Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: jerry on 19 February 2012, 22:52:56
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Dont know if anyone else saw Panorama the other day about America's growing poor? Our welfare state may be far from perfect (not least in the ease in which it can be abused) but surely its a way better system than that of America? Sure, some people who could have afforded medical insurance but chose not to and are now paying the price may not gain too much sympathy but what about the construction worker who has never earned enough to pay for such insurance and who is now seriously ill with nowhere to go?This feller queued for hours through the night to see a free doctor (in a scheme set up by a Brit who had set up similar in "third world" countries) only to be told that his untreated hernia would likely kill him if he did not have quite a straight forward surgical procedure but , at 20K, there was no way he could afford it. IMO decent basic healthcare via a welfare system paid for via taxation should be an essential. Should people choose to spend their money on enhanced care (or education for that matter) fine but it seems very bizzare that such a "rich" nation should come to this in this century. Guess its all about the ever growing gap between rich and poor which clearly isnt just the case in such countries as Russia/India/China etc anymore >:(
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I suppose the ideal system woul be somewhere between theirs and ours.Although imo ours is less preferable than theirs overall currently.
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
Yes exactly. The system would only want those in good health!
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
Yes exactly. The system would only want those in good health!
That's me f***ed then ::)
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
Yes exactly. The system would only want those in good health!
That's me f***ed then ::)
And me, and SWMBO ::)
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Just watched that episode on iplayer, very shocking and sad. The world is changing rapidly and I fear for our children.
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
Yes exactly. The system would only want those in good health!
That's me f***ed then ::)
And me, and SWMBO ::)
Not necessarily. If I were to go for my own health insurance I woul dbe told to prompty either cough up you rentire worth or f-off. Your company though should be able to put you on their insurance subject to a medical and a calculation of the necessary risk. However it is possible to be put on my wife's insurance through her employer at very little additional cost to me or the wife. From what I have discovered in my investigations for moving over the US is that the actual situation differs somewhat from what we are led to believe by the media. Besides, if our system was perfect we would have no homeless.......
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I think that our system should be changed to an insurance based healthcare system.
But, I think that up to 18 Years of age and people who are genuinely on benefits should get it "Credited" to keep them insured. :y
If the money we pay into the NHS was rearranged into this system, there would be a much better healthcare infrastructure and (I expect) some savings to boot ::)
Of course, the downside is that people with an existing condition like SWMBO (Severe Allergies) would struggle to get cover :-\
Yes exactly. The system would only want those in good health!
That's me f***ed then ::)
And me, and SWMBO ::)
Not necessarily. If I were to go for my own health insurance I woul dbe told to prompty either cough up you rentire worth or f-off. Your company though should be able to put you on their insurance subject to a medical and a calculation of the necessary risk. However it is possible to be put on my wife's insurance through her employer at very little additional cost to me or the wife. From what I have discovered in my investigations for moving over the US is that the actual situation differs somewhat from what we are led to believe by the media. Besides, if our system was perfect we would have no homeless.......
I agree. Speak to most Americans and you get a bit of a different picture. Conversely,I saw a programmed Michael Moore made about our NHS (for the U.S. market) and the picture of utopia he painted was unrecogniseable as the NHS that I have had too many dealings with over the years.Its not easy to get an accurate picture of anything via the media.There is almost always an agaenda somehwere along the line. ;)
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Dont know if anyone else saw Panorama the other day about America's growing poor? Our welfare state may be far from perfect (not least in the ease in which it can be abused) but surely its a way better system than that of America? Sure, some people who could have afforded medical insurance but chose not to and are now paying the price may not gain too much sympathy but what about the construction worker who has never earned enough to pay for such insurance and who is now seriously ill with nowhere to go?This feller queued for hours through the night to see a free doctor (in a scheme set up by a Brit who had set up similar in "third world" countries) only to be told that his untreated hernia would likely kill him if he did not have quite a straight forward surgical procedure but , at 20K, there was no way he could afford it. IMO decent basic healthcare via a welfare system paid for via taxation should be an essential. Should people choose to spend their money on enhanced care (or education for that matter) fine but it seems very bizzare that such a "rich" nation should come to this in this century. Guess its all about the ever growing gap between rich and poor which clearly isnt just the case in such countries as Russia/India/China etc anymore >:(
I agree. The current NHS was implemented by a socialist Labour government in 1948. The doctors bitterly opposed it at that time.
