. Don’t know the answer, just wondering, and trying to get 3 stars!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
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You can go through if you can show the tank is empty :(
A bit silly with the caravans though :-/
Is it a propane / butane thing? different calorific values. Cars run on propane, most caravans carry butane. Don’t know the answer, just wondering, and trying to get 3 stars!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
Nowadays many regular caravanners use propane (red cylinder) all year round .. saves the hassle of changing regulators etc between summer and winter (butane - blue - is worse than useless in winter )
:)
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You can go through if you can show the tank is empty :(
A bit silly with the caravans though :-/
Is it a propane / butane thing? different calorific values. Cars run on propane, most caravans carry butane. Don’t know the answer, just wondering, and trying to get 3 stars!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
Nowadays many regular caravanners use propane (red cylinder) all year round .. saves the hassle of changing regulators etc between summer and winter (butane - blue - is worse than useless in winter )
:)
Yep. I know that, I use propane all year round, take it you are a caravaner, apparently brave on this site!
:) :) :)
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I emailed once - bureaocratic rubbish
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You can go through if you can show the tank is empty :(
A bit silly with the caravans though :-/
Is it a propane / butane thing? different calorific values. Cars run on propane, most caravans carry butane. Don’t know the answer, just wondering, and trying to get 3 stars!!!!!!!!!! :) :) :)
Nowadays many regular caravanners use propane (red cylinder) all year round .. saves the hassle of changing regulators etc between summer and winter (butane - blue - is worse than useless in winter )
:)
Yep. I know that, I use propane all year round, take it you are a caravaner, apparently brave on this site!
:) :) :)
Ahhh they are not so bad ... just a bit of banter .. methinks this qualifies me as a 'vanner ... and they didn't excommunicate me when I posted them .. :)
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1187538758
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You'll probably find it's just a matter of doing a "risk assessment" before they are allowed to do it (as with everything these days).
The revenue they're losing by pi$$ing off the minority of motorists with dual fuel cars is probably judged to be less than they'd have to pay some consultant to generate a load of paperwork that would make it possible to put an LPG car on the train.
Once their losses become more significant they'll probably change their mind!
I have a feeling the Mont Blanc tunnel had something about LPG on a sign near the entrance. It was in French so that's a good excuse for it being ignored :y
Kevin
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One thing is clear. It’s not allowed and clearly stated in Terms and Cond. I assume that they will not change their mind on that. Nice lady will ask you if you “have an LPG tank”. That is the most stupid thing I’ve ever heard – so what if I have an extra tank for petrol? How can they find that it’s an LPG tank and what if it left from old LPG installation?
Why they did this restriction? People are afraid of LPG or any king of gas. Dont know why but I've met many who claim to rather have just electric supply than gas. Eurotunnel has bankrupt once and there was an idea to close it permanently (no profit). Because of lack of money, safety systems weren’t improved and there was an incident few years ago and as they didn’t have enough money to improve it they had to find a witch and burn it on the Pyle. This way the “did” something to improve safety.
Main idea is that LPG is heavier than air and will stay at the bottom of the channel. There is also higher (much higher) pressure at the lowest point of the tunnel so they assumed that it might affect some lpg installations to start leaking. Although it’s very easy to put few sensors around to check if everything is ok. There is a ventilation system and how much the LPG can leak within 30 minutes trip? If anyone’s car is leaking then it’s very easy to check it when entering the tunnel.
I know few people which passed eurotunnel with LPG but their cars weren’t registered in UK so they couldn’t check if the car has an LPG.
If you will go on ferry, you may find big sign to cut your LPG off. Year, right, there is no way to do it as it cuts off automatically…
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People are afraid of LPG or any king of gas. Dont know why but I've met many who claim to rather have just electric supply than gas.
This is the result of lobbying and the spreading of paranoia by the various gas-related trade organisations to promote their "jobs for the boys".
Gas is just like any liquid / gaseous substance - liquid fuel, compressed air, even water, sewerage, etc..
Sealed = Good
Leaking = Bad
Nothing to be afraid of, really.
Yes, there are invisible dangers associated with its' leaking. Just the same as there are with petrol vapours, or even Methane from waste.
I would have thought there'd be a similar issue with any potential gas spillage accumulating in the bilges of a ferry but maybe they are properly ventilated?
