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Author Topic: One for the amateur economics, doomsayers and anyone who wants to be depressed!  (Read 2807 times)

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MR MISTER

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I enjoyed watching this too. Thanks. :y

Is it inflation that will push interest rates up? I wasn't too clear on this point.
Don't worry your little head about it, bint. Just get the dishes washed. ;D
I take a passing interest in all of this stuff, but if I try to go too deep, I get a headache and go all depressed like. Ignorance really is bliss. :-*
I've already done them! ;D

Seriously though, I did economics at university and I thought that this is what would push them up?
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Field Marshal Dr. Opti

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I enjoyed watching this too. Thanks. :y

Is it inflation that will push interest rates up? I wasn't too clear on this point.
Don't worry your little head about it, bint. Just get the dishes washed. ;D

.......and the ironing won't do itself either. ;) :-* :-* :-*
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MR MISTER

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I enjoyed watching this too. Thanks. :y

Is it inflation that will push interest rates up? I wasn't too clear on this point.
Don't worry your little head about it, bint. Just get the dishes washed. ;D
I take a passing interest in all of this stuff, but if I try to go too deep, I get a headache and go all depressed like. Ignorance really is bliss. :-*
I've already done them! ;D

Seriously though, I did economics at university and I thought that this is what would push them up?
Oops. Posted in the middle......again :-[
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Vamps

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I enjoyed watching this too. Thanks. :y

Is it inflation that will push interest rates up? I wasn't too clear on this point.
Don't worry your little head about it, bint. Just get the dishes washed. ;D
I take a passing interest in all of this stuff, but if I try to go too deep, I get a headache and go all depressed like. Ignorance really is bliss. :-*
I've already done them! ;D

Seriously though, I did economics at university and I thought that this is what would push them up?
Oops. Posted in the middle......again :-[

That seems to be an age thing........ ;) ;)
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dbdb

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Such a load of patronising crap economics that I couldn't listen to it all.  Also a very blatant rip off of Adam Curtis's style, for anyone who watched the excellent  'Power of Nightmares' or 'The Trap'.

This advert plays to the worst middle class paranoia and is based on a load of lies, have a look at the facts:


It also takes no account of the immense improvements in technology and production.

Capitalist will end, simply because it contains the seeds of its own destruction- as a Capitalist how can you keep making money if you keep screwing the 99%?  Who will buy your goods?  How Will You Get Robots to Buy Cars? http://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/11/16/robots-buy-cars/

One irritating example - the predicted run on the banks.    Northern Rock only happened because that idiot Brown and the BoE bureacucrats couldn't have a simple and fast  compensation scheme.  Now there is one, and the first £85K of anyones savings with a single bank is guaranteed, who would bother queuing outside a bank for hours?  To say the government couldn't pay the compensation is stupid, the government can just print the stuff! (and they levy a fee for their trouble every year from the banks)
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Such a load of patronising crap economics that I couldn't listen to it all.  Also a very blatant rip off of Adam Curtis's style, for anyone who watched the excellent  'Power of Nightmares' or 'The Trap'.

This advert plays to the worst middle class paranoia and is based on a load of lies, have a look at the facts:


It also takes no account of the immense improvements in technology and production.

Capitalist will end, simply because it contains the seeds of its own destruction- as a Capitalist how can you keep making money if you keep screwing the 99%?  Who will buy your goods?  How Will You Get Robots to Buy Cars? http://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/11/16/robots-buy-cars/


Not so sure on that one dbdb.

The UK's National Debt in 1945 was £3 billion.  Today in 2013 it is £1.5 Trillion.  Now I may be wrong, and no doubt our resident financial guru, Rods2, will put us right, but I think the current percent of National Debt v. GDP is much higher than in 1945. ;)
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dbdb

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Not so sure on that one dbdb.

The UK's National Debt in 1945 was £3 billion.  Today in 2013 it is £1.5 Trillion. 
£3 billion in 1945 is £110 billion now but GDP has gone up too, the figure to watch is debt as a %age of GDP.  100% is not bad I suspect some individuals here have debts >1000% of their annual income when you include mortgages.

Now I may be wrong, and no doubt our resident financial guru, Rods2, will put us right, but I think the current percent of National Debt v. GDP is much higher than in 1945. ;)
Here are the  latest OECD figures,  it's now up to 109% (compared to 240% in 1945): http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/economics/government-debt_gov-debt-table-en.  The recent rise is because GDP has been clobbered I think.
« Last Edit: 09 September 2013, 18:04:32 by dbdb »
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Not so sure on that one dbdb.

The UK's National Debt in 1945 was £3 billion.  Today in 2013 it is £1.5 Trillion. 
£3 billion in 1945 is £110 billion now but GDP has gone up too, the figure to watch is debt as a %age of GDP.  100% is not bad I suspect some individuals here have debts >1000% of their annual income when you include mortgages.

Now I may be wrong, and no doubt our resident financial guru, Rods2, will put us right, but I think the current percent of National Debt v. GDP is much higher than in 1945. ;)
Here are the  latest OECD figures,  it's now up to 109% (compared to 240% in 1945): http://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/economics/government-debt_gov-debt-table-en.  The recent rise is because GDP has been clobbered I think.

