Omega Owners Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Please play nicely.  No one wants to listen/read a keyboard warriors rants....

Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5]  All   Go Down

Author Topic: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!  (Read 4132 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Kevin Wood

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Alton, Hampshire
  • Posts: 36285
    • Jaguar XE 25t, Westfield
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #60 on: 15 August 2008, 21:59:40 »

Maybe you were not smart enough.

I reckon you should do your next spanner wielding session in your new attire rather than overalls, James. See if that changes his tune.. ;D

Kevin
Logged
Tech2 services currently available. See TheBoy's price list: http://theboy.omegaowners.com/

JamesV6CDX

  • Omega Queen
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Gloucestershire/Buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 16550
    • Omega 3.2 Retail MV6 LPG
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #61 on: 15 August 2008, 22:02:53 »

Quote
Maybe you were not smart enough.

I reckon you should do your next spanner wielding session in your new attire rather than overalls, James. See if that changes his tune.. ;D

Kevin

;D ;D


Logged

Big Fra

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Motherwell
  • Posts: 1227
  • I will ride with miggy pride once again!
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #62 on: 15 August 2008, 22:44:43 »

New attire?

You are not doing strip-o-grams now are you?

 ;D :y
Logged

maria

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Female
  • Derbyshire
  • Posts: 3869
  • I'm proud to be welsh :)
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #63 on: 15 August 2008, 22:47:41 »

Quote
New attire?

You are not doing strip-o-grams now are you?

 ;D :y



I hope he dont or he wouldn't get no work done ::)
Logged

FRE07962128

  • Guest
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #64 on: 16 August 2008, 05:43:09 »

Quote
Quote
This is an emergency repair now, and I am sure that a law enacted in 1847, before the advent of the combustion engine, could not be "reasonable" as classed by the lawyers and therefore cannot be enforced in 2008. :o :o :o  

I am sure common sense must prevail, and what makes Maria's neighboughs house sepecial?  This act must still cover all / most of GB if it really hasn't been superceeded by later Acts regarding Motor propelled vehicles, and would result in no motorist being able to maintain their motor vehicle outside their own house.  That is frankly abursed and totally unreasonable so surely cannot be enforced. :-/ :-/

In addition James are you sure this would still fall within Criminal Law and not Civil Law in 2008? :-/ :-/
Sorry Lizzie, but if there is an Act of Parliament that makes it a crime then it is dealt with by the criminal system. Even a stupid 1847 law like this. The police will only respond to contravention of criminal law.

If your deeds say you can't repair cars on your property (many do) then that would be dealt with by civil law. Police can be involved in civil action, but they usually only go along to keep the peace.

Common law allows people to get redress for actions that aren't covered by the above. People who claim damages for an accident negligently caused do so under common law.

Tort law is the law that would allow James to sue for damage of reputation if his neighbour said something out of order in front of a witness (slander) or wrote and published the same (libel).

Tort law is the one that our admins/mods have to be very careful with, because they can be held responsible for libel posted by any member.

Unfortunately, virtually none of it is based on common sense.  

Sorry if this is patronising, but I thought an explanation would help.  :y



Just caught up with this thread Bandit, and yes thanks for the in-depth explanation! :y  The one point I would make is that deeds can stipulate vaious limitations such as no caravans being parked on the drive; no errection of roof top aerials or satelite dishes; no front garden fences etc., but once the developer has ceased to have an active interest in the property, those restrictions are frequently ignored and would, in my experience of such situations, be difficult to challenge in a civil court.  (Yes, and I do know the difference between criminal and civil law) :y

Back to the main point;

I have been studying the Town Police Clauses Act 1847
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts1847/pdf/ukpga_18470089_en.pdf

, and in particular Clause XXVIII that James first referred to.

As I originally stated this particular clause relates to horses, carts and carriages, being written well before the internal combustion motor vehicle was thought of, so I still fail to see how it can be related to in a court of law in 2008 in the context of such vehicles.  It may be that the law has not been rescinded / abolished, but it can be clearly argued when you read the full extract of the clause that it refers to horse driven vehicles only and can only be applied to that degree.

The Collins English Dictionary & Thesaurus (2006) Glasgow: HarperCollins Publishers  defines "carriage" as:

1. A railway coach for passengers;   2. The manner in which a person holds and moves his head and body;   3. A  four-wheeled horse-drawn vehicle for persons

This then instinctively would be the first line of defence over any suggestion that the 1847 Act can possibly relate to a 2008 motor "vehicle", which indeed has very obviously no mention in the aforestated Act.

