Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: jay99 on 15 September 2013, 00:35:16
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Hello and here's the story
My dad bought an omega for £600 as a temporary measure as his car was knackered and he was looking for a new one with the intention of passing it down to me when I passed my test.
Now I have it and it simply is god awful. He did not look after it (not even a service or anything) and always drove it really rough and now I have to deal with the consequences. It is a very nice car and its very comfortable (apart from the cassette player from the olden days) but difficult to park because its so long and I've already crashed it into a bollard which resulted in a big dent on the back door.
I've done some research on it and its a W reg 2000 Omega 2.0 litre ecotec manual GLX. Its a facelift model with basic features.
Here are the problems:
It keeps misfiring and the engine light is always on, I've been told its the coil pack but I'm not sure. I took it to a mechanic who replaced a spark plug and the engine stopped juddering but dosen't really help.
When I press the accelerator a loud noises appears to come from the exhaust and the way I would describe the car is that it stutters and bangs and when the revs go up it appears to smooth out. I have found a way round the problem which is to feather the throttle and it runs ok but when a hill approaches it seems to stutter and bang. I've replaced the backbox (which split in two and had a massive hole in it) but the problem is still there.
It cuts out when idling or sometimes when going round a corner. the revs sometimes go down under one and sometimes come back resulting in a squeaking noise from the engine or cuts out completely.
It absolutely drinks fuel, no other way to put it.
You may ask why am I keeping it and the answer is that it never seems to break down and it keeps on going no matter what. It still works day after day and gets me to where I go. As an 18 year old I literally have little money and buying a new car would outweigh the cost of repairing it.
I have done a number of repairs to it recently. A new GM backbox which cost £60 including fitting. A new radiator and cooling fan (my fault as the cooling fan stopped working due to me fiddling around with the fuses and I decided to continue using it and forgetting to keep the heater on which resulting in the radiator exploding) Cost £330 including a service and oil change. Thankfully my dad paid for this.
Any ideas on these problems?
Thanks
Jay
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Hi Jay.
Does sound like a missfire. Its quite easy to replace the plugs, and the leads aren't expensive. Should be able to sort it with minimal cost diy.
But the smart thing to do would be to read the engine ecu for fault codes first to confirm the actual faults as the ecu sees them first.
There may be a cam sensor fault the 4 pots seem to suffer with.
But see what the 4pot owners here say.
Welcome to Oof. :)
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Hello and here's the story ....
Welcome to the forum. :y
Have you tried the 'paper clip test'? http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90479.0 That'll give you a clue as to why the management light is is.
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Hi and Welcome Jay to OOF :y
Probably GLS rather than GLX I'd imagine.
Plenty of help on here Omega related and much much more :)
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Welcome to OOF mate :y
Does sound like a misfire, but, as advised, get the codes read. Good luck with it
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As others have said, read the codes. Look in Maintenence Guides section for Paperclip test. A post 1996 2.0l should use the OBDII type codes (but is NOT OBDII compliant!!).
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The stalling issue could be a failing cam sensor (as it's a 2.0) but as said, a code clear followed by reading of the persistent codes would be the first point of call.
It would also be helpful if you put your location in so we can advise who may be local.
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where you from jay there might be aq member with a code reader near you willing to help
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It sounds to me that you have a weak spark which would explain why it misfires under load but feathering the throttle gets round the problem and it would also explain the high fuel consumption. I would change the plugs and leads as these are relatively cheap and by the sounds of it the car could do with them, and get the codes read to highlight any more problems.
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it seems to flash 10 times, then 3 times' then 4 times, then 10 times again and repeats itself.
but i've tried to read the codes but the codes that are given on the website are unclear and only seem to be 2 digits, I've recorded a video which shows the same thing but wont upload for some reason.
This morning the car would switch on but would turn off and I could not accelerate to keep it going. This coupled with a whining noise which I presume is the fuel pump. It kept turning off but I got it going eventually and when it warmed up the problem disappeared.
First thing i'll do tomorrow is get the plugs changed which should be easy as there are only four of them and they're quite cheap. The leads are next but I'll need a quote to go ahead, are leads coil packs?
Thanks
Jay
By the way Its been difficult to post as the verification images are very hard to read!
