Omega Owners Forum

Omega Help Area => Omega Electrical and Audio Help => Topic started by: Kate on 24 July 2011, 15:25:48

Title: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 24 July 2011, 15:25:48
Been having a problem with the airbag system.  Got some diagnostic data which says that the battery voltage is 11.25.  Does this mean that the battery is faulty?

Many thanks! :y

Date and time>,24/07/2011. 14:2955

Workshop information:

hkj


Selected model>,1998 (W),Omega-B,Body,Airbag SAB6

Control Unit:


KW82 protocol initialized.

ECU ID= DC,90565938,S0052655,440602,1398,


Measuring blocks information:

System Voltage,11.25 V
System Voltage Status,Okay
Airbag Configuration,Side Airbags
Pretensioner Configuration,Driver&Passenger
Driver Airbag Squib Circuit Resistance,3.05 Ohm
Passenger Airbag Squib Circuit Resistance,2.12 Ohm
Driver Pretensioner Circuit Resistance,2.30 Ohm
Passenger Pretensioner Circuit Resistance,2.30 Ohm
Driver Side Airbag Squib Circuit Resistance,2.85 Ohm
Driver SAS Message Status (Side Airbag Sensor),Okay
Passenger Side Airbag Squib Circuit Resistance,2.43 Ohm
Passenger SAS Message Status (Side Airbag Sensor),Okay
Reset Passenger Side Airbag After Activation (DTC69),Inactive
Reset Driver Side Airbag After Activation (DTC68),Inactive
Reset Pretensioning Devices After Activation (DTC67),Inactive
Driver SAS Initialisation Status (Side Airbag Sensor),Okay
Driver SAS Communication Error (Side Airbag Sensor),None
Passenger SAS Initialisation Status (Side Airbag Sensor),Okay
Passenger SAS Communication Error (Side Airbag Sensor),None
DTC set since,0
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 24 July 2011, 16:12:34
11.25V is a bit low, even if the reading was taken with the ignition on.

Assuming the alternator is doing it's job correctly, I'd try charging the battery overnight from a mains charger and see how it holds up for a few days.

The off load voltage of a good battery should be between 12.4 - 12.7 volts.
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 24 July 2011, 16:36:19
Quote
11.25V is a bit low, even if the reading was taken with the ignition on.

Assuming the alternator is doing it's job correctly, I'd try charging the battery overnight from a mains charger and see how it holds up for a few days.

The off load voltage of a good battery should be between 12.4 - 12.7 volts.

Thanks.:y

Could the faulty airbag sensor have caused a slow drain? The mig wouldn't start if not used everyday but only since the airbag light came on. :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 24 July 2011, 16:46:12
Quote
Could the faulty airbag sensor have caused a slow drain?
No, all the sensor does is to tell the ECU to deploy the bag it is related to in the event of a collision.

Quote
The mig wouldn't start if not used everyday
Assuming the alternator is working correctly and there isn't another fault on the car that has caused the usual quiescent current to increase, that is indicative of a failing battery.

Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 24 July 2011, 16:55:11
Quote
Quote
Could the faulty airbag sensor have caused a slow drain?
No, all the sensor does is to tell the ECU to deploy the bag it is related to in the event of a collision.

Quote
The mig wouldn't start if not used everyday
Assuming the alternator is working correctly and there isn't another fault on the car that has caused the usual quiescent current to increase, that is indicative of a failing battery.


What spec is a mig battery?  Should I get a new one or will a used one do? :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Bionic on 24 July 2011, 18:01:52
Fancy meeting you here  ;D ;D ;D Should have rang me :'(
Hiya Kate (and Gill) if I still had it the first thing I would do would be to give the battery a long trickle charge but the problem with that is that you would have to take it off cos its too far from where its parked to your house for a lead. Best other option would be to take it to a tyre station and have them 'Resistance Test' it. NOT the hand held meter type cos it does not place any strain on the battery to test for weak cells.
Short runs with many gadgets running will soon knock down even a healthy battery so give scarface a good long run regularly...... :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 24 July 2011, 21:07:44
Quote
Fancy meeting you here  ;D ;D ;D Should have rang me :'(
Hiya Kate (and Gill) if I still had it the first thing I would do would be to give the battery a long trickle charge but the problem with that is that you would have to take it off cos its too far from where its parked to your house for a lead. Best other option would be to take it to a tyre station and have them 'Resistance Test' it. NOT the hand held meter type cos it does not place any strain on the battery to test for weak cells.
Short runs with many gadgets running will soon knock down even a healthy battery so give scarface a good long run regularly...... :-*

Thanks Ray.  I have been doing mostly short runs really with the blower on 5 as it's been really warm down here.

