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[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

Indeed, DG. Once the dust settles on this we as a country need to make sure the little bit of freedom we had left before it is returned completely.
Politicians love to have power over people for the sake of it, and it must be resisted.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

I can honestly say these new rules will make no difference to me. I wasn't planning on mixing with anyone from outside my own household...until at least 2023....maybe 😄

This will be the upside to' having no mates'

You have mates at school, after that they become an unnecessary nuisance. These days I don't fancy going the park or playing football in the street.

I tend to agree. I have one good mate a mile away who is in his 80,s so may not be a mate muc longer. Also have one really good mate in Norn Irn who I havent seen for over 5 years, and might never see again.
Im happy enough with this and dont want or need any more mates.
Experience has taught me that most of the "mates" Ive had are people who I have helped out time after time, but theres always a good reason why they cant reciprocate when Ive needed help.

[STEMO]

I can honestly say these new rules will make no difference to me. I wasn't planning on mixing with anyone from outside my own household...until at least 2023....maybe 😄

This will be the upside to' having no mates'

You have mates at school, after that they become an unnecessary nuisance. These days I don't fancy going the park or playing football in the street.

I tend to agree. I have one good mate a mile away who is in his 80,s so may not be a mate muc longer. Also have one really good mate in Norn Irn who I havent seen for over 5 years, and might never see again.
Im happy enough with this and dont want or need any more mates.
Experience has taught me that most of the "mates" Ive had are people who I have helped out time after time, but theres always a good reason why they cant reciprocate when Ive needed help.

Stop using words like 'reciprocate', or we'll think you've had the vaccine chip already. 😄

[Doctor Gollum]

A better solution might be to keep everything open but contain areas. Seal off the cities from travel in and out and shut down passenger transport.

Lundun, Birmingham and Mancchester all have ring roads, so easily closed down.

That way, people can still retain some normality whilst not spreading Batflu across the country.

Likewise close the borders. No one in and no one out.

Make the ferries trailer only as well. Might actually speed things up a bit too.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

Ive been saying since Feb / Mar h we should have stopped anyone from coming into the country. Im sure it was already here, but could have been kept at a low level, contained, and dealt with.
Were an island for christs sake. We should have used the advantage of that.

[Lizzie Zoom]

Common Sense suggests that nobody should mix with anyone else.  Though reality is this is not always possible.

If the government had to legislate for every conceivable variation, well, that would be unmanageable.  Trouble is, the British Public, as we know, are incredibly thick and, as has been stated, aim for the rules to be the target they must meet*.  And the authorities are pissing in the wind by trying to rely on the common sense of the populous.  Personally, I think all parts of the Great Britain (not sure on NI's current rules) have implemented the least restrictive rules possible given the circumstances, I think they do need tightening...   ...this new more infectious strain is clearly now everywhere, so I think everywhere should be a minimum of T3, and most places T4.

I'm in T2, in a commuter town, a few miles north is the T3 area spreading south from the midlands, and 1 mile south is T4.  Its a bit non sensical, as a significant proportion of people are mixing to what the rules allow.

Whilst I'm pretty confident if/when I catch it, I probably won't notice any more than the usual colds I get this time of year, it would be likely I would spread it to someone (directly or indirectly) who would not fare so well.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, but I do think the government has always been slow to respond.  For the current extra restrictions, this was obvious early last week when the numbers started to rise significantly.  Other than that, I think the government has done a reasonable job...   ...and the mainstream media has done an absolutely crap job, even by their pathetic standards.



*But these same people refuse to use the speed limits as a target, and drive at 15mph below them   

Yes, indeed TB, over many years now many of us have been complaining about the "Nanny State" and how we are being controlled by the government of the day and not allowed to make our own decisions.

Now this IS the time for a complete, absolute Nanny State to exist, even an autocratic one, to protect the many stupid people from themselves.  How can the government trust people to "do the right thing" and use common sense when they constantly fail to do that in normal times, let alone now!

It is interesting how the Western democratic world has been so badly affected compared to what we know has been the case in the autocratic countries.  It is down to democratic "Freedoms" that normally are a good thing, but NOT NOW.  We need state control, with our leader telling us clearly, and laying down the law, about what we should not do with war time like legal enforcement.  That way it will protect us from ourselves and save thousands of lives.

The trouble is, there are those in government or opposition who would impose such restrictions in such a way as to be irreversible.

And whilst you might argue that freedom (perceived or otherwise) is a luxury, losing what we have left isn't an option because once it's gone it will be to late to reclaim it.

The longer term choice seems to be carry on regardless or become mindless drones.

Not against the principle behind the restrictions, but we're leaning over a cliff with a very rickety guard rail.

Yes, I take that point on board entirely and agree DG.

However I think our democracy is strong enough to modify itself when necessary, as it did in WW2 to protect the nation, but then rebound to it's full strengths for us all afterwards.  As long as we do not become a police state then we, I believe, will always have people around strong enough to fight for our freedoms, and not end up like poor Hong Kong dragged against the will of the majority into the Chinese autocracy / dictatorship. Our history would seem to suggest we have the depth of experience as a people to understand the worth of our freedoms, but also understand we have to take on the responsibility of limiting those benefits in the interests of the nation and those who live here.

[Doctor Gollum]

Life is very, very different to 1945, and we're already past George Orwell's take on the future.

Don’t doubt for a second that once those who would seize control do so, that they will waste any time removing democratic process and with it, accountability.

[STEMO]

Nah.

[Lizzie Zoom]

Life is very, very different to 1945, and we're already past George Orwell's take on the future.

Don’t doubt for a second that once those who would seize control do so, that they will waste any time removing democratic process and with it, accountability.

Since Germany did that after 1933, all fully democratic nations have parliamentary restrictions in place to stop that happening without it being very obvious to the contemporary opposition parties and the peoples, especially with the very vocal media we have now that even autocratic countries like China cannot escape.

[Doctor Gollum]

The very vocal media? 

Global social media is fundamentally owned by Facebook.

Mainstream media is largely pushing a left leaning narrative often at odds with what is actually happening.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

No need to remove Parliamentary Democracy. Just have two parties which are fundamentally the same as one another.
In some respects we arent actually a million miles from there, now that Corbyn has been pushed out of Labour.
Labour isnt a particularly Socialist party any more, and the Tories are anything but Conservative.
They both dance on the head of a pin in what is perceived as the centre ground (which is actually quite far to the left of centre now), magnify their differences and argue about them.

[TheBoy]

If I was in charge, I'd reduce the numbers by massively reducing the population of this overcrowded rock, especially in England.

[Doctor Gollum]

My suggestion for the conurbations would probably achieve that result without having everyone sitting at home waiting for summat to happen...

[ronnyd]

I'm in a very similar position to you James. My mother is now receiving end of life care at home with the help of a live in care (a lovely lady from Zimbabwe via Southend). This will most certainly be her last Christmas. The only saving grace for me is that she is only 20 miles away so visiting isn't much of a problem. I'm not sure if i'm breaking any of the new rules with this or not though.

[Doctor Gollum]

I'm in a very similar position to you James. My mother is now receiving end of life care at home with the help of a live in care (a lovely lady from Zimbabwe via Southend). This will most certainly be her last Christmas. The only saving grace for me is that she is only 20 miles away so visiting isn't much of a problem. I'm not sure if i'm breaking any of the new rules with this or not though.

Arguably, if the only other time you leave the house is for essentials and the other person you speak to is the checkout person, visiting is completely reasonable. Under the circumstances.