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Author Topic: More wind farms = less wildlife  (Read 2289 times)

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Nickbat

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More wind farms = less wildlife
« on: 14 August 2009, 21:55:17 »

This makes me sad. We do not need wind farms, yet so much money and greenwash is tied up in them that all we can do is to sit back and watch the deaths mount.  :'( :(

http://www.examiner.com/x-13344-Wildlife-Conservation-Examiner~y2009m8d7-Deadly-blades-wind-farm-death-toll-mounts-as-birds-of-prey-are-massacred
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Dishevelled Den

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #1 on: 14 August 2009, 23:56:45 »

More wind farms = more interference from Brussels and Whitehall = more 'power' to the utility companies to increase costs and control distribution = more landscape blighted = less intelligent investment in additional, more efficient, generating sets = less choice for the consumer which ultimately leads to less funds in our bank accounts as we will be expected to pay for all this through the green levy these idiots in Government will apply to adopt this short-sighted policy. Yes? - No? - More? - Less?
« Last Edit: 14 August 2009, 23:57:39 by Zulu77 »
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Nickbat

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #2 on: 15 August 2009, 00:22:18 »

Quote
More wind farms = more interference from Brussels and Whitehall = more 'power' to the utility companies to increase costs and control distribution = more landscape blighted = less intelligent investment in additional, more efficient, generating sets = less choice for the consumer which ultimately leads to less funds in our bank accounts as we will be expected to pay for all this through the green levy these idiots in Government will apply to adopt this short-sighted policy. Yes? - No? - More? - Less?

You're right about the economics, Zulu. But I am passionate about our feathered friends (and the environment generally) and to see those decapitated birds, slaughtered for a hoax, makes my blood boil.  >:( >:(
« Last Edit: 15 August 2009, 00:22:28 by Nickbat »
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Dishevelled Den

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #3 on: 15 August 2009, 00:38:47 »

Quote
Quote
More wind farms = more interference from Brussels and Whitehall = more 'power' to the utility companies to increase costs and control distribution = more landscape blighted = less intelligent investment in additional, more efficient, generating sets = less choice for the consumer which ultimately leads to less funds in our bank accounts as we will be expected to pay for all this through the green levy these idiots in Government will apply to adopt this short-sighted policy. Yes? - No? - More? - Less?

You're right about the economics, Zulu. But I am passionate about our feathered friends (and the environment generally) and to see those decapitated birds, slaughtered for a hoax, makes my blood boil.  >:( >:(


It's a damn shame for sure but that's OK, Whitehall and the real brokers of power in Brussels are doing all this for our benefit.  The avian communtiy simply have to look to the greater good and pay the price required - isn't too much to ask is it? ::) ::) ::) ::)

After all it's being done to protect the planet and its environment so that life can be sustained in the most reasonable way possible - oh wait - does the logic fail at this point, kill by way of short-sighted meddling with technology the benefits of which are by no means clear?

May have hit a snag here. ::) :y
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Nickbat

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #4 on: 15 August 2009, 00:39:58 »

Quote
Quote
Quote
More wind farms = more interference from Brussels and Whitehall = more 'power' to the utility companies to increase costs and control distribution = more landscape blighted = less intelligent investment in additional, more efficient, generating sets = less choice for the consumer which ultimately leads to less funds in our bank accounts as we will be expected to pay for all this through the green levy these idiots in Government will apply to adopt this short-sighted policy. Yes? - No? - More? - Less?

You're right about the economics, Zulu. But I am passionate about our feathered friends (and the environment generally) and to see those decapitated birds, slaughtered for a hoax, makes my blood boil.  >:( >:(


It's a damn shame for sure but that's OK, Whitehall and the real brokers of power in Brussels are doing all this for our benefit.  The avian communtiy simply have to look to the greater good and pay the price required - isn't too much to ask is it? ::) ::) ::) ::)

After all it's being done to protect the planet and its environment so that life can be sustained in the most reasonable way possible - oh wait - does the logic fail at this point, kill by way of short-sighted meddling with technology the benefits of which are by no means clear?

