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[Lazydocker]

On the subject of meets, I'd love to meet some of the characters on here, but I hesitated to go to Newent this year, as I didn't know whether I would have felt comfortable with a group of people that know each other so well. Maybe this puts other newer members off? There's no doubt that I would have been made welcome, even though I'm not that well known on here, but I'm quite quiet so Daz, I'll try and make the effort next time 
 I've been here a while and prefer to observe than post a great deal. I personally think the forum's as good as when I first joined though. It serves its primary purpose, which is to provide help and advice for the Omega, better than any other, as we all know.
  As for the rest of it, I think the discussion area is still great, I happen to love the jokes and I loved it when Nickbat revived the Nag's Head as well 

We all had to meet face to face for the fist time somewhere But I understand what you mean. Unfortunately Mrs LD and I couldn't make any of the meets (except the day meet in Essex) last year and it was strange for us!

The meets are really enjoyable and you find that, having met people face to face, it is easier to interpret postings as they are intended.

This year we intend to attend both the Lakes and Newent meets, both of which are a very long way from home, and are looking forward to them

So to anyone else who felt the same as jonny, come along and meet some people... You'll find it enjoyable

[albitz]

The original point by Daz was mostly about the fact that OOF just isnt as much fun as it used to be. Imo this is to a certain extent connected to Daz himself. When there was hilarity and mayhem on here most nights he was almost always right in the middle of it, and the really hilarious stuff was usually him/Dundee/Zok/STMO and one or two others taking the p155 out of each other.or collectively taking it from other people.
He has in the last couple of years become a busy man - fixing/breaking/selling cars etc and life is maybe a bit more serious than it once was, and maybe not as much time/energy/inclanation available for hilarity as there used to be ?
I might be well wide of the mark, I dont know,just voicing my thoughts on the subject.

[Darth Loo-knee]

I'm interested to hear what Daz thinks. Clearly it's changed for the worse for him. I wonder if he see's a reason for it...?

The reason I asked Chris

There are far better than me at putting things into words, but we all started on The Forum at sometime. I started about 6 months after its birth. The first time I went to anything was a "Cambelt Meet" at The Boys house. I did not know a soul but met The Boy, Elite Pete, Mike Dundee, Timbuk, Mark DTM, Tunnie, JamesV6, Bobo and the list goes on but when after the meet you had something else in common as well as driving an Omega.
Timbuk held a Cambelt Meet which was huge about 20 odd cars got worked on, Members I had not met before turned up had a laugh and a joke and then the fun grew again on the forum after the meet.
The Meets do work wonders for the Forum not only do people get work done for nothing but they make friends that can then carry that friendship on at home through the Forum on the internet.....
Like I said in my orginal post I can write down now who will be at both the Lakes & Newent as the same members go. I also now that at each meet people who I have not met before turn up to have their cars worked on which is great, but not to see them again after until perhaps the following year when again they come for some free work seems to be an insult to me... maybe I am wrong what do you think??

The work that goes into this forum is unbelievable and for me would be a crying shame for it to go to the Dogs. The reason again for my post, as I certainly don't want it to go that way.

[Jimbob]

Yes, definately changed, long gone are the nights sat up for hours having a laugh 

I still read just about everything, but dont join in too much, (personally, and nothing more, got very bored of all the naked women posts, political debate, climate debate too name a few).

There is imho, a need for more moderation than there was once, I see this as both lines being further crossed than they ever where...but also the OOF audience is worldwide now, not a select group in the pub etc.

Therefore the racist, anti anyone 'English' humor couldn't continue, on the back of this, every minority then jumps in that humour shouldnt be at them etc etc etc.

I also see a lot of us came here to learn, and we have learned, meaning a lot of that sort of post isnt as valued as it once was.
I also this think makes it harder for newbies to get involved.  Where a few years ago someone with a problem was far more encoraged to fix it themselves, and be guided through doing it, now the 'way' is to hire help to do it instead. (no bad thing in itself, a very valuble service Ive used myself)

I have made some vey good friends here, which would continue even if the forum didnt, and often wish we could get together more often...There has been the standing joke about the non existant Christmas party...well why dont we actually do it next year?  or some winter meets anyway, even if not the traditional camping meet.

