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[vista]

last week saw me buy my 98 omega elite sport estate wat a car black bodywork with black leather interior the full spec however little did i know that some asswipe would allso like to have it for nothin... i was lucky enough to get away with the rear side glass going through the rac came out to make the car safe as they dont carry this glass in stock so its gonner be next week before the damage is put right so iv been lookin at more security on the car as i dont have a garage and its out of site to when im at home iv been looking at the microscan car alarm this they say warns of a would be toerag before they can do any damage to the car my question is this is there anyone in the forum who has one of these alarms fitted and if so do they really work i dont want a  waste a lot of money on this and its not all its cracked up to be there will allways be those who want your car for nothin having it stolen is bad enough but the damage they couse trying to take it can be worse id be gratfull for comments otherwise its bullet proof glass yer...

[Marks DTM Calib]

Do consider that the basic Omega immobiliser is already a Thatcham Cat 2 device and if you have the factory fitted alarm then its a Cat1....so adding an extra alarm setup is not going to do much for you.

Chances are the little scrotes were probably trying to nick stuff from the boot/backset....

[Dave DND]

The problem with the basic factory fit alrm systems are that they are all the same. Same modules, same wiring and same locations for everything.

this means that the scrote that wants your car can "learn" on one and then target a car very fast as he knows exactly what the layout is and which wires to mess with.

An aftermarket alarm will always add to the confusion - they are all installed differently, and no two are ever fitted the same meaning tyhat if the thief is confused he may give up and you will still have the car left (better than an empty driveway)

We have fitted most makes of alarms over the last 16 years, and had callouts for most as well. Statistically, the least number of call outs we have ever had are with Sigma alrms - the most being Clifford !

Whatever you choose, get it professionally fitted.  

[Dave DND]

oh, bandit proof and bullet proof glass will require extensive modifications to the door

Roughly

£1.5K per door - and £4K each front and rear screen

We have done a few of these now for for some of our "High Profile" and "dubious" clients  

[GastronomicKleptomaniac]

oh, bandit proof and bullet proof glass will require extensive modifications to the door

Roughly

£1.5K per door - and £4K each front and rear screen

We have done a few of these now for for some of our "High Profile" and "dubious" clients  

 On BMW X5s by any chance?

[Marks DTM Calib]

I am still not sold on the merit of an aftermarket alarm, certianly not given the outlay for one.

If they are nicking things from a car, no alarm will stop them as they will be in and out.

As for immobiliser, I cant see any aftermarket one getting close to the security of the Vx 95 onwards version.

And, at the end of the day, if they want it, they will get it!

Money down the pan in this case is my view.

[Dave DND]

(Windows? No, haven`t done an X5 as yet) Jaguar / Merc

As far as your comments on the OEM security

How fast could you get in the car, wrench the lock on the steering wheel and plug a device into the diagnostic socket?

Less than a minute?  Less that 30 secs with the adrenalin pumping?

Thats what the pro`s are doing !!  Yes, a lot of Vauxhalls can now be started and driven by plugging a device into various ports around the vehicle. Some of the methods for stealing cars are so sophisticated that many of the aftermarket alarm companies now employ criminals to advise them. On a training course I went on a few years ago, there was a demonstartion using a car from the audience as to how fast it could be removed. There was a team of "ahem" experts, and they put a screen around the car to prevent us from seeing what was done.

The Merc 350 was opened and driven off in 15 seconds with no visable or physical damage done (steering lock on - but they said it would only take another 10 seconds to break that)

That was a fairly modern car - How old is the Omega now?

Want to rethink the aftermarket security  

[Marks DTM Calib]

(Windows? No, haven`t done an X5 as yet) Jaguar / Merc

As far as your comments on the OEM security

How fast could you get in the car, wrench the lock on the steering wheel and plug a device into the diagnostic socket?

Less than a minute?  Less that 30 secs with the adrenalin pumping?

Thats what the pro`s are doing !!  Yes, a lot of Vauxhalls can now be started and driven by plugging a device into various ports around the vehicle. Some of the methods for stealing cars are so sophisticated that many of the aftermarket alarm companies now employ criminals to advise them. On a training course I went on a few years ago, there was a demonstartion using a car from the audience as to how fast it could be removed. There was a team of "ahem" experts, and they put a screen around the car to prevent us from seeing what was done.

The Merc 350 was opened and driven off in 15 seconds with no visable or physical damage done (steering lock on - but they said it would only take another 10 seconds to break that)

That was a fairly modern car - How old is the Omega now?

Want to rethink the aftermarket security  

No, I still wouldn't bother, its the hardened criminals that are still going to nick them and you wont stop them not even with an aftermarket alarm/immobiliser. Its the more common druggies after a bit of change adn joy riders that the Standard stuff will stop.

Still struggling to see how they are getting around the ECU setup without the PIN though (unless they obtain this first)

[TheBoy]

Now I don't know, but if the immobiliser software can stop itself being reflashed via diags port (and the Omega one doesn't appear flashable), and the engine ECU won't start without a coded signal (not a simple signal) from immobiliser ECU, and the engine ECU is not flashable (on 2/5/3.0), then I can't see a way to break it  :-/

I'd need a lot of convincing about aftermarket security as well.

[Dave DND]

No, I still wouldn't bother, its the hardened criminals that are still going to nick them and you wont stop them not even with an aftermarket alarm/immobiliser. Its the more common druggies after a bit of change adn joy riders that the Standard stuff will stop.

Thats about it - If a pro has decided to target your car, then he has got it, and the joyriders will simply vandalise it if they cant drive it.

Either way you can`t win.  

[TheBoy]

No, I still wouldn't bother, its the hardened criminals that are still going to nick them and you wont stop them not even with an aftermarket alarm/immobiliser. Its the more common druggies after a bit of change adn joy riders that the Standard stuff will stop.

Thats about it - If a pro has decided to target your car, then he has got it, and the joyriders will simply vandalise it if they cant drive it.

Either way you can`t win.  

But on the upside, I still have that £1k - 1.5k money that I could have spent on a aftermarket, pro fitted alarm in my back pocket

[Dave DND]

But on the upside, I still have that £1k - 1.5k money that I could have spent on a aftermarket, pro fitted alarm in my back pocket

Quite right - that will about cover the difference from what the Insurance will pay out  

[Dave DND]

Still struggling to see how they are getting around the ECU setup without the PIN though (unless they obtain this first)

Thats because you are assuming they are using the standard ECU, and not an alternative pre-programmed device carried around in their pocket!  

Car theft is now Plug and Play

[TheBoy]

Still struggling to see how they are getting around the ECU setup without the PIN though (unless they obtain this first)

Thats because you are assuming they are using the standard ECU, and not an alternative pre-programmed device carried around in their pocket!  

Car theft is now Plug and Play

Lot of effort for a (relatively) worthless Omega....

[Martin_1962]

Sometimes there is something to be said for unplugging things, if you leave it for a while unplug the fuel pump relay