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[cruisetopoland]

Shame the Omega does not get the excellent DSG 'box like most VW group cars...

Faster than a manual? I don't know. Give me a decent manual 6 speeder with the right choice of gear ratios... It might make the changes quick, but that doesn't mean it is quick.

Does the DSG box have any motorsport pedigree? Not sure, just asking, cos that often speaks volumes about where a component is on the performance versus reliability / durability scale.

Kevin

Golf GTi 0-62 mph: 7.2 seconds (6.9 – DSG) so 0.3 sec FASTER!

Depends on application how smooth it is-I drove the Octavia vRS with DSG and it was 1000x smoother than the (good) box in my Omega!

No idea on durability though...

[Kevin Wood]

Golf GTi 0-62 mph: 7.2 seconds (6.9 – DSG) so 0.3 sec FASTER!

Well, 0.3 seconds off the 0-60, assuming both measurements were with all else being equal (a couple of degrees cooler air could make that difference) is undeniably faster but is it worth all the extra complexity?

.. and, putting aside real life experience, DSG boxes change so aggressively when driven hard that there simply MUST be a reliability/durability price to pay for that little bit of performance due to the shock loads on the drivetrain.

.. Just as there is in running a sequential manual box. You wouldn't do it unless you have deep pockets and a passion for rebuilds.

I might be tempted by one if it was a company hack, but it'd be a brave DIY'er who touched one, IMHO.

Maybe in 5 years time they'll have proven to be bomb-proof and I'll eat my words... Maybe.

Kevin

[cruisetopoland]

Golf GTi 0-62 mph: 7.2 seconds (6.9 – DSG) so 0.3 sec FASTER!

Well, 0.3 seconds off the 0-60, assuming both measurements were with all else being equal (a couple of degrees cooler air could make that difference) is undeniably faster but is it worth all the extra complexity?

.. and, putting aside real life experience, DSG boxes change so aggressively when driven hard that there simply MUST be a reliability/durability price to pay for that little bit of performance due to the shock loads on the drivetrain.

.. Just as there is in running a sequential manual box. You wouldn't do it unless you have deep pockets and a passion for rebuilds.

I might be tempted by one if it was a company hack, but it'd be a brave DIY'er who touched one, IMHO.

Maybe in 5 years time they'll have proven to be bomb-proof and I'll eat my words... Maybe.

Kevin

A fair point.  DSG lovely to drive.... but best under warranty!! 

[feeutfo]

Golf GTi 0-62 mph: 7.2 seconds (6.9 – DSG) so 0.3 sec FASTER!

Well, 0.3 seconds off the 0-60, assuming both measurements were with all else being equal (a couple of degrees cooler air could make that difference) is undeniably faster but is it worth all the extra complexity?

.. and, putting aside real life experience, DSG boxes change so aggressively when driven hard that there simply MUST be a reliability/durability price to pay for that little bit of performance due to the shock loads on the drivetrain.

.. Just as there is in running a sequential manual box. You wouldn't do it unless you have deep pockets and a passion for rebuilds.

I might be tempted by one if it was a company hack, but it'd be a brave DIY'er who touched one, IMHO.

Maybe in 5 years time they'll have proven to be bomb-proof and I'll eat my words... Maybe.

Kevin

A fair point.  DSG lovely to drive.... but best under warranty!! 

agree with you both,dsg is a very good box ime. Mrs G had one in a company Golf 2.0d. Could not get my head round the description until the test drive. There is no, NO drop in power between changes. When second runs out of puff, 3rd gear is engaged with the second clutch, before second gear is fully disengaged. It times the cog swap perfectly to be seemless. i can see how the dsg might be quicker than a normal auto purely because there is so no lag. The omega is fairly seemless between cogs, but the dsg takes this a step further by making gear changes pull, rather than a dip in power....if that makes sense?

Fantastic to drive, but would not own one in a million years. Hand grenades by all acounts,  bugger that  :-/. Would be madness to put one in a bigger car.....

[cruisetopoland]

Golf GTi 0-62 mph: 7.2 seconds (6.9 – DSG) so 0.3 sec FASTER!

Well, 0.3 seconds off the 0-60, assuming both measurements were with all else being equal (a couple of degrees cooler air could make that difference) is undeniably faster but is it worth all the extra complexity?

.. and, putting aside real life experience, DSG boxes change so aggressively when driven hard that there simply MUST be a reliability/durability price to pay for that little bit of performance due to the shock loads on the drivetrain.

.. Just as there is in running a sequential manual box. You wouldn't do it unless you have deep pockets and a passion for rebuilds.

I might be tempted by one if it was a company hack, but it'd be a brave DIY'er who touched one, IMHO.

Maybe in 5 years time they'll have proven to be bomb-proof and I'll eat my words... Maybe.

