Topic: ADSL Router Toast... (Read 3079 times)

Marks DTM Calib · « **on:** 16 June 2007, 10:50:13 »

Must of had a close lightning strike yesterday as it toasted my ADSL Modem/router......and a few others in the Close to!

I hate buying things from PC World but, what choice do you have when you need the product in a rush!

TheBoy · « **Reply #1 on:** 16 June 2007, 10:59:23 »

Quote

Must of had a close lightning strike yesterday as it toasted my ADSL Modem/router......and a few others in the Close to!

I hate buying things from PC World but, what choice do you have when you need the product in a rush!

i can give a router to lb66 tomorrow if thats any good to you?

TheBoy · « **Reply #2 on:** 16 June 2007, 11:00:47 »

Mine survived, and line still up....

System up: 340 days 22 hours 34 minutes
Line up: 339 days 7 hours 9 minutes

Wonder if it will make the year...

TheBoy · « **Reply #3 on:** 16 June 2007, 11:08:57 »

Quote

Quote
Must of had a close lightning strike yesterday as it toasted my ADSL Modem/router......and a few others in the Close to!

I hate buying things from PC World but, what choice do you have when you need the product in a rush!
i can give a router to lb66 tomorrow if thats any good to you?

I should say its not wireless, and only 10Mb hub, but a great bit of kit, the next revision is what is used on forum....

....and best of all, free to you

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #4 on:** 16 June 2007, 13:35:25 »

Thanks for the offer but, I bought one and got it working.....

Taxi_Driver · « **Reply #5 on:** 16 June 2007, 13:46:30 »

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Thanks for the offer but, I bought one and got it working.....

Ive just set one up for a m8......who didnt know his username or password!

Fortunately his isp has a automated username and password retrieval phone service......tho unfortunately first time round it gave me someone elses username and password

Also had work out how to connect his PS3 to it as well....success

JohnM · « **Reply #6 on:** 18 June 2007, 23:22:19 »

Mmm, wish I'd been on earlier and seen this.

Just has to pull one from not so far from you Mark to test at home as it wasn't playing no matter what I did. Been off since Friday. Modem portion toast - can't see it but it is. Replcement due. Shame really but I suppose a spare 100Mb switch will always come in handy.

I gather something rather big went, flash--bang not so far from the goose.

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #7 on:** 19 June 2007, 08:48:52 »

That would explain why it appears that half the estate has lost cable and ADSL modems then....

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #8 on:** 19 June 2007, 08:51:06 »

On disection, mine showed a small amount of charring around a decoupling cap on the main micro and the 1.5V supply is now clamped to 0.7V so I guess one of the internel insulation layers has blown through to the substrate..

hotel21 · « **Reply #9 on:** 19 June 2007, 10:22:06 »

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On disection, mine showed a small amount of charring around a decoupling cap on the main micro and the 1.5V supply is now clamped to 0.7V so I guess one of the internel insulation layers has blown through to the substrate..

So you finally confirmed my diagnosis then??

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #10 on:** 19 June 2007, 11:05:08 »

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So you finally confirmed my diagnosis then??

Yep. Sounds like it's F***ed!

My parents had a scaffolding tower on their house a couple of years ago during some building work and it got struck by lightening (luckily when the builders were having a fag break! It didn't half make them spill their tea though, apparently!).

Anyway, the insurance claim for all the knackered electronics ran into thousands. Anything with more than a few feet of cable connected to it died.

About half the items that bought it didn't pack up immediately but took a week or two to fail having been damaged by the strike.

My dad's ADSL router had a pin hole in the bottom of it, and a corresponding pin hole in the paint on the metal surface on which it had been standing where something had flashed over.

Most consumer items have only very basic protection against abnormal voltages. If you look at the circuit boards of network cards, ADSL routers, etc you can see where extra protection components have been designed into the device but not populated because some bean counter has decided to cheapen it.

Kevin

CaptainZok · « **Reply #11 on:** 19 June 2007, 15:11:12 »

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Quote
So you finally confirmed my diagnosis then??

Yep. Sounds like it's F***ed!

My parents had a scaffolding tower on their house a couple of years ago during some building work and it got struck by lightening (luckily when the builders were having a fag break! It didn't half make them spill their tea though, apparently!).

Anyway, the insurance claim for all the knackered electronics ran into thousands. Anything with more than a few feet of cable connected to it died.

About half the items that bought it didn't pack up immediately but took a week or two to fail having been damaged by the strike.

My dad's ADSL router had a pin hole in the bottom of it, and a corresponding pin hole in the paint on the metal surface on which it had been standing where something had flashed over.

Most consumer items have only very basic protection against abnormal voltages. If you look at the circuit boards of network cards, ADSL routers, etc you can see where extra protection components have been designed into the device but not populated because some bean counter has decided to cheapen it.

Kevin

Alas we now live in a world that is run by bloody bean counters.

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #12 on:** 19 June 2007, 15:52:43 »

It wont be a bean counter.....the interface will pass its required EMC radiated, conducted and immunity tests plus any further region specific ones, as a (proper) engineer, you dont add cost for no reason.

And if you think a 1p component or one small enough to fit inside a piece of domesic kit is enough to stop a lightning surge then you are in for a big surprise because its a high voltage, high current and very fast energy spike and the only effective way to deal with one of these is to add some L (or R) and a VERY big C and only then will you of hopefuly slugged the edge speed enough to give a transient suppressor enough to time turn on and hopefuly clamp the pulse before dying in a small puff of smoke.....

