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[05omegav6]

She did also order police on horseback to beat the living shite out of ordinary working men( miners) with truncheons who were striking to try and ensure their jobs

Had they seen/known what the union was uptobeen allowed to and vote with their subscriptions, 80% would have still been in work, and their kids/grandkids would still have jobs.

That union that some died for, soon stopped paying for food and support when the subs ran out

[cem_devecioglu]

Keep listening to your union rep Cem

The unions only interest in its members is the subscriptions. The higher your wages get, the more they can take from you. Turn off google and wikiblocks and think for yourself

The last productive stike was probably (according to the film 'Dagenham', anyway), when the female workers at  Fords Dagenham plant walked out demanding equal pay. Eventually they got their way. But most strikes were over trivial nonsense, and in the case of nationalised industries, cost the country billions of pounds in lost production, helping to make the likes of British Leyland a laughing stock. By the time she came to power Maggie had little choice but to crush the unions and privatise everything, just to protect the British Economy. That those companies failed simply demonstrates how damaging the unions had been 

As I said earlier, it is purely down to the left-wing fatcat approach to government that has created our current predicament, and not as you suggest, the policies of Margaret Thatcher and her government.

if, any ordinary person, can be elected to be a prime minister, can see lots of variables that he/she can play with for closing the holes of the economy as I stated before.. but if that person serves a certain group (and her agenda) who holds a whole nation as slaves (sadly here is the same) , of course will march directly on those unions.. 

[Lizzie_Zoom]

As for those despicable specimens holding street parties and popping champagne etc because of her death !!
If they had a shred of the most basic human decency they would refrain from doing it due to the extra pain and hurt it will inflict on her family,if for no other reason.

Absoute freakin' morons who probably have no idea about politics or the time before or during her Prime Ministership.
It just shows you what this country has become

As for Derek Pratton and Ken Slimingston they ought to go freak one another with the rough end of a pineapple

Indeed, and a large proportion of those "celebrating" with pictures of her defaced with slogans on the streets I note were not even born when she came to power.  Everything has already been said but for the fact we were classed as "The sick man of Europe" and we deserved it for the crap the country was in before Maggie.

[05omegav6]

When Margaret Thatcher became PM the UK was in a similar state to now. She inherited a near bankrupt, Labour impoverished economy.

She did what she felt necessary to get the country back on its feet, and by-and-large she succeded. Call-me-Dave really needs to get his yaris in gear and follow in her footsteps with some pricipled and followed through decision making. History will judge right from wrong, as long as he actually does something.

It only took Bliar five years to undo her legacy, and a further seven to really make sure.  I suspect it will take an awful lot longer to rectify the current status quo

[Lizzie_Zoom]

I think this basically explains the picture (although there are a lot more than that)
 
   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government. They wanted to replace Britain's use of coal-fired power stations and industries with power derived from gas or nuclear sources. Also, Thatcher knew that the mining communities and the NUM were a very large left wing power-block who opposed her, and felt that if she could decimate them as an effective force, she would succesfully remove a potential threat to her continued leadership of the country. Thatcher brought in a Canadian buisnessman, Ian MacGregor, as her so-called 'economic advisor'. He was not a British citizen, had no understanding whatsoever of British economic history, and was certainly not impartial. Nonetheless, he oversaw a shoddy and biased 'survey' of the future economic viability of British mining, which predictably painted a bleak picture of it's ability to survive- one which was very far from the actual truth. This gave Thatcher the excuse that she needed to announce the programme of pit closures early in 1984. The sheer injustice of the situation prompted a furious response from the mining communities, and resulted in the NUM leader, Arthur Scargill, calling a nationwide miner's strike before the union membership had been balloted for strike action. This enabled the strike's critics to label it as technically illegal, although if a ballot HAD been run, the overwhelming vote would have been to strike anyway. There was particular hatred for Ian MacGregor, who had no buisness in being invited to a foreign country and serving as advisor to the Prime Minister when he wasn't even an elected British politician, and not accountable to the electorate."

Wow, that has to be the most biased and inaccurate account of the reality that I have ever seen.  If you need to use biased references instead of your own experience, perhaps this is a debate to avoid!

Yes Cem I think you have got this one very wrong and you had to be a Britain living in the 1970s to fully understand the whole situation.  Lifting someone else's statement on the internet just proves you do not understand this one Cem.

[jimac]

She did also order police on horseback to beat the living shite out of ordinary working men( miners) with truncheons who were striking to try and ensure their jobs

Really?  You have any proof of that?

I suppose you also think she ordered the police to open up the gates of Hillsborough so that a few working men (and women) could be crushed to death.

[Kevin Wood]

I think you have to respect Thatcher for being a leader who had her principles, and the determination to stick to them, come riots, criticism, bad headlines and, eventually, of course, the contrary opinion of the majority of her own party, which is what did for her. She certainly cared more for what she considered right for the country, than her own popularity. The opposite is true of most politicians now.

Such a leader is going to make enemies. I remember not being overly impressed when, as a student, I received the kick in the nads that was the poll tax bill. Others were hit much harder, although in the case of the miners it was worshipping that idiot Scargill, and allowing him to make political pawns out of them, that was their undoing. I notice no party has since contemplated reversing the changes she made to kerb the power of the unions back then.

But.. Look at the leaders we've had since, and find one example who hasn't blundered through office ducking and diving from one day's headlines to the next and tell me that a dose of her leadership qualities and backbone (not necessarily policies) aren't what we need to turn the current mess round. We have since had a string of spineless PR men, in the game only to feather their own beds.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Cem is more right than wrong. Thatcher gleefully destroyed the unions, she didn't do it with a heavy heart.

