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[MV6Danny]

Hi guys just after some advise really. i was just wondering if i could do a straight swap for rear vented brakes and calipers  from a 3.2 onto a mfl mv6 3.0 which has solid rear discs. will they fit? is it just a straight swap or is there some mods that would need to be done?  Cheers guys and happy new year to you all 

[RobG]

Straight swap...................pads are around the £50+ mark on TC though

[MV6Danny]

Straight swap...................pads are around the £50+ mark on TC though

Excellent News. Thanks Rob 

[Andy B]

Straight swap...................pads are around the £50+ mark on TC though

Excellent News. Thanks Rob 

The calipers might be a straight swap, but you'll alter the front / rear bias set up because those cars that were designed to have vented rears also had a different master cylinder. 2Woody will give the details if you ask him. IMO you don't gain any extra braking by fitting tyhe rear vented discs to earlier cars.

[Jimbob]

Elite Pete did this to his old estate years ago.

gave no noticable benefit.

[TheBoy]

No gain to be had.

Takes the same £10 TC pads (not that they are listed on TC website, but are still available) as the earlier calipers, despite what EPC says (EPC lists the OE pads (at £50) which include the fitting kit, its the fitting kit that varies).

[Andy B]

..... its the fitting kit that varies).

because the caliper is obviously half an inch wider 

[TheBoy]

..... its the fitting kit that varies).

because the caliper is obviously half an inch wider 

Indeed, so pins need to be longer, and spring wider.

But the pads are the same

[Andy B]

..... its the fitting kit that varies).

because the caliper is obviously half an inch wider 

Indeed, so pins need to be longer, and spring wider.

But the pads are the same

I was agreeing with you ........ 

[vauxsull]

The pads are around 50 pounds from vauxhall or can get ferrodo from motorworld or halfords for 15 pounds

[Osprey]

... or, if  you prefer, £10 from Vauxhall as TB said 

[vauxsull]

It was vauxhall that told me the price of 50 Pounds for the pads and they where not on trade for this vehicle anymore

[TheBoy]

It was vauxhall that told me the price of 50 Pounds for the pads and they where not on trade for this vehicle anymore

I got some 3 or 4 months ago .

[Osprey]

Takes the same £10 TC pads (not that they are listed on TC website, but are still available) as the earlier calipers, despite what EPC says (EPC lists the OE pads (at £50) which include the fitting kit, its the fitting kit that varies).

So the Vx dealer will quote the expensive version with the extra fitting kit because that's what the Electronic Parts Catalogue (EPC) says.  But the actual pads that come in the box are the same fitment as the ones they sell for £10 without the fitting kit. 

[Andy B]

Takes the same £10 TC pads (not that they are listed on TC website, but are still available) as the earlier calipers, despite what EPC says (EPC lists the OE pads (at £50) which include the fitting kit, its the fitting kit that varies).

So the Vx dealer will quote the expensive version with the extra fitting kit because that's what the Electronic Parts Catalogue (EPC) says.  But the actual pads that come in the box are the same fitment as the ones they sell for £10 without the fitting kit.

Yes. But to give him his due, he shouldn't be expected to know everything about all cars Vauxhall/Opel have made over the last 15/20 yrs, he can only go by his copy of EPC 

[TheBoy]

Takes the same £10 TC pads (not that they are listed on TC website, but are still available) as the earlier calipers, despite what EPC says (EPC lists the OE pads (at £50) which include the fitting kit, its the fitting kit that varies).

So the Vx dealer will quote the expensive version with the extra fitting kit because that's what the Electronic Parts Catalogue (EPC) says.  But the actual pads that come in the box are the same fitment as the ones they sell for £10 without the fitting kit.

No, the £50 ones are OE, the £10 are classed as GM Aftermarket.

[hotel21]

Takes the same £10 TC pads (not that they are listed on TC website, but are still available) as the earlier calipers, despite what EPC says (EPC lists the OE pads (at £50) which include the fitting kit, its the fitting kit that varies).

So the Vx dealer will quote the expensive version with the extra fitting kit because that's what the Electronic Parts Catalogue (EPC) says.  But the actual pads that come in the box are the same fitment as the ones they sell for £10 without the fitting kit.

No, the £50 ones are OE, the £10 are classed as GM Aftermarket.

and according to some on here, have different coefficients of friction, thus OE work better.  Apparently.  And are less dirty....

[Osprey]

True - that's why I was careful to say the same fitment.  You can get pads that fit, work and are sold by Vauxhall so are presumably not likely to kill you at the first touch of the brakes. 

Maybe it is indeed worth five times the price for a different friction material - I would have to try it out for myself before offering an opinion on that.   