Really dont know how to ressurect the oof of old to everyones benefit

[hotel21]

To paraphrase Daz and his comments regarding meets, perhaps wrongly.

Its the Panda syndrome all over again for some OOFers.

Eats (attends the meets)
Shoots (gets work done for nowt)
Leaves (until the next meet when something else needs done and meantime, contributed hee haw to the forum....)

    

[feeutfo]

My personal tuppenceworth and not that of an admin.  Timelines of matters of fact may be out of kilter, but the gist is there.

Society in general has changed such that even the quietest of minorities can and do make themselves heard to the extent that the greater good of society changes to accomodate their thoughts and wishes.

OOF originally was a WYSIWYG - what you see is what you get - forum with little or no moderation, simply because none was required.  It was about Omegas, how to repair them cheaply and not pay full dealer or garage prices.  Such was the ability to share such information via howtoo's and clever folks keen to be online and impart information, freely and at no cost, the forum grew.

There was a demand for an area where anything could be discussed, hence the gendiss area.  Again, common sense prevailed and the assorted adults (note 'adults') were able to have a laugh and share jokes and banter at The Nags Head.  Look back the old threads and see whats meant.

There were a few very good meets, including a tour round Drax power station courtesy of member miked, and the cameraderie simply grew thereafter.

The Omega got older and less mainstream and its availability to those of us with lesser means became more and more.  The forum started to reflect that.

What was initially a relatively small group of enthusiasts quickly became a larger mass of folks wanting to run large expensive, well specced cars on the cheap.  With that came a degree of political correctness and some upsets and tears at some of the good natured banter and repartee.

The well learned maxim that religion and politics should not be discussed in a pub with friends was quickly forgotten and such things soon became common place.

As the years continued to turn, so did the mindset of the membership, in my opinion.  Gone was the happy understanding that jokes and banter were that and umbrage was taken by some, thus the 'alert mod' option was introduced and with that, came what can be perceived as moderator intervention overload.

As I said earlier elsewhere, we reap what we sow.

If you take the huff about something without having some consideration for others folks standpoint - be that PC or very non PC - and simply 'tell teacher', what do you expect to be the outcome? 

OOF is publicly accountable on so many various levels, be that technical, copywrite or some of the PC guff as I outlined, so you have to get what you asked for, within reason.

As said, my tuppenceworth as OOFer and not an admin.  Those who have met me in person know that I call a spade a spade and can cuss and blind with the best of them but those that simply launch large on the forum and do not take the very small step to make a meet to show themselves face to face?  Ach well, we all need keyboard warriors, I suppose.

If this is a rant, well, I suppose thats now /end rant...

Thanks for reading thus far....

B

So we agree then? I think?

I reckon a leaf out of the top gear book. They get away with it, even though Andy Grey doesn't.

[Darth Loo-knee]

The original point by Daz was mostly about the fact that OOF just isnt as much fun as it used to be. Imo this is to a certain extent connected to Daz himself. When there was hilarity and mayhem on here most nights he was almost always right in the middle of it, and the really hilarious stuff was usually him/Dundee/Zok/STMO and one or two others taking the p155 out of each other.or collectively taking it from other people.
He has in the last couple of years become a busy man - fixing/breaking/selling cars etc and life is maybe a bit more serious than it once was, and maybe not as much time/energy/inclanation available for hilarity as there used to be ?
I might be well wide of the mark, I dont know,just voicing my thoughts on the subject.

I don't agree there mate.
I am busy yes but have plenty of time to come on here for a laugh ( I am on it now, I was on it last night until after 1am). But I prefer to go on my xbox as here for me as lost its appeal that I used to love.
I love a laugh and a joke, I certainly dont mind jokes on me, if you play tricks etc you should be willing to have them returned..

[albitz]

Fair enough Daz, just thinking /wodering out loud really.
I cant read your mind......................dont think I would want to

[hotel21]

... snip

So we agree then? I think?

