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[Nickbat]

these idiots at the EU cant even explain where the millions have gone from their accounts over the years, so much for security in their own ranks let alone the whole of europe, the sooner we get out the better if you ask me

Spot on, Alf. They haven't been able to find anyone to sign off their accounts for 17 years! 

[crazyjoetavola]

Britain will 'obviously' join euro says Mandelson.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/5506385/Britain-will-obviously-join-euro-says-Mandelson.html

Who elected that sleazebag? 

Oh yes, no one.

... Nick! how dare you refer to our beloved Prime Minister in those cruel terms

[crazyjoetavola]

ok..time to be serious..

actually EU is not for the masses to transport freely ..

and neither its for the workers rights..

just to expand the lands of cheap labour..

while we are discussing here pages of reasons about BNP..

True, but it's probably all part of this New World Order thing they whisper about. :-/

..........it's not exactly being whispered about now, Nick.......

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B5JHSTOrdU[/media]

[Nickbat]

Britain will 'obviously' join euro says Mandelson.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/5506385/Britain-will-obviously-join-euro-says-Mandelson.html

Who elected that sleazebag? 

Oh yes, no one.

... Nick! how dare you refer to our beloved Prime Minister in those cruel terms

Yes, you're right, Zulu.

I must show due deference. Allow me to change the the reference to Lord Sleazebag. 

[crazyjoetavola]

Britain will 'obviously' join euro says Mandelson.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/5506385/Britain-will-obviously-join-euro-says-Mandelson.html

Who elected that sleazebag? 

Oh yes, no one.

... Nick! how dare you refer to our beloved Prime Minister in those cruel terms

Yes, you're right, Zulu.

I must show due deference. Allow me to change the the reference to Lord Sleazebag. 

....please feel free to do so Nick - it doesn't make the bitter pill any easier to take however - what a corruption of the honours system - done in such a bare-faced way - incredible - don't they ever think that people will see throught this nonsense? - could go on and on and on [size=9]and on and on........[/size]

[Nickbat]

ok..time to be serious..

actually EU is not for the masses to transport freely ..

and neither its for the workers rights..

just to expand the lands of cheap labour..

while we are discussing here pages of reasons about BNP..

True, but it's probably all part of this New World Order thing they whisper about. :-/

..........it's not exactly being whispered about now, Nick.......

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B5JHSTOrdU[/media]

I wanted to get some sleep tonight!  That's scary stuff. Bilderburg, Club of Rome etc, etc.  :-/

Let's start a secret society for normal people. 

[crazyjoetavola]

.........please sign me up immediately - thank you   - for the normal society I would hasten to add

[Nickbat]

Britain will 'obviously' join euro says Mandelson.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/5506385/Britain-will-obviously-join-euro-says-Mandelson.html

Who elected that sleazebag? 

Oh yes, no one.

... Nick! how dare you refer to our beloved Prime Minister in those cruel terms

Yes, you're right, Zulu.

I must show due deference. Allow me to change the the reference to Lord Sleazebag. 

....please feel free to do so Nick - it doesn't make the bitter pill any easier to take however - what a corruption of the honours system - done in such a bare-faced way - incredible - don't they ever think that people will see throught this nonsense? - could go on and on and on [size=9]and on and on........[/size]

Do you know what? With all that's gone on here over the last week or so, I am happier with those who discuss support for extremist parties rather than those who say they know nothing about politics and find it "boring", for it is the latter's refusal to get involved that will allow all this to continue to the eventual end-game.   

[Nickbat]

To put my last comment more succinctly, extremism is a symptom, but apathy is the disease.

Reckon I'll get into the Oxford Dictionary of Quotations with that one?   

[crazyjoetavola]

Correct Nick, apathy is the most dangerous condition with which people allow themselves to be afflicted.

Whilst there have been many opinions expressed in the various threads covering the BNP, EU and so on, the encouraging thing is, that those opinions have merit -  in that those expressing them at least took the trouble to do so.  That is always a good thing.

I think this forum has shown its worth over and above that for which it primarily exists.  The standard of debate has been pleasing to say the least.

Long may that be so

[Nickbat]

Correct Nick, apathy is the most dangerous condition with which people allow themselves to be afflicted.

Whilst there have been many opinions expressed in the various threads covering the BNP, EU and so on, the encouraging thing is, that those opinions have merit -  in that those expressing them at least took the trouble to do so.  That is always a good thing.

I think this forum has shown its worth over and above that for which it primarily exists.  The standard of debate has been pleasing to say the least.