Scargill made it easy for her by being  out of touch with the wishes of his members, his actions made  both himself and his union appear militant, when for the main part it was made up of decent hard working men and women. Thatcher ( with Scargill's help) destroyed their lives, so it's unsurprising that such hatred for her still exists.

As for the trade unions, since when did they become the anti-christ. The unions were formed to protect the rights of the working man, and stop him from being exploited. Is there a problem with that?

Of course, some right wing Conservatives despise the unions.......and the minimum wage, and if they had their way we'd (not them) work sixteen hours a day, seven days a week for a loaf of bread.......which incidentally is very tasty now Mrs Opti has her new breadmaker.

[Nickbat]

She did also order police on horseback to beat the living shite out of ordinary working men( miners) with truncheons who were striking to try and ensure their jobs

Cobblers. Tactical policing is controlled by Area Commissioners. She would not stipulate how the police should enforce the law on a day-to-day basis.

I suppose that does not fit into the Thatcher-hating meme though, does it? 

[ozzycat]

I wonder what will happens when Arthur Scargill goes. Will I be criticised for having a celebratory street party ?

ill dance on his grave with pleasure he cost this country more money and jobs than maggie ever did hes a total commie and an arsehole

[cem_devecioglu]

I think this basically explains the picture (although there are a lot more than that)
 
   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government. They wanted to replace Britain's use of coal-fired power stations and industries with power derived from gas or nuclear sources. Also, Thatcher knew that the mining communities and the NUM were a very large left wing power-block who opposed her, and felt that if she could decimate them as an effective force, she would succesfully remove a potential threat to her continued leadership of the country. Thatcher brought in a Canadian buisnessman, Ian MacGregor, as her so-called 'economic advisor'. He was not a British citizen, had no understanding whatsoever of British economic history, and was certainly not impartial. Nonetheless, he oversaw a shoddy and biased 'survey' of the future economic viability of British mining, which predictably painted a bleak picture of it's ability to survive- one which was very far from the actual truth. This gave Thatcher the excuse that she needed to announce the programme of pit closures early in 1984. The sheer injustice of the situation prompted a furious response from the mining communities, and resulted in the NUM leader, Arthur Scargill, calling a nationwide miner's strike before the union membership had been balloted for strike action. This enabled the strike's critics to label it as technically illegal, although if a ballot HAD been run, the overwhelming vote would have been to strike anyway. There was particular hatred for Ian MacGregor, who had no buisness in being invited to a foreign country and serving as advisor to the Prime Minister when he wasn't even an elected British politician, and not accountable to the electorate."

Wow, that has to be the most biased and inaccurate account of the reality that I have ever seen.  If you need to use biased references instead of your own experience, perhaps this is a debate to avoid!

Yes Cem I think you have got this one very wrong and you had to be a Britain living in the 1970s to fully understand the whole situation.  Lifting someone else's statement on the internet just proves you do not understand this one Cem.

 
obvious things dont need further explanation or 1st hand experience Lizzie..  I have lots of ex-politicans here which behaves similiar to yours.. and if you want I can send you free
 

[Nickbat]

   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government.

Harold Wilson (LABOUR - SOCIALIST) closed 4 times as many mines as Margaret Thatcher - Thatcher closed 22 pits Wilson closed 93.

The announcement that led to the miners strike was the proposed closure of 20 mines out of the remaining 174 owned by the state and the loss of 20,000 jobs out of 187,000. Under a previous Labour Government there were 576 coal mines when they took office, and just 300 by the time they left in 1970. They closed 276 mines and 170,000 jobs were lost.

Methinks you need to be careful where you get your stories, Cem.

[cem_devecioglu]

   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government.

Harold Wilson (LABOUR - SOCIALIST) closed 4 times as many mines as Margaret Thatcher - Thatcher closed 22 pits Wilson closed 93.

The announcement that led to the miners strike was the proposed closure of 20 mines out of the remaining 174 owned by the state and the loss of 20,000 jobs out of 187,000. Under a previous Labour Government there were 576 coal mines when they took office, and just 300 by the time they left in 1970. They closed 276 mines and 170,000 jobs were lost.

Methinks you need to be careful where you get your stories, Cem.

I think you need to be careful who you call SOCIALIST.. anyone who is against workers rights , anyone who is defending the masters rights is never ever a socialist.. oh I forgot , we have different definitions about who is leftwing..oops

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government.

Harold Wilson (LABOUR - SOCIALIST) closed 4 times as many mines as Margaret Thatcher - Thatcher closed 22 pits Wilson closed 93.

The announcement that led to the miners strike was the proposed closure of 20 mines out of the remaining 174 owned by the state and the loss of 20,000 jobs out of 187,000. Under a previous Labour Government there were 576 coal mines when they took office, and just 300 by the time they left in 1970. They closed 276 mines and 170,000 jobs were lost.

Methinks you need to be careful where you get your stories, Cem.

To begin with. The thin end of the wedge methinks.

[cem_devecioglu]

   "The Miner's Strike of 1984 / '85 was caused by the massive pit closure programme introduced by Margaret Thatcher and her Tory government.

Harold Wilson (LABOUR - SOCIALIST) closed 4 times as many mines as Margaret Thatcher - Thatcher closed 22 pits Wilson closed 93.

The announcement that led to the miners strike was the proposed closure of 20 mines out of the remaining 174 owned by the state and the loss of 20,000 jobs out of 187,000. Under a previous Labour Government there were 576 coal mines when they took office, and just 300 by the time they left in 1970. They closed 276 mines and 170,000 jobs were lost.

Methinks you need to be careful where you get your stories, Cem.

I think you need to be careful who you call SOCIALIST.. anyone who is against workers rights , anyone who is defending the masters rights is never ever a socialist.. oh I forgot , we have different definitions about who is leftwing..oops

and must add, as I said million times , really I'm not sure your labour party is leftwing or not