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[TheBoy]

Assuming it will be on budget - it won't - these figures of £53bn are best case scenario, and do not include the changes that will need to be made. I mean, FFS, they haven't decided on the rail design yet, so how can they cost it?

Its another civil service monumental white elephant, that won't get used unless you need to travel from central Mancs/Leeds to a specific station in London.

And the cost? Not the £2k per household mentioned, its £2.7k for every UK worker (inc part time). Thats just to build, and assuming the guesses are correct. HS2's own admission is 50-60% subsidisation on fares.

Scrap it now.

[TheBoy]

My mistake, £55bn. Looking at wrong set of figures for Phase 2.

[albitz]

If all that is true - cancel the bloody thing now. ............Im not paying 2.7k plus subsidy for something I will never use.
Anyone oop tnorth want to start up an independence movement ?  I will chip in a few bob.  

[Rog]

HS2 sounds to me like another ill-thought-out vanity project.

I recently took a train to Glasgow. It was almost frighteningly fast. Five and something hours from my house to a hotel just outside the city centre . . . on existing lines, and costing less than driving or flying. I really don't see the point. I really don't see that half an hour or even a whole hour makes much practical difference.

AND . . . . you can be sure that tickets will cost a fortune, so nobody will use the line anyway.

[Vamps]

If all that is true - cancel the bloody thing now. ............Im not paying 2.7k plus subsidy for something I will never use.
Anyone oop tnorth want to start up an independence movement ?  I will chip in a few bob.  

I am and it's not coming all the way up here and most people do not want it, very few of us want to go to London, even Miss Vamps, age 12, asked why when the cost of a ticket will prevent most people using it, she was more verbal and passionate that that - I was quite proud of her.....
A huge waste of money imo.....yes Lizzie imo which I am allowed......

[Nickbat]

Assuming it will be on budget - it won't - these figures of £53bn are best case scenario, and do not include the changes that will need to be made. I mean, FFS, they haven't decided on the rail design yet, so how can they cost it?

Its another civil service monumental white elephant, that won't get used unless you need to travel from central Mancs/Leeds to a specific station in London.

And the cost? Not the £2k per household mentioned, its £2.7k for every UK worker (inc part time). Thats just to build, and assuming the guesses are correct. HS2's own admission is 50-60% subsidisation on fares.

Scrap it now.

Agreed! 

[Terbs]

Its another case of sod who gets in the way....bulldoze their homes, shut their business, bugger up the countryside. We don't live near it so sod the rest

Well...I for one don't want it coming through here

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Reading all the posts, with many so anti this step into the  future, I am so glad you were not around in Victorian England!  If you had been there, Britain would never have become Great!

Great Britain either moves on and modernises, or dies.  Then everyone will be complaining about a lack of job opportunities far greater than now.

Let progress wagons roll on!

[jimac]

Reading all the posts, with many so anti this step into the  future, I am so glad you were not around in Victorian England!  If you had been there, Britain would never have become Great!

Great Britain either moves on and modernises, or dies.  Then everyone will be complaining about a lack of job opportunities far greater than now.

Let progress wagons roll on!

But progress does not need to be centred on London and the South East.  The vast majority of people in this country do not live or work in the South East corner of Britain and seldom need to get there.  Rather than making the funnel wider, to pour more people into an already crowded and expensive part of the country, I'd rather see real incentives for businesses (and other organisations) to relocate or expand into the less densely populated (and often more attractive) regions.

[Entwood]

Reading all the posts, with many so anti this step into the  future, I am so glad you were not around in Victorian England!  If you had been there, Britain would never have become Great!

Great Britain either moves on and modernises, or dies.  Then everyone will be complaining about a lack of job opportunities far greater than now.

Let progress wagons roll on!

But progress does not need to be centred on London and the South East.  The vast majority of people in this country do not live or work in the South East corner of Britain and seldom need to get there.  Rather than making the funnel wider, to pour more people into an already crowded and expensive part of the country, I'd rather see real incentives for businesses (and other organisations) to relocate or expand into the less densely populated (and often more attractive) regions.

