Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[tunnie]

On BBC 2 now, very interesting. Charting the history of the single currency.

Great points raised of how the debt climbed, fact as a single currency the borrowing rates became the same between countries.

[TheBoy]

Was gonna watch it, but Peston is a first class, self centred, arrogant prat

[tunnie]

Still found it interesting, partially the bits of how it was formed & how certain restrictions were dropped in order to allow other states to join.

[TheBoy]

Still found it interesting, partially the bits of how it was formed & how certain restrictions were dropped in order to allow other states to join.

Indeed, Europe (and UK) got carried away this millenium, and I think they thought recession could never happen, despite history proving it does every 10-15yrs.  So when recession hit, it was hard.

[TheBoy]

But I still couldn't have watched it with Peston doing it.


There was a report (based I suspect on rumour rather than confirmed fact) that Germany, before xmas, were printing Deutchemarks, clearly showing they think, if the report is correct, that Germany think the Euro will fail.  That would break UK, at a time we are already breaked.

[Entwood]

Not sure I agree with that last ....

If, BIG If, the euro were to go completely and all the countries reverted to pre-euro currencies, the general consensus, in the tabloids, is that the Deutchmark would be exceedingly strong and cause major problems for other currencies.... doom , doom and more doom caused by the government.

Other than the fact that the UK government has no part in that scenario, which shows how wrong the tabloids are already, there is an opposing view that, due to the large amount of money the Germans have injected into supporting the weaker Euro currencies (money they will not get back), the Deutchmark may not be as strong as that.

A "slightly" strong DM would hit their exports and make their imports rise, thus giving other countries, including UK, the chance to export more.

The end of the Euro will cause problems for sure, but it would also present possibilities.

[TheBoy]

Not sure I agree with that last ....

If, BIG If, the euro were to go completely and all the countries reverted to pre-euro currencies, the general consensus, in the tabloids, is that the Deutchmark would be exceedingly strong and cause major problems for other currencies.... doom , doom and more doom caused by the government.

Other than the fact that the UK government has no part in that scenario, which shows how wrong the tabloids are already, there is an opposing view that, due to the large amount of money the Germans have injected into supporting the weaker Euro currencies (money they will not get back), the Deutchmark may not be as strong as that.

A "slightly" strong DM would hit their exports and make their imports rise, thus giving other countries, including UK, the chance to export more.

The end of the Euro will cause problems for sure, but it would also present possibilities.

As a minimum, I reckon we'd have another banking crisis. With all that that brings.

[albitz]

Single currency cant possibly work without political union. No-one outside of the political and chattering classes wants political union.They want it a lot less now than they ever did before.
It looks inevitable in many ways that Greece will leave the Eurozone,but dont underestimate the lengths the Germans will go to to try tokeep them in.Germanys worst nightmare is for Greece to leave and then start to recover relatively quickly (which is quite likely).Once that happens the dam will burst - Spain,Portugal,Ireland - end of Euro,soon followed by collapse of EU.
Big problems for all in the short to medium term (probably) but the best thing for all concerned in the long term.
And to think the reason given for the whole EU project was to stop Germany from ever becoming dominant in Europe again. That worked well didnt it ?
Just had to turn over from Question Time (again) due to remedials & retards talking utter shite about how we need to spend our way out of trouble.They just wont get off that rather gravy train will they.
Fortunately I have discovered that Snatch is on Channel 5.

[Terbs]

Was gonna watch it, but Peston is a first class, self centred, arrogant prat

With TB all the way with this....
I don't know why but I cannot stand the bloke

[cleggy]

Single currency cant possibly work without political union. No-one outside of the political and chattering classes wants political union.They want it a lot less now than they ever did before.
It looks inevitable in many ways that Greece will leave the Eurozone,but dont underestimate the lengths the Germans will go to to try tokeep them in.Germanys worst nightmare is for Greece to leave and then start to recover relatively quickly (which is quite likely).Once that happens the dam will burst - Spain,Portugal,Ireland - end of Euro,soon followed by collapse of EU.
Big problems for all in the short to medium term (probably) but the best thing for all concerned in the long term.
And to think the reason given for the whole EU project was to stop Germany from ever becoming dominant in Europe again. That worked well didnt it ?
Just had to turn over from Question Time (again) due to remedials & retards talking utter shite about how we need to spend our way out of trouble.They just wont get off that rather gravy train will they.
Fortunately I have discovered that Snatch is on Channel 5.

