Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Varche]

Calling plumbing experts or professionals.!

We have a project on to make two bedrooms and a bathroom out of one upstairs space. Several years ago we put in grey capped 11cm waste pipe flush within the existing old floor. That vertical pipe is virtually impossible to move as it goes between two big wooden beams in an enclosed constructed space.  In an ideal world we would like to have the down exit toilet pan type (not bought yet) up to 30 cm back. That would make the room bigger and the internal walls easier to construct.

I know you can buy 4 cm offset pan connectors but need a bit more. Screwfix sell a Floplast SP106 flexible connector 16cm to 30cm.that lloks good.

Now the variables. The new reinforced floor will be a finished thickness of 8 and a half centimetres. I could get an internal pipe cutter inside the grey toilet waste pipe in the floor and cut off say a half of the female fitting to give more leeway


I can think of two possible solutions.

1. use the Floplast type flexi connector on a horizontal outlet pipe and 180 degree back on itself and then 90 degrees down into floor under the pan. Part of the run from the 180 bend could be within the new 8 cm thick floor. I guess that would work so long as the toilet pan had a void for the remaining part of the exposed flexible pipe.   

2. Try and use same Floplast flexi connector with a vertical outlet toilet pan.

I haven't got a spare toilet to hand to have a look at free space underneath and I suspect that I might need a longer than 30 cm flexi fitting but what do you think please? Any other fittings or stuff available?

 

[Viral_Jim]

Hi Varche,

Someone may pop up in a minute with a solution but personally I'm having trouble visualising exactly what you mean. Could you take a quick snap?

Do I have it right that you basically have a soil pipe coming up through the floor but what you want to achieve is to have the pan set as far back as possible - effectively right on top of the soil pipe?

If so, would there be scope to site the toilet to the side of the pipe (but still set well back) so that your soil ipie could come out of the back of the toilet (horizontal) turn left (or right) 90 degrees into the floor.

Other than that, there are some fittings you can buy that are designed to join plastic soil pipe to the old clay stuff which are basically a big rubber boot and 2 jubilee clips, maybe that would give to enough flex to do what you need?

[Varche]

Photo, good idea.


Ignore all the 40 mm grey pipes and the two 15mm white water feed pipes.

Toilet grey waste is the 11cm one in the hole in the floor. Next to that is a floor tile resting on a black object to represent new finished floor level.

Wall behind toilet is represented by the green box at 21 cm ( that would work with current waste pipe location) brown cardboard represents where we would like to build the wall.


That photo just shows the whole area

[Andy H]

Do you enjoy unblocking toilets?

Turds don't like to change direction. If you apply any of the solutions described then you had better make the pipework easy to dismantle because you will need to take it apart on a regular basis to unblock it 

[05omegav6]

Turn the toilet 90 degrees left and fit a suitably sized box cupboard behind the cistern...

As you look at it so the toilet sits parallel to the green box with a cupboard into the corner across the back of it... Handy loo roll/towel storage so not wasted space... And toilet gets a nice easy 90 degree waste straight down the soil pipe...

 

[Marks DTM Calib]

Shit in the cardboard box instead?

Any opportunity to chisel out some of the concrete around the soil pipe and add a couple of 45 degree bend to shift the outlet back significantly?

Oh those flexi joints are a bit of a mare!

[Viral_Jim]

Given all the space you have, could you not move the wall nearer to the soil pipe? Such that the vertical pipe is sitting at the base of the wall, then you could just come out the back of the toilet (at horizontal) and turn 90 degrees down into the existing pipe.

In terms of a fitment to get directly onto the existing pipe, I think you may struggle. What's the existing floor made of? The reason I ask is could you not cut the top (say) 3" off the vertical pipe. Add 2 standard 90 degree bends on to take the soil pipe back to the wall while sitting them partly in the thickness of the existing floor.


Like this....



Sorry for my sub pre-school esque drawing technique.

[Varche]

Mrs V is overjoyed. Your diagram Jimmy is exactly her solution. She even has a drawing from yesterday to prove it.

I am off to do some electrical work. I have shown her the SDS drill and tools including hand files to enlarge the floor opening.

I am glad the flexi pipes don't come recommended.

(can't turn the toilet round but good lateral thinking)

[Marks DTM Calib]

Just remember you need to maintain a fall of at least 18mm per metre and more ideally 25mm for a soil pipe (ideally even more if its a low water flush)

[aaronjb]

I think with the pipe that shape you'll have made a nice poo-shelf for everything to collect on and back up, no?

[Marks DTM Calib]

I think with the pipe that shape you'll have made a nice poo-shelf for everything to collect on and back up, no?

Depends on the fall, the water should have a reasonable amount of inertia and be able to carry said deposit over a shortish distance, interestingly, get to steep (up to a point) and you get issues as the water travels to fast and leaves King Kongs finger behind!

[Viral_Jim]

I have this setup in our house at the moment, for a toilet on the 2nd floor. Only difference is the distance between the first 90 deg bend and the second is about 7ft. It took some time to get the right fall as per the reg's - I went near to the max recommended but not beyond it (90mm/m iirc) in order to keep momentum but without leaving anything behind. In the end I lowered the ceiling in the room below by about 75mm - fortunately in our place that means the ceiling is "only" now 2.6m in height. So far its been in 9 months with no issue.

Not sure what a building inspector would make of it - but not really bothered either as long as it works 

Then again, we also have a macerator toilet installed in our place (the horror!) which, if you believe the internet means our house will be entirely consumed by effluent any day now

Admittedly, looking at it again, the drawing I did shows a slight upward slope on the section between the 2 bends - something I would NOT recommend!

[Varche]

Well yesterday Mrs V tracked down the Jimten S 495 , Sounds like a model of a car!

Here is the beast.     http://www.jimten.com/es/producto/673/manguito-inodoro-excentrico-vertical/   We now have one on order.

We then had a good look at the underside of some toilets in a shop and concluded we have some piggling away of the area to do in order to fit it. Should work tho as it is designed for a vertical outlet toilet (quite common in Spain).

[Viral_Jim]

Excellent, top find that! 

Do you cast them into a concrete floor? I'm guessing at least they would need support from underneath as otherwise the first flush is likely to blow it off  .

The ones I've seen in the uk (admittedly not offset - didnt know you could get them) have a rubber pipe end with big jubilee clip rather than the flared end and rubber seal of the one you've found.

Just out of interest (gosh I'm a sad ba$tard when it comes to DIY), does your system have a separate vent pipe somewhere?

[Varche]

Well we would cast it into the floor. I might also screw a thick piece of wood to the floor with a cut out for the Jimten S 6000GTi so that the toilet pan can be secured. The concrete will be liable to be friable near its edge.

We have spent time this afternoon shifting the as yet unbuilt walls around and have gained a bit of space on the other internal wall. Might get away with a 10 cm offset.

Separate vent? Only down in the septic tank.