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Author Topic: Cam timing wrong?  (Read 2384 times)

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terry paget

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Cam timing wrong?
« on: 13 May 2015, 12:53:06 »
Bought 2001 2.6 petrol manual Sunday in Plymouth. Drove it home, ran fine. However, cam belt was last changed 10 years and 45000 miles ago, so due for a change. Took it apart this morning, and cams look about 30 degrees ahead of crankshaft. I have inserted cam sprocket locking tools, have not yet removed belt. Pics follow. Please advise.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/x95r8mnjpmi0rmj/crankpulley50%25.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/uwhcg2bemvyac0s/cam4.50%25.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/rdl5dumags889gp/cam3.50%25.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ouqdkyvv6o5l0b8/cam2.50%25.JPG?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/n8zfr55razzufwh/cam1.50%25.JPG?dl=0
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05omegav6

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #1 on: 13 May 2015, 13:08:49 »
Does the crank tool line up immediately with the water pump when offered up?

If yes, then remove belt, turn the crank anti clockwise about 20° fit crank lock and rotate clockwise until the crank lock is home. Then simply swap pullies over and fit new belt etc as per the guide :y
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #2 on: 13 May 2015, 13:25:40 »
I bet that was running like a dog. :o

But yes, just remove the belt with the cam locking tools in place, fit the crank locking tool, rotate crank forwards until it fits the water pump and replace belt as normal. :y
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #3 on: 13 May 2015, 13:26:52 »
Might be worth a compression check after it's correctly timed, too, looking at how far out it is.
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #4 on: 13 May 2015, 15:46:12 »
30 degrees ahead and you may get away with it (as its actually 15 degrees on the cam), advance just slightly and its curtains. reason being is that the inlet starts to open slightly just before TDC and closes close to or slightly after BDC so no issues, exhaust opens slightly just before BDC and closes just after TDC, its here there may be an issue but you would have so noticed it by now! The fact its a 2.6 works in your favour as the cam lift is a mm or more less than a 3.2/3.0 (hence why the G cams give a gain)
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terry paget

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #5 on: 13 May 2015, 16:13:24 »
I am glad I got it home, but it's been like that for 11 years!
I have put on the crank setting tool, showing how far out it is.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pblbleo6zjgze8r/crankTOOLon.JPG?dl=0
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The Red Baron

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #6 on: 13 May 2015, 16:15:10 »
 :o :o thats miles away, sure the cam spockets are on there marks. ?
Edit, just looked at the earlier phots. can see they are.
wow
« Last Edit: 13 May 2015, 16:17:34 by The Red Baron »
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05omegav6

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #7 on: 13 May 2015, 16:40:10 »
Here's a thought... could the crank pulley have been fitted incorrectly? Say after a crank seal or oil pump change... :-\
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The Red Baron

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #8 on: 13 May 2015, 16:47:41 »
cant see how, its keyed.
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joff

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #9 on: 13 May 2015, 16:53:08 »
Bet it was done at the dealers too.
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05omegav6

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #10 on: 13 May 2015, 17:46:26 »
Quote from: The Red Baron on 13 May 2015, 16:47:41
cant see how, its keyed.
Surely worth checking, just in case :-\

Or put another way would you presume it to be fine if it were your car?
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #11 on: 13 May 2015, 17:56:44 »
Easy to check with a plug removed from number 1.

But yes, the bottom sprocket is keyed all be it easy to sheer if changing the oil seal and you don't know what your doing.

Does it run rough/down on power?
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terry paget

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #12 on: 13 May 2015, 18:14:53 »
Car ran well on way back from Plymouth, that's why I am worried. Cam belt was changed 11 Oct 2005 41632 by C D Bramall, Gilston Road, Saltash, Cornwall. There is no service record of change of oil pump or crankshaft oil seal. I am presently cleaning breathers and changing cam cover gaskets. Cam belt is still on so will check timing mark with pencil in no. 1 cylinder - is that front cylinder driver's side?
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #13 on: 13 May 2015, 18:16:08 »
Yep, front drivers side.  :y
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terry paget

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Re: Cam timing wrong?
« Reply #14 on: 13 May 2015, 19:55:06 »
Just checked. No. 1 is at top of stroke when the line on the botton pulley points straight down, in line with the nick in the rear timing cover.
So I conclude the bottom pulley is correctly located on its Woodruff key, and the cams are about 30 degrees ahead of correct timing. I have no reason to believe the camshaft pulley has been disturbed, so the cam belt fitted in 2005 was fitted incorrectly.

Recently the car has had several 'full' services, which changed oil, filters, plugs, tyres and brake pads. What they did not do is change the cam belt, clean the breathers and change the cam cover gaskets. It has clearly suffered misfiring, not surprising with the plugs immersed in oil, but they just changed the plugs, the lambda sensors and the right hand coil stick.

They must have noticed the oil when they changed the plugs, but did nothing about it.

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