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[Martin_1962]

So what would be the drawback of fitting the 2.5 gearing

Economy mostly. Keeping the revs low during cruising cuts down the losses in the engine. Might take a bit off the maximum speed too I suppose.

If the engine's got the grunt, it's much better to cruise with low RPM and a wider throttle opening than at a higher speed where it could potentially generate much more power than required but is being throttled back.

Production cars are about a compromise of all factors, not just fastest to 60 etc. after all.

In fact, my main moan about most manual cars is that first gear is designed to pull away with a caravan on the back, a bootful of luggage and a back seat full of kids, and a less than competent driver at the wheel, without burning the clutch out. Conditions that my car rarely ever sees (ok, maybe the incompetent driver...). I'd say the auto has the upper hand here, because first in a manual will just light up the back tyres when given full bore in first without a full load, whereas in an auto the combination of a higher first and a torque converter that will give a lower ratio for just as long as it takes to get the engine up into the torque means that the initial 30 feet might be slower, but you won't be reaching for another gear at 35 MPH.

So, replace first and second gear with one gear almost as high as second but not quite, and the aforementioned 4 speed Omega would probably do pretty much as well as a 5 speed. Wouldn't be fun with a caravan though.


Kevin

The torque converter slip means you can handle quite steep starts, but a 5 speed auto with closer 1 2 3 would be great on hills

[Martin_1962]

You are of course forgetting that many of us 'autobox boys' have been driving manuals (often very fast) since way before you were even a smile on your Dad's face .  Don't worry, you'll probably learn to drive fast/quick/safe as you get older, even with an auto (which if driven properly do have control and speed (though not usually to the finite offered by traditional manuals))

Perhaps, but lack of practice driving proper cars, coupled with the slower reactions of an oldie can't be helping matters

I can drive fast/safe/quick perfectly well at the moment, although admittedly only with a real car that is actually under my control. Doubt I'll ever learn to do it with an auto though, as the things bore me to tears to the point where I just can't be bothered pushing on any more, and usually drive it like the old man it was designed to be driven by

Erm we have all had "Proper" cars, I have owned a car,  not particularly fast but would out handle ANY you have owned, not out corner probably but position accurately and be fun.

And 90mph on loose chippings when you won't do the same road at 80 in the wet and when at 100 a Mondeo I was following was lifting a wheel was fun.

Yes I was looking out of the door windows!

Never take on small Rootes hatches if they are either stripe down side, spoiler fitted, or have large exhaust.

If you want to learn how a car handles buy your self one of the following

1) Mark 1 or 2 Escort 1600 or 2000
2) Hillman/Chrysler/Talbot Avenger
3) Vauxhall Chevette HS
4) Chrysler/Talbot Sunbeam

All are commonly fitted with better suspension and engine mods, and will teach you more about car control than most modern cars.

Note all light, small, RWD, fastish (modified if necessary), and have done well at rallying.

[Martin_1962]

Seriously, fellas, I initially wanted to query the wisdom of using very high revs. on my 2.6l. The points raised are fascinating, and I realise that, as one of the oldies, my conception of modern engine capabilities was way wide of the mark. You live and you learn. I think I'm beginning to feel like the oldest swinger in town.
I'm not sure which one of you I'll home in on to blame when I blow the top off my little darling, though.  

Mine gets there every day

[Paul M]

Erm we have all had "Proper" cars, I have owned a car,  not particularly fast but would out handle ANY you have owned, not out corner probably but position accurately and be fun.

And 90mph on loose chippings when you won't do the same road at 80 in the wet and when at 100 a Mondeo I was following was lifting a wheel was fun.

Yes I was looking out of the door windows!

Never take on small Rootes hatches if they are either stripe down side, spoiler fitted, or have large exhaust.

If you want to learn how a car handles buy your self one of the following

1) Mark 1 or 2 Escort 1600 or 2000
2) Hillman/Chrysler/Talbot Avenger
3) Vauxhall Chevette HS
4) Chrysler/Talbot Sunbeam

All are commonly fitted with better suspension and engine mods, and will teach you more about car control than most modern cars.

Note all light, small, RWD, fastish (modified if necessary), and have done well at rallying.

I have recently been seriously considering something along those lines, not so much the cars you mention (as they're before my time so I have no knowledge of them other than the Mk2 Escort which I've heard of and seen), more something like a stripped out BMW E30 325i sport coupé with decent suspension. Basically something light, nice handling and of course RWD. Thing is though, it would basically be a track toy as I'm absolutely sick of paying through the nose for insurance, tax etc for cars that sit on the driveway every day, so I'd probably be better off with something a little more basic and even lighter.