I don't recall the name of the Prime Minister in charge of that administration.... ::) ::) ::) ::) ;)
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the actual situation differs somewhat from what we are led to believe by the media. Besides, if our system was perfect we would have no homeless.......
Quite so, Guffers. Anyone who believes all the tripe that is put out by the BBC as supposedly independent and not agenda-driven must be hugely gullible. ::) ::)
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Dont know if anyone else saw Panorama the other day about America's growing poor? Our welfare state may be far from perfect (not least in the ease in which it can be abused) but surely its a way better system than that of America? Sure, some people who could have afforded medical insurance but chose not to and are now paying the price may not gain too much sympathy but what about the construction worker who has never earned enough to pay for such insurance and who is now seriously ill with nowhere to go?This feller queued for hours through the night to see a free doctor (in a scheme set up by a Brit who had set up similar in "third world" countries) only to be told that his untreated hernia would likely kill him if he did not have quite a straight forward surgical procedure but , at 20K, there was no way he could afford it. IMO decent basic healthcare via a welfare system paid for via taxation should be an essential. Should people choose to spend their money on enhanced care (or education for that matter) fine but it seems very bizzare that such a "rich" nation should come to this in this century. Guess its all about the ever growing gap between rich and poor which clearly isnt just the case in such countries as Russia/India/China etc anymore >:(
I agree. The current NHS was implemented by a socialist Labour government in 1948. The doctors bitterly opposed it at that time.
I don't recall the name of the Prime Minister in charge of that administration.... ::) ::) ::) ::) ;)
And a wonderful thing i was too - at that time.It has since grown into an enormous monster,which is incredibly innefficient,and to a large extent is run for those who work in it rather than the patients.Its one of the biggest gravy trains in the world,employing many people in many roles who/which are completely unnecessary.Its also one big gravy tain for its suppliers,particularily the drug companies,who charge what they like.
Government funding keeps rising espite the economic reality in the real world,but the funding cant keep up with the inflation in the NHS. It needs to change,it cant stay as it is,but those on the gravy train are fighting for their own self interest,and resisting change every step of the way.
Andrew Lansley has spent the last seven years devoted to studying the NHS and thinking/consulting what to do about it. As soon as he announced his findings the Limpdems jumped all over it an ripped it apart.Now those on the gravy train are trying to scupper whats left of his findings. There is a class of people in this country who think the great institutions of state exist for the purpose of keeping them in a certain lifestyle.The country needs rid of them before they destroy and bankrupt it imo. Were nearly there,it wont be long, unless someone grasps some nettles.
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the actual situation differs somewhat from what we are led to believe by the media. Besides, if our system was perfect we would have no homeless.......
Quite so, Guffers. Anyone who believes all the tripe that is put out by the BBC as supposedly independent and not agenda-driven must be hugely gullible. ::) ::)
I read somewhere the other day that the Beeb has taken legal steps to prevent a report from being published on whether or not the Beebs coverage on Israel is biased.
