Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: albitz on 25 May 2011, 11:33:48
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Had the plenum/inlet manifold etc off my car to reseal the oil cooler plate a couple of days ago. When I put it all back together it ran fine on petrol but rough on gas.
Lazydocker plugged it into his laptop yesterday which said there is a problem with no.6 injector. I thought this may well have been a crimped/ squashed pipe, but having took the plenum back off this morning it appears that this isnt the case.
Everything looks ok visually, so Im at a bit of a loss what to do next.
I think it must be connected to the work I did - too much of a coincidence not to be - but not sure what it could be. :-/
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Wiring issue with the feed to that injector or the petrol injector piggy back on that pot? :-/
Then again, that would have raised a fault in the LPG ECU.
Could a bit of crud have got into the injector block or the pipe down to the nozzle when you were working?
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Could I test the voltage to the injector with a multimeter Kevin ?
I can try blowing down the pipe to see if its blocked ? :-/
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Spent more hours faffing around with it to no avail.
Blown down the tubes to the nozzles - all clear as far as I can tell.
Listened to all the injectors with the screwdriver to the ear method (very high tech) all ticking away, and all sound the same as each other - even no.6.
Downloaded the software from Kevin Woods link (twice)doesnt seem to have completed for some reason - keep getting on screen message - no LPG controller.
Tried to install the software from the disc which came with the lead. Got a bit lost with that, cant make much sense from it tbh.
Cant think what else to do, other than a visit to the local LPG "expert", but they will probably plug their laptop in and tell me number 6 injector has a problem, the same as LD did. :-/
:'( :'(...........anyone got any fresh ideas please ?
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So you've got the software now?
All electrical connections as they were and good?
It could be a coincidence but I find it hard to accept :-/ But the fault definitely lies with LPG injector 6 somewhere (as proven by switching it back to petrol yesterday) ;)
Might be able to pop down tomorrow but I'm pretty tied up until next week now :(
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You could always try swapping the electrical feed to the injector, and the rubber pipe to the nozzle, with the adjacent cylinder and see if the problem moves to the other cylinder. This will narrow it down to a problem with the injector.
Beware that the Stag looms generally number the cylinders differently to GM, so the cylinder you'll likely swap with no. 6 will be number 4 in the GM numbering patter. This'll be number 5 as reported by the ECU.
Stag looms normally have the cylinder numbers attached with little tags on the looms feeding the injectors.
Kevin
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The only way I could tell if that moved the problem to a different cylinder would be to get the software installed ??
Im slightly confused by the loom markings already.The o/s injectors are tagged as 2/4/6 but those feed the nozzles on the n/s of the manifold, so shouldnt they be 1/3/5 ?
Im assuming the installer has just put the tags 2/4/6 above cylinders 2/4/6. :-/
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The numbers on the LPG loom are irrelevant as long as the same interrupts are used for the same LPG injector (I.e. 1 for 1, 2 for 2 etc)
What I mean is that you could use LPG injector 6 for cyl 1 as long as the piggyback connector marked 6 was used on the same cyl to interrupt the signal.
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I know what you mean, but wont that only aid diagnosis if I can see what effect its having via the laptop ?
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I know what you mean, but wont that only aid diagnosis if I can see what effect its having via the laptop ?
Yes, that's why I mentioned it, because you want to see if it's still cylinder 6 that's the problem or whether it's moved (and if so, to the number you expected it to). So, you need the laptop working to cut injectors back to petrol.
Is the cable you have USB? If so, IIRC, there's also a driver for the cable on the CD and the AC site that you need to install before it'll talk to the ECU.
Kevin
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Yep its USB Kevin. CD came with it, but I cant make any sense of the installation process thus far. :-[ :(
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Yep its USB Kevin. CD came with it, but I cant make any sense of the installation process thus far. :-[ :(
OK. Well, regarding the software, you just have to run the executable SetupAcGasSynchro-1_14_1_0.exe.
If you are getting messages saying it can't find the ECU that bit worked fine and you have got the application running.
With the software running, connect up the ECU and switch the ignition on. It normally just finds the ECU but you can prompt it to have another go by selecting the leftmost menu in the bar. Can't remember what it's called "Port" or "Connect" IIRC.
If it doesn't automatically locate it, right click on "My Computer", Select "Manage" and then "Device Manager" then "Ports (LPT and COM)" and see if you can see a serial port provided by the LPG cable.
What operating system are you running? IIRC, XP just works out of the box without installing extra drivers, Vista / 7 is probably more of a PITA.
Kevin
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Got the software up and runing now Kevin.Lazydocker sent me another link which I downloaded and bingo. :y
Had a quick look last night and (as LD found) if I switch off no.6 injector it runs fine. The only problem is that when you switch off and restart the engine it reverts back to all 6 injectors running, so I cant leave it switched off until problem is resolved.
