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[Nickbat]

I had a brief look through some of those links, Lizzie. Much of it is slur and "guilt by association" stuff. The EFD is primarily a Eurosceptic grouping and, given that the majority of MEPs are very much pro-Europe, it seems not unreasonable to me to group with others in EU debates who share a similar views on the growing EU superstate. It doesn't mean you have to agree with their domestic policies.

You said: Ukip is the only UK party to explicitly ban BNP members from joining”. What party, other than a party whose policies are attractive to such organisations, would need to do that?
UKIP is the only party that favours controls on immigration. Thus, it is bound to receive attention from those who would support BNP. There is always overlap in party policies. However, the BNP is far-LEFT in its views (wanting state control over many areas).

You said: More recently, however, Farage refused to vote to oppose moves for the European Union to fund the BNP.
I would too. No matter how odious the BNP is, it sets a very dangerous precedent to refuse funding merely because you don't like their policies. First they came for the BNP, then they came for UKIP, etc..

There are some odious creeps in the Conservative Party, The Labour Party and the Liberal Democrat Party, why should UKIP be any different? The point is that UKIP is clearly not racist in its policies and attracts people of many different races and religions.

Immigration MUST be controlled and I find it irritating that as soon as the subject is brought up, the old racist card is brought out yet again...    

[Lizzie_Zoom]

I had a brief look through some of those links, Lizzie. Much of it is slur and "guilt by association" stuff. The EFD is primarily a Eurosceptic grouping and, given that the majority of MEPs are very much pro-Europe, it seems not unreasonable to me to group with others in EU debates who share a similar views on the growing EU superstate. It doesn't mean you have to agree with their domestic policies.

You said: Ukip is the only UK party to explicitly ban BNP members from joining”. What party, other than a party whose policies are attractive to such organisations, would need to do that?
UKIP is the only party that favours controls on immigration. Thus, it is bound to receive attention from those who would support BNP. There is always overlap in party policies. However, the BNP is far-LEFT in its views (wanting state control over many areas).

You said: More recently, however, Farage refused to vote to oppose moves for the European Union to fund the BNP.
I would too. No matter how odious the BNP is, it sets a very dangerous precedent to refuse funding merely because you don't like their policies. First they came for the BNP, then they came for UKIP, etc..

There are some odious creeps in the Conservative Party, The Labour Party and the Liberal Democrat Party, why should UKIP be any different? The point is that UKIP is clearly not racist in its policies and attracts people of many different races and religions.

Immigration MUST be controlled and I find it irritating that as soon as the subject is brought up, the old racist card is brought out yet again...

Please read my post to Terbert.

Yes, I agree the amount of people coming into this country MUST be controlled as you say. But those right wing links around Europe is disturbing until Farage clearly states and proves what his party's position really is.  Transparency is what we now need Nick.

[Terbs]

Why oh why does the subject of stopping immigration bring up the Nazi' thing.

I don't give a stuff about what has gone....That is the past.....

I see 'in my eyes', what is happening in this country, stuff all the political parties  vote for who you like.....

I believe immigration should be stopped.......so if I say anything other than that statement, I become a rascist...end off

[STMO123]

As I've said before on here, most 'normal' people are ( a bit) racist. Human nature/self preservation.

[Terbs]

As I've said before on here, most 'normal' people are ( a bit) racist. Human nature/self preservation.

That statement, my friend, is about the trueist thing said on here

[Nickbat]

Yes, I agree the amount of people coming into this country MUST be controlled as you say. But those right wing links around Europe is disturbing until Farage clearly states and proves what his party's position really is.  Transparency is what we now need Nick.

• The tide of mass EU immigration has pushed down wages and restricted job opportunities.  Only by leaving the EU can we regain control of our borders.

• Freeze permanent immigration for 5 years. Immigrants must be fluent in English, have minimum education levels and show they can financially support themselves.

• Bring in a points based visa system and time limited work permits.

http://www.ukip.org/content/ukip-policies/2553-what-we-stand-for

Seems reasonable to me.

Of course it is impossible for any party to "prove" anything until they are in a position to implement their manifesto, so I don't understand that part of your post.  

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Why oh why does the subject of stopping immigration bring up the Nazi' thing.

I don't give a stuff about what has gone....That is the past.....

I see 'in my eyes', what is happening in this country, stuff all the political parties  vote for who you like.....