The big flaw in this plan is how I'd get it to the track! Knockhill isn't far from me, and an A-frame is an option, but if I end up with the only the 840Ci there's no way I can tow with that so it may not be feasible, at least in the meantime. Unless of course I could come to some arrangement with a mate to tow it for me, in return for some track time in it, hmm got me thinking now

[Martin_1962]

Tow bar on the MV6

Try to get a go in a 1970s RWD car to see how they go

[Entwood]

Please mister can I have my Escort Mexico back....... with hindsight the one car I wish I'd never sold, next was the Mk1 Cortina but I did silly things both to and in that one ....

[Vamps]

Mk1 Cortina GT, had loads of other stuff, bit of a mini fan, mine had been previously ‘sorted’ easily pull 8000rpm, had Lotus Rev Counter in it which IIRC Redlined at 9000.
Han an umbrella handbrake but could still be put to good use in the right roads, did not have Tesco Car parks when I was a lad. There is an old 3 lane road near to me which was bypassed years ago, it only leads to the old garage and a couple of farms. 3 lane, wide grass verge and only the odd tree, you had to be very unlucky!!!!! No I did not but I know a man who did. Great in the wet and FAB in the snow.
Put a 3L V6 into a Mk2 Cortina without up rating the gearbox, not many of today’s ‘boy racers’ could handle that, whatever they think, few have any experience in RWD with cart suspension and no lsd.

[Entwood]

Mk1 Cortina GT, had loads of other stuff, bit of a mini fan, mine had been previously ‘sorted’ easily pull 8000rpm, had Lotus Rev Counter in it which IIRC Redlined at 9000.
Han an umbrella handbrake but could still be put to good use in the right roads, did not have Tesco Car parks when I was a lad. There is an old 3 lane road near to me which was bypassed years ago, it only leads to the old garage and a couple of farms. 3 lane, wide grass verge and only the odd tree, you had to be very unlucky!!!!! No I did not but I know a man who did. Great in the wet and FAB in the snow.
Put a 3L V6 into a Mk2 Cortina without up rating the gearbox, not many of today’s ‘boy racers’ could handle that, whatever they think, few have any experience in RWD with cart suspension and no lsd.

Similar to the stupidity I did ... Lotus Cortina engine/gearbox in 1600 x-flow car with standard back axle/diff....  accelerated like S*** of a shovel but very limited top speed, handled like a bitch ... fortunately for my longevity, the half shafts didn't last very long and I bent it around a tree ..  ..

[Paul M]

Tow bar on the MV6

Try to get a go in a 1970s RWD car to see how they go

The MV6 might be going though, as I do about 4000 miles a year these days since moving into the city centre, and having 3 road legal cars with the associated costs is just madness. So I plan on keeping the 840Ci until I get bored of it, and there's no such thing as a tow bar for one of those.

Wouldn't mind a shot of an old RWD mota with live axle suspension... none of this 50-50 weight distribution either, must be pretty tail happy with sod all weight back there

[Paul M]

With all this talk of Lotuses and Cortinas, I just remembered my dad had a Lotus Cortina back in the day. Bit of a boy racer car of its time I think 8-)

[Entwood]

Nostalgia time ...

http://www.lotuscortina.net/Story1x.html

[Andy B]

..... as I do about 4000 miles a year these days  ......

No wonder you're such an expert driver with all those miles under your very young belt!      

PS I took my test in a Mk1 Escort

[Paul M]

..... as I do about 4000 miles a year these days  ......

No wonder you're such an expert driver with all those miles under your very young belt!      

PS I took my test in a Mk1 Escort

I used to do lots more, but living in the city centre brings many benefits such as lots and lots of partying, and I can stagger home afterwards but one of the drawbacks is you have to wade through loads of traffic lights to get to any decent roads, so I hardly use the car now.

Still, once I get out of the city I'm never far from a twisty B-road -- benefit of living in Scotland . It's usually pissing with rain too which helps fine-tune your skills

[Andy B]

..... It's usually pissing with rain too which helps fine-tune your skills

I know I've lived there. As long as you only have rain booked for today and not more snow - Sally Traffic mentioned delays yesterday on the A720 - I'm on  my way to Edinburgh this afternnoon. Just hope I can keep in control of my auto.    

[Auto Addict]

4.5... 6... 7k RPM??? OMG! I never go over 2.5...

Keep mine below 2k