I reckon a leaf out of the top gear book. They get away with it, even though Andy Grey doesn't.

So many times I have had to bite my tongue and think of the forum rather than share personal opinion, you wouldn't believe....      

[Amigo]

Firstly it's no big news that i can be abit of a cock sometimes. I get a bee in my bonnet & away i go on the wrong tack. I'm the first to admit this & i'm doing my level best to shut up at times. I bought my first Omega a week before getting on the internet, googled Vx Omega & found this place. I did'nt know what an internet car forum was. I can't remember the exact date but the Drax power station meet was about to happen. I was made very welcome on screen & a shortly afterwards attended the first Lakesmeet were i was made equally welcome in person (Jonnycool read this & attend a meet, you'll love it) I know at times i don't help the easy running of the forum but for every time i kick off there are two or three times i bite my lip & don't post. That said i've made a few very good friends here who i sometimes meet up with outside the forum as well as at meets
    Daz. Regarding meets i'd love to attend more than i do. Some of you must be earning a shed load more than i am because much as i'm willing to drive 600 miles (a days work) i can't afford the money or time off work to do 'em all plus i have my classic meets to consider, not just OOF. This years 5th birthday Lakes falls a week before my Fir Park classic do. I dunno if i can take two weekends off in a row or if i can afford to plus i've got to go back into hospital some time this year so there goes my holiday pay ...again. Some of us have problems/hobbies outside the forum.
    That said i still love it here & think the changes are purely down to the growing number of members & thier differing opinions.

   Has OOF become a victim of it's own success?
If so then we all have to adjust.

[VXL V6]

I'm interested to hear what Daz thinks. Clearly it's changed for the worse for him. I wonder if he see's a reason for it...?

The reason I asked Chris

There are far better than me at putting things into words, but we all started on The Forum at sometime. I started about 6 months after its birth. The first time I went to anything was a "Cambelt Meet" at The Boys house. I did not know a soul but met The Boy, Elite Pete, Mike Dundee, Timbuk, Mark DTM, Tunnie, JamesV6, Bobo and the list goes on but when after the meet you had something else in common as well as driving an Omega.
Timbuk held a Cambelt Meet which was huge about 20 odd cars got worked on, Members I had not met before turned up had a laugh and a joke and then the fun grew again on the forum after the meet.
The Meets do work wonders for the Forum not only do people get work done for nothing but they make friends that can then carry that friendship on at home through the Forum on the internet.....
Like I said in my orginal post I can write down now who will be at both the Lakes & Newent as the same members go. I also now that at each meet people who I have not met before turn up to have their cars worked on which is great, but not to see them again after until perhaps the following year when again they come for some free work seems to be an insult to me... maybe I am wrong what do you think??

The work that goes into this forum is unbelievable and for me would be a crying shame for it to go to the Dogs. The reason again for my post, as I certainly don't want it to go that way.

 

The meets are great events and I have to agree that you could probably write the list of attendee's on the confirmed list right now!

The perception of 'jobs for free' is indeed a problem, not sure how that one would be resolved because people could see the forum as then being 'elitist' and only the long standing members having the big jobs being done on their cars.

As H21 has hinted, these cars are getting older and cheaper which brings an entirely different member base to the forum form 6 / 7 years ago (trying very hard here not to sound elitist myself!  ), more members is good but more people ultimately brings more diverse subject matter to general chat and more potential for disagreement.

It takes a huge amount of moderation to manage this forum which takes huge amounts of peoples time, the more disagreements and problems this forum encounters the closer I feel it gets to reaching it's endpoint, which to me and many others on here would be a disaster and a situation that should never be reached.

We must make sure this conclusion is never reached!

I'm afraid I don't have any answers, only observations and to end with a line so often used by others because of the tender state we now live in....

Just my two penneth worth, nothing more, nothing less, no offence intended or implied... etc etc etc...