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it seems to flash 10 times, then 3 times' then 4 times, then 10 times again and repeats itself.
but i've tried to read the codes but the codes that are given on the website are unclear and only seem to be 2 digits, I've recorded a video which shows the same thing but wont upload for some reason.
......
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90583.0
P0340 Camshaft Sensor Incorrect Signal :y :y :y
...., are leads coil packs?
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No, leads are HT leads. You have a DIS pack, ie Distributorless Ignition System with HT leads from it to the plugs. Later 2.2 cars have coil packs that plug directly on top of the plugs so don't have HT leads. ;)
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Thanks Andy for your help. What does this mean and how can it be fixed and how much? The car can sometimes turn off but this isn't a massive problem just clutch down and turn the key and its working again.
The problem is when you put the accelerator down or go up a hill and it feels like its choking and chugging. When I replaced the backbox the problem did not go away but improved and there are still a few holes on the pipe connecting the box to the pipe. Could this be a problem?
Just to confirm I don't have a coil pack but leads. How much would the leads cost to replace? Would it solve the choking and chugging that seems to stop the car from accelerating?
Thanks
Jay
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Thanks Andy for your help. What does this mean and how can it be fixed and how much? The car can sometimes turn off but this isn't a massive problem just clutch down and turn the key and its working again.
The problem is when you put the accelerator down or go up a hill and it feels like its choking and chugging. When I replaced the backbox the problem did not go away but improved and there are still a few holes on the pipe connecting the box to the pipe. Could this be a problem?
Just to confirm I don't have a coil pack but leads. How much would the leads cost to replace? Would it solve the choking and chugging that seems to stop the car from accelerating?
Thanks
Jay
First off change the cam sensor http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90628.0 (the 2.0 & 2.2 are near identical, so the job will be pretty much the same) and go from there. Bite the bullet & buy from Vauxhall though.
You have HT leads, they're the long black 'wires' that go to each spark plug. ;)
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by the way I've read up on the problem and can't rev above 4500 so confirms the suspicion.
But due to lack of funds Its at the bottom of the list as revving over 4500 and acceleration isn't important. How much would the leads approximately cost to change and parts? Would a cam sensor significantly imprive fuel consumption?
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..... Would a cam sensor significantly imprive fuel consumption?
Probably because the car will be running a load better. It's been a while since I bought HT leads (& I bought 6 + a king lead ... the one from the dizzy to the coil) but OE Vauxhall's are scandalously expensive. Maybe a set from a breaker here :-\ You might not even need them yet, just change the sensor first & see how you get on.
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see he still hasnt posted his location, i have loads off 2.0 bits here that could of helped him if local to me, bought a complete engine just for the head for a vectra, could of also tried to diagnose problems hes having
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sorry mate I'm near oldham in manchester hope that helps, I could come down and bring a crate of lager for your troubles!
will bring a mechanic mate of mine to have a look as I have no mechanical knowledge whatsoever and often make things worse!
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Use a genuine cam sensor when you do the job otherwise you'll be replacing it again sooner rather than later. The genuine ones seem to last approx. 4 years or 40K.
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Use a genuine cam sensor when you do the job otherwise you'll be replacing it again sooner rather than later. The genuine ones seem to last approx. 4 years or 40K.
I'd say they last longer than that, I replaced mine in 2007, at around 90k odd. Now at 165k :)
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The ecu shows a cam sensor fault. Plain as day. That's the first thing to fix.
As cost are an issue its even more important not to guess the diagnosis.
Fit a GENUINE sensor from vx. Then see how it runs. You'll probably find its sorted. If there's still issues, address those then.
One step at a time Jay. One step at a time. :y
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I went to the mechanic this morning and asked for his opinion. For a cam sensor it would require removing cambelts and basically dissecting the engine which would be a big and expensive job. He said he would look into parts cost but the big and expensive job bit put me right off. He said he would charge to have the codes read but I told him I knew the problem but said he'd need to look into it anyway.
How much would I be looking for in terms of parts and labour so I know he's not ripping me off. Should I do the leads first to improve the general running first and worry about that later?
Thanks
Jay
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Having read this guide
http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90628.0
It doesn't seem like a big expensive job to me. Hour and a half including tea break is mentioned.
No engine dissection and certainly no cambelt removal.
