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[albitz]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.
Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Lol, in reality Maggie sorted this country out but, in doing so had to upset a lot of people!. I personaly have no like or dislike for her

She laid the foundations for the last 10+years of economic growth and got rid of the rather huge anounts of debt the labour lot had run up before her (hmmmm, sounds like history about to repeat it self again).

But all most people see is the loss of the huge burden of coal mines (tey dug thier own grave!) and ship building.....

Yes indeed Mark!  By then the UK was using only a fraction of the coal being produced.....tax payer subsidising under Labour; the ship building industry could not compete with foreign (Japanese ship yards in particular).....tax payer subsidizing; the car plants were outdated and producing crap cars in over bearing unionized environments........tax payer subsidising;  the steel plants were over producing as the market for their products had dramatically declined in the UK due to the collapse of the aforementioned industries, and the lack of worldwide demand.........tax payers subsidising.  

Finally most key industries were being crippled by that previously mentioned trade union factor, especially in the nationalised industries of British Leyland, British Railways and the National Coal Board, with the Government (Labour), and thus......the tax payer......being held to ransom with widespread strikes over ridiculous pay or conditions claims!  Oh yes, and then there was the strike at British Leyland because 'the management' had sacked men regularly sleeping on the floor whilst being paid to work a night shift!

This is all that Maggie brought to a halt after her 1979 election victory.  The 1980's saw pride in GB rise, although, of course, for those who initially lost jobs in the dramatic events it was far from pleasant.  But finally the Government ran the Country, not the unions as they had done prior to 1979. 8-) 8-)

Oh Lizzie .................I like you ..............I really do. ........but I have to ask the question.......Are you mad woman?

Thatcher was a disaster for this country......she divided Britain like few other PM 's before or since..................and eventually she became so detached from reality .............that she had to be booted out by her own party at the end of 1990....in order to make way for JM. :-/ :-/ :-/

I agree that this current Labour government has precious little to do with socialist values........as did the Blair government before it. :-/

I feel that we could have a complete change in politics soon......as we did when Clem Attlee replaced Churchill in 1945......and then went on to form the NHS in1948.......something the Tories of the time were very much against.

Don't worry Lizzie....................I still like you ...........even if your politics is well to the right of Vlad the Impaler or Genghis Khan.....so keep up the great postings.

Funny you should say that Optimist, but every Management Profiling I have ever had to undertake in my commercial years showed me well hard right of centre!  However, I have mellowed in recent years, especially with my political studies, and believe true pure Marxism (not Russian or Chinese communism!!) may well be the way to go for modern society .

As for Maggie......well what more can I say in addition to what I have already stated!   As for the Conservatives in 1990 'booting' her out........12 years of the blue's out of office after the 'grey' man' Major says it all for me.  

[Markie]

im leaning backwards in my chair, what a strange statement to make :-/

Not really, seems that the government is a permanent cause for complaint, regardless of subject matter, & there just aren't enough trees/ lamposts & rope to go round!
Seems you have all forgotten that wretched Thatcher woman & what she did to the country

strange statement but each to their own...

Thatcher remains one of the best true leaders we have had in modern times, in my opinion of course

As for hanging this current bunch of thieves and liars that we call a government....hell yeah can i tighten the noose, please, i`ll pay?!? This bunch have wrecked this once Great nation and it will take a conservative government at least a decade to fix it.

I thought i would struggle to find a bigger two faced cheating liar than tony blair - i wont even do him the courtesy of capitals :-? .....but step forward gordon brown....

[cem_devecioglu]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.
Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

Spot on Albitz.......................Thatcher hated the unions as did most tories...........and yes "super powerful" unions can be a problem....
But let's not forget ..............if there had never been a Trade union movement...........then we would all be working 20 hours a day ......for a loaf of bread.....and a sip of water.
Responsible unions have a positive effect on society.

The Tories were very much against the "minimum wage"........their mantra has always been....I do well ....because I make sure that you don't

[waspy]

I would just like to say

<--------COCKS

[cem_devecioglu]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

Spot on Albitz.......................Thatcher hated the unions as did most tories...........and yes "super powerful" unions can be a problem....
But let's not forget ..............if there had never been a Trade union movement...........then we would all be working 20 hours a day ......for a loaf of bread.....and a sip of water.
Responsible unions have a positive effect on society.

