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[Nickbat]

1. Machine-translated via Bishop Hill:

"After press reports, it was established during inspections that several solar power plants were generating current and feeding it into the net at night. To simulate a larger installation capacity, the operators connected diesel generators.

"This is just the tip of the iceberg," said one industry expert to the newspaper "El Mundo", which brought the scandal to light. If solar systems apparently produce current in the dark, will be noticed sooner or later. However, if  electricity generators were connected during daytime, the swindle would hardly be noticed."

http://bishophill.squarespace.com/blog/2010/4/13/its-true.html



2. Comment by "Dr Gitfinger" on Umbrella Blog:

Any party that encourages people to have solar cells fitted to their houses will have to explain to the occupants that, in the event of the house catching fire, the fire brigade will probably have to just let it burn. This has happened in Ostfriesland in Germany and the Stuttgarter Zeitung is warning about it as well.
The solar cells continue generating electricity, even if the rest of the installation is shut down or destroyed. 120 V DC is enough to kill, apparently. Connected in series, the panels can deliver as much as 900 V. Combine that with the water from the hoses and it's too risky for firefighters to mess around with.

Original link (in German):
http://www.stuttgarter-zeitung.de/stz/page/2450637_0_9223_-braende-solaranlagen-bremsen-feuerwehr.html

Solar panels? Great idea. 

[Banjax]

1. Machine-translated via Bishop Hill:

"After press reports, it was established during inspections that several solar power plants were generating current and feeding it into the net at night. To simulate a larger installation capacity, the operators connected diesel generators.

"This is just the tip of the iceberg," said one industry expert to the newspaper "El Mundo", which brought the scandal to light. If solar systems apparently produce current in the dark, will be noticed sooner or later. However, if  electricity generators were connected during daytime, the swindle would hardly be noticed."

http://bishophill.squarespace.com/blog/2010/4/13/its-true.html



2. Comment by "Dr Gitfinger" on Umbrella Blog:

Any party that encourages people to have solar cells fitted to their houses will have to explain to the occupants that, in the event of the house catching fire, the fire brigade will probably have to just let it burn. This has happened in Ostfriesland in Germany and the Stuttgarter Zeitung is warning about it as well.
The solar cells continue generating electricity, even if the rest of the installation is shut down or destroyed. 120 V DC is enough to kill, apparently. Connected in series, the panels can deliver as much as 900 V. Combine that with the water from the hoses and it's too risky for firefighters to mess around with.

Original link (in German):
http://www.stuttgarter-zeitung.de/stz/page/2450637_0_9223_-braende-solaranlagen-bremsen-feuerwehr.html

Solar panels? Great idea. 

  and when it rains....wouldn't that be watering the panels? or are they....i dunno....waterproof maybe?? 

[Varche]

Solar panels are a great idea.

Those reports are just a bit of verbage to fuel the hysteria that folk (in more Northern climes)  seem to enjoy on any subject to do with protecting our planet. I don't suppose anyone was arrested for the fraud they were committing?? No didn't think so.

Living in a country where the sun shines endlessly for months on end (over 300 days a year) loads of people have solar panels (electric and water). Also there are loads of solar farms putting electric in the grid without burning hard won and getting scarcer fossil fuels. I haven't seen any houses burning down here but a North European tourist did set fire to about 100,000 hectares by lighting a fire cos he was "lost"!

If you leave a garden hose out in the sun the water comes out uncomfortably hot. I say lets have more green energy.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Solar water heating in the Uk is not viable although yes, it works well in central europe.

And a photovoltaic panel takes around 15 years to produce the same amount of energy as was required to fabricate the thing in the first place.....if you can get it to last that long!

[Varche]

And a photovoltaic panel takes around 15 years to produce the same amount of energy as was required to fabricate the thing in the first place.....if you can get it to last that long!

That of course is the problem with solar voltaic energy. The cost. Same with the wind turbines people can buy (B&Q?) for home use. payback time. Simple solution. Gear up prisons for production and get cheap labour out of them. It always amazes me that governments can find plenty of money for useless causes but none for worthwhile ones!