I'm sure a 4 pot expert will be along soon to confirm. :y
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As above, the "expert" is feeding you a load of rubbish and probably trying to take your money as you are a youngster.
It is not even a 30 minute job, and you only have to dismantle as far as the timing cover for acess to the bolt.
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I went to the mechanic this morning and asked for his opinion. For a cam sensor it would require removing cambelts and basically dissecting the engine which would be a big and expensive job. He said he would look into parts cost but the big and expensive job bit put me right off. He said he would charge to have the codes read but I told him I knew the problem but said he'd need to look into it anyway.
How much would I be looking for in terms of parts and labour so I know he's not ripping me off. Should I do the leads first to improve the general running first and worry about that later?
Thanks
Jay
As above, find another mechanic.
The only belt that needs to come off is the 'fan'/auxiliary belt
You've given him the code ... it's telling you it needs a new cam sensor
What are doing Thursday? I've never done a cam sensor on a four pot, but there doesn't look to much to it, if you fancy a drive to Bury, I'll help you.
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Yup, your mechanic is full of shit I'm afraid :(
Cam sensor on 2.0l is either slightly annoying (if you have to acquire and change the plug) or piss easy. 30mins max, including a cuppa and bacon sarnie, if the plug is the same.
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if you have to acquire and change the plug .....
??? ??? As I've offered my services ...... please explain
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I went to the mechanic this morning and asked for his opinion. For a cam sensor it would require removing cambelts and basically dissecting the engine which would be a big and expensive job. He said he would look into parts cost but the big and expensive job bit put me right off. He said he would charge to have the codes read but I told him I knew the problem but said he'd need to look into it anyway.
How much would I be looking for in terms of parts and labour so I know he's not ripping me off. Should I do the leads first to improve the general running first and worry about that later? I have
Thanks
Jay
As above, find another mechanic.
The only belt that needs to come off is the 'fan'/auxiliary belt
You've given him the code ... it's telling you it needs a new cam sensor
What are doing Thursday? I've never done a cam sensor on a four pot, but there doesn't look to much to it, if you fancy a drive to Bury, I'll help you.
Thanks Andy for your much appreciated offer but I have college on Thursday and I don't think the car can handle a trip to bury and never mind the fuel cost, it does about 1 MPG!
I'll try another mechanic later today and see what he thinks. I've traced this part
http://www.vauxhall-car-parts.co.uk/acatalog/VAUXHALL_CAMSHAFT_SENSOR_-_90458252N.html -
at £12 it seems a little cheap but they say genuine on the website. if the job takes 1+1/2 hours how much would a garage be looking to charge me for it? Would they charge half an hours labour? Seems about right if a mechanic is doing the job. I need something to go off when I ask them.
*By the way can anyone find the leads on google. Is it possible that only 1 lead has gone instead of replacing all four? Would this work? If a lead is gone then presumably it runs on three cylinders and if all the leads had gone it probably wouldn't work so I would hypothetically only need to replace one, is this right, ? - sorry I don't know what I'm talking about here is right.
By the way when googling I've found that there are coil packs for x20xev engines as well as leads. Just to double check do I need to replace the coil packs or leads? http://www.vauxhall-car-parts.co.uk/acatalog/Omega_Coils___Plug_Leads.html
Thanks
Jay
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I went to the mechanic this morning and asked for his opinion. For a cam sensor it would require removing cambelts and basically dissecting the engine which would be a big and expensive job. He said he would look into parts cost but the big and expensive job bit put me right off. He said he would charge to have the codes read but I told him I knew the problem but said he'd need to look into it anyway.
How much would I be looking for in terms of parts and labour so I know he's not ripping me off. Should I do the leads first to improve the general running first and worry about that later? I have
Thanks
Jay
As above, find another mechanic.
The only belt that needs to come off is the 'fan'/auxiliary belt
You've given him the code ... it's telling you it needs a new cam sensor
What are doing Thursday? I've never done a cam sensor on a four pot, but there doesn't look to much to it, if you fancy a drive to Bury, I'll help you.
Thanks Andy for your much appreciated offer but I have college on Thursday and I don't think the car can handle a trip to bury and never mind the fuel cost, it does about 1 MPG!
