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[Marks DTM Calib]

Update:

Just had breathers and throttle body to bits.

Breather pipe wringing, intake saturated with oil.  On opening filler, there is oil lying there.

Also-the new oil (300 miles ago) is now black as tar

Eeek?

What to do?

Clean it all up and get it breathing right then do a few short oil changes

[cruisetopoland]

Update:

Just had breathers and throttle body to bits.

Breather pipe wringing, intake saturated with oil.  On opening filler, there is oil lying there.

Also-the new oil (300 miles ago) is now black as tar

Eeek?

What to do?

Clean it all up and get it breathing right then do a few short oil changes

Cheers Mark

I have accessed a few sites for this particular engine and they say that under harsh load, they have a tendency to send oil down the breather-in their home country a breather catch tank is regularly fitted to stop the issue.

Is there a particular reason or fault in mine (27k miles) to send so much oil?
Should that be investigated before cleaning up and fitting a £30 catch tank?

Which to fit-the top filter on non-filter type?

I think as long as there is no serious issue in the engine itself that is causing this oil in the breather pipe, that this will sort it.

Comments, anyone? 

[Kevin Wood]

If you haven't had to modify the breathers on previous cars it begs the question why you should on this one.

Yes, there might be a greater tendency for them to block if they are passing oil and the oil is dirty. If that has persisted to allow the crankcase to get manky it might have affected piston ring seal.

I would follow Mark's advice. Clear the breathers, run a few oil changes through it and see if that is helping.

Kevin

[Marks DTM Calib]

Update:

Just had breathers and throttle body to bits.

Breather pipe wringing, intake saturated with oil.  On opening filler, there is oil lying there.

Also-the new oil (300 miles ago) is now black as tar

Eeek?

What to do?

Clean it all up and get it breathing right then do a few short oil changes

Cheers Mark

I have accessed a few sites for this particular engine and they say that under harsh load, they have a tendency to send oil down the breather-in their home country a breather catch tank is regularly fitted to stop the issue.

Is there a particular reason or fault in mine (27k miles) to send so much oil?
Should that be investigated before cleaning up and fitting a £30 catch tank?

Which to fit-the top filter on non-filter type?

I think as long as there is no serious issue in the engine itself that is causing this oil in the breather pipe, that this will sort it.

Comments, anyone? 

Past more general experience sudgests that a major cause of oil the inlet via the breatehrs is either:

1) Poor servicing resulting in a clogged air filter.

2) Large amounts of blow by gases.

We knwo they are not a particularly robust unit with respect to wear but, the mileage is low. Given what you describe of the oil, it could well be a very clogged air filter.

[cruisetopoland]

Oil and air filters are new 

[Marks DTM Calib]

Oil and air filters are new 

Is it still doing it?

[cruisetopoland]

Oil and air filters are new 

Is it still doing it?

Yes....

Took it to my tame kit car building client earlier, who took breather, throttle body, and all associated bits off and blew them through.  Hole into air intake tiny, seemed like mis-manufacture, enlarged this and also blew clear a pipe off the throttle body.

We checked the oil and....it has disappeared...

Put it all together, gave it a good few revs....palls of blue smoke.

You were right (as usual!)-it looks like rings or valve seals have gone 

Damn, damn, damn.  Only bought this as a stop-gap after selling my 2007 car for a great price.  Looks like the repairs will be £££££££££.

My fault-bought it on trust, trade sale after having three high milers with the same engine with no issues whatsoever-one had over 100k and ran like new.  Daft thing is, like the Omega, I have done loads of other time consuming jobs to perfect it and make it look new.

What now?   

[Marks DTM Calib]

It sadly wont be the valve seals....a quick compression test would be worth while

[cruisetopoland]

It sadly wont be the valve seals....a quick compression test would be worth while

Will do, cheers 

[cruisetopoland]

Right; sorted-man of action!!  Has got progressively worse and engine has had professional assessment as being "beyond economical repair".