As a matter of interest there are many laws, such as not riding a bicycle on a pavement, or riding it at night without lights, or using an old ex-police car with exposed lights and markings still in place, which I have personally witnessed being ignored by the average police constable who has many more pressing matters (and paperwork!) to deal with on the streets in 2008 than an archaic law that dates from 1847 and relates clearly to horse drawn vehicles. ;)  

Obviously if a member of the public makes a complaint, then the Police are duty bound to investigate. However, as already stated this particular Act has no direct bearing on motor vehicles, and it is unlikely to overcoming the hurdle of the CPS, who frequently decide not to prosecute when the the legal facts are of greater clarity, due often to "not being in the public interest".   With hundreds of thousands regularly working on their cars in the street, along with the clear meaning of the 1847 Act, I am sure this would be their response. 8-) 8-)  British Law works in anycase on "precedent", combined with "reasonableness" and I feel sure these would also be significant factors in any decision process, especially if no prosecutions exist, even perhaps for horse-drawn carriage repair since the advent of the motor vehicle, then there would be no case to answer. 8-)  
« Last Edit: 16 August 2008, 07:05:08 by FRE07962128 »
Logged

JamesV6CDX

  • Omega Queen
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Gloucestershire/Buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 16550
    • Omega 3.2 Retail MV6 LPG
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #65 on: 16 August 2008, 11:23:40 »

Well it's all back together and I've escaped custody so far  :D

It'll just be my luck to get knobbled taking the battery off to charge it, but that is undisputably an emergency repair! (I'm not calling out the AA for a flat battery, whether I'm away from home or not...!)
Logged

Andy B

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Bury Lancs
  • Posts: 39504
    • ML350 TDM SmartRoadster
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #66 on: 31 August 2008, 16:38:22 »

In this months Practical Classics



there's a question that could've been written by you JamesV6CDX. You're not breaking the law mate and you can tell the cantakerous old f4rt where to go ....  ;D
Quote
[size=16]Q[/size] My car's head gasket has blown. I've got the tools, the parts and the skills to do the job. The only thing I haven't igot is a driveway to do it on. Can I work in the street where I park my car without getting grief from my fight-prone neighbours?
[size=16]A[/size] The law is on your side. The Clean Neighbourhoods and Environment Act of 2005 allows you to work on a vehicle at the side of the road as long as you're not doing the work for 'gain or reward'. It's also good to know that you can't be penalised for working on a genuine breakdown where 'repairs on the spot or elsewhere on the road are necessary' even if someone starts complaining. Breakdown repairs have to be completed within 72 hours of the initial fault or within a pre-arranged time frame agreed with the loacl authority.
« Last Edit: 31 August 2008, 16:39:34 by Andy_B »
Logged

amigov6

  • Guest
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #67 on: 31 August 2008, 16:49:13 »

I've heard of laws regarding working on vehicles on a public highway, but given the Practical Classics post, who knows?
   The plot thickens.....
  
Logged

Andy B

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Bury Lancs
  • Posts: 39504
    • ML350 TDM SmartRoadster
    • View Profile
Re: The silly old git was right.I AM breaking the law!
« Reply #68 on: 31 August 2008, 16:57:58 »

Quote
I've heard of laws regarding working on vehicles on a public highway, but given the Practical Classics post, who knows?
   The plot thickens.....
  

PC's answer is somewhat simplified.
4 Repairing vehicles on a road (1) A person who carries out restricted works on a motor vehicle on a road is guilty of an offence, subject as follows.
(2) For the purposes of this section “restricted works” means—
(a) works for the repair, maintenance, servicing, improvement or dismantling of a motor vehicle or of any part of or accessory to a motor vehicle;
(b) works for the installation, replacement or renewal of any such part or accessory.
(3) A person is not to be convicted of an offence under this section in relation to any works if he proves to the satisfaction of the court that the works were not carried out—
(a) in the course of, or for the purposes of, a business of carrying out restricted works; or
(b) for gain or reward.
(4) Subsection (3) does not apply where the carrying out of the works gave reasonable cause for annoyance to persons in the vicinity.
(5) A person is also not to be convicted of an offence under this section in relation to any works if he proves to the satisfaction of the court that the works carried out were works of repair which—
(a) arose from an accident or breakdown in circumstances where repairs on the spot or elsewhere on the road were necessary; and
(b) were carried out within 72 hours of the accident or breakdown or were within that period authorised to be carried out at a later time by the local authority for the area.
(6) A person guilty of an offence under this section is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 4 on the standard scale.
(7) In this section—
“motor vehicle” has the same meaning as in the Refuse Disposal (Amenity) Act 1978;
“road” has the same meaning as in the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984;
“local authority” has the meaning given in section


http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2005/ukpga_20050016_en_3#pt2-pb1-l1g4
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 [5]  All   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.017 seconds with 17 queries.