[Cliffo B]

also be aware that replacement new calipers are now no longer available
either from Opel Vx or GM
only reconditoned ones 
the castings are still all original
although they epoxy coat them 
some are still badly corroded away as they can't refurb them.
So if the non vented ones have new replacement calipers available you could be in error exchangeing them

[MV6Danny]

Thanks for all the info guys. I was thinking of going to the breakers and removing the whole assembly ie callipers mounting brackets and discs. If i do this will it all just fit straight onto my car. Not really bothered about the change in bias. does the handbrake need to be modified in any way? Thanks Danny 

[Andy B]

...
Not really bothered about the change in bias.  ....

until you're in a 'Oh! F*@! Sh1t' moment as your foot is buried in the carpet!

[RobG]

Thanks for all the info guys. I was thinking of going to the breakers and removing the whole assembly ie callipers mounting brackets and discs. If i do this will it all just fit straight onto my car. Not really bothered about the change in bias. does the handbrake need to be modified in any way? Thanks Danny 

Fitting the vented setup to a car with no other changes will raise the efficiency of the rear brakes, but will also result in them locking earlier - hence bringing the ABS on earlier which in turn will increase the overall stopping distance, rear improvements should be matched by front improvements.

[Andy B]

...
 rear improvements should be matched by front improvements.

but as you know, all (but the very early) cars have the same size front discs. the difference between the two systems is the bore of the master cylinder.
As has been said above, fitting of the vented rear discs will provide no increase in braking efficiency.

ISTR a Land Rover driver (think it might have been the bloke that fell asleep at the wheel on the motorway & caused the derailment of the train) was prosecuted for various things after an accident, one of them being a mismatch of various braking components ie bore sizes of wheel/slave cylinders.

[Kevin Wood]

...
 rear improvements should be matched by front improvements.

but as you know, all (but the very early) cars have the same size front discs. the difference between the two systems is the bore of the master cylinder.
As has been said above, fitting of the vented rear discs will provide no increase in braking efficiency.

ISTR a Land Rover driver (think it might have been the bloke that fell asleep at the wheel on the motorway & caused the derailment of the train) was prosecuted for various things after an accident, one of them being a mismatch of various braking components ie bore sizes of wheel/slave cylinders.

ISTR it was some guy who left the road into a river and drowned a couple of his children.

He too was probably "not really bothered" until he was up before the beak with an expert witness asking to review the calculations that he had made before bolting on random braking components to "improve" his vehicle.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Straight swap...................pads are around the £50+ mark on TC though

Excellent News. Thanks Rob 

The calipers might be a straight swap, but you'll alter the front / rear bias set up because those cars that were designed to have vented rears also had a different master cylinder. 2Woody will give the details if you ask him. IMO you don't gain any extra braking by fitting tyhe rear vented discs to earlier cars.

Pretty sure its no different as the caliper piston sizes are the same and so are the disc sized (with the exception of the depth due to the vents).

[Andy B]

Straight swap...................pads are around the £50+ mark on TC though

Excellent News. Thanks Rob 

The calipers might be a straight swap, but you'll alter the front / rear bias set up because those cars that were designed to have vented rears also had a different master cylinder. 2Woody will give the details if you ask him. IMO you don't gain any extra braking by fitting tyhe rear vented discs to earlier cars.

Pretty sure its no different as the caliper piston sizes are the same and so are the disc sized (with the exception of the depth due to the vents).

Going off what Stu/2Woody says, they're different.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Still not convinced, I know I stripped some a few years ago after they did a 'mick dundee' and the pistons etc were all the same because I compared them at the time.

[Andy B]

Still not convinced, I know I stripped some a few years ago after they did a 'mick dundee' and the pistons etc were all the same because I compared them at the time.

I've never done any comparisons, but I know that Stu said they were different bore/piston sizes in the master cylinder 

[andyc]

Only two types of master cylinder ever fitted to the Omega.

All models upto '97 9193233 and from '97 to end of production the cylinder was 9193218.

Andy

[Marks DTM Calib]

Only two types of master cylinder ever fitted to the Omega.

All models upto '97 9193233 and from '97 to end of production the cylinder was 9193218.

Andy

Thought so, thanks Andy

[Andy B]

Only two types of master cylinder ever fitted to the Omega.

All models upto '97 9193233 and from '97 to end of production the cylinder was 9193218.

Andy

Thought so, thanks Andy

That's confused me ............... Stu says he's always right!   

[2woody]

I think I'm sure that there were indeed only two master cylinders now. 25/20 mm on earlier cars and 25/25mm on later cars.

( ATE, the original manufacturer still list six different ones, mind )

If the OP's car has the later 25/25 master cylinder, then the components will be compatible, as all he's doing is to update his car to the later spec.

If the OP has the earlier 25/20 master cylinder then I would advise against the swap, as these cars are a bit too rear-biased in standard form.

The rear calipers have the piston size cast into the housing, easily readable from the outside. On inspection, you'll find that ALL non-vented cars are 40mm, whilst the vented rear calipers are 42mm bore.

hope this clears it up a bit.