Me and Gill changed the airbag sensor in the door today so hopefully that little problem will be fixed now. (The airbag light was on). 

Guffer changed the HBV for me last week as it was leaking.  (Thanks again Guffer).

Other than that Scarface has been doing really well! :y

How's your mig doing then?  Hope she's not another Scarface now if you know what I mean!  :o :o :o

Sorry I'm really bad emailer Ray! The oof has been distracting me a lot lately! :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: cristina on 25 July 2011, 09:42:08
No probs, mine is running well and according to the other half she is now called 'Goldie'! Can't think why though....must be my age :D
Sounds very much like the battery was just not getting enough charge back into it cos the leccys on these do whack a great deal out of them on short runs. Just do as advised and you will probably find thats its ok. Buy yourself an emergency starter pack, they are cheapish and you can hook that up if you decide to take the battery off to trickle charge it overnight. Just remember to hook it up in tandem (parralel ie + to +) before you disconnect the main battery and it will then retain the settings. Do the same when you put the main battery back. Or do as I do and use a small 12v bike battery. Both ideas do work though.
Might even get to visit sometime again.....you never know...... :D ;) Pillock I bought it from still hasn't sent the other bits though so frig keeping him posted as to what I am doing with it. :o :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kevin Wood on 25 July 2011, 10:29:58
I would suggest measuring the voltage at the battery itself with a multimeter. 11.25 is indeed low, but most ECUs in the car report a lower voltage than the true battery voltage in my experience.

Have a work through this guide for the full diagnosis before condemning the battery. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1225724099
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 25 July 2011, 11:13:02
Quote
What spec is a mig battery?
The autistic bit of me could have so much fun answering such an open ended question, but I've had my ritalin this morning so I'll be sensible  ;D

Assuming you are talking the 2.5 Elite (as per your profile), it needs a battery that can do 65Ah with a CCA (Cold Cranking Ability) of 600 Amps if memory serves me correctly.

Quote
Should I get a new one or will a used one do? :-*
The trouble with secondhand batteries is that you can't tell how long they will last, and you can't guage whether the CCA is anywhere near enough unless you "drop test" it.
As a brand new battery is approx £60 with a 3 year warranty, I'd buy new if you intend to keep the car.
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 25 July 2011, 12:28:26
Quote
No probs, mine is running well and according to the other half she is now called 'Goldie'! Can't think why though....must be my age :D
Sounds very much like the battery was just not getting enough charge back into it cos the leccys on these do whack a great deal out of them on short runs. Just do as advised and you will probably find thats its ok. Buy yourself an emergency starter pack, they are cheapish and you can hook that up if you decide to take the battery off to trickle charge it overnight. Just remember to hook it up in tandem (parralel ie + to +) before you disconnect the main battery and it will then retain the settings. Do the same when you put the main battery back. Or do as I do and use a small 12v bike battery. Both ideas do work though.
Might even get to visit sometime again.....you never know...... :D ;) Pillock I bought it from still hasn't sent the other bits though so frig keeping him posted as to what I am doing with it. :o :y

I've had to take the battery of twice to charge it and I managed to put the radio code in no bother.

What other bits are you waiting for for yours?  Is she running well then?

It would be great to meet up with you Ray, it's a shame you live so fay away!  I know you enjoy pub visits and I kind of like them too! ;D
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 25 July 2011, 12:34:55
Quote
I would suggest measuring the voltage at the battery itself with a multimeter. 11.25 is indeed low, but most ECUs in the car report a lower voltage than the true battery voltage in my experience.