Edit. Here it is.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/02/15/bbc-wins-court-battle-not_n_1278452.html
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And here is another one
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1349506/Left-wing-bias-Its-written-BBCs-DNA-says-Peter-Sissons.html
And no dribbling over Helen Flanigans t*ts either :-X :-X ;D
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And here is another one
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1349506/Left-wing-bias-Its-written-BBCs-DNA-says-Peter-Sissons.html
And no dribbling over Helen Flanigans t*ts either :-X :-X ;D
.......too late TG....... ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :D :D :D :D ;)
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An heres two more from non other than the Director General of the BBC.Although he says it has changed now.Hes right actually,its more biased now than it ever was.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1308215/Yes-BBC-biased-Mark-Thompson-admits-massive-lean-Left.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/bbc/7976318/BBC-was-biased-against-Thatcher-admits-Mark-Thompson.html
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And here is another one
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1349506/Left-wing-bias-Its-written-BBCs-DNA-says-Peter-Sissons.html
And no dribbling over Helen Flanigans t*ts either :-X :-X ;D
I wasn't going to bother reading that, until you mentioned the tits ::)
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I bumped into an old pal a week or so back who I'd not seen for a few months - so we went for a beer or two to catch up.
Seemed that he was on holiday in the US and was taken ill & ended up in hospital. His situation got worse and worse with complications and infections all meaning that he had to be taken to a specialist isolation hospital.
By the time he was well enough to fly home, the best part of two months had passed and his insurance had forked out IRO $500,000! Makes you think don't it?
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Tbh, we all moan and groan about the NHS but at the end of the day, is there a better choice anyware in the world ?
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Tbh, we all moan and groan about the NHS but at the end of the day, is there a better choice anyware in the world ?
Fair point, but the NHS is grotesquely inefficient. Top-heavy management and excessive administration means that the amount available for frontline services is woefully short. Needs a root-and-branch reform, IMHO. :y
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Dont know if anyone else saw Panorama the other day about America's growing poor? Our welfare state may be far from perfect (not least in the ease in which it can be abused) but surely its a way better system than that of America? Sure, some people who could have afforded medical insurance but chose not to and are now paying the price may not gain too much sympathy but what about the construction worker who has never earned enough to pay for such insurance and who is now seriously ill with nowhere to go?This feller queued for hours through the night to see a free doctor (in a scheme set up by a Brit who had set up similar in "third world" countries) only to be told that his untreated hernia would likely kill him if he did not have quite a straight forward surgical procedure but , at 20K, there was no way he could afford it. IMO decent basic healthcare via a welfare system paid for via taxation should be an essential. Should people choose to spend their money on enhanced care (or education for that matter) fine but it seems very bizzare that such a "rich" nation should come to this in this century. Guess its all about the ever growing gap between rich and poor which clearly isnt just the case in such countries as Russia/India/China etc anymore >:(
I agree. The current NHS was implemented by a socialist Labour government in 1948. The doctors bitterly opposed it at that time.
I don't recall the name of the Prime Minister in charge of that administration.... ::) ::) ::) ::) ;)
And a wonderful thing i was too - at that time.It has since grown into an enormous monster,which is incredibly innefficient,and to a large extent is run for those who work in it rather than the patients.Its one of the biggest gravy trains in the world,employing many people in many roles who/which are completely unnecessary.Its also one big gravy tain for its suppliers,particularily the drug companies,who charge what they like.
Government funding keeps rising espite the economic reality in the real world,but the funding cant keep up with the inflation in the NHS. It needs to change,it cant stay as it is,but those on the gravy train are fighting for their own self interest,and resisting change every step of the way.
Andrew Lansley has spent the last seven years devoted to studying the NHS and thinking/consulting what to do about it. As soon as he announced his findings the Limpdems jumped all over it an ripped it apart.Now those on the gravy train are trying to scupper whats left of his findings. There is a class of people in this country who think the great institutions of state exist for the purpose of keeping them in a certain lifestyle.The country needs rid of them before they destroy and bankrupt it imo. Were nearly there,it wont be long, unless someone grasps some nettles.
But is it? £7000 for a years treatment here. generic drug(i.e. a copy) in India £120. The drug companies would argue that they have to charge 1st world countries so much in order to be able to research and develop new stuff.