Long may that be so

Agreed! 

[Varche]

At the risk of sounding like a staunch supporter of the EU (which I am not) all this is just sound bites.Like the current justified railing at a few thousand pounds erroneously claimed by politicians whilst ignoring the BILLIONS being spent (open chequebook) on Trident - as a deterrent against who?! The truth is the average person can only comprehend small figures. What is a Trillion anyway!

It would be nice for someone to publish or show on TV the household accounts for the EU. Will we get it, No. Info does exist even if they cannot get the auditors to "sign it off". How can people say they don't agree with something if they don't know the facts just a few "headline grabbing bites"?

As for trotting out the fishing industry. Makes my blood boil. UK didn't support its fishing industry, Spain among others did. Some UK fishermen sold their licences to the highest bidders (Spanish). The Spanish have super effecient state of the art fish dredgers and pay good money for their beloved fish. The villains of the piece? Not the fishermen,not the Spanish but the beauracrats administering quotas and governments of yesteryear for not supporting the fishing industry.

Next you will be wanting to pull Scotland, NI and Wales out of Breat Britain! And the South out of England.

varche

[Nickbat]

At the risk of sounding like a staunch supporter of the EU (which I am not) all this is just sound bites.Like the current justified railing at a few thousand pounds erroneously claimed by politicians whilst ignoring the BILLIONS being spent (open chequebook) on Trident - as a deterrent against who?! The truth is the average person can only comprehend small figures. What is a Trillion anyway!

It would be nice for someone to publish or show on TV the household accounts for the EU. Will we get it, No. Info does exist even if they cannot get the auditors to "sign it off". How can people say they don't agree with something if they don't know the facts just a few "headline grabbing bites"?

As for trotting out the fishing industry. Makes my blood boil. UK didn't support its fishing industry, Spain among others did. Some UK fishermen sold their licences to the highest bidders (Spanish). The Spanish have super effecient state of the art fish dredgers and pay good money for their beloved fish. The villains of the piece? Not the fishermen,not the Spanish but the beauracrats administering quotas and governments of yesteryear for not supporting the fishing industry.

Next you will be wanting to pull Scotland, NI and Wales out of Breat Britain! And the South out of England.

varche

Speaking at a conference of fishermen, scientists and conservationists at a summit in Edinburgh, Richard Lochhead, the Scottish environment minister, said £40 million of fish is thrown away every year.

He said: "Discards are bad news. Bad news for fishermen, bad news for consumers and bad news for the environment.

"I am appalled and frustrated at the scandalous level of waste and the economic and environmental madness discards represent. In what other industry would it be acceptable to throw away so much of what is produced?

"Responsible and hard-working skippers are heartbroken because they have to throw away precious fish. That is why they, like me, are determined to tackle the scourge of discards.

"The scale of the problem beggars belief. Crazy European regulations mean that at a time of worldwide food shortages and higher food prices at home, our fishermen are having to throw away up to £40 million worth of fish for which there is a perfectly good market."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/earthnews/3352389/Call-to-end-crazy-EU-regulations-on-fishing-catch-quotas.html

Never mind about going back decades to previous UK policies on fishing. I'm not saying they were right, but any system that allows this sort of waste is criminal. Yes, in my eyes it is criminal to be forced to throw so much fish back into the sea.

[Varche]

I am surprised it is only £40million pounds worth of fish a year. It is criminal. BUT

Still small potatoes compared to the big picture. How much does YOUR local council pay out of your community charge to the EU? How much do developing countries in the EU receive to improve roads or infrastructure? You cannot fail to see the signs everywhere in Spain saying "this built with EU money" I bet the eastern part of the EU will be awash with infrastructure improvement money soon.

What is the net benefit to Britain in terms of trade and incomings and outgoings.?

[Nickbat]

I am surprised it is only £40million pounds worth of fish a year. It is criminal. BUT

Still small potatoes compared to the big picture. How much does YOUR local council pay out of your community charge to the EU? How much do developing countries in the EU receive to improve roads or infrastructure? You cannot fail to see the signs everywhere in Spain saying "this built with EU money" I bet the eastern part of the EU will be awash with infrastructure improvement money soon.

What is the net benefit to Britain in terms of trade and incomings and outgoings.?

I don't know, is the short answer. 

However, this makes for interesting reading:

"The European Union costs us £65 billion gross every year.

That's about £1,000 each every year for every man, woman and child in the UK. And it increases every year."

and there's more here:

http://www.democracymovementsurrey.co.uk/dyk_eucosts.htm