Have a work through this guide for the full diagnosis before condemning the battery. http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1225724099

Thanks very much Kevin, that's really helpful! :y :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 25 July 2011, 12:36:56
Quote
Quote
What spec is a mig battery?
The autistic bit of me could have so much fun answering such an open ended question, but I've had my ritalin this morning so I'll be sensible  ;D

Assuming you are talking the 2.5 Elite (as per your profile), it needs a battery that can do 65Ah with a CCA (Cold Cranking Ability) of 600 Amps if memory serves me correctly.

Quote
Should I get a new one or will a used one do? :-*
The trouble with secondhand batteries is that you can't tell how long they will last, and you can't guage whether the CCA is anywhere near enough unless you "drop test" it.
As a brand new battery is approx £60 with a 3 year warranty, I'd buy new if you intend to keep the car.

Thanks for that! Where do you get your batteries from? :y :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: twiglet on 25 July 2011, 12:46:35
Get one from Vxl on TC Kate. I wouldn't go anywhere else!  :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 26 July 2011, 09:38:00
Quote
Thanks for that! Where do you get your batteries from? :y :-*
Get my batteries from a local independant tyre/exhaust place called G-Force.
Last battery I bought was for our Isuzu Trooper and they charged £62 all in for the heavy duty version (95Ah, 750 CCA) with a 4 year warranty (everywhere else was around the £90 mark for the same thing).
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 26 July 2011, 11:53:49
Would this one be any good?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130550506036&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_510wt_932
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kevin Wood on 26 July 2011, 12:31:53
Quote
Would this one be any good?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130550506036&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_510wt_932

Almost certainly too large to fit an Omega, looking at it.

I think a 2nd hand car battery would be a false economy.
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 26 July 2011, 16:45:00
Quote
Quote
Would this one be any good?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130550506036&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_510wt_932

Almost certainly too large to fit an Omega, looking at it.

I think a 2nd hand car battery would be a false economy.

I totally agree Kevin! :y

The only problem is that I have only 8p in my bank account! ;D
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Bionic on 27 July 2011, 11:48:02
Ah! Pub visits - yep you got that right, they are all very welcome and it is the distance that is the problem.........so move up nearer to us is what Cris has just shouted in. Its cheaper than living in the smoke anyway and the air is a hell of a lot cleaner too which makes the beer taste better I reckon.
As for your battery it would, as the best advisors have already said, be best to buy a new one that is the recommended one for the model of car.
If you really have to rely on getting a used one the best place I reckon would be a breakers that break only fairly recent accident write offs. Or tour the local breakers and look under the lids for a one that is dated as being fairly new. Wherever you look though test it with the old 'tongs' type of tester to see if there are any weak cells. None of the handhelds will tell you that!
GudLuk...and may the force be with you!
By the way the largest size that would fit is 170 x 170 x 280mm.
 :D ;)
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 27 July 2011, 12:35:54
Quote
Ah! Pub visits - yep you got that right, they are all very welcome and it is the distance that is the problem.........so move up nearer to us is what Cris has just shouted in. Its cheaper than living in the smoke anyway and the air is a hell of a lot cleaner too which makes the beer taste better I reckon.
As for your battery it would, as the best advisors have already said, be best to buy a new one that is the recommended one for the model of car.
If you really have to rely on getting a used one the best place I reckon would be a breakers that break only fairly recent accident write offs. Or tour the local breakers and look under the lids for a one that is dated as being fairly new. Wherever you look though test it with the old 'tongs' type of tester to see if there are any weak cells. None of the handhelds will tell you that!
GudLuk...and may the force be with you!
By the way the largest size that would fit is 170 x 170 x 280mm.
 :D ;)

Thanks Ray. Yes it would be better if we lived a bit nearer.

I think that's a good idea to try a local breakers, I'm sure there will be loads round here!  They drive like maniacs!! :o :o :o
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: twiglet on 27 July 2011, 13:31:14
I have a nearly new battery here Kate, if you happen to be over this way at all.  :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Bionic on 27 July 2011, 15:00:45
Yep...go for it kate and you can try the cider there too...... :P :P :P
If you opt to try the breakers take a tape to measure it though and you will get it right.

 ;) ;D ;D
Can Cris and I look forward to you both moving here then?????? Great countryside and great pubs aplenty  :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 27 July 2011, 20:23:25
Quote
I have a nearly new battery here Kate, if you happen to be over this way at all.  :y

Thanks James.  If I'm ever in Suffolk I'll pay you a visit! :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 27 July 2011, 20:25:59
Quote
Yep...go for it kate and you can try the cider there too...... :P :P :P
If you opt to try the breakers take a tape to measure it though and you will get it right.