Kevin

A fair point.  DSG lovely to drive.... but best under warranty!! 

agree with you both,dsg is a very good box ime. Mrs G had one in a company Golf 2.0d. Could not get my head round the description until the test drive. There is no, NO drop in power between changes. When second runs out of puff, 3rd gear is engaged with the second clutch, before second gear is fully disengaged. It times the cog swap perfectly to be seemless. i can see how the dsg might be quicker than a normal auto purely because there is so no lag. The omega is fairly seemless between cogs, but the dsg takes this a step further by making gear changes pull, rather than a dip in power....if that makes sense?

Fantastic to drive, but would not own one in a million years. Hand grenades by all acounts,  bugger that  :-/. Would be madness to put one in a bigger car.....

Very complex, but amazing.  I would love a DSG car-but only under warranty as said previously.  These boxes are fitted to the big Audis, VWs, Seats and Skodas, just as they are with smaller models.

DSG is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the Omega box-those who doubt this should drive one-amazing 

All new cars are over complicated and one day Omegas will be obselete, so this is where it is all going.... :-/

[Andy B]

.....
DSG is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the Omega box-those who doubt this should drive one-amazing  ......

Sorry! But I can't agree with you, I thought it was clunky and every gear change was certainly noticable, as it would be cos it's a manual box underneath afterall. It was more seemless than the change on Mrs Andy B's 'new' Smart. To a passerby it sounds just like a manual box.
I'd have my proper auto Omega anyday before the DSG 

[feeutfo]

.....
DSG is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the Omega box-those who doubt this should drive one-amazing  ......

Sorry! But I can't agree with you, I thought it was clunky and every gear change was certainly noticable, as it would be cos it's a manual box underneath afterall. It was more seemless than the change on Mrs Andy B's 'new' Smart. To a passerby it sounds just like a manual box.
I'd have my proper auto Omega anyday before the DSG 

Sumat wrong there mate, sell it, sharpish?   :-/

[cruisetopoland]

.....
DSG is LIGHT YEARS ahead of the Omega box-those who doubt this should drive one-amazing  ......

Sorry! But I can't agree with you, I thought it was clunky and every gear change was certainly noticable, as it would be cos it's a manual box underneath afterall. It was more seemless than the change on Mrs Andy B's 'new' Smart. To a passerby it sounds just like a manual box.
I'd have my proper auto Omega anyday before the DSG 

Perhaps was faulty?  Driven a few and have been seemless and offer great control 

[Andy B]

.....
Perhaps was faulty?  Driven a few and have been seemless

It wasn't our problem, but it was a 57 plate car with 30 000 miles on.
I'm sure it was as it should be, it was smooth if driven gently, but gear changes were more noticable when giving it a boot full.

..... and offer great control 

because you could use the up-a-gear dow-a-gear on the gear lever?  :-/ You need a car with pedal and be in complete control!!   

[Andy B]

....
Sumat wrong there mate, sell it, sharpish?   :-/

There must be sumat wrong with them all then. It has to have some time to change gear. You can't compare it with te DSG cos they have 2 clutches as far as I can make out (or care  ) One does 1 3 & 5 and t'other does 2 4 & 6 so it's going to take atleast half as long to change gear as the Smart cos it's got twice the clutches.

[feeutfo]

....
Sumat wrong there mate, sell it, sharpish?   :-/

There must be sumat wrong with them all then. It has to have some time to change gear. You can't compare it with te DSG cos they have 2 clutches as far as I can make out (or care  ) One does 1 3 & 5 and t'other does 2 4 & 6 so it's going to take atleast half as long to change gear as the Smart cos it's got twice the clutches.

Or wait for it to blow up, your choice, your car.... :-/

[tunnie]

smart sequential gearboxes are horrid, they have a habbit of surging, in a change. Almost makes you sea sick.

Press + or - to change gear, you can go away, make a cup of tea, 2 sugars, it might have changed by the time you get back 

[Marks DTM Calib]

Lol, the funniest thing about this latter part of the thread is stupid comparison between a 20 year old gearbox design and a 5 year gearbox design.

HELLO.....things do get developed!

[Andy B]

smart sequential gearboxes are horrid, they have a habbit of surging, in a change. Almost makes you sea sick.

Press + or - to change gear, you can go away, make a cup of tea, 2 sugars, it might have changed by the time you get back 

You talking from experience of hearsay from the likes of Clarkson?       

[Andy B]

Lol, the funniest thing about this latter part of the thread is stupid comparison between a 20 year old gearbox design and a 5 year gearbox design.

HELLO.....things do get developed!

But there's no comparison at all between the 2 of them, 20 yrs or not. One is an auto with torque converter and the other is a manual gearbox with auto controls. They are like comparing apples with bananas. They both achieve a similar end result but using completely different ideas. I personally didn't like the DSG - I said at the time, I could live with it if I had to, but I'd have a proper torque converter auto any day of the week, no matter whether it was a 20odd 3 speed box with a 4th electrically opperated overdrive or one of the fance 6 & 7 speed autos from Mercedes.