May have hit a snag here. ::) :y


You're nearly as cynical as me, Zulu!  ;) ;D ;D
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Dishevelled Den

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #5 on: 15 August 2009, 00:43:55 »

Quote
Quote
Quote
Quote
More wind farms = more interference from Brussels and Whitehall = more 'power' to the utility companies to increase costs and control distribution = more landscape blighted = less intelligent investment in additional, more efficient, generating sets = less choice for the consumer which ultimately leads to less funds in our bank accounts as we will be expected to pay for all this through the green levy these idiots in Government will apply to adopt this short-sighted policy. Yes? - No? - More? - Less?

You're right about the economics, Zulu. But I am passionate about our feathered friends (and the environment generally) and to see those decapitated birds, slaughtered for a hoax, makes my blood boil.  >:( >:(


It's a damn shame for sure but that's OK, Whitehall and the real brokers of power in Brussels are doing all this for our benefit.  The avian communtiy simply have to look to the greater good and pay the price required - isn't too much to ask is it? ::) ::) ::) ::)

After all it's being done to protect the planet and its environment so that life can be sustained in the most reasonable way possible - oh wait - does the logic fail at this point, kill by way of short-sighted meddling with technology the benefits of which are by no means clear?

May have hit a snag here. ::) :y


You're nearly as cynical as me, Zulu!  ;) ;D ;D

Consider myself in the best of company then 8-) :y :y
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kris

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #6 on: 15 August 2009, 07:40:26 »

i'd rather see wind turbines than some bloody  great power station poluting the air that my kids breath.

there are more birds killed by vehicles than wind farms
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Banjax

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #7 on: 15 August 2009, 09:59:04 »

Quote
This makes me sad. We do not need wind farms, yet so much money and greenwash is tied up in them that all we can do is to sit back and watch the deaths mount.  :'( :(

http://www.examiner.com/x-13344-Wildlife-Conservation-Examiner~y2009m8d7-Deadly-blades-wind-farm-death-toll-mounts-as-birds-of-prey-are-massacred


if i can ease your mind nickbat - modern, large bladed , slow moving wind turbines are little risk to birds - it was the early fast, small bladed turbines that created this panic - unfortunately data from the new, intelligently sited wind farms doesnt bear out this bird killing

besides, how many birds die flying into windows and cars?
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cem_devecioglu

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #8 on: 15 August 2009, 10:00:08 »

 >:( >:(

some precautions must be applied to those windmills..dont know how but some clever engineering can prevent those birds from that bloody end.. :(
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miked

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #9 on: 15 August 2009, 10:00:44 »

I'd rather have a predictable load factor with spinning inertia for fault tolerance.

Drax, Eggborough and Ferrybridge together is 8000MW

Current average wind turbine is 2.5MW

Thats 3200 wind turbines, 120 feet tall :-?
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Nickbat

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #10 on: 15 August 2009, 10:14:23 »

Quote
Quote
This makes me sad. We do not need wind farms, yet so much money and greenwash is tied up in them that all we can do is to sit back and watch the deaths mount.  :'( :(

http://www.examiner.com/x-13344-Wildlife-Conservation-Examiner~y2009m8d7-Deadly-blades-wind-farm-death-toll-mounts-as-birds-of-prey-are-massacred


if i can ease your mind nickbat - modern, large bladed , slow moving wind turbines are little risk to birds - it was the early fast, small bladed turbines that created this panic - unfortunately data from the new, intelligently sited wind farms doesnt bear out this bird killing

besides, how many birds die flying into windows and cars?


