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[Mikes1670]

Friend of mine had a puncture repaired at Kwik-fit which cost Ł20 for a plug and at the same time they re-inflated all his tyres with nitrogen. He seems to think it has made quite a difference (reduction in road noise apparently). Also, you are supposed to get more consistent tyre wear as nitrogen is more stable given temperature variations depending on type of driving.

Just wondered if else is a nitrogen convert.

[Shelby]

I get mine done with nitrogen, but only because I am friends with the manager at my local Kwik Fit so I get staff discount on any work and he does nitrogen fills for nothing on new tyres for me.

I haven't noticed any real difference but then again I haven't really owned any particularly decent cars in the past.

[feeutfo]

Considering it on mine tbh. Lower profile tyres on 18 rims and sports contact 3's are sensitive to pressure changes. General weather and seasonal changes have an effect Feel and ride quality being important go me.

However most seem to go for this to prevent slow leaks or gradual air loss over a couple of weeks. Something better remedied by removing the tyre from the wheel and insuring the beed and rim are clean allowing a good seal.

I very much doubt there will be any change in road noise though.

[Andy H]

According to Wikipedia: Dry air contains roughly (by volume) 78.09% nitrogen, 20.95% oxygen, 0.93% argon, 0.039% carbon dioxide, and small amounts of other gases. Air also contains a variable amount of water vapour, on average around 1%.

Changes in pressure due to changes in temperature are pretty much the same for any gas. Any benefit is going to be down to the elimination of water (or maybe just the reassuring feeling you get when you buy something in a bottle when you could have got it for free  )

[feeutfo]

External atmospheric pressure varies according to weather conditions. Allowing the tyres internal pressure to vary as well. On most cars it's not necessary. But if pressures are critical for what ever reason it can help.

As Entwood is on Hols we won't get his aircraft tyre explanation that their tyres can expand to dangerous levels at altitude and be heavily affected by changes in temperature from cold to extreme heat on landing etc if air is used.

Nitrogen answers all those questions.

Obviously cars don't encounter those extremes normally. But it can have it's uses. Although mostly these uses are canceled out due to availability and convenience. Plus, there will always be some air in there no matter what you do.

[Radar]

As prev. mentioned the normal air in the tyre is already 78% nitrogen. Also consider that if you fill with nitrogen and then need a top up you will need to go back to where you got it done and not just any old petrol station.

This is what made me decide against it but there prob. is a very slight improvement but would it be enough for you to notice?

[feeutfo]

Theory is if it works as advertised we won't notice any change at all, as the pressure won't vary at all.

Only if noticing a variation or a change in pressure (thats not a leak) would it be needed!

There is also the theory that Nitrogen is a gas with bigger particles or molecules. So there for normal air loss won't happen, but as said, ime clean the wheel rim to give a good seal and that's negligible anyway(within the confines of regular tyre pressure checks anyway) Something almost always over looked at fast fit places until the owner decides they have a slow puncture.

In the past I have considered fitting tyre pressure sensors in an effort to fully understand operating temps, cold temps, temp changes and obviously be warned of a puncture etc. But they ain't cheap, and how far do you go with it all. Plus real time data and it's usefulness is never apparent until actually fitted and working. By then, if it's crap, it's too late.

I have a compressor in the garage anyway, so that's far more convenient than nipping up the petrol station.

[Abiton]

...nitrogen is more stable given temperature variations ...

Not. 

[mantahatch]

I assume it requires some kind of vacuum system to clear out the normal air first ? otherwise it would be a waste of time surely.

Shame really as we have so many bottles of OFN (oxygen free nitrogen) at work that I could have a bottle at home.

I smell snake oil here for road use.

[Andy H]

I assume it requires some kind of vacuum system to clear out the normal air first ? otherwise it would be a waste of time surely.

Shame really as we have so many bottles of OFN (oxygen free nitrogen) at work that I could have a bottle at home.

I smell snake oil here for road use.

Me too.

Nitrogen is subject to the same gas laws / laws of physics as any other gas.

I can see how it can be an advantage at a race meeting to have a bottle of clean dry nitrogen on your tool trolley instead of having to lug an air compressor around.

I also know that some hospitals use a 'molecular sieve' to separate oxygen molecules (atomic mass = from nitrogen molecules (atomic mass=7) in the air in order to generate oxygen to give to patients so there might be something in that angle. The gases that have tiny molecules are Hydrogen (atomic mass = 1) and Helium (atomic mass =2). They do leak away quickly but they aren't present in significant quantities in the atmosphere.  :-/

[feeutfo]

It's certainly not snake oil as such.

Is it suitable in this application...  Given regular tyre checks are still vital anyway, and a couple of presses on the valve with a pressure gauge can release a psi or two anyway, it doesn't really make sense IMO for day to day.

The odd fully loaded trip will throw a spanner in the works by adding and releasing the relevant psi back down to normal pressures if your nitrogen supplier is closed and atŁ20 a pop that aint happening. Even if it is was worth while.

[mantahatch]

It's certainly not snake oil as such.

Is it suitable in this application...  Given regular tyre checks are still vital anyway, and a couple of presses on the valve with a pressure gauge can release a psi or two anyway, it doesn't really make sense IMO for day to day.

The odd fully loaded trip will throw a spanner in the works by adding and releasing the relevant psi back down to normal pressures if your nitrogen supplier is closed and atŁ20 a pop that aint happening. Even if it is was worth while.

I am not saying it is totally useless, but for 99.99% of road users will it make any, any difference ?

[feeutfo]

Further more, another question, operating temperature gives an operating pressure because warm tyres have increased pressure due to heat, hence all tyres pressures are quoted cold.

What pressures do Nitrogen suppliers recommend? Because the stock pressures will now be useless as the tyres pressure won't increase correctly because the pressure won't increase with the tyre temperature if Nitrogen is used.

Get that wrong and the tyre could be permanently under inflated... No?

[Abiton]

Further more, another question, operating temperature gives an operating pressure because warm tyres have increased pressure due to heat, hence all tyres pressures are quoted cold.

What pressures do Nitrogen suppliers recommend? Because the stock pressures will now be useless as the tyres pressure won't increase correctly because the pressure won't increase with the tyre temperature if Nitrogen is used.

Get that wrong and the tyre could be permanently under inflated... No?

This is nonsense I'm afraid Chris.

[feeutfo]

Further more, another question, operating temperature gives an operating pressure because warm tyres have increased pressure due to heat, hence all tyres pressures are quoted cold.

What pressures do Nitrogen suppliers recommend? Because the stock pressures will now be useless as the tyres pressure won't increase correctly because the pressure won't increase with the tyre temperature if Nitrogen is used.

Get that wrong and the tyre could be permanently under inflated... No?

This is nonsense I'm afraid Chris.

Which bit...? That Nitrogen won't expand with heat?

If so there's no point using it, fair enough.

However there is a part of that equation I believe to be useful. Rightly or wrongly.