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[Entwood]

Hi
As most of you know by now I'm researching the LPG conversion - and probably boring you all to bits ...

Latest question... regards mapping...

In a conversation today with a possible contender ... he said the BRC system did NOT require ANY mapping as the LPG ECU took its signals directly from the petrol injector ECU and so used the "normal" signals as required ... if the petrol ECU decides the system nedes more fuel, the gas ECU provides it, the only additional thing done is to actually turn off the petrol injectors when they are not required.

This makes the BRC system simpler and more reliable as it never requires fiddly re-mapping.

Does that make any sense ?? and is it true

[Jay w]

I was always under the impression that LPG settings were always richer than those of petrol, as a result the injectors had to be open for longer.

[Kevin Wood]

I wouldn't say it's 100% true. If you sized the LPG injector nozzles exactly you could make them work on the same pulse width as the petrol injectors. However, my experience with the couple I've done is that the LPG injectors need different correction at different levels of engine load.

There is also only a limited amount of adjustment the main ECU will do based on the lambda sensor output before it decides something is wrong and puts the EML on.

Another issue is that if the ECU winds on a load of long term fuel trim when on gas, it'll run like a dog for a while when you switch back to petrol, until the fuel trim reverts to normal.

In summary, they need some tweaking IME. However, yesterday we had Marie's running perfectly after about 8 or 9 miles on the road with yours truly fiddling with the laptop on the passenger seat.

Kevin

[Entwood]

Thanks KW .. so he's telling porkies ..  another one off the list ...

[Martin_1962]

Thanks KW .. so he's telling porkies ..  another one off the list ...

He may do the fiddling but not count it

[Martin_1962]

Hi
As most of you know by now I'm researching the LPG conversion - and probably boring you all to bits ...

Latest question... regards mapping...

In a conversation today with a possible contender ... he said the BRC system did NOT require ANY mapping as the LPG ECU took its signals directly from the petrol injector ECU and so used the "normal" signals as required ... if the petrol ECU decides the system nedes more fuel, the gas ECU provides it, the only additional thing done is to actually turn off the petrol injectors when they are not required.

This makes the BRC system simpler and more reliable as it never requires fiddly re-mapping.

Does that make any sense ?? and is it true

AFAIK the LPG ECU needs to apply fiddle factors at different loads and engine speeds due to the different way gas injectors work, and the different burning properties of propane

[Entwood]

Thanks Martin, confims that guy is off the list .. his "selling point" was "never need to remap, no need for checks, 100 % adjustment free etc etc" ....

Flying bacon  

Looks like I'll be going for the BRC system done by the guys near Winchester .. £1850 + VAT  

[tunnie]

Hi
As most of you know by now I'm researching the LPG conversion - and probably boring you all to bits ...

Latest question... regards mapping...

In a conversation today with a possible contender ... he said the BRC system did NOT require ANY mapping as the LPG ECU took its signals directly from the petrol injector ECU and so used the "normal" signals as required ... if the petrol ECU decides the system nedes more fuel, the gas ECU provides it, the only additional thing done is to actually turn off the petrol injectors when they are not required.

This makes the BRC system simpler and more reliable as it never requires fiddly re-mapping.

Does that make any sense ?? and is it true

Come now, you know the only TRUE condendor is the wonder full Mr Kevin Wood! or JayW!  

I would honestly, bribe a few people here, who know how to LPG the V6, and to do it RIGHT, bribe them with either some notes, beer, women, or all of the above to get the job done right.

Poor Danny here had a tough experiance, and i would hate to see the same thing happen again.

[Kevin Wood]

Thanks Martin, confims that guy is off the list .. his "selling point" was "never need to remap, no need for checks, 100 % adjustment free etc etc" ....

Flying bacon  

Looks like I'll be going for the BRC system done by the guys near Winchester .. £1850 + VAT  

If you're coming up this way it might be worth talking to these guys : http://www.amsautogas.com.

He's only a couple of miles up the road from me and James and I have popped in there for bits and pieces before. He gave us a load of advice and seemed knowledgeable and the type who would do things properly or not at all. You could have a bed for the night here while he's doing it too.

Have you thought about DIY?

Kevin

[Entwood]

Hi
As most of you know by now I'm researching the LPG conversion - and probably boring you all to bits ...

Latest question... regards mapping...