 ;) ;D ;D
Can Cris and I look forward to you both moving here then?????? Great countryside and great pubs aplenty  :y

That'll be great as there are hardly any pubs in London! ;D ;D ;D

Affordable ones I mean! ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 27 July 2011, 20:29:53
In Southall, about 2 miles from my house, there is a pub where you can pay with rupees! And that ISN'T a joke! ::)
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 27 July 2011, 20:33:02
http://www.glassyjunction.co.uk/ :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Bionic on 28 July 2011, 07:27:39
Kate.....Bloody hell  :-/...pay in rupees? That just about proves my case in the post I started about immigration 'This is not racist' in the Discussion Area! Have a looky at that one and see the support there is for my views.
One thing certain though is that the next time we get down there we will definitely not be going in there! At least if your have you have a hangover bad head the bandage will  not look out of place ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
(note the when not if) ;)
Pubs are well cheap where we are.... :y
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 29 July 2011, 08:23:28
Quote
Pubs are well cheap where we are.... :y
Just as well, because the taxi prices are a joke.
£10 to travel from town to just the other side of Beaumont Leys....do I look like a f*****g tourist??

Thinking about it, I'm white so I probably am a tourist up there  ;D ;D
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Bionic on 29 July 2011, 08:31:05
Quote
Quote
Pubs are well cheap where we are.... :y
Just as well, because the taxi prices are a joke.
£10 to travel from town to just the other side of Beaumont Leys....do I look like a f*****g tourist??

Thinking about it, I'm white so I probably am a tourist up there  ;D ;D
Martian..How right you are. Thanx to the Leicester City (sh*tty) Council's policy on giving the top jobs to the headbandage wearers what else could we expect?
It would not be so bad if they could drive and speak a language you can understand that is not so deformed by an unintelligable accent that it is virtually impossible to understand. Best part of it is that they expect you tip them too ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D (move along the bus please) :D
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 29 July 2011, 16:26:56
Ray, you know that guy you told me about who sells mig parts near Heathrow? Well is his ebay user name omegaspareparts?

He's got a battery for sale.  Wasn't sure if I've got the right bloke? :-* :-* :-*
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 01 August 2011, 19:21:44
Well, got the new battery today.  Made sure it was fully charged and guess what?

Yes, my mig wouldn't start!! >:(

It's a Bosch 500 amp and it doesn't look very old.

I can't understand why a fully charged battery would not start the car. It hardly even moved the starter motor! I checked the multimeter which said the battery was giving 13.4V.

I am going a bit mad? :o :o :o
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kevin Wood on 01 August 2011, 19:27:12
Are you sure the battery is really fully charged? Best to put it on a charger for a few hours just to make sure.

If that doesn't help, check that the battery terminals are still securely crimped where the thick leads join the terminals and the terminals are not getting hot. They can work loose here and cause high resistance.

Check the straps between the battery negative terminal and chassis and also to the engine block are secure and not getting warm when you try to start it.

Could be starter motor, I suppose, but they very rarely fail on a V6 so I'd double check everything first.
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 01 August 2011, 19:42:34
Thanks Kevin. :y

I'm sure the battery was charged.  The only thing I forgot was to clean the terminals so maybe it was that. :-/
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 04 August 2011, 00:16:20
Quote
I checked the multimeter which said the battery was giving 13.4V.
Use a known good meter.
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Kate on 04 August 2011, 19:07:44
Quote
Quote
I checked the multimeter which said the battery was giving 13.4V.
Use a known good meter.

Thanks. How would I check it?
Title: Re: Battery Voltage
Post by: Martian on 04 August 2011, 21:54:53
Quote
Quote
Quote
I checked the multimeter which said the battery was giving 13.4V.
Use a known good meter.

Thanks. How would I check it?
There are quite a few ways to test a meter for accuracy, including cross referencing it with another meter and comparing the differences.

When you tested the battery voltage and the meter reported 13.4V, how was that test conducted?

1. Was it with the battery disconnected?
2. Had it just come off charge?