I believe immigration should be stopped.......so if I say anything other than that statement, I become a rascist...end off

Because that history was the biggest event known to man.  It revolved around ethnic cleansing and favouring one "superhuman" race over the rest of mankind.  To you it may be the past, but in actual fact it is still affecting the social and political situation around the World.  It is still destabilising how we live, and what happens around us.  Europe was a creation that came out of that war, that in turn was a product of the First World War, and before that the Empire Power System that started the whole thing off.  The past effects our future, and we must learn lessons from history to stop terrible events from happening again. We can only do that by understanding what we are getting involved in politically and taking the right action, for us via the ballot box, before events overtake us.  Knee jerk reactions are dangerous, as history proves, so we must take careful decisions via transparent politics. We the people are in charge; make the politicians know that.

Regrettably though there are millions out there who do not care, cannot be bothered, and certainly would never take part in a debate as we enjoy in these threads!

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Yes, I agree the amount of people coming into this country MUST be controlled as you say. But those right wing links around Europe is disturbing until Farage clearly states and proves what his party's position really is.  Transparency is what we now need Nick.

• The tide of mass EU immigration has pushed down wages and restricted job opportunities.  Only by leaving the EU can we regain control of our borders.

• Freeze permanent immigration for 5 years. Immigrants must be fluent in English, have minimum education levels and show they can financially support themselves.

• Bring in a points based visa system and time limited work permits.

http://www.ukip.org/content/ukip-policies/2553-what-we-stand-for

Seems reasonable to me.

Of course it is impossible for any party to "prove" anything until they are in a position to implement their manifesto, so I don't understand that part of your post.

It is not impossible. It is essential that all parties show their full hand, as indeed the established ones have, thus we know their shortcomings. UKIP as the new kids on the block must clearly dispel  the concern over their right wing links and clearly show how apart from them they are.  That is not impossible. Farage could make a clear statement and publically denounce all the right wing groups that he is accused of being associated with, such as the EFD.  Then we can all rest easy.

[Terbs]

Why oh why does the subject of stopping immigration bring up the Nazi' thing.

I don't give a stuff about what has gone....That is the past.....

I see 'in my eyes', what is happening in this country, stuff all the political parties  vote for who you like.....

I believe immigration should be stopped.......so if I say anything other than that statement, I become a rascist...end off

Because that history was the biggest event known to man.  It revolved around ethnic cleansing and favouring one "superhuman" race over the rest of mankind.  To you it may be the past, but in actual fact it is still affecting the social and political situation around the World.  It is still destabilising how we live, and what happens around us.  Europe was a creation that came out of that war, that in turn was a product of the First World War, and before that the Empire Power System that started the whole thing off.  The past effects our future, and we must learn lessons from history to stop terrible events from happening again. We can only do that by understanding what we are getting involved in politically and taking the right action, for us via the ballot box, before events overtake us.  Knee jerk reactions are dangerous, as history proves, so we must take careful decisions via transparent politics. We the people are in charge; make the politicians know that.Regrettably though there are millions out there who do not care, cannot be bothered, and certainly would never take part in a debate as we enjoy in these threads!

Don't take any personal offence at my replies, Lizzie....they are not aimed at you in particular.

Now that highlight in itself is a laugh, Lizzie. The population have been trying that since voting began. All the politicians are hell bent on destruction of the masses, as long as it feathers their own nests.
You are lied to whilst they are after your vote, and lied to after they get it. Politics is a select club. What the people of the country want, does not enter into the equation.
As someone posted elsewhere, 'I wish I was young enough to be an anarchist'

The whole shebang at Westminster want sacking/booting out, and a fresh new system installed........but what

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Why oh why does the subject of stopping immigration bring up the Nazi' thing.

I don't give a stuff about what has gone....That is the past.....

I see 'in my eyes', what is happening in this country, stuff all the political parties  vote for who you like.....

I believe immigration should be stopped.......so if I say anything other than that statement, I become a rascist...end off

Because that history was the biggest event known to man.  It revolved around ethnic cleansing and favouring one "superhuman" race over the rest of mankind.  To you it may be the past, but in actual fact it is still affecting the social and political situation around the World.  It is still destabilising how we live, and what happens around us.  Europe was a creation that came out of that war, that in turn was a product of the First World War, and before that the Empire Power System that started the whole thing off.  The past effects our future, and we must learn lessons from history to stop terrible events from happening again. We can only do that by understanding what we are getting involved in politically and taking the right action, for us via the ballot box, before events overtake us.  Knee jerk reactions are dangerous, as history proves, so we must take careful decisions via transparent politics. We the people are in charge; make the politicians know that.Regrettably though there are millions out there who do not care, cannot be bothered, and certainly would never take part in a debate as we enjoy in these threads!