I'll try another mechanic later today and see what he thinks. I've traced this part
http://www.vauxhall-car-parts.co.uk/acatalog/VAUXHALL_CAMSHAFT_SENSOR_-_90458252N.html -
at £12 it seems a little cheap but they say genuine on the website. if the job takes 1+1/2 hours how much would a garage be looking to charge me for it? Would they charge half an hours labour? Seems about right if a mechanic is doing the job. I need something to go off when I ask them.
*By the way can anyone find the leads on google. Is it possible that only 1 lead has gone instead of replacing all four? Would this work? If a lead is gone then presumably it runs on three cylinders and if all the leads had gone it probably wouldn't work so I would hypothetically only need to replace one, is this right, ? - sorry I don't know what I'm talking about here is right.
By the way when googling I've found that there are coil packs for x20xev engines as well as leads. Just to double check do I need to replace the coil packs or leads? http://www.vauxhall-car-parts.co.uk/acatalog/Omega_Coils___Plug_Leads.html
Thanks
Jay
Jay
Replace the cam shaft sensor with a real GM/Vauxhall sensor & then go from there! Chances are you won't need HT leads or a DIS pack
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HT leads on the 2.0xev have caused me problems in the past, replace only with Vauxhall or Bosch who make for Vauxhall, failure to do so will incur early failure and extra costs !
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This morning the car would start but the accelerator would not work and it was idling and kept turning off. Was late for college!!!!! had to leave it about 10 minutes to warm up but I'd just end up losing power and it would turn off after running rough and making a loud high pitched whining sound. Had to WALK. Yes WALKING was required today.
Anyway I have located a genuine siemens cam sensor on ebay
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vauxhall-OMEGA-VECTRA-CAM-CAMSHAFT-SENSOR-SIEMENS-NEW-/170570838212?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item27b6d070c4
Please tell me that its the right one as the other £85 are very expensive.
Thanks
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Cam sensor change on my 4 pot took me 15 minutes, same code as you same symptoms cured in 15 minutes, that mechanic is talking crap, it is as easy as other people here have said.
Only problem with cam sensor I found was sourcing the old style, my car still had the ones with a short collar on the sensor while the new ones have a deeper collar, to fit new ones VX do a kit but it means splicing leads, which from the sounds of you posts you might not be happy with. I hunted around and found a genuine GM sensor, and as sais fitted and working, don't let the mechanics con you. All the help is on here.
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I reckon this car needs -
- Cam sensor (priority)
- 4 new plugs (not one)
- Check of HT leads for deterioration, damage
- Check for leaking camcover gasket causing HT issues and rectify if needsbe
- Check of breather system, probably a good clear out (including unblocking the metal pipe from crank case to cam cover)
- Clean out of throttle body assembly, (above and below) and clean out of Idle Control Valve along with new gaskets for these
Given what you've said, (neglect) in order to remain reliable and / or roadworthy, it's likely to need:
- Cambelt kit, water pump, and check of correct valve timing. Unlikely it's been done within 40k or 4 years given neglect described
- Check of wishbones and check for uneven tyre wear
- Full, comprehensive service
As said though, start with basics, which for you is the cam sensor.
I have to draw a balance between making jobs worthwhile / not getting overwhelmed, and the spirit of OOF - and given your situation, I'd be prepared to do the items on the (more basic) top list for a box of stella as realistically they're not that complex, the only barrier really is the distance and the fact you shouldn't drive the car that far if it's poorly
I'm certain a local member will come along soon and offer to have a look. Someone with a little knowledge of the Omega could soon put this right for you, I'm certain :y
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How've you got on with this Jay? :-\ :-\
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Due to a lack of funds I have not bothered with it at the moment as I've had to prioritise. I really need your thoughts on that genuine Siemens cam sensor I found for under £20 (link posted above)
Car is awful at the moment as it won't go up hills without slowing to a stop and drinks fuel and won't start from cold so I've resorted to walking for the time being. Dad will not pay a penny more after that £300 odd for the radiator and fan.
I'll let you know how I get on.
Thanks
Jay
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..... I really need your thoughts on that genuine Siemens cam sensor I found for under £20 (link posted above) .....