As you say the channel tunnel has been built and is running on a shoestring. Last time I tried to use it it was a total farce due to the cables having fallen down onto a train - so I won't be repeating that experience all the while London has an airport and Dover has a ferry port!
Kevin
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well i got a reply.......
Thank you for your email, we hope that the answer below will be helpful.
We do not accept any vehicles that are fitted with LPG or dual fuel
tanks and there are no plans in the near future to change this policy.
This decision is made because of the different points of origin of LPG
vehicles (northern / southern countries have differences in the
standards applied to LPG cars, hence different level of safety offered
by these cars); some LPG tanks are fitted at a later stage, either by a
garage or by individuals, hence the impossibility to ensure that all
systems are fitted to a proper standard. The last point is that the
tunnel is a more confined space than the open air and specific
conditions are hence obviously applicable, in the same way as is
underground parking areas where LPG cars are usually not allowed.
The main difference between LPG cylinders and LPG propulsion tanks is
that cylinders can be turned off and isolated whilst tanks cannot. In
addition, whilst turning off the cylinders, our staff has an opportunity
to check the type of cylinder and ensure it is a proper cylinder
straight from the manufacture. This is not the case with propulsion
systems, as we cannot open the bonnets and easily check on the standard
of manufacturing of an LPG tank. We base our conclusions on the advice
of expert well recognised companies. We put the safety of our customers
first, and any area where an appropriate level of safety cannot be
guaranteed is covered by restrictions in our safety policy.
All companies have safety policies, and this is ours. We are a
responsible Company taking responsible measures to ensure the safety of
our customers. As a conclusion, when any decision has been reached about
a change to the LPG policy, it will be made public, and customers will
thus be informed.
Campervans and other recreational vehicles which have LPG containers (as
opposed to gas bottles) to power domestic services e.g. heating and
refrigeration are accepted on the condition that the tanks are no more
than 80% full and will be subject to inspection.
Gas cylinders for cooking purposes may be carried as long as the bottle
is no larger than 50kg, max. cylinder size 47kg.
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so pardon my iggerance, but whats the difference in this statement?
Campervans and other recreational vehicles which have LPG containers (as opposed to gas bottles) to power domestic services e.g. heating and....
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well i got a reply.......
Thank you for your email, we hope that the answer below will be helpful.
We do not accept any vehicles that are fitted with LPG or dual fuel
tanks and there are no plans in the near future to change this policy.
This decision is made because of the different points of origin of LPG
vehicles (northern / southern countries have differences in the
standards applied to LPG cars, hence different level of safety offered
by these cars); some LPG tanks are fitted at a later stage, either by a
garage or by individuals, hence the impossibility to ensure that all
systems are fitted to a proper standard. The last point is that the
tunnel is a more confined space than the open air and specific
conditions are hence obviously applicable, in the same way as is
underground parking areas where LPG cars are usually not allowed.
The main difference between LPG cylinders and LPG propulsion tanks is
that cylinders can be turned off and isolated whilst tanks cannot. In
addition, whilst turning off the cylinders, our staff has an opportunity
to check the type of cylinder and ensure it is a proper cylinder
straight from the manufacture. This is not the case with propulsion
systems, as we cannot open the bonnets and easily check on the standard
of manufacturing of an LPG tank. We base our conclusions on the advice
of expert well recognised companies. We put the safety of our customers
first, and any area where an appropriate level of safety cannot be
guaranteed is covered by restrictions in our safety policy.
All companies have safety policies, and this is ours. We are a
responsible Company taking responsible measures to ensure the safety of
our customers. As a conclusion, when any decision has been reached about
a change to the LPG policy, it will be made public, and customers will
thus be informed.
Campervans and other recreational vehicles which have LPG containers (as
opposed to gas bottles) to power domestic services e.g. heating and
refrigeration are accepted on the condition that the tanks are no more
than 80% full and will be subject to inspection.
Gas cylinders for cooking purposes may be carried as long as the bottle
is no larger than 50kg, max. cylinder size 47kg.
They say that a gas tank cannot be isolated. Of course it can !!!
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They say that a gas tank cannot be isolated. Of course it can !!!
They clearly wrote that without knowing their @rse from their elbow.
Kevin