Don't take any personal offence at my replies, Lizzie....they are not aimed at you in particular.

Now that highlight in itself is a laugh, Lizzie. The population have been trying that since voting began. All the politicians are hell bent on destruction of the masses, as long as it feathers their own nests.
You are lied to whilst they are after your vote, and lied to after they get it. Politics is a select club. What the people of the country want, does not enter into the equation.
As someone posted elsewhere, 'I wish I was young enough to be an anarchist'

The whole shebang at Westminster want sacking/booting out, and a fresh new system installed........but what

Don't worry about that!  We are having a good healthy debate amongst friends! It is those that do not discuss politics that worry me!  They are the reason we allow crap politicians into power.  Voting turn-outs are depressingly low, and that does not allow for really good competitive politics.

We, the people, can be in charge if we wish.  You may not like history over played ( ) but after Churchill had taken Britain through the war to Victory, the people voted him out in 1945 in favour of the socialist policies of the Labour Party and Clement Attlee in particular. So things can change dramatically if we want; we just have to encourage everyone to fully participate in the democratic system.  Maybe it should become mandatory to vote, but that I know is very controversial.  If we want change though people's attitudes in the UK must change first.

The Chartist indirectly changed the voting system, eventually, and women also got the vote (Hurray!!!!) so we can do it, with commitment and being prepared for a fight by the masses!

[Rods2]

Don't worry Lizzie but 2020 unless we leave the EU we will be a province of the EUSSR. Voting will be compulsory and easy. There will be no confusing choice on who to vote for president, just put your cross for the only candidate. "The most worshipful high President Barosso". There will be a full party list of candidates, just put your cross for the Barosso Maoist Party and where they have 100% of the votes they will then pick your representative from the party list. Simples. 

It will be very lucky to support the Barosso Maoist Party as they have a good safe life, whereas the dissenters, keep falling of high rise buildings and are bad drivers where they have fatal accidents. If you join the Barosso Maoist Party and become an official you will then get a decent state residence, get your name on the car waiting list and you will be able to afford them from your position of power where you have all those lovely brown envelopes full of Euros, from grateful non-party members that you have helped. 

This is a well proven system that stood a 70 year test of time in the Soviet Union. 

Welcome to 1984 2020. 

[albitz]

Racism is often assumed to be something that only happens on the right wing of politics for some reason. Thnkfully George Galloway has reminded us that it also comes from the left.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/02/21/anti-semitic-george-galloway-oxford-debate-israeli-student_n_2731009.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl17%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D156476

[Nickbat]

Racism is often assumed to be something that only happens on the right wing of politics for some reason. Thnkfully George Galloway has reminded us that it also comes from the left.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/02/21/anti-semitic-george-galloway-oxford-debate-israeli-student_n_2731009.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl17%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D156476

Yes, indeed. His obnoxious behaviour even loses his "allies":

Following George Galloway's dramatic exit from an Oxford University debate, telling the audience "I don't debate with Israelis", a leading Palestinian organisation has issued a press release saying it doesn't condone boycotting individuals "because she or he happens to be Israeli or because they express certain views".

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tobyyoung/100203839/has-one-of-george-galloways-political-allies-just-backed-away-from-him/

The man is a complete ar*e. Why people voted for him is a mystery.

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Racism is often assumed to be something that only happens on the right wing of politics for some reason. Thnkfully George Galloway has reminded us that it also comes from the left.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/02/21/anti-semitic-george-galloway-oxford-debate-israeli-student_n_2731009.html?icid=maing-grid7%7Cuk%7Cdl17%7Csec1_lnk2%26pLid%3D156476

Well he is one of politics misfits!

[Lizzie_Zoom]

Don't worry Lizzie but 2020 unless we leave the EU we will be a province of the EUSSR.
 

Not if the British public wake up and vote in numbers for the politicians who really will represent them and give them good, transparent, policies that are for the good of our nation.