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[Kevin Wood]

The Racelogic setup would be the way to go, IMHO. It is able to limit wheel slip to a set amount by dropping cylinders. I believe it also has a lateral G sensor so it reduces the amount of wheel slip when cornering. It can do flat shift and launch control too, I believe. More importantly, it interfaces to the engine ECU by intercepting the injector drive signals so nice and simple and can be applied to any engine easily.

Just a bit pricy. <thinks about options for home-brewing one>

Kevin

[2woody]

£725 pricey

[Kevin Wood]

£725 pricey

Yep.

Still, that's the price you pay for someone taking a lot of time testing, getting the algorithms right and making a system that complements the car instead of crippling it.

Now, a Megasquirt could skip ignition/injection events easily enough. Wouldn't be that hard to add a box that will measure the speeds at 4 ABS wheel sensors and compute the amount of slip, then send a command up the CAN bus to reduce torque..

I suspect fine tuning it might take some effort.

Kevin

[aaronjb]

And that's not including the optional extra controller box, IIRC - which these days has a nice LCD screen and allows you to program it on-the-fly as well as select slip levels with a simple rotary dial from 0-20% by default.

It is a really nice setup.. I was pondering it for the MR2 for a while, but as you both say .. it's not cheap.

[2woody]

£725 pricey

Yep.

Still, that's the price you pay for someone taking a lot of time testing, getting the algorithms right and making a system that complements the car instead of crippling it.

Now, a Megasquirt could skip ignition/injection events easily enough. Wouldn't be that hard to add a box that will measure the speeds at 4 ABS wheel sensors and compute the amount of slip, then send a command up the CAN bus to reduce torque..

I suspect fine tuning it might take some effort.

Kevin

that's what 2woody's little brother does for a living.

[aaronjb]

Now, a Megasquirt could skip ignition/injection events easily enough. Wouldn't be that hard to add a box that will measure the speeds at 4 ABS wheel sensors and compute the amount of slip, then send a command up the CAN bus to reduce torque..

Drifting (even further) - do I take it from that statement that current MS incarnations support CAN bus?

[feeutfo]

removing stock features is never a good idea imo, fitting a v8 with a third more power is an improvement imo, removing abs and tc needed order to conrtrole it cant be a good idea, esp not to a possible buyer. Yes the omega abs and tc are basic perhaps, but as with the brakes the whole deal needs to progress as a package, possibly suspension as well...

....and i dont believe for one momment that we are all such great drivers that we havent been cought out on the odd frosty morning...weather the driver aids would have helped or not, imo its madness to remove something that has certainly saved my bacon before now....

Point taken on the frosty morning.

Very much doubt it would have made any difference if I'd had a crap Omega TC system fitted though.

I can't remember the last time my TC kicked in noticeably. I'm normally off the power by the time it's done anything. When it does intervene and you keep it planted it simply cuts the power, then applies it all again, then cuts it all. Repeat until ditch located. Worst possible scenario if you're trying to control the car in a buttock-clenching scenario, IMHO.

I have also had the Omega quite sideways under power without a murmur from the TC. If all the wheels happen to be still turning at the right speed it's none the wiser. I'd expect this to become the norm if you add an LSD.

I really don't regard the Omega TC setup as being worth bothering with. It simply stops play at the slightest hint of a wheel slipping, then it all comes back in with a bang if you haven't backed off.

Now, a decent aftermarket solution that would intervene more subtly and actually help you use the traction available more effectively is another matter.

ABS - you're pushing an open door. It's perfectly feasible to keep it and it will probably perform OK if any brake upgrades are done sensibly.

V8 power will make for a car that needs respect in most circumstances (will you choose to drive it on frosty mornings at all?) and I don't think the factory TC bodged to control a V8 is a crutch that will help, TBH. :-/

Kevin

Ah yes, I was talking about my frosty morning moment, not yours, sorry. 

 I have had moments in the early a.m. When I firmly expected the car to go round a corner at very sensible speeds on a tentative throttle and had the back step out and be cought by the tc, and thinking omega tc may be crap, but at that unexpected moment it was better than I. 

[Kevin Wood]

that's what 2woody's little brother does for a living.

Ahh. Yes, as you were saying. Hmm. Might be worth having a play. So many projects, so little time.

Drifting (even further) - do I take it from that statement that current MS incarnations support CAN bus?