In a conversation today with a possible contender ... he said the BRC system did NOT require ANY mapping as the LPG ECU took its signals directly from the petrol injector ECU and so used the "normal" signals as required ... if the petrol ECU decides the system nedes more fuel, the gas ECU provides it, the only additional thing done is to actually turn off the petrol injectors when they are not required.

This makes the BRC system simpler and more reliable as it never requires fiddly re-mapping.

Does that make any sense ?? and is it true

Come now, you know the only TRUE condendor is the wonder full Mr Kevin Wood! or JayW!  

I would honestly, bribe a few people here, who know how to LPG the V6, and to do it RIGHT, bribe them with either some notes, beer, women, or all of the above to get the job done right.

Poor Danny here had a tough experiance, and i would hate to see the same thing happen again.

A few little points to make here  

1.  I just don't think its right to burden folks with major work that I'm too incompetent to even help with, and I have no facilities to offer. I know KW, James and Marie have just done one in "nearly" a weekend .. but I can't expect folks to run around after me... and I would not be rude enough to expect any warranty .. lets face it .. the guys would be doing  me a big enough favour in the first place !!

2.  As my intention is to keep the car for about 10 years (if I can), my research, so far, indicates that the BRC system appears to be the present "top-of-the-range" and has the least problems - long term.

3.  The BRC system is not available for DIY but will come with a 2 year warranty.

Those are my present thoughts ... always willing to listen to counter arguments ... this is a major learning process for me ....  

[Entwood]

KW .. those are the guys who top the list at the moment ...  I've spoken to "Patrick" and he seems to know what he's on about ..... he reckons  a week to do the job, but provides a courtesy car, a 1000 mile check, "flashlube" included...  

[Debs.]

I`m watching this and other LPG posts with growing interest in the 'possibilites'.

I have a large stored-source of cheap(ish) Liquid Propane in my garden; from the 1000 ltr. central heating fuel-tank!.

I pay significantly less than the petrol station prices for bulk LPG delivery, but wonder what pressure the car system`s LPG tanks accept for refueling: anyone know?

[Entwood]

Debs .. you lucky sod !!!

You buy a simple "liquid transfer pump" which allows you to fill your car from the bulk installation !!

If you don't have LPG yet .. get it soon you can save a fortune !!  You just don't tell anyone you have the pump ...  

[Marie]

A few little points to make here  

1.  I just don't think its right to burden folks with major work that I'm too incompetent to even help with, and I have no facilities to offer. I know KW, James and Marie have just done one in "nearly" a weekend .. but I can't expect folks to run around after me... and I would not be rude enough to expect any warranty .. lets face it .. the guys would be doing  me a big enough favour in the first place !!

2.  As my intention is to keep the car for about 10 years (if I can), my research, so far, indicates that the BRC system appears to be the present "top-of-the-range" and has the least problems - long term.

3.  The BRC system is not available for DIY but will come with a 2 year warranty.

Those are my present thoughts ... always willing to listen to counter arguments ... this is a major learning process for me ....  

i didnt have any experiance with lpg. i followed james and kevs lead. There are things that you could do like run the fuel and power lines under the car. dependent on the tank drill the holes in the boot secure the tank and fit the filler and make tea!

[Kevin Wood]

KW .. those are the guys who top the list at the moment ...  I've spoken to "Patrick" and he seems to know what he's on about ..... he reckons  a week to do the job, but provides a courtesy car, a 1000 mile check, "flashlube" included...  

Patrick's the chap we spoke to. Only had a chat with him as I said but he seemed competent and was happy to advise us despite the fact we only bought a couple of bits and pieces.

Whilst I would be happy to help, this weekend has shown it requires 3 people who are confident with working on cars to get close to doing one in a weekend and even then we were in the garage all waking hours and I felt a little sorry for Mrs. KW because the only time she saw us all weekend was to bring us food to eat on the job, bless her.

James being out of circulation when he would probably have been happy to come and help in return for a contribution to his "guzzler petrol fund" is also an issue.

I also feel a little uneasy about doing a conversion "for" someone rather than "helping" them if that makes sense? There's some fairly major surgery involved and I'd prefer to share the responsibility. :-/

Anyway, if you do come down this way you'll have to pop in. As I say, he's only a couple of miles up the road. I'd also be very interested in having a look over the result.

Kevin