Not Jessie Wallace's again

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Single currency cant possibly work without political union. No-one outside of the political and chattering classes wants political union.They want it a lot less now than they ever did before.
It looks inevitable in many ways that Greece will leave the Eurozone,but dont underestimate the lengths the Germans will go to to try tokeep them in.Germanys worst nightmare is for Greece to leave and then start to recover relatively quickly (which is quite likely).Once that happens the dam will burst - Spain,Portugal,Ireland - end of Euro,soon followed by collapse of EU.
Big problems for all in the short to medium term (probably) but the best thing for all concerned in the long term.
And to think the reason given for the whole EU project was to stop Germany from ever becoming dominant in Europe again. That worked well didnt it ?
Just had to turn over from Question Time (again) due to remedials & retards talking utter shite about how we need to spend our way out of trouble.They just wont get off that rather gravy train will they.

Fortunately I have discovered that Snatch is on Channel 5.



Still plenty of pussy on Channel 5 then.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Single currency cant possibly work without political union. No-one outside of the political and chattering classes wants political union.They want it a lot less now than they ever did before.
It looks inevitable in many ways that Greece will leave the Eurozone,but dont underestimate the lengths the Germans will go to to try tokeep them in.Germanys worst nightmare is for Greece to leave and then start to recover relatively quickly (which is quite likely).Once that happens the dam will burst - Spain,Portugal,Ireland - end of Euro,soon followed by collapse of EU.
Big problems for all in the short to medium term (probably) but the best thing for all concerned in the long term.
And to think the reason given for the whole EU project was to stop Germany from ever becoming dominant in Europe again. That worked well didnt it ?
Just had to turn over from Question Time (again) due to remedials & retards talking utter shite about how we need to spend our way out of trouble.They just wont get off that rather gravy train will they.
Fortunately I have discovered that Snatch is on Channel 5.

I believe it is inevitable if the Euro is to survive.......about  which I have my doubts.

[Varche]

We live in very dangerous times.

As someone living in a weak Euro country(Spain) I am only too aware of the dangers that there are. However it would be foolhardy to assume that the Uk is in a "strong" position. It isn't. If the euro unravels the banks (my favourites  ) would face Armageddon with their losses. British banks are up to their hilt in Euro debt so the Uk isn't immune.

Interestingly it was North European countries that first bust the debt rules. Spain only succumbed as late as 2009. What did for us here was the construction boom leaving the country with masses of empty property that someone has to pay for. There are plenty of people who have been made to pay for "off plan" that were never construicted and never will be!

Loads of Spanish banks (many downgraded last night) have toxic debts but and here is the kicker- they took out government debt too. Our PM here is desperately trying to fix it.

What is needed is yet more ECB cheap loans or some tool like EU debt bonds- out of thin air. That will kick the problem down the road a bit more and add to the burden on our children.

I fear for the Greeks. Most people, Greeks included haven't a clue about just how much debt their governments have racked up. When austerity actually kicks in (because mostly hardly anything has actually happened yet) then we will all start squeelling.

Me glass half empty

[Grrrrrr]

Yeah, interesting mess as politicians scrabble for power. All about control.

Remember Germany was only too happy to lower those entry restrictions because it stopped Spain, Italy and Greece from devaluating their currency. Once out Greece etc will devalue like a shot and Germany will have no export market (too expensive) and all of a sudden these countries internal markets and exports will pick up. Germany won't want that in a hurry. Not when they are currently in control.

The british banks are full of toxic European debt - possibly only trumped by the french banks. Noticed how the government had another massive injection of quantitative easing after the last Eurocrisis in the winter? Ever see any of that filter down? I reckon that went straight into bank coffers to offset the fiddle they're doing trying to keep Europe afloat. We're too tied into Europe not to have to help pay them out. Camaron's lying when he says the British tax-payer won't pay. We already have and will continue to, through the IMF or the back door of the banks or whatever.

Bi question: is it worth it? How much money do you throw away before realising it is a bottomless pit? Has this brought to light the internal flaws in the system? Do you throw that system away or build a new one that works or go back to the way we were? All the politicians want is to hold onto power and control. What's best for the countries? Probably pull out and then rebuild some sort of alliance but based on policies that properly support each contries needs and protects their assets rather than supporting the german export market and internal inefficiencies in countries that were never financially viable.

I'd have let the banks go to the wall in the first place and stuff 'em. Even if I lost all my saving it wouldn't be the end of the world because I never had much. I'll earn it back - possibly by setting up a bank that works and doesn't rape the rest of the world in the process.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Read a very interesting report regarding UK exports and how industry is focusing more attention outside the euro zone and less within due to the poor exchange rate with the Euro.