Found engine/box out of rear end shunted 2006 car with 12k miles on it on ebay today, very helpful Poles selling it are doing 200 miles round trip to do the engine change in my mate's garage on Saturday for £400 all in.

This is great news as cambelt was due on my 2003 engine, costing about £100 and is not due on this newer engine, plus the decent gearbox being taken out of my own car should fetch £100-odd on ebay, and whatever I can get for the manky engine; scrap??  Plus I can go to work on Saturday and have no fuel/faffing time costs; and clean hands 

So total cost to me will be less than £200 net if all goes well (!!) and I did buy the car cheaply enough in the first place.  It is a lovely little thing; odd, but sweet and we both like it-will be glad to be able to keep it. 

Hopefully this will be the end of the woeful tale  :-?

Thanks for all the help on a non-Omega topic 

[cruisetopoland]

Further to above if any experts still awake....!

Bought the car, huge oily mess of an engine, took into garage, said mess was from kinked oil filter seal, replaced oil and filter (recommended 5w30 semi-synth), cleaned off, mess not come back.

Running a bit less lively than the last three with same motor, so pondered on what to do, added 400ml Comma concentrated Petrol Magic fuel additive in 30l of "EvoX" type petrol-said use all of it in a tank of fuel.

Caned the living jerusalem out of it for 150 miles, still a bit slow, got smokier.  Filled up with same posh fuel.

Went to kit car mate who removed air intakes, throttle bodies, breather pipe, vacuum pipes-chock full of mid-brown gunge/oil, cleaned out, re-assembled.  Revved it to hell, loads of blue and black smoke.  Oil down to min from full on oil change 2 days ago-put in 10x40 fully synth as was only thing we had.

Smoke got worse, took it to garage, said rings gone, another 100 miles, another min-max top-up with oil-this time 10w40 semi-synth.

This morning started it and revved gently to take a look-lost the car in a world of acrid white smoke with rings and a few puffs of blue/black, took it easy today for 80 miles including some steep hills.  Much less smoke than yesterday, running better.  Checked oil when cooled down-same as this morning-none used.

Tonight after going cold for 6 hours; started instantly, no smoke, warmed it up, thrashed the living hell out of it for 30 miles; idles perfectly, starts perfectly, pulls cleanly but some brown smoke on hard revving at standstill.  Breather still clean after 200-odd miles, but does breath out noticeably under power; very slightly smoky-normal?  Exhaust smells normal, eggyness completely gone; if anything a bit rich.  Marginally better performance when cold than hot, but drives 100% with no hiccups or loss of power.  Minimal fuel use, sounds fine at tickover, slight rattle on very harsh tickover to rev limiter while standing-as has been on the other three.

I'm thinking that this may be a temporary issue as diddled around by OAP for 7 years and 27k miles; the whole 400ml concentrated fuel additive was a bit overkill in 30l especially with 97 detergent fuel; this has dislodged a world of crap that has been burnt, hence the smoke.  No water in oil/oil in water.

Questions:
Is the breather supposed to noticeably push out a fair quantity of slightly smoky air, when red hot and revved out at standstilll?

Why was this full of old oil and crap?

Were my MAF/throttle bodies damaged by all the former oil and crap, hence the rich running/brown smoke?

Is oil use and blue smoke while using detergent/cleaner normal? (bear in mind 400ml in 30l of strong fuel)

Have the different types of oil affected it?


I think I will postpone engine change and run it for another week and monitor it  :-/  but any comments much appreciated 

[Kevin Wood]

Is the breather supposed to noticeably push out a fair quantity of slightly smoky air, when red hot and revved out at standstilll?

Probably just steam from moisture by products of combustion boiling off or a little blowby. See how it goes.

Why was this full of old oil and crap?