The Tories were very much against the "minimum wage"........their mantra has always been....I do well ....because I make sure that you don't

 

[Martin_1962]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.
Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

Labour shut more mines than shut during MT years

[Martin_1962]

The unions did not behave responsible they wanted money for nothing.

Scargill was a thingy and needed to be shot.

[Lizzie_Zoom]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.
Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

The truth is Albitz is the mines were over-producing expensive, and growling expensive, subsidised coal that no one wanted in those quantities from many outdated pits.  The majority of houses were not using coal anymore, nor were ships, factories, nor the railways that had ceased using that fuel 11 years before 1979.

King coal was dead, and the country only needed the coal for, as you rightly state, the coal fired power stations, which this country should have lost by now!  So why keep an industry going that was out of date, highly expensive to run, not wanted, and dangerous to work in.  Indeed on the last point I have heard and seen many ex-miners admit they never wanted their sons to work in such diabolical conditions.

So it makes sense to import the extra coal we need (I believe we do have a few mines still producing including open-cast ones), as our needs decline to zero with the closing (hopefully) of all coal fired power stations. 8-)  

[Marks DTM Calib]

Thats and the miners were thier own worst enemy with the damage they used to do to the kit so they were sent home on full pay and bonus!

[TheBoy]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

Spot on Albitz.......................Thatcher hated the unions as did most tories...........and yes "super powerful" unions can be a problem....
But let's not forget ..............if there had never been a Trade union movement...........then we would all be working 20 hours a day ......for a loaf of bread.....and a sip of water.
Responsible unions have a positive effect on society.

The Tories were very much against the "minimum wage"........their mantra has always been....I do well ....because I make sure that you don't

Problem was, in the 70s, power corrupts and the unions had got too powerful, and were making ridiculous, unsustainable demands.  I know at the Morris factory in Oxford, walkouts would happen purely because the biscuits had run out

[Pitchfork]

I also dont agree that the mining industry was doomed regardless.
It was planned by the tories that if they won the 1979 election(and it is documentd)that they would take on the miners and do whatever it took to beat them.They knew that if they beat the miners then the rest of the unions would would soon roll over,and Thatcher had a personal vendetta against them for bringing down the Heath govt.in which she was a minister.Luckily for her they were led by a bloke with the intellect of an educationally sub normal gnat.He could have beaten her but he was way to stupid.
Meanwhile the farmers (who are always tories)carried on recieving huge subsidies from the taxpayer and of course almost every business in the country which employs more than a handful of people is now getting subsidies and we are importing very expensive foreign coal to fuel the coal fired power stations,The whole energy industry in this country is now owned by foriegners and they blackmail us constantly,so maybe it would have been better to chuck Scargill off a boat in the middle of the night and keep the mines open,with sensible management(rather than the lunatic mcgregor) and moderate unions.

Spot on Albitz.......................Thatcher hated the unions as did most tories...........and yes "super powerful" unions can be a problem....
But let's not forget ..............if there had never been a Trade union movement...........then we would all be working 20 hours a day ......for a loaf of bread.....and a sip of water.
Responsible unions have a positive effect on society.

The Tories were very much against the "minimum wage"........their mantra has always been....I do well ....because I make sure that you don't

Problem was, in the 70s, power corrupts and the unions had got too powerful, and were making ridiculous, unsustainable demands.  I know at the Morris factory in Oxford, walkouts would happen purely because the biscuits had run out

Biscuits with legs! Whatever next?

[TheBoy]

Maggie, bless her cotton socks, normally brings utter hatred or lots of admiration, with few able to sit on the fence.


She certainly appeared to become too detached at the end (or did she simply upset the media?), but the tories suffered too much infighting - most governments start to fall apart after 2 - 3 elections, because, again, power corrupts.

[Dusty]

Maggie, bless her cotton socks, normally brings utter hatred or lots of admiration, with few able to sit on the fence.


She certainly appeared to become too detached at the end (or did she simply upset the media?), but the tories suffered too much infighting - most governments start to fall apart after 2 - 3 elections, because, again, power corrupts.

Almost inevitable I would say.