[Lazydocker]

So what we all seem to be agreeing on is that the winter blues do affect the forum... As in, there seems to be a lull because of the lack of meets?  :-? So, moving on from this, perhaps we need to try thinking forwards to find something/somewhere suitable for a cold weather bash? :-/

As Jimbob has said... I too have made some friends through here that I would keep in touch with if the unthinkable happened In fact, I do see people I have met through here and thoroughly enjoy it!

That said, I hope this "problem" is just, as I stated in my first post, dip in the cycle of the life of OOF

[skinwiz]

My personal tuppenceworth and not that of an admin.  Timelines of matters of fact may be out of kilter, but the gist is there.

Society in general has changed such that even the quietest of minorities can and do make themselves heard to the extent that the greater good of society changes to accomodate their thoughts and wishes.

OOF originally was a WYSIWYG - what you see is what you get - forum with little or no moderation, simply because none was required.  It was about Omegas, how to repair them cheaply and not pay full dealer or garage prices.  Such was the ability to share such information via howtoo's and clever folks keen to be online and impart information, freely and at no cost, the forum grew.

There was a demand for an area where anything could be discussed, hence the gendiss area.  Again, common sense prevailed and the assorted adults (note 'adults') were able to have a laugh and share jokes and banter at The Nags Head.  Look back the old threads and see whats meant.

There were a few very good meets, including a tour round Drax power station courtesy of member miked, and the cameraderie simply grew thereafter.

The Omega got older and less mainstream and its availability to those of us with lesser means became more and more.  The forum started to reflect that.

What was initially a relatively small group of enthusiasts quickly became a larger mass of folks wanting to run large expensive, well specced cars on the cheap.  With that came a degree of political correctness and some upsets and tears at some of the good natured banter and repartee.

The well learned maxim that religion and politics should not be discussed in a pub with friends was quickly forgotten and such things soon became common place.

As the years continued to turn, so did the mindset of the membership, in my opinion.  Gone was the happy understanding that jokes and banter were that and umbrage was taken by some, thus the 'alert mod' option was introduced and with that, came what can be perceived as moderator intervention overload.

As I said earlier elsewhere, we reap what we sow.

If you take the huff about something without having some consideration for others folks standpoint - be that PC or very non PC - and simply 'tell teacher', what do you expect to be the outcome? 

OOF is publicly accountable on so many various levels, be that technical, copywrite or some of the PC guff as I outlined, so you have to get what you asked for, within reason.

As said, my tuppenceworth as OOFer and not an admin.  Those who have met me in person know that I call a spade a spade and can cuss and blind with the best of them but those that simply launch large on the forum and do not take the very small step to make a meet to show themselves face to face?  Ach well, we all need keyboard warriors, I suppose.

If this is a rant, well, I suppose thats now /end rant...

Thanks for reading thus far....

B

So we agree then? I think?

I reckon a leaf out of the top gear book. They get away with it, even though Andy Grey doesn't.

apparently not  , even Top Gear has fallen prey to the madness http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-12361790

[tunnie]

H21 hit nail on the head, when I bought my facelift, I paid £2.5k in 2005. Back then facelifts were easily worth £10k+ - With Prefacelifts still fetching a good price. Now even the most expensive examples are £3 or £4k, they are rare, most are sub £1k.

As H21 suggested thats had a direct affect on the type of people buying the Omega.

For me there was more of a club feeling few years ago everyone posted everywhere, now General Help is mostly newbies posting questions with established members posting technical replies (for the most part)

Past few years have seen influx of members who just sit in General Discussion, they don't post replies to any of the technical help section questions, they just post crap topics in General Chat and stir up trouble.

I remember the first ever OOF meet in the Lakes, with Bob Dent, H21, TB, Zok, AA, Timbuck, Jimbob, Tony and loads of others who I forget their user ID's

The game of football was great example of OOF at the time, where else could you play footie (which i generally don't like) while carrying a can of larger?

Last meet i went to, York II really showed the change in OOF, I don't think we will ever see a return to what it was.

[hoofing it]

Well i'd love to be on here every night Daz but when the wifes feeling frisky well oof gets the bullet