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[Andy B]

....
How on earth do you plan to time the cams independently and correctly without the correct tool?

Change the belt without the correct locking kit at your peril

You're not going to be that far off, but as you're trying to line up marks at the back of the belt casing it'd be a bit hit or miss 

[Lazydocker]

....
How on earth do you plan to time the cams independently and correctly without the correct tool?

Change the belt without the correct locking kit at your peril

You're not going to be that far off, but as you're trying to line up marks at the back of the belt casing it'd be a bit hit or miss 

Didn't mean damage wise but having had a car with a bank of cams timed about half a tooth out I could feel the difference

[feeutfo]

its possible to "change the belt" with pulleys and tensioner, without a cam locking kit, of course it is, and in my pre forum days i thought that was good enough, with the asvice on here though next time i changed the cam belt kit i used a full
locking kit!

Let me assure you, as others will say and have already said, IT IS NOT POSSIBLE TO SET THE CAM TIMING ACCURATELY without a locking kit, this includes a crank locking tool, two cam locking tools machined to fit the cam wheel teeth perfctly, and a timing gauge to set the cam wheel marks to a fraction of a millimeter.

This is not possible when working to the marks on the rear timing cover. Not a hope.

[tidla]

cams locked with the tools. spring loading of the valve springs .. cam timing going nowhere. without the cam tools 2.0, difficult. v6 near on impossible. no spring loading on the crank once in the correct position. other motors dont have crank locking tools unless keyless..(reno/small ford)
admitted, having a tool to make sure it dont move is nice, but not essential. as long as you check everything in line after a few hand turns of the crank, job done.

timing tools are expensive, buying all the tools because they are reqd says the manufacturer, 

[JamesV6CDX]

cams locked with the tools. spring loading of the valve springs .. cam timing going nowhere. without the cam tools 2.0, difficult. v6 near on impossible. no spring loading on the crank once in the correct position. other motors dont have crank locking tools unless keyless..(reno/small ford)
admitted, having a tool to make sure it dont move is nice, but not essential. as long as you check everything in line after a few hand turns of the crank, job done.

timing tools are expensive, buying all the tools because they are reqd says the manufacturer, 

You are missing the point. The idlers are not simply idlers. They are concentric rollers, which (a) adjust cams 3 and 4 with crank position, and b) adjust cams 1 and 2 to the other bank.

You cannot do it without the correct kit 

[tidla]

didnt say it would be quicker,keep an eye on the big spanner.the start of the thread was cheap priced tooling.
as someone said it can be done, accurately in my opinion with a bit more time.if money wasnt an problem,gm all do it.

[feeutfo]

didnt say it would be quicker,keep an eye on the big spanner.the start of the thread was cheap priced tooling.
as someone said it can be done, accurately in my opinion with a bit more time.if money wasnt an problem,gm all do it.

Botrow a kit from here, or hire one from autovaux for £15 odd, then come back and tell us your opinion. Had a similar view to yours..........once!
 

[tidla]

ok

[tomoco]

Got one of those laser kits about 6 months ago from someone on here, looks pretty sturdy. paid £50 for it. Dont need it for another 15K. to be honest i may never use it because a few members on here will fit a timing belt kit for a reasonable price inc all parts. Got to know a few good grease monkeys on here,all do excellent jobs at great prices

[Lazydocker]

ok

You obviously know better than the rest of us... Don't complain if you change your belt without the kit and find the car a little down on power