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[tunnie]

Think i'm with Tunnie on this. our cars are slow. and the auto box doesnt help. im sure a modern diesel could outdrag the omega quite easily.

having said that i wouldnt swap the old girl for anything. absolute pleasure to drive.

 

Why I still have mine, that plus fact they are dirt cheap to run 

But I know I won't win much, not even in the 3.2 

[cem_devecioglu]

its a prooven fact that slushboxes are always slower..  unless you play with the ratios.. 


even the best autobox is pumping fluid instead of a direct drive if its a real auto..   

A few years back I would agree, but the figures for my auto are as below. (Totally standard, as it left the factory) 

Acceleration 0-62 mph (sec) 5.4 [5.1]

and the 435d auto is 4.7 sec 0-62mph and the manual is definitely not quicker. 

Figure in brackets is for auto. 

530d and 535d are bloody quick off the mark. Considering its weight, it matches the lighter models off the lights.

     interestingly all given examples are turbo diesels


if a car is turbo where even any slight tuning can bring considerable power gain..


as I said before either turbo pressures are not equal or some other tweak whatever..


now being an engineer I can never understand illogical claims that a slush box operating with oil pressure is faster than a  direct physical face to face touch..   if your claims were true all race cars would be equipped with autos..


and if those claims were depending on an auto which is converted from a manual by some means thats funny..

[tigers_gonads]

Cem
The so called auto boxes that are mostly used now days are of the duel clutch, direct shift type.
These have in effect 2 clutches on a common output drive shaft.
One clutch drives / controls gears 1/3/5/7 ect and the other controls 2,4,6 ect.
This enables the box to pre select the next gear whether going up or down the ratios so the change is just as fast as the best manual boxes / driver interface 

I believe they do away with the torque convertor too so there is no slack in the drivetrain when you put your foot down   

[YZ250]

its a prooven fact that slushboxes are always slower..  unless you play with the ratios.. 


even the best autobox is pumping fluid instead of a direct drive if its a real auto..   

A few years back I would agree, but the figures for my auto are as below. (Totally standard, as it left the factory) 

Acceleration 0-62 mph (sec) 5.4 [5.1]

and the 435d auto is 4.7 sec 0-62mph and the manual is definitely not quicker. 

Figure in brackets is for auto. 

530d and 535d are bloody quick off the mark. Considering its weight, it matches the lighter models off the lights.

     interestingly all given examples are turbo diesels


if a car is turbo where even any slight tuning can bring considerable power gain..


as I said before either turbo pressures are not equal or some other tweak whatever..
...............

Just to clarify, I used a comparison between two almost identical straight six diesel vehicles, one with auto and one with manual. The auto is definitely quicker on the launch than the manual, it just digs in and goes. 
I've owned/driven loads of them and you'd be surprised at how the auto puts the power down. It's almost neck breaking from a total standstill. 

Anyway, what's this got to do with Skoda's. 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I don't subscribe to this 'dieselmania' that is currently sweeping the country.

Soot chuckers are horrible oily things and the diesel engine should stay where it belongs.......it has a natural home in the lorry......coach....taxi....and bus......


Petrol yes ......derv no .

I remember driving a 2.2 litre X-Type diesel a few years ago and the 'powerband' was painfully narrow.


having said that modern derv drinkers may be better.

[TheBoy]

I don't subscribe to this 'dieselmania' that is currently sweeping the country.

Soot chuckers are horrible oily things and the diesel engine should stay where it belongs.......it has a natural home in the lorry......coach....taxi....and bus......


Petrol yes ......derv no .

I remember driving a 2.2 litre X-Type diesel a few years ago and the 'powerband' was painfully narrow.


having said that modern derv drinkers may be better.

The latest luxury German cars get around the narrow powerband of overblown tractor units by shoving in lots of ratios into the autoboxes. That's why they can beat their petrol engine siblings.


But a 6 speed auto 2.2 Jag against a 4 speed 3.2 Omega in a straight line to 130mph, nah, I don't buy it. The Omega is also available in manual form, and the 3.0/3.2 manual Omegas are pretty quick, if you can use the agricultural gearbox.

[05omegav6]

Sub 7 seconds to 60, which is nice...

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I don't subscribe to this 'dieselmania' that is currently sweeping the country.

Soot chuckers are horrible oily things and the diesel engine should stay where it belongs.......it has a natural home in the lorry......coach....taxi....and bus......


Petrol yes ......derv no .

I remember driving a 2.2 litre X-Type diesel a few years ago and the 'powerband' was painfully narrow.


having said that modern derv drinkers may be better.

The latest luxury German cars get around the narrow powerband of overblown tractor units by shoving in lots of ratios into the autoboxes. That's why they can beat their petrol engine siblings.


But a 6 speed auto 2.2 Jag against a 4 speed 3.2 Omega in a straight line to 130mph, nah, I don't buy it. The Omega is also available in manual form, and the 3.0/3.2 manual Omegas are pretty quick, if you can use the agricultural gearbox.

Neither do I, TB.

My 2.6 MV6 is far faster than the X-Type diesel was........and that was a manual..

[cem_devecioglu]

Cem
The so called auto boxes that are mostly used now days are of the duel clutch, direct shift type.
These have in effect 2 clutches on a common output drive shaft.
One clutch drives / controls gears 1/3/5/7 ect and the other controls 2,4,6 ect.
This enables the box to pre select the next gear whether going up or down the ratios so the change is just as fast as the best manual boxes / driver interface 

I believe they do away with the torque convertor too so there is no slack in the drivetrain when you put your foot down 

what about the torque converter locking and how there will be no slack..

[cem_devecioglu]

1. if we compare two cars with same gear ratios (either being auto or manual) , thats a valid comparison otherwise apples and pears..


2. you can easily play with an injection map on a turbo diesel and thats also not valid


3 and if we are comparing turbo diesel auto and petrol manuals, remember petrol manuals are kept athmospheric and gear ratios are longer for cost reasons but also can be converted to a shorter ratio box and also to turbo with custom ecus ..

so briefly autos are faster is nothing more than a empty claim..   

[TheBoy]

so briefly autos are faster is nothing more than a empty claim..   

Not really. If the manufacturer optimise the gearing for the application, that's perfectly valid.

[aaronjb]

Not to mention DSG boxes can change gear a hell of a lot faster than even the very best driver.. Although I don't consider those "automatic" personally.

[cem_devecioglu]

so briefly autos are faster is nothing more than a empty claim..   

Not really. If the manufacturer optimise the gearing for the application, that's perfectly valid.

why not optimise the gearing for manual also 

[cem_devecioglu]

Not to mention DSG boxes can change gear a hell of a lot faster than even the very best driver.. Although I don't consider those "automatic" personally.

those are automated manuals actually.. but not a real slush box

[TheBoy]

so briefly autos are faster is nothing more than a empty claim..   

Not really. If the manufacturer optimise the gearing for the application, that's perfectly valid.

why not optimise the gearing for manual also 

For overblown diesels, they *have* to wedge in as many ratios as possible. For NA petrols, with a much wider power delivery band, the gains aren't as dramatic, and as (on these types of cars) autos are far more popular, I imagine the cost/benefit doesn't work out.