Intelligently sited, Bannjaax? Read this open letter (dated June 2009) from David Bellamy. In your neck of the woods, I believe. :(

http://www.epaw.org/documents.php?lang=en&article=b2
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Nickbat

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #11 on: 15 August 2009, 10:17:16 »

Quote
I'd rather have a predictable load factor with spinning inertia for fault tolerance.

Drax, Eggborough and Ferrybridge together is 8000MW

Current average wind turbine is 2.5MW

Thats 3200 wind turbines, 120 feet tall :-?


Miked, that's exactly the point. Wind farms will never provide a predictable load factor and will thus never replace conventional power stations. They will, however, despoil the countryside, kill wildlife and cost us millions. >:(
« Last Edit: 15 August 2009, 10:17:36 by Nickbat »
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #12 on: 15 August 2009, 10:56:48 »

Regardless of all the cons and pros with the need for power versus the affect, or not, on the environment, let's face the fact that everyone of us is constantly creating a demand for electricity.  No one that I know, including me, is prepared or can give up the 'essential luxury' of electrical power to give us the standard of living we enjoy today.

If we, mankind as a whole, was really worried about the effects of our activities on wildlife then we would give up all modern technology and go back to a time when we just lived off the land immediately around us.  But of course we will not because we do not want to sacrifice what we have.

Mankind has affected other life on this planet ever since we came into existence in some form or another.  But that should not be a problem because we are part of the whole; God / nature put us here, created our desire to continually evolve and advance, using the planet to fulfil our needs.  That is what was intended, and none of us within the history of mankind was ever able to change our direction and hunger for advance.  Only natural plagues and man-made wars have short term slowed down this progress, although because of these events we have in the long term advanced significantly after the sacrifice.

The problem now, as I see it, is that mankind is unsure of the best way to go forward, meeting our needs with the apparent dilemma about how we affect the planet.  It is a self inflicted psychological dilemma, as whatever we do is nothing compared to the scale of nature itself and we are inflating our perceived involved in that gigantic process.  But we still beat ourselves up over something that is not within our control. 

I am not saying we do nothing; humans have never done that!  No we should pursue more efficient ways to produce the power we demand for reasons of economy.  That IS nuclear power, not crazy windfarms or other so called harnessing of nature devises that can never be of sufficient numbers to produce the power we require, are an unnecessary blot on the environmental landscape, and in fact do have a significant cost during their manufacture, transportation, erection / construction and future use.

So the choice for mankind is this.  We either stop using power or we accept there is a cost whatever we do on the environment as there always has been, and just build the most efficient, suitable and economically viable generation equipment to produce our electricity.  No political pleasing of this that and the other NGO, lobbying movement, aunt Sally in the street, but just sound logical decision making to produce what we really need in viable quantities.  Nuclear power has been that answer for 50 years, and with development can be the answer for generations to come.



« Last Edit: 15 August 2009, 10:58:27 by Lizzie_Zoom »
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Varche

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #13 on: 15 August 2009, 12:03:58 »

Yet another red herring I am afraid. Far more animals,birds and other wildlife are killed/wiped out by man across the globe than a few thousand wind farms can ever do.

For what it is worth, I believe that the Uk ought to get cracking with nuclear before it is held to ransom by  foreign power companies. Wait a minute too late - you are already paying for the capped by government energy prices in other sane EU countries because Britain fully embraces the "free market"!

v
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Dishevelled Den

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Re: More wind farms = less wildlife
« Reply #14 on: 15 August 2009, 12:19:56 »

Quote
Yet another red herring I am afraid. Far more animals,birds and other wildlife are killed/wiped out by man across the globe than a few thousand wind farms can ever do.

For what it is worth, I believe that the Uk ought to get cracking with nuclear before it is held to ransom by  foreign power companies. Wait a minute too late - you are already paying for the capped by government energy prices in other sane EU countries because Britain fully embraces the "free market"!

v


...sadly you might well be correct V - but when did this present administration last have a cogent, well researched and above all sensible policy designed to benefit the citizens of this country?
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