I really couldn't say. Just know that the general opinion here is to buy OE because pattern parts fail sooner rather than later .... depends whether you can afford to lose the £20 for the cheap part if you then have to eventually buy OE :-\
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I thought that the cam and crank sensors for the Omegas were either made by Bosch or Siemens and it's just a matter of getting the right one! :-\
If it's not either of them then it's a Chinese copy and not worth bothering with, unless you're really really skint and you're prepared to change it again in a few days/weeks/months.... ;)
I might be wrong however..... :-\
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Right today I'm off to the scrappies after finding a good local mechanic who is dirt cheap. He diagnosed the top lead which needs replacing (and said if that wasn't the problem then it would be the coil pack (but I thought there wasn't a coil pack on these engines?)) and found a leak in the top bit of the big rubber air pipe (just above the bulge) which comes from the airbox. There is a massive crack which is where the hissing is coming from. He also said to get a cam sensor from the scrappy (if there aren't any then I'll be ordering the £15 siemens one off ebay (I have luck on my side so should work). I'll also be getting 4 spark plugs.
He's said if there aren't any omegas then I can get the parts from a Vectra with the 2.0L engine as there basically the same but sideways. (is this right?)
But I have encountered a far more serious and expensive problem. He told me that the cambelt inside the engine was loose and needed replacing. He said he could hear it and links in with the squealing and almost turning off symptoms that I've been experiencing. The service history says it was replaced at 110,000 and I'm only on 125,000 miles and its been about 2 years. Surely this can't be right. The cambelt on the outside looks to be tight and the round things they spin on seem fine and only a little rusted. If this is the case then I might as well scrap the car but after the £330 my dad spent on a rad and fan it would be a shame.
I've also encountered another problem, the engine temp rises slightly over 100 and only then will the cooling fan kick in and take it back to 80c/90c. It will go back up again to over 100 but never overheats. Is this ok? The expansion tank also seems to boil sometimes.
Thanks
Jay
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Temp gauge normal(ish) as they vary from car to car :y if the fans kick in and the temperature drops then I wouldn't worry too much. Try leaving the aircon on all the time, as that runs the front two fans permanently :y
Cambelt depends who changed it... Vauxhall had a nasty habit of changing the belts and not the tensioners/pulleys. Being a four pot, you'll need to do the water pump as well, but all service related items :y scrapping an otherwise working car for servicing related items is short sighted, expensive and futile, because every car you buy will need something doing and you end up buying £5-600 cars, spending £500 sorting them only to scrap them once the next thing happens, often tax/mot/insurance. Next car, and the cycle starts again... Better to fix one car properly once and run it for avyear or two :y
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Take the timing belt cover off yourself and investigate. I have a sneaky suspicion your mechanic is talking out of his arse, unless there is no compression (easily checked, so would have thought he would have done that)...
...oh, and avoid Ebay "genuine" sensors, as you'll find that invariably they are not.
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Well today I've got the leads and spark plugs. I'll get the cam sensor and the pipe thingy tomorrow.
Looking through the service history the last owner was quite meticulous in maintaining his car. He did everything by the book and its a real shame that the car is now in awful owner. I think he may have been a member here.
For example
8 March 2011 - New cambelt, water pump, auxilary belt, oil+filter, Antifreeze, door strap on drivers door - (Daz's stoke OMEGA MAN) Mileage 106130
3 may 2011 - Track rod end o/s New cat and MOT - 106650
30 September 2011 - Oil+filter and breather system cleaned - 107777
January to July 2012 - Pollen filter, Oil+filter, Anti freeze, rear brake pipes renewed with copper and heavy duty drop links fitted
The guy has owned it for 5 years and there is a proper service history, and before that there all vauxhall stamped.
Seeing that all the belts/pumps were done in 2011 and I'm now on 125250 miles I think I'll leave that for now and ignore the mechanic. What a shame.
Theres a massive dent on drivers side rear door and the passenger side rear light is all smashed. I will not rest until this car is perfected.
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steve, at omega spare parts nr heathrow for your parts, and I believe that you get a discount as a member of the forum, assuming that one of the breakers on here can't assist !
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I have done a very very stupid thing tonight. The wipers were parking in the wrong place and I decided to fix it by moving them when the wipers were operating, hoping that they would move back into the right position.
I pushed too hard and snapped something. The wipers don't work anymore and move freely and the motor seems to be working fine, I can hear it clunk.
DAMMIT :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
How do I fix this and how much will it cost. I must remember that I am not a mechanic.
