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[Nick W]

It is a diseasal Mundeo though, so bo laxxed flywheels are a thing

And knackered starters are one of the symptoms.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Well when I eventually got the old one out....      .... the bastard thing!                                                       

I did have a good look at the flywheel best I could and couldn't see any damage. There were no metal filings or swarf type stuff, and the cog on the old starter was intact. I don't really know what to look for though. 

This was one of those jobs that looked easy enough on a YouTube video.. 

[Doctor Gollum]

Do you recall seeing the teeth on the flywheel circumference?

[Marks DTM Calib]

The flywheel on the Mondeo does not suffer a failed ring gear, the starters go because the DMF sheds bits of metal which get into the starter motor (attracted to the magnetic field) and jam them up.

I assume this is a new starter and not a second hand one which might have come from a car with a goosed DMF?

Your only option is to remove and check it over, the fact its spinning suggests the drive dog is being pushed fully out or the high current contacts would not mate. I assume its correctly fitted and fully home in the machined opening and not sat on a lip?

[Sir Tigger KC]

Yes DG the teeth that I could see on the flywheel all looked intact and in good condition and there was no sign of metal filings or swarf anywhere. 

It's a new starter and yes it's possible it's not sat in the housing properly.  I'll check later and report back. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

So I lost more skin off my knuckles and my swear jar is a little fuller after wrestling the new starter out this afternoon.   

Giving birth must be easier than removing/fitting a starter motor on a 2.2 TDCi Mondeo.     

Anyhoo, I'm sure it was fitted OK, there is no sign of swarf or metal filings on or around the flywheel or the old starter, and all the teeth that I could see on the flywheel were intact and are in good condition. 

I bench tested* both starters with a set of jump leads and an old battery and on both, the cog (Bendix?) moves out.  I assume this action is the starter engaging with the flywheel. I couldn't get either motor to spin however, but then I don't really know what I'm doing....     

That's as far as I've got and I might let some skin grow back before I refit the bleddy thing! 

* More accurately - garden waste bin tested.

[Kevin Wood]

Might be worth checking that the throw on the starter pinion is the same on both starters. It's not impossible they've sold you the wrong starter and the pinion isn't long enough to reach the ring gear.

[cam.in.head]

if you clamp the body / casing to your negative jump lead and
clamp your positive to the big empty terminal on the solenoid thats now wired as it sits in the car. then just use a thin lead to apply positive to the solenoid small terminal.
bendix should pull up and motor should turn.
 
if motor doesnt turn then solenoid is faulty.   Or    try positive wire direct to the other side of solenoid( thick wire entering into starter motor)
if it still doesnt run motor itself is faulty.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Following cam.in.head's advice above, both the old and the new starter motors work.  The bendix moves out and the motor spins perfectly on both, and both operate identically. 

To recap, the old starter had the classic symptoms of a stuck starter.  Press the start button and all I'd get was a clunk. For a while the old trick of giving it a whack with a hammer worked, but no more.  When I fitted the new starter and pressed the start button, the starter motor ran but wasn't turning the engine.  I assume that the cog/bendix wasn't moving into position to engage with the flywheel.

Could it be as simple as the electrical connectors to the starter needing a good clean?  Especially the one to the solenoid?   

Many thanks to cam.in.head for the advice! 

[countrywoman]

It could be what they call dog ending, pinion hitting ring gear but not sliding between teeth, have you tried turning engine by hand/pushing it gear?

[cam.in.head]

sometimes they can work on the bench but may not have worked on the car. you may have disturbed a bad connection BUT for 2 starters to have identical symptoms does sound suspect .i would try to measure the distance that the cog moves out to when running and see if there are any alignment issues. and it is worth turning the engine slowly and carefully examining all the flywheel ring teeth just to be sure ,looking for any obvious damage or places where the cog may have hit the gear rather than engaged it .( as countrywwoman said)
with the car back together. does the car start and work perfectly after a bump start. no clutch or gearchange issues.?

[Kevin Wood]

There's normally a freewheel at the pinion end that allows the pinion to freewheel when the engine fires.

It's not impossible that this is faulty and "giving" in both directions. That would cause your symptoms. You might be able to verify this by hand.

Normally the solenoid has to extend to the full length of its throw before the contacts that energise the motor make.

Another thing to check is that on some Fords I've seen several sets of mounting holes for different styles of starter. Is there any room for adjustment of its position?

[Doctor Gollum]

Thst reminds me...

It is a starter for a manual?

Had one fail on a 2.0 Mk3 Granada. Bought a reman one from Sovereign only to find it wouldn't fit. Swapping the solenoid onto the old one fixed it.

Is the solenoid integral or bolted on? May be possible to 'fix' the original starter

[Kevin Wood]

May be possible to 'fix' the original starter

Good point. Dismantle it and clean up the contacts in the solenoid and it'll probably go for long enough to get it sold, given the symptoms.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Countrywoman: No I haven't tried turning the engine by hand, but I did try the old trick of rocking it in gear before I bought the new starter, but it still didn't work.

cam.in.head: The two starters have different symptoms when fitted. The old starter was 'stuck' and the new starter whirred over but didn't engage with the flywheel.  Both operated exactly the same when tested on the 'bench'. Unfortunately where I parked up the last time it was running makes it difficult even to rock the car in gear and there's no chance of bumping it. 

Kevin: No there's only 3 bolt holes and the two starters are identical.  On both starters I can 'freewheel' the pinion with my thumb in one direction but not the other. The only difference is that with the old one I can push the pinion out as far as it will go on it's shaft with my thumb, but needed assistance from a screwdriver on the new one. I guess this is just a new spring verses an old one.

DG: It's a manual, but the new starter fits and is identical to the old one.  The solenoid is bolted on, so yes I guess with a bit of soldering I could fit the new solenoid to the old starter, but as both of them appear to work on the 'bench'.... ?