So ... how does the business that "relocates" to your "less populated area" actually DO business ?? if its major client base is in a populated area ??

That is the whole purpose of better infrastructure links .. it actually ALLOWS what you desire !! Without the decent links the business must remain in the populated area .. with them, it can move and still service its clients.  It is fine being able to view/order/pay for your items on the internet .. but you actually do want them delivered don't you ?? and that takes infrastructure.

Lots of hypocrisy (again) over these issues ... "Government must do more"   "Government must invest" "Government encourages north/south divide as they all live in London" ......  but when they actually do something that answers all 3 points  "Government wastes money" "Government blights lives" etc etc etc ..

It is, I believe, simply that many folk don't think, they simply repeat the headlines of the politically motivated press... who never let the truth get in the way of a headline ..

Good news sells no papers ... slating the government does ...  regardless of the truth.

[jimac]

Reading all the posts, with many so anti this step into the  future, I am so glad you were not around in Victorian England!  If you had been there, Britain would never have become Great!

Great Britain either moves on and modernises, or dies.  Then everyone will be complaining about a lack of job opportunities far greater than now.

Let progress wagons roll on!

But progress does not need to be centred on London and the South East.  The vast majority of people in this country do not live or work in the South East corner of Britain and seldom need to get there.  Rather than making the funnel wider, to pour more people into an already crowded and expensive part of the country, I'd rather see real incentives for businesses (and other organisations) to relocate or expand into the less densely populated (and often more attractive) regions.

So ... how does the business that "relocates" to your "less populated area" actually DO business ?? if its major client base is in a populated area ??

That is the whole purpose of better infrastructure links .. it actually ALLOWS what you desire !! Without the decent links the business must remain in the populated area .. with them, it can move and still service its clients.  It is fine being able to view/order/pay for your items on the internet .. but you actually do want them delivered don't you ?? and that takes infrastructure.

Lots of hypocrisy (again) over these issues ... "Government must do more"   "Government must invest" "Government encourages north/south divide as they all live in London" ......  but when they actually do something that answers all 3 points  "Government wastes money" "Government blights lives" etc etc etc ..

It is, I believe, simply that many folk don't think, they simply repeat the headlines of the politically motivated press... who never let the truth get in the way of a headline ..

Good news sells no papers ... slating the government does ...  regardless of the truth.

But we have infrastructure, and businesses outside of the South East that still manage to thrive.  I order goods off the Internet today and can get them delivered tomorrow.  HS2 is all about getting people into and out of London quicker, not about providing new routes or opening up non-existant corridors.

And, like I said, most people don't live in the South East so there is already a good client base everywhere else.  Many distribution depots are already based in the Midlands so that goods can be distributed effectively around the country.  I don't see HS2 helping with this at all.

[redelitev6]

  And they say there is no money to repair the roads , the "A1" in Northumberland into Scotland is SINGLE carriage way for long stretches , transport policy in this country is a joke

[Entwood]

Keep up at the back ..

http://www.journallive.co.uk/north-east-news/todays-news/2013/01/26/a1-dualling-in-northumbeland-is-back-on-agenda-clegg-61634-32682207

[albitz]

London and the home counties has a population of approx. 18 million people.The whole of thenorth of England has a population of approx. 14.5 million people.Thats why everything tends to centre around London and the surrounding area.Its the capital city and  also arguably the worlds biggest finance centre,so that will always be where the money (and therefore people) tends to be concentrated.
In many ways people in the north are better off as its a much less crowded & hectic place to be.

[Terbs]

Thats a better suggestion....use the money to repair the roads

I have to say...irrespective of all the comments on here....it seems nobody gives a toss for those in its way. As I said earlier,....'It doesn't come near me so I ain't bothered.' attitude.

I can remember when Concorde was needed for business, it was needed for business to survive....where is it now !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rotting in museums while business now trundles around again in 747's etc. If rail travel is so good....why haven't all the lorries disappeared from our roads ? They were talking about container rail to do this donkey's years ago, Another failure