Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[mkaminski100]

“TheBoy” did the tech2 check-up on Saturday and advised me to post a question regarding my autobox.
Two month ago I bought and Omega "C" 1999, 2.0 16V. It was fine till the time when we were driving for a long time in town. Suddenly (I think when gear was changed from 1 to 2 ) revs went up like the clutch would start slipping.  When I pressed the throttle, revs went up, but the car didn't accelerate. So I pressed the brake and it went to normal. Second time, when it happened, I got an "Automatic Gearbox" message (I was waiting what will happened), but as soon as I restarted the engine it went to back to normal again. Both problems appeared when accelerating from low speed, somewhere around 1-2-3 gear, after quite long driving. I was doing longer trips in town since then and before but nothing happen.
I have changed the oil and filter. There was nothing in oil sump (no bits or pieces – all clean); only the magnet was covered in grey mud. Oil was dark but wasn't really bad. I got out ca 4l of oil and used ca 5,5l of Castrol Dexron III, I started the engine (on N) and topped up, till it started to go out. Car was bit tilted so I give him bit more oil.
Everything seemed to be ok. Gearbox was working smooth, without any problems with revs. Only thing that I found odd was that when accelerating to ca 30 miles/hour and letting go the throttle I felt a hard pull from time to time, like when changing gear and releasing clutch to fast (like a kick). I was told that it might be common in these engines as the gearbox, when accelerating, is ready to change a gear and is doing it when I am letting go the throttle.  
I went to "TheBoy" to change autobox soft and he told me that there's something wrong with it. First he said that there is a ratio error (no8) message but as it was old he deleted it.  After reprogramming, he did a test drive and after, told me that the gearbox is broken (clutch is slipping). He said that this knock (hard pull) is when the gearbox has some issues with ratio and the gearbox is in error mode, and is waiting with gear change. After a second it changes the gear rapidly and that's why I can feel it.
Anyway, as he was testing the car the gearbox was very busy and it was a hard test. (Before the car was standing with started engine for about 30-40 minutes) When we were going back home, ca 5 and then 15 miles from "Boy's" house I got the same "rev's" problems as a first time. When accelerating hard or going on slope, suddenly, after gear change or letting the throttle and pressing it again, revs went up and car wasn't accelerating (like with broken clutch). It happened three times within first 20 miles, but it didn't happen again (next 4 miles). It was ok all way back. When going on hill, gear was kicked down so revs went up to ca 3500 but as soon as we reached the top of the hill it went back to 2500 (70 mile/hour).  I went back home and decided to drive in town to warm up the gearbox, but the gearbox was working even smoother than before. I was waiting ca 30 minutes in long queue and the gearbox was working just fine.  Gears now are changed smoothly and even that I can fell a little "kick" when changing a gear but it's nothing with old rev's problem or "kick problem.
I don't know what to do, as the gearbox works fine now, and I'm afraid that it might fail at any time. I am going to Poland within 4 weeks and I'm stressed about it. I don't want to stuck somewhere in the middle.
Thank you for any help and suggestions.

[VXL V6]

When you refilled the gearbox did you go through every gear once or twice with the selector, holding it in each position for about ten seconds? You would also need someone to keep toping the box up while you do this.

How many miles has the gearbox done?

I am tempted to say that the simplest solution would be another box but would suggest you get the opinions of other (more knowledgable than me!) on here.

[mkaminski100]

No I didnt go throught every gear. I just toped it while on "P". Car was on axle stand and I couldnt risk to put any gear. I was underneath the car and second person started the engine. Shouldnt there be an error message when there's not enogh oil? Something with oil pressure? I will try to check oil level once again (warm engine), but I think that if I used 5.5 litres of oil, there shouldnt be a problem.
Gearbox did 77.000 miles, and I assume that the oil wasnt changed since new. As I said before, there was a grey mud on the magnet. My friend's suggestion was that it's a one of the gear discs which is used. I assume that this car was mainly used in London by a lady owner so it rarely reached 3rd gear. Maybe as it was driven on first and second, discs got used... But I dont know much about autoboxes.
Buying a second hand autobox isn't a solution for me, as I dont know anything about it's condition and might be that it will fail within next 5000miles. My friend bought a second hand one ang it got broken after 6 monts (6 months warranty).
I was told than Sassanach is an expert in autoboxes. I've already posted the same question to him but he might be busy.