Neglected oil changes and too much "miss daisy" causes dirty oil. Dirt is splashed into breather with fumes, some sticks, breather blocks, even more crud forms in engine as there is now no way out.

Was my MAF/throttle bodies damaged by all the former oil and crap, hence the rich running/brown smoke

Don't know. Normally MAF is well upstream of any breathers for this very reason.

Is oil use and blue smoke while using detergent/cleaner normal? (bear in mind 300m in 30l)

I think either it was so cruddy that the piston rings were previously sticking or additives have dislodged a lot of crud in one go and this made matters worse for a while. A good spanking creates pressure to push the piston rings against the cylinder bores and bed them back in, so matters then improve.

Have the different types of oil affected it?

No. you're only talking about a relatively small change in viscosity IMHO. It wouldn't make a drastic difference to oil consumption / smoke on a worn engine.

I would say keep it for now. Run it, keeping an eye on the oil condition, level and breathers. If oil gets black, change it for some cheap mineral oil, and repeat until oil stays clean. If breathers show signs of blocking, clean them out. See how it goes.

If the consumption and smoke have got better it's because there was only a temporary issue, IMHO. Engines can temporarily show symptoms of being knackered but unlikely to show temporary symptoms of being fixed when actually badly worn (unless they have just run out of oil, in which case very temporary!).

Kevin

Kevin

[cruisetopoland]

Is the breather supposed to noticeably push out a fair quantity of slightly smoky air, when red hot and revved out at standstilll?

Probably just steam from moisture by products of combustion boiling off or a little blowby. See how it goes.

Why was this full of old oil and crap?

Neglected oil changes and too much "miss daisy" causes dirty oil. Dirt is splashed into breather with fumes, some sticks, breather blocks, even more crud forms in engine as there is now no way out.

Was my MAF/throttle bodies damaged by all the former oil and crap, hence the rich running/brown smoke

Don't know. Normally MAF is well upstream of any breathers for this very reason.

Is oil use and blue smoke while using detergent/cleaner normal? (bear in mind 300m in 30l)

I think either it was so cruddy that the piston rings were previously sticking or additives have dislodged a lot of crud in one go and this made matters worse for a while. A good spanking creates pressure to push the piston rings against the cylinder bores and bed them back in, so matters then improve.

Have the different types of oil affected it?

No. you're only talking about a relatively small change in viscosity IMHO. It wouldn't make a drastic difference to oil consumption / smoke on a worn engine.

I would say keep it for now. Run it, keeping an eye on the oil condition, level and breathers. If oil gets black, change it for some cheap mineral oil, and repeat until oil stays clean. If breathers show signs of blocking, clean them out. See how it goes.

If the consumption and smoke have got better it's because there was only a temporary issue, IMHO. Engines can temporarily show symptoms of being knackered but unlikely to show temporary symptoms of being fixed when actually badly worn (unless they have just run out of oil, in which case very temporary!).

Kevin

Kevin

Cheers Kevin-that's really helpful 

I'm starting to believe it may right itself once the treated fuel is completely used up and normal fuel used until the crap has been burnt off.  Breathers now look clean and tidy, oil has been topped up and each time got cleaner; ie not blackened each time.  Now seems to not burn any oil, just a bit of brown smoke when revved hard at standstill.

It would be a mega result if this was the case; could do without spending £400++

[Marks DTM Calib]

Yep, sounds like you may have had stuck rings.....I would repeat the process again and monitor things.

[cruisetopoland]

Update; after 30 miles 6,000 rpm thrash last night eggy smell went, slight brown smoke under heavy revving.

This morning-oil dropped quarter way from max-min from checking before the 30 mile hard run last night.  Started up, slight blue/white smoke, let it idle, revved it-palls and palls of acrid white smoke with some blue and grey, kept revving it until it cleared.  Now giving blue smoke on throttle and used half max-min in 20 miles this morning.  Starts and  drives perfect, though....

I have the engine change booked for Saturday am; what do I do?