Spanish health system is interesting and not cheap. If you are in work you pay (even if you only work one day that month) about £250 flat rate. On top of that many people have insurance top up schemes. The hospitals are efficient and modern (for example wherever you are in the country the doctor can access your history on screen AND they actually keep you informed) but patient care(bathing and feeding and washing PJs etc) is the responsibility of the family. Free healthcare when you retire. Appointments are done on line or via a central phone line are very efficient.
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Tbh, we all moan and groan about the NHS but at the end of the day, is there a better choice anyware in the world ?
Fair point, but the NHS is grotesquely inefficient. Top-heavy management and excessive administration means that the amount available for frontline services is woefully short. Needs a root-and-branch reform, IMHO. :y
Agreed. :y And thats what Lansley was genuinely attempting to do until the vested interests got their teeth into him. It will probably cost him his career, by trying to take them on,and result in changes which will be a directionless muddle which wont attempt to sort the real problems.Shame.
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Tbh, we all moan and groan about the NHS but at the end of the day, is there a better choice anyware in the world ?
Fair point, but the NHS is grotesquely inefficient. Top-heavy management and excessive administration means that the amount available for frontline services is woefully short. Needs a root-and-branch reform, IMHO. :y
A year or 2 ago, i'd have agreed with you but nowdays, most of them have been moved on.
My sister is a mental health worker, and a friend / customer runs a secure unit for little barstewards children. In there opinion, the cuts have now gone that far that they are struggling with the workload.
When it comes to meeting targets, you find that most of the surgeons take on the extra work so the local health authority can meet its targets. For this, they charge crazy prices >:(
Somthing like 30% of our local BUPA hostpital's beds are used by NHS patents. All this creams more money off the budget.
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Like the man said.It needs root & branch reform. ;)
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Like the man said.It needs root & branch reform. ;)
I type slowly ;) ;D ;D
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Seen the headlines on the BBC?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17093082 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-17093082)
"Health Secretary Andrew Lansley has been heckled and jostled by protesters as he arrived at Downing Street for a meeting on the future of the NHS.
He was greeted by shouts of "shame" and one woman refused to stand aside, saying: "I've had enough of you."
You have to read further to find out a bit more about this aggrieved "member of the public".
"One woman, Jean Hautot, believed to be a former Unison rep, barred his way, telling the health secretary: "I'm not getting out of the way."
Then you have to go elsewhere ( http://order-order.com/2012/02/20/watch-lansley-mobbed-on-way-into-downing-street/ (http://order-order.com/2012/02/20/watch-lansley-mobbed-on-way-into-downing-street/) ) to find out who she is: Yes, she is a former union rep, but is also an organiser for “Keep NHS public”, i.e a political agitator.
But the BBC doesn't want to give you that impression, does it? ::) ::)
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Par for the course Nick. :(
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Dont know if anyone else saw Panorama the other day about America's growing poor? Our welfare state may be far from perfect (not least in the ease in which it can be abused) but surely its a way better system than that of America? Sure, some people who could have afforded medical insurance but chose not to and are now paying the price may not gain too much sympathy but what about the construction worker who has never earned enough to pay for such insurance and who is now seriously ill with nowhere to go?This feller queued for hours through the night to see a free doctor (in a scheme set up by a Brit who had set up similar in "third world" countries) only to be told that his untreated hernia would likely kill him if he did not have quite a straight forward surgical procedure but , at 20K, there was no way he could afford it. IMO decent basic healthcare via a welfare system paid for via taxation should be an essential. Should people choose to spend their money on enhanced care (or education for that matter) fine but it seems very bizzare that such a "rich" nation should come to this in this century. Guess its all about the ever growing gap between rich and poor which clearly isnt just the case in such countries as Russia/India/China etc anymore >:(
I agree. The current NHS was implemented by a socialist Labour government in 1948. The doctors bitterly opposed it at that time.
I don't recall the name of the Prime Minister in charge of that administration.... ::) ::) ::) ::) ;)
:) :)
in our country a similiar system exists .. if you are poor and have no income , funds pay for your health.. with only one condition.. you need to be registered..and have green card..