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[Nick W]

I imagine it would have taken several more oil and filter changes to remove all that debris from the system. I should have changed the oil and filter again on seeing that dip stick, and again and again until the stick showed clean oil. Silly me. I shall not make that mistake again.

If that mess was after an oil change then several changes wouldn't really have helped: pulling the sump and physically removing all off the sludge would have been the only realistic option. Quicker and cheaper too.

[terry paget]

Thanks Nick, I am sure you are right. My only clues were the vendor telling me she had not had the car serviced 'for ages', and the ominous appearance of the dip stick after the oil change. Then I had never removed a sump, so I gamblsd on the car passing its MOT, and planning to do another oil change after a few hundred miles. Next time I see a black dipstick after an oil change I shall think twice.

It reminds me to change the oil on my other cars in good time too.

[Kevin Wood]

Actually, now you have the sump off, I would take a peek at one or two of the main / big end bearings. That will tell you everything you need to know about whether it's worth persevering.

If you do, it's vital you mark and keep the bearing caps and bearings  the right way so they go back as they came off 

top end cam housings will starve of oil long before the crank though normally

Yes, of course. Everything needs to go back exactly as it was.

.. and whilst the top end might be starved first, the bottom end will be the most prone to damage when the engine's driven under load.

If the top end has suffered, popping a 2nd hand head on would be an easy fix. If the bottom end bearings have suffered, it probably need a complete stripdown and rebuild.

[terry paget]

Yesterday I bought another Astra 1.6 H, 111000 miles, full MOT, £795. On getting it home I promptly changed the oil and filter. Dipped the oil, it was not bad, but not completely clean either. I see in the service record the oil and filter have been changed 5 times since Feb 2017, in 11000 miles. Could it be Astras are prone to collecting muck in the sump? I would drop the sump of this one, but doing so involves destroying the central exhaust. As Nick W observed, the muck in my 04 Astra would never have been removed by oil changes.
What are the points for and against changing to 10W40 oil?

[dave the builder]

5w30 synthetic is ok for a new engine , but after 100k and 14+ years it is thin and has detergents and additives, if you had the car from new and did regular oil changes then it may be ok , but with a high mile engine ,that may have had cheap or thicker oil  ,or done short journeys ,not getting up to tempreture, sludge and deposits can be washed off(as you proved  )
10w40 semi or even mineral (with regular changes ) is thicker ,
I've had vauxhalls since i was 18 ,never found a 100k+ one that ran happy on fully synthetic P155 (5w30)  they smoke ,use stupid amounts of  oil ,IIRC vauxhall official oil consumption on a 1.6 astra g was 1 L per 1000 miles 

I'm sure someone will b along shortly to say i'm wrong  but 30 years of vauxhalls under my belt ,none i scrapped for engine problems  the tin worm ate em 
 

I see in the service record the oil and filter have been changed 5 times since Feb 2017, in 11000 miles.

sounds very odd 
unless they tried 5w30 and it smoked /got very dirty 
or maybe they are using  10/40 with 3k oil and filter changes ,which would be fine if the 11k was traffic jams or short journeys which requires more regular service

when buying a car, ask questions about what oil they used etc

are you not going to try replacing the sump + fresh oil on the other 120k car 

[Doctor Gollum]

Probably done to cure the same problem as the first car...

Sounds like it worked temporarily enough to make the car worth £795

Joking aside, whatever was done clearly doesn't work long term otherwise the seller would have kept it

Caveat Emptor etc...

[terry paget]

Probably done to cure the same problem as the first car...

Sounds like it worked temporarily enough to make the car worth £795

Joking aside, whatever was done clearly doesn't work long term otherwise the seller would have kept it

Caveat Emptor etc...

Maybe. First Astra I bought was the 2010 160K car which I bought 3 weeks ago, seemed fine, was in and out in a day, and is still giving satisfactory service with my high mikeage son Jonny. This gave me confidence in the Astra and bought more. I have bought Omegas, 2 a year, on that basis, for16 years.
I suspect that Astras and 5W30 oil are less tolerant of missed filter changes than10W40.
 

[ajsphead]

5w30 synthetic is ok for a new engine , but after 100k and 14+ years it is thin and has detergents and additives, if you had the car from new and did regular oil changes then it may be ok , but with a high mile engine ,that may have had cheap or thicker oil  ,or done short journeys ,not getting up to tempreture, sludge and deposits can be washed off(as you proved  )
10w40 semi or even mineral (with regular changes ) is thicker ,
I've had vauxhalls since i was 18 ,never found a 100k+ one that ran happy on fully synthetic P155 (5w30)  they smoke ,use stupid amounts of  oil ,IIRC vauxhall official oil consumption on a 1.6 astra g was 1 L per 1000 miles 

I'm sure someone will b along shortly to say i'm wrong  but 30 years of vauxhalls under my belt ,none i scrapped for engine problems  the tin worm ate em 
 

I see in the service record the oil and filter have been changed 5 times since Feb 2017, in 11000 miles.

sounds very odd 
unless they tried 5w30 and it smoked /got very dirty 
or maybe they are using  10/40 with 3k oil and filter changes ,which would be fine if the 11k was traffic jams or short journeys which requires more regular service

when buying a car, ask questions about what oil they used etc

are you not going to try replacing the sump + fresh oil on the other 120k car 

GM provide a wide range of suitable oil grades for the engine so it isn't as critical as some. My 1.6 has done 111K has always had 5W30 and is smooth and quiet. it also uses no oil between changes. It's been serviced according to the fixed mileage schedule and used I think really "normally" so i have no reason to change the oil grade.