Thanks! :y :y
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Rods2

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There are a number of differences between the past when we had high debts and now. At the end of WWI and WWII much of the debt was in war bonds which governments delayed paying back until the price was right through inflation. With WWI debt they did a forced cut on the interest rate in 1932 from 5% to 3.5%. Technically this has been considered by some a default, but it is questionable where the Government had the right to refinance them at anytime. At the end of WWI and WWII our demographics and low welfare spending were very different to what they are now.

There are currently several elephants in the current room. Off balance sheet debts which includes the refinancing of the banks, PFI, future government and state pension commitments, the unwinding of QE, especially where the current Government nicked the interest, which had been put aside to cover losses, which must be painful where bond prices have dropped significantly of late and of course demographics.

The chart below shows how fast the Government's bill for pensions is rising from £129.6bn in 2012 to an estimated £149.6 in 2015, and this is also going to put the amount that old people are going to consume of the NHS budget up, where old people need more care, treatment and drugs.

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/uk_budget_detail_13bt12012n_0040#ukgs303

Using OECD standard for the figures the UK debt is currently about 110% of GDP, but the worry is that our deficit went up slightly last year at £120bn. The chancellor is relying on growth and inflation to bring this down, if he doesn't get the growth then he will use plan B of higher inflation which is stealing our wealth by stealth. Once your debt to GDP ratio is above 100% then economic options tend to start to get much more painful.

Of course whatever the difficulties, society will survive, like it has in Greece, but that does not mean life will be pleasant for a much bigger percentage of the population.

Kate you are right higher inflation normally means higher interest rates, where holders will look at the post inflation return and tend to sell UK Gilts to invest in other country's sovereign bonds or other things that offer a better return. UK Gilt prices will drop, pushing up the yield, which is what is happening now. You also tend to get yields rising as an economy recovers from a recession, where holders sell them to invest in the growing economy in the expectation of a better return. As the economy recovers the £375bn of QE money sloshing around in the system is adding and will continue to add to inflationary pressures, so there are Gilt investor's concerns here along with the amount of debt, where we having a history of using high inflation to bring them under control.

Socialist and Communist like to continually write off capitalism but history has proved that it is a much better driver of innovation, allocation of capital and wealth creation, compared to any other system that has been tried, hence the failure of the Soviet Union, communist China where it was a case of starve or adopt capitalism. The two countries that currently embrace communism North Korea and Cuba struggle to feed themselves and the populace have very low standards of living. History has also shown that communism and liberty and human rights are mutually exclusive. All of our living standards, health and life span have constantly risen since the capitalist led industrial revolution.
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Varche

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The two countries that currently embrace communism North Korea and Cuba struggle to feed themselves and the populace have very low standards of livingDecades of blockades and sanctions haven't helped though either.
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dbdb

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The two countries that currently embrace communism North Korea and Cuba struggle to feed themselves and the populace have very low standards of living.

Cuba is a third world country, don't expect to find people living in luxury, but: 

Infant mortality:

Cuba 4.76 deaths per 1,000 live births

USA 5.9 deaths per 1,000 live births

(2013 figures from the CIA World Factbook)
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Rods2

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The two countries that currently embrace communism North Korea and Cuba struggle to feed themselves and the populace have very low standards of living.

Cuba is a third world country, don't expect to find people living in luxury, but: 

Infant mortality:

Cuba 4.76 deaths per 1,000 live births

USA 5.9 deaths per 1,000 live births

(2013 figures from the CIA World Factbook)

No surprise there with the drug taking problems in the US. UK is 4.50 and the lowest 10 are: France 3.34, Italy 3.33, Iceland 3.17, Macau 3.15, Hong Kong 2.89, Sweden 2.73, Singapore 2.59, Bermuda 2.47, Japan 2.17, Monaco 1.89 all from the CIA factbook.

Around 2 per 1,000 is probably as low as you can get due to death by natural causes, many of which can't be explained.
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dbdb

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The two countries that currently embrace communism North Korea and Cuba struggle to feed themselves and the populace have very low standards of living.

Cuba is a third world country, don't expect to find people living in luxury, but: 

Infant mortality:

Cuba 4.76 deaths per 1,000 live births

USA 5.9 deaths per 1,000 live births

(2013 figures from the CIA World Factbook)

No surprise there with the drug taking problems in the US.

Highest Drug use by Country Statistics
Country    Substance    Total Number of Addicts (approx.)    Per Capita
Iran    Heroin    95,000,00    14.32%
United Kingdom    Alcohol    81,3000    13.65%
France    Prescription pills    85,000,0    13.2%
Slovakian    Inhalants    7,000,0    13.01%
Russia    Alcohol    100,000    7.1%
Afghanistan    Heroin    24,3000    6.9%
Canada    Pot    22,3000    6.4%
United States    Prescription pills    192,9000    6.2%
Brazil    Oxi    84,3000    4.29%
Mexico    Meth    14,1000    3.9%
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