Yes, MSII and above have a CAN interface in hardware. As it stands the firmware doesn't implement any standard sort of CAN protocol but allows peeking and poking of the variables within the ECU, as I understand it, so probably won't communicate with OEM ECUs. I think most of my recent thoughts are diverging from the off-the-shelf MS firmware anyway, though.

I have had moments in the early a.m. When I firmly expected the car to go round a corner at very sensible speeds on a tentative throttle and had the back step out and be caught by the tc, and thinking omega tc may be crap, but at that unexpected moment it was better than I.

Understood. Part the problem with the TC, IMHO, is that its' response to such scenarios is not gentle enough, especially when on a seriously slippery surface such as ice. Even if I recognised the situation late, as a driver, I hope I wouldn't respond by snapping shut the throttle, firing up the ABS pump and modulating the rear brakes.

Hmm. My rear tyres are almost down to the wear indicators anyway. Guess I'll be "doing some investigation" later.

Kevin

[aaronjb]

Thanks for the MS info, Kevin Interesting stuff.. one day I might get one and have a play on the MR2, see if I could dial out some of the inadequacies of the PFC with one.

Hmm. My rear tyres are almost down to the wear indicators anyway. Guess I'll be "doing some investigation" later.

Ditto to that after the track day in the MR2! Was supposed to pick up a set of tyres there, had the track day organiser not forgotten to order any for me  Probably a good job it honked it down with rain or they'd be well bald now!

[feeutfo]

£725 pricey

Yes, too pricey, by the time the lump is found there may not be enough cash left. It's this area that worries me, and general hidden costs that may/will catch us out leaving the thing sat on the drive going nowhere.

Aquiring an engine and getting it in the engine bay does not worry me, connecting everything up does, or the potential costs involved... gear box, transmision dif, gear lever and gaiter, the doner car is auto, drive shafts, ok that's 2woody territory. Cooling hoses and routing, bigger rad possibly, will an omega throttle cable fit/reach, vac supply to cabin for the heater, is the wiper motor in the way? Wondering why the piston heads mv8's wipers would not park....mating the engine 8 cylinder ecu and electrics to v6 omega elecrtics, brake upgrade, exhaust system will need binning and reworking, what cats?, locate o2 sensors, are the engine mounts in the right place, think the steering box is out the way but what if it clouts the engine?

In short I tend to look at things the other way, as you may have noticed by now,  in that, ok, we can see it's possible with our "glass half full", if it's still possible with our "glass half empty" then we're laughing, yes I know it's possible ultimately, so is walking on the moon,but at what cost? And what result? This could turn into a big outlay, with the best will in the world.

Covered a lot of this in chatting to prominent members on here tbh, but it's good to talk         

[Kevin Wood]

£725 pricey

Yes, too pricey, by the time the lump is found there may not be enough cash left....

Like I said, keep it simple. 

Get the basics sorted first. Get the lump in the car, coupled up, and connected to fuel, cooling, electrics and exhaust. Get some sort of engine management that will allow it to run.

Get a braking system working that will cope with the extra power/weight.

If it overheats, put a bigger rad. in. If it doesn't, happy days. 

By this time you will have a totally different idea of priorities.

If it's too much of an animal, and there's money left, fit TC.
If it's a total scream and perfect the way it is, don't.

If it annoys you that the MID doesn't give you the right MPG, the sat nav doesn't work, the air con blows hot, etc, find a way to make it work.
If it's such a grin-inducer to drive that you don't give a damn how much fuel it's using, where you're going or how hot you are, don't.

Having built a car (albeit a totally different beast) I found that the decisions you make at the beginning (and which can potentially turn out to be expensive) don't necessarily get you to where you later realise you wanted to be at the end of the project.

Take it in small, manageable steps and you can re-assess your aims and your budget as you go.

Kevin

[Psychoca]

Try looking for Lincolnshire-based club for yank cars. There seems to be a fair following for them here, despite the fact that there are only 72 people that live in Lincolnshire 

As many as that???

[venom]

Like I've said my mate has some Northstar 4.6 L V8's

[feeutfo]

Like I've said my mate has some Northstar 4.6 L V8's

Kind thought, but I don't think they fit sadly, one of the advantages of the Ls pushrod twin valve heads is there is only one cam, so gives a much smaller head and hence less width.... As I understand it... Where's those books...

[feeutfo]

Well, if it fits in an Astra....
http://www.migweb.co.uk/forums/cars-sale/387275-ls1-v8-rwd-astra-coupe-sale.html