To my knowledge there are no known issues with sludging so it may be as much to do with how it's driven and the quality of lubricant used and whether it's been flushed at oil changes if needed.

I'd look for signs of swarf and sludge in the sump. I have a simpler way of checking the sump for sludge using a thick gauge wire or thin gauge steel rod with a shortish 90 degree bend inserted through the drain plug hole and then rotated gently across the inside of the sump pan. it's not perfect in that it won't show what's under the baffle but it gives some idea of whether it's fairly clean or slimy and the sump needs to be removed. Even if you pull no sludge out you can feel the rod pulling through it.

Out of interest do you use a flushing agent at oil changes?

Did you suss out the owner to see if:

1. They were trying to hide something or
2. They were paranoid ?

[Kevin Wood]

My Omega is knocking on 230k miles, I use 5w30 in it and it doesn't burn a drop.

There is no point over thinking it and the difference in viscosity between grades in not huge anyway. Just use what the manufacturer recommends. I am not really a fan of semi synthetic when you can get fully synthetic almost as cheap these days but then I CBA to change the oil every 3k either.

With an unknown history a few quick changes with cheap oil might be a decent idea in the light of recent experience.

[terry paget]

5w30 synthetic is ok for a new engine , but after 100k and 14+ years it is thin and has detergents and additives, if you had the car from new and did regular oil changes then it may be ok , but with a high mile engine ,that may have had cheap or thicker oil  ,or done short journeys ,not getting up to tempreture, sludge and deposits can be washed off(as you proved  )
10w40 semi or even mineral (with regular changes ) is thicker ,
I've had vauxhalls since i was 18 ,never found a 100k+ one that ran happy on fully synthetic P155 (5w30)  they smoke ,use stupid amounts of  oil ,IIRC vauxhall official oil consumption on a 1.6 astra g was 1 L per 1000 miles 

I'm sure someone will b along shortly to say i'm wrong  but 30 years of vauxhalls under my belt ,none i scrapped for engine problems  the tin worm ate em 
 

I see in the service record the oil and filter have been changed 5 times since Feb 2017, in 11000 miles.

sounds very odd 
unless they tried 5w30 and it smoked /got very dirty 
or maybe they are using  10/40 with 3k oil and filter changes ,which would be fine if the 11k was traffic jams or short journeys which requires more regular service

when buying a car, ask questions about what oil they used etc

are you not going to try replacing the sump + fresh oil on the other 120k car 

GM provide a wide range of suitable oil grades for the engine so it isn't as critical as some. My 1.6 has done 111K has always had 5W30 and is smooth and quiet. it also uses no oil between changes. It's been serviced according to the fixed mileage schedule and used I think really "normally" so i have no reason to change the oil grade.

To my knowledge there are no known issues with sludging so it may be as much to do with how it's driven and the quality of lubricant used and whether it's been flushed at oil changes if needed.

I'd look for signs of swarf and sludge in the sump. I have a simpler way of checking the sump for sludge using a thick gauge wire or thin gauge steel rod with a shortish 90 degree bend inserted through the drain plug hole and then rotated gently across the inside of the sump pan. it's not perfect in that it won't show what's under the baffle but it gives some idea of whether it's fairly clean or slimy and the sump needs to be removed. Even if you pull no sludge out you can feel the rod pulling through it.

Out of interest do you use a flushing agent at oil changes?

Did you suss out the owner to see if:

1. They were trying to hide something or
2. They were paranoid ?

Thanks for your sludge checking tip. I shall employ it.
The first Astra I bought was a dealer p/x to clear; great car. The second was an MOT failed car, no mention of emissions on the fail certificate; I inspected it, no rust, and bought it. It was a 'wife's car', when I picked it up I met the wife, and she proudly announced she had never had the oil changed in 4 years.  The third was bought from a dodgy dealer in Ringwood, but the car came with MOT till 25 Nov 2019, and looked all right and test drove all right. I know buying 10 year old cars is always a gamble, but I have never encountered sump sludge before.

[Doctor Gollum]

Nothing you have said about the second or third Astra inspires confidence and only suggests that you got lucky with the first one. I for one, would be interested to know how the sump contents compare between cars 2 and 3

You would do well to spend that sort of cash on ex plod stuff... at least you know exactly what you're getting.

Ex Surrey or TVP from WOMA is a safe bet... 4-5 years old and no nonsense.

[terry paget]

Nothing you have said about the second or third Astra inspires confidence and only suggests that you got lucky with the first one. I for one, would be interested to know how the sump contents compare between cars 2 and 3

You would do well to spend that sort of cash on ex plod stuff... at least you know exactly what you're getting.

Ex Surrey or TVP from WOMA is a safe bet... 4-5 years old and no nonsense.

I bought all my Senators from WOMA, and my second Omega, ex TVP. They weren't as cheap as the rest of my Omegas, though, and they were unique police spec, manuals, no cruise. I have become accustomed to paying less than £1000 for my cars recently, paid £190 for my last Omega purchase. At least Astras don't rust. I wonder what ex-police Astras cost?

[Doctor Gollum]

About £800

[Nick W]

And they're not treated like motorway cars either. Used up is probably the nicest description.

[Doctor Gollum]

Half the age though