[VXL V6]

As I said before, there was a grey mud on the magnet.

Wouldn't worry about that too much, that's why the sump has a magnet and why there is a filter in the pickup. the sludge is very fine particles of metal but is normal, mine had a layer of it in the sump as well.

[mkaminski100]

There wasnt any piece of metal or plastic, just a mud.
Tell me if I'm right about toping up. I will start warmed engine on flat surface. Then change gears keeping them for 10 sec. Then lift the car, open check plug, top up  oil, lower it (while running), let the excess oil go out and close the plug.

[VXL V6]

Topping up procedure is here:-

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1152783586

[mkaminski100]

I've seen this guide, but it doesnt say anything about changing gears and gear which should be on when toping. I toped my autobox according to Mark's guide (on "P") but the engine was cold (as I was changing oil and filter and poured 5.5 of cold DIII)

Oh, and one more thing. I was told that whole autobox contail ca 8-8.5 l of oil and "only" 5.5 are in oil sumps. I was told, after changing oil, to take out small plastic plug from the gearbox and this way I could get out extra 2-3 l of old oil.

[TheBoy]

The gearbox level should be adjusted when transimission fluid at 60C.  ie, take it for a 20min drive around the town, then check.

My gut reaction is there is something more fundamental wrong with this box from the short test drive (2 miles).

I can't believe the plates are worn on 78k car, unless its been driven with excessive slip, so would have to assume sticking solenoid or similar...  ...don't really know enough about these boxes. Sassanach it probably the one who knows these boxes best.

[VXL V6]

Hi Mkaminski100

Top up procedure is for toping up, Filling the box after emptying the fluid out is a different procedure as you need to 'prime' the box in each gear.

I would assume that once you have driven the car for a while then it would prime itself and you may need to top it up afterwards, though i'm not 100% on this.

If the fluid was low for a while then I would assume more damage would have occured, Sassanach showed me parts from a box that'd obviously led a hard life, worn parts were rather obvious!

[Marks DTM Calib]

It does sound very much like a loss of fluid pressure which does pint to a worn bush....

[mkaminski100]

I will chceck the oil level again today.
Mark. Can you please tell me more about this bush? It it this gear ring or something else? The gearbox doesn't leak. Ther revs problem hapens only on low speed when accelerating on 2 or 3 gear (not sure wchich one). Shouldn't there be a problem on each gear if the bush is worn out. And shouldnt there be an error code if the pressure is not correct?

[TheBoy]

Hi Mkaminski100

Top up procedure is for toping up, Filling the box after emptying the fluid out is a different procedure as you need to 'prime' the box in each gear.

I would assume that once you have driven the car for a while then it would prime itself and you may need to top it up afterwards, though i'm not 100% on this.

If the fluid was low for a while then I would assume more damage would have occured, Sassanach showed me parts from a box that'd obviously led a hard life, worn parts were rather obvious!

I wonder if that was from my tractor

[TheBoy]

I will chceck the oil level again today.
Mark. Can you please tell me more about this bush? It it this gear ring or something else? The gearbox doesn't leak. Ther revs problem hapens only on low speed when accelerating on 2 or 3 gear (not sure wchich one). Shouldn't there be a problem on each gear if the bush is worn out. And shouldnt there be an error code if the pressure is not correct?

The electronic fault diagnosis on the autobox is not that involved.  It actually monitors very little in reality.

[VXL V6]

Sassanach showed me parts from a box that'd obviously led a hard life, worn parts were rather obvious!

I wonder if that was from my tractor

Nope, not saying who it belonged too!  

[TheBoy]

Sassanach showed me parts from a box that'd obviously led a hard life, worn parts were rather obvious!

I wonder if that was from my tractor

Nope, not saying who it belonged too!  

Was it from a tractor?