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Pop the plasti scuttle panel off and have a look at the linkage.Hopefully you have just caused one of the arms to pop off its balljoint. ;)
If Daz changed the cambelt, waterpump etc. its unlikely theres a problem in that area.Sounds like the mechanic is either an idiot,or is trying to rip you off.
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Pop the plasti scuttle panel off and have a look at the linkage.Hopefully you have just caused one of the arms to pop off its balljoint. ;)
If Daz changed the cambelt, waterpump etc. its unlikely theres a problem in that area.Sounds like the mechanic is either an idiot,or is trying to rip you off.
How do I remove one of these? I can remove the passenger side one as it clips off but the drivers side is fixed in position. Theres a funny looking screw holding it down I think?
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Its a torx screw.You need the tools to do the job to be honest.Whereabouts in the country are you ? There may be an OOFer nearby who could give a bit of help.
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Jay, welcome to oof.
Don't take this the wrong way but I think you've gone about this the wrong way.
Cam sensor is what you need. once that's fitted you can then assess the engine's performance (i.e. if its misfiring after the cam sensor is fitted then look at leads, coil pack etc etc)
Do you have tools? If so follow Albs advice re the wipers.
You seem to be panicking a bit. It's scary when you first play with cars. I should know. just done some work on mine, cocked it up and wrecked the cylinder head :) but it's just a machine and the more you can do yourself the better off you'll be in the future. follow the advice on here. theyre the ones that know :)
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Been asked a couple of times now...
Where on this island are you?
As suggested, someone local might be able to help... :y
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Says U.K. so not necessarily on this island. :P ;D
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True, but will still be on an island :P
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Been asked a couple of times now...
Where on this island are you?
As suggested, someone local might be able to help... :y
He's in Oldham ..... he said earlier on in the thread. ;)
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Absolutely agree with Webby,step back for a moment or two and take a good look at all of advice that has been offered as this is based on solid fact drawn from many years of Omega ownership.You will be more likely to solve your immediate problems by drawing on what has been said here rather than listening to so called mechanics who more than likely have had only minimal experience of working on an Omega and are more interested in taking your hard earned off you.Hopefully in the meantime someone on here who is near to you will be able to help you to get the car running properly and keep it so.It's a pity that you are so far away because I have just sold a 2.0 GLS after owning it for twelve years and have just got rid of a lot of new parts that were left over.....all of which would have helped you with your problems .......bugger >:(
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Having said all of that...I'll have a good look around all of my sheds and see if there's any thing that I've missed,and I'm sure that there will be a few others on here that will do the same,but until you can bottom out what's needed........ :-\ :y
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::) not too far from Daz or Pete then :y
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Fix that cam sensor and i bet 99 percent of your problems disappear, this forum is great but you do need to act on the advice given for it to help!!
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Its been a few weeks since I last posted but I have been really busy due to a load of history coursework and uni applications etc. I have been using the 'bus' which cannot go on for any longer as using public transport is distressing. Half term has arrived and I have time to sort everything out.
As mrgreen has said the cam sensor needs doing first and I'm hoping that it cures everything, but I need to know if the cam sensor connector plug has square or rounded corners for my type of car. How do I check this as I can't remove the cover myself without removing the belts because I'll mess it up. I really don't want to get this wrong just in case of the mechanic opening everything up only to find that I've provided him with the wrong part.
Tried the car recently and its cranking but not firing up. I get pops from the exhaust while doing this, I'm holding it and its turning and turning but just doesn't fire. it eventually fires which leads to a really really rough idle. The accelerator doesn't do anything during this rough idle. When I get it to accelerate eventually, I have to ride the clutch in high revs as it will simply rough idle again if the revs go down. When its warm there are absolutely no problems at all. - fingers crossed I'm hoping this is related to the cam sensor.
Can only drive the car when its not raining or if its light drizzle. Had a look at the wiper motor and its spinning on its own with nothing connected to it. The balljoint is still there but it looks like the linkage has snapped off the motor. I will post a video tomorrow.
Are there any forum members in the Manchester area that would be able to offer some help or have a good look at the car this week in exchange for alcohol which will be provided :) *by the way I am in oldham and do you know where daz/pete are located?
Thanks for your help!
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Daz is in Stoke and Pete in Chester iirc :y