The other slightly confusing thing was that it showed an error for injector no.5. :-/.............Im going out side shortly to have another go at it. Will report back on what I find. :y
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Got the software up and runing now Kevin.Lazydocker sent me another link which I downloaded and bingo. :y
Had a quick look last night and (as LD found) if I switch off no.6 injector it runs fine. The only problem is that when you switch off and restart the engine it reverts back to all 6 injectors running, so I cant leave it switched off until problem is resolved.
The other slightly confusing thing was that it showed an error for injector no.5. :-/.............Im going out side shortly to have another go at it. Will report back on what I find. :y
Which has me thinking that there's a connection loose somewhere and you've disturbed it accidentally... Clear the faults as I showed you and see where you go :y
It may be a coincidental failure of injector 6 but I'm always sceptical of coincidences when work has been carried out ;)
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Me too. :y..........got to go to work in a while, but will try to make some progree before I do. ;)
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Me too. :y..........got to go to work in a while, but will try to make some progree before I do. ;)
You can always take the lappy with you and then switch off no 6 so you're running mostly on LPG ;)
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Just swapped the connectors and pipes from injectors to nozzles between 4 &6. The problem is still with no.6
Switch 6 off and it runs fine. So, that means a problem with the power supply to no. 6 ? :-/
LD, re carrying the lappy around. Thats what Im planning to do until I get it sorted. :y
P.S I cleared the no.5 error before I started. It hasnt reprted any new errors. :-/
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Just swapped the connectors and pipes from injectors to nozzles between 4 &6. The problem is still with no.6
Switch 6 off and it runs fine.
LD, re carrying the lappy around. Thats what Im planning to do until I get it sorted. :y
Which does point towards a fault in the wiring (or injector hose for No 6) then. If the problem remains with No 6 Injector (bearing in mind it's the wire that denotes which injector it is ;)) then there's a problem with either the piggyback interrupt or the LPG injector wiring (assuming the ECU is fine as it appears to be) :y
It's certainly reduced your potential issues ;)
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Any way of testing it with a multimeter ?
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Any way of testing it with a multimeter ?
I wouldn't think a multimeter will react quickly enough to register the pulses :-/ :-/
Kevin will be more help on that front ;)
But I'd be looking at the pipework and wiring to that injector (and the associated piggy back wiring) very carefully :y
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Injector timing (ms) shows all 6 injectors operating about the same. Would that indicate that the problem is pipework rather than electrical - or is it not that simple ?
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Injector timing (ms) shows all 6 injectors operating about the same. Would that indicate that the problem is pipework rather than electrical - or is it not that simple ?
Fairly sure that version of the software doesn't show individual LPG injector times ;)
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column on right side of screen says - injection times (ms) numbered 1 to 8, and they (1-6) are constantly moving - between approx. 2.8 to 3.1 on idle. :-/
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column on right side of screen says - injection times (ms) numbered 1 to 8, and they (1-6) are constantly moving - between approx. 2.8 to 3.1 on idle. :-/
Those are the times measured at the petrol injector inputs to the LPG ECU. There's only a single LPG injector pulse width reported.
If the No.6 injector time is stable and broadly doing the same as the other ones it's an indication that the signal is getting to the ECU from the piggy-back wiring. (As we'd expect, because the same signal operates the petrol injector when running on petrol.)
I reckon you have an issue with the wiring from LPG ECU to that LPG injector or a blockage in the pipe. :-/
Kevin
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A t least we have narrowed it down to a couple of probable areas, so Im feeling a bit more confiedent now.
Nothing worse than having a problem and absollutely no idea how to solve it.
Thanks LD and KW for the help so far.
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A t least we have narrowed it down to a couple of probable areas, so Im feeling a bit more confiedent now.
Nothing worse than having a problem and absollutely no idea how to solve it.
Thanks LD and KW for the help so far.
No worries... If you still haven't gotten to the bottom of it I'll try to come over next week and give you some pointers ;)
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Cheers Paul. :y
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YAAY !! fixed it. :)...........had a 12 hour break between shifts today, so took the plenum etc. off and had a careful look at everything. The pipe to the nozzle on no.6 was cracked where it goes onto the nozzle and was bent too tight where it comes out of the nozzle.Chopped 1cm off the end and carefully rerouted it and alls well. Wouldnt be such a pita if the nozzles had have been drilled in a better place during installation, but its sorted now. :) :)
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Glad to see you've got it fettled Albs :y
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YAAY !! fixed it. :)...........had a 12 hour break between shifts today, so took the plenum etc. off and had a careful look at everything. The pipe to the nozzle on no.6 was cracked where it goes onto the nozzle and was bent too tight where it comes out of the nozzle.Chopped 1cm off the end and carefully rerouted it and alls well. Wouldnt be such a pita if the nozzles had have been drilled in a better place during installation, but its sorted now. :) :)
Great news... Told you it had to be "related" to the work you had done ;) ;)
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As for my car, injectors are now taken off.
Is there a way to test them on my desktop ?
E.g. should I hear some clicking sound when connecting one to the battery, or so .... ?