Nasty stuff lightning, loads of different types, pretty much impossible to stop it damaging modern electronics.....

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #13 on:** 19 June 2007, 16:43:12 »

Granted that the only way to stop a direct lightning strike from killing something is to go back to using valves and, even then, you'll struggle.

However, the point I was making, and I think you have made as well, is that consumer electronics products are engineered down to the mininum cost and, whilst it meets the applicable standards that doesn't necessarily mean it'll work in anything other than the least hostile environment.

That the standards are set as low as they are is probably back to the bean counters, but at a national or european level.

I've often pondered the power of a lightning strike when driving the winch at the gliding club. Sending a length of 5mm steel cable with a bloke on the end if it 2,000 feet into the sky does focus the mind, and the winch gets shut down at the slightest hint of electrical activity.

A glider was unlucky enough to get hit (in free space, not on a winch) a couple of years ago and the damage was mindblowing. Sections of circa 15mm diameter control tubes in the wings got flattened by electromagnetic forces due to the currents they were carrying. Analysis showed they didn't get heated much above ambient so there was no melting involved, just a stong enough current in the tube, and thus electromagnetic field around it, to crush it. The steel levers at the inboard ends didn't fair too well due to their higher resistance. They vapourised explosively, blowing out a section of fuselage and both canopies. The pilots parachuted to safety but both suffered burst eardrums from the aforementioned blast.

BTW: Stormchasers might be interested in this:

http://www.isleofwightweather.co.uk/live_storm_data.htm

Looks like Devon's getting a bit of a zapping at the moment!

Kevin

hol666 · « **Reply #14 on:** 19 June 2007, 19:49:35 »

This has happened to me too, big storm and then no phones or broadband. Blew the dect phone base and the router!

Always keep a spare router now and one day, I'll actually fit the surge plug to the phoneline...... :-/

TheBoy · « **Reply #15 on:** 19 June 2007, 20:02:51 »

My router survived the lightening we had Friday, and my line up time is still improving....

superuser@lan-> gti st
System up: 344 days 7 hours 35 minutes
Line up: 342 days 15 hours 47 minutes
Attenuation:
   Local: 35.5 dB
   Remote: 17 dB
Noise Margin:
   Upstream: 24 dB
   Downstream: 30.5 dB
Xmit Power Level: 11.93 dBm

Taxi_Driver · « **Reply #16 on:** 19 June 2007, 20:11:09 »

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It wont be a bean counter.....the interface will pass its required EMC radiated, conducted and immunity tests plus any further region specific ones, as a (proper) engineer, you dont add cost for no reason.

And if you think a 1p component or one small enough to fit inside a piece of domesic kit is enough to stop a lightning surge then you are in for a big surprise because its a high voltage, high current and very fast energy spike and the only effective way to deal with one of these is to add some L (or R) and a VERY big C and only then will you of hopefuly slugged the edge speed enough to give a transient suppressor enough to time turn on and hopefuly clamp the pulse before dying in a small puff of smoke.....

Nasty stuff lightning, loads of different types, pretty much impossible to stop it damaging modern electronics.....

Years ago i used to work for a telecoms manufacturer......that used to supply BT, in the time that BT would only buy UK manufactured goods. They used to make small switchboards......i can remember for BT approval then, they had to fit a discharge device (carnt remember the name of the device

) on each exchange line input.....this was to try to prevent lightening damage to the circuit boards....basically if a v high voltage came down the input lines the device would 'flash' the spike to earth.
They rarely got a unit returned with lightening damage.....and on the rare occasion they did then half the plastic casing had melted as well.
Dont think manufacturers seem to bother with this type of device now

but then that was the days when if it wasnt BT approved it was a big no no to connect it to a BT line!

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #17 on:** 19 June 2007, 20:11:49 »

Apparantly the ground strike was a mere 30m up the road from me......so no surprise at all....

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #18 on:** 20 June 2007, 10:21:06 »

While we're on the subject of ADSL routers, can anyone recommend a stable model suitable for a small office? Needs to support a single IP address over ADSL with NAT and ideally internal VPN. No wireless required, just ethernet.

We've got a couple of Vigor 2600's at the moment both in the office and at home and whilst they work OK the one in the office crashes occasionally, which is a bit of a pain if you're trying to get in through a VPN.

Kevin

Jimbob · « **Reply #19 on:** 20 June 2007, 11:29:53 »

Your 2600's on latest firmware? was all set to recommend a 2800 (like i'm using here) until I got to that part?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #20 on:** 20 June 2007, 12:10:43 »

It's not on the latest. I suspect it was a previous firmware upgrade that saw the stability degrade so I suppose I should try the latest in the hope that they've fixed it. I gues sit could get worse, better or stay the same :-/ What version do you run on the 2800 (don't know if there are any parallels between the two models)?

Kevin

Jimbob · « **Reply #21 on:** 20 June 2007, 12:21:14 »

Mine is on the latest, different hardware as this one supports adsl2, maxadsl etc, so sohould be no parallels.
If you think it got worse with firmware, why not try the latest, if thats no better, go back to the previous, or did that fix something else you had an issue with?

TheBoy · « **Reply #22 on:** 20 June 2007, 22:49:47 »

I personally use a pair of Siemens sb5830 here. Decent business class routers

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Author Topic: ADSL Router Toast... (Read 3079 times)

Taxi_Driver

Taxi_Driver