[Marks DTM Calib]

And a photovoltaic panel takes around 15 years to produce the same amount of energy as was required to fabricate the thing in the first place.....if you can get it to last that long!

That of course is the problem with solar voltaic energy. The cost. Same with the wind turbines people can buy (B&Q?) for home use. payback time. Simple solution. Gear up prisons for production and get cheap labour out of them. It always amazes me that governments can find plenty of money for useless causes but none for worthwhile ones!

Gets my vote!

I note that some success has been seen with heating water via solar to drive turbines

[Kevin Wood]

My parents have a solar water heating setup and it's very carefully monitored. (Something the systems never seem to have built-in. I wonder why not? )

It delivers about 2 or 3 kWh on an average good sunny day. It's actually most effective about this time of year when the proportion of sunny days without cloud cover is high.

Despite the marketing hype of piping hot water even on cloudy days it does nothing whatsoever unless it's in bright sunshine. Nothing today, then.

The number of days when adequate hot water is available without additional heating is probably single figures per year. We are talking about supplying the requirements of a retired couple living alone here.

Some of this appears to be because as the temperature of the tank approaches a usable level (say 50-60^oC), the losses in the system increase to the point where it's in equilibrium, so unless you like lukewarm baths you're on a hiding to nothing if you think it's going to supply your hot water. You are only "pre-heating" water that you'll later heat to a more sensible temperature. It will obviously reduce energy consumption in this regard though.

Their options for heating other than solar are oil or electric so it pays back more than most. I still doubt they'll ever see a return. Would be a complete waste of time if they were on mains gas.

Kevin

[Pitchfork]

My parents have a solar water heating setup and it's very carefully monitored. (Something the systems never seem to have built-in. I wonder why not? )

It delivers about 2 or 3 kWh on an average good sunny day. It's actually most effective about this time of year when the proportion of sunny days without cloud cover is high.

Despite the marketing hype of piping hot water even on cloudy days it does nothing whatsoever unless it's in bright sunshine. Nothing today, then.

The number of days when adequate hot water is available without additional heating is probably single figures per year. We are talking about supplying the requirements of a retired couple living alone here.

Some of this appears to be because as the temperature of the tank approaches a usable level (say 50-60^oC), the losses in the system increase to the point where it's in equilibrium, so unless you like lukewarm baths you're on a hiding to nothing if you think it's going to supply your hot water. You are only "pre-heating" water that you'll later heat to a more sensible temperature. It will obviously reduce energy consumption in this regard though.

Their options for heating other than solar are oil or electric so it pays back more than most. I still doubt they'll ever see a return. Would be a complete waste of time if they were on mains gas.

Kevin

Mine works even on a cloudy day, saved about 625 cubic metres of gas in 2009 compared with 2008
'doing my bit for the planet'

[Sixstring]

Being silly now.....

Would it be worth putting a decent size photo voltaic panel (solar panel) in a car to keep the battery at peak condition, you know, OE fitting??
Could be fitted in the glass sunroof panel, or even built into the top 2" of the windscreen, front and back??

Just a thought.

Mike.

[Nickbat]

Being silly now.....

Would it be worth putting a decent size photo voltaic panel (solar panel) in a car to keep the battery at peak condition, you know, OE fitting??
Could be fitted in the glass sunroof panel, or even built into the top 2" of the windscreen, front and back??

Just a thought.

Mike.

You can buy them in Maplins, I think. 

[Nickbat]

Couldn't find one on the Maplin site, but this is the sort of thing that is available:

http://www.theultimatefinish.co.uk/icp-solar/se-500-solar-battery-charger.aspx

[Marks DTM Calib]

lol, 80 quid for something that might on a good day deliver 7w of power

[Gaffers]

lol, 80 quid for something that might on a good day deliver 7w of power

I remember they went for £15 on a popular online auction site