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Author Topic: Israel Again.......!!  (Read 12007 times)

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cem_devecioglu

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #120 on: 01 June 2010, 13:02:47 »

nah.. result .. egypt is now opening the border for those aids.. ;D
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Sixstring

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #121 on: 01 June 2010, 13:06:46 »

Does that now mean the border from Egypt is open to allow aid into Gaza by land??

Oh dear, methinks the old egypt/israel argument is going to escalate again..........
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cem_devecioglu

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #122 on: 01 June 2010, 13:08:13 »

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Does that now mean the border from Egypt is open to allow aid into Gaza by land??

Oh dear, methinks the old egypt/israel argument is going to escalate again..........

yep..

this time there will be a difference.. we are definitely a side ..
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #123 on: 01 June 2010, 13:09:57 »

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nah.. result .. egypt is now opening the border for those aids.. ;D


That is good news Cem! 8-) 8-) ;)
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Sixstring

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #124 on: 01 June 2010, 13:11:59 »

Unfortunately, this was never really "settled" by either party.........I can see this ending up with fighting and further bloodshed. I hope not, but there is a history of this, and history does tend to repeat itself...........
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cem_devecioglu

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #125 on: 01 June 2010, 13:15:33 »

Quote
Unfortunately, this was never really "settled" by either party.........I can see this ending up with fighting and further bloodshed. I hope not, but there is a history of this, and history does tend to repeat itself...........

I'm afraid so..

but israel must understand that this nation now is keeping an angry eye on them..

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Sixstring

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #126 on: 01 June 2010, 13:19:08 »

Would you think that the Turkish government would ever take "decisive action" against Israel? after all, some of their nationals died in this latest incident.......?

To be honest, I would'nt blame them for being pro-active!
(but it would escalate then, and worse would happen, so maybe not)
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #127 on: 01 June 2010, 13:23:09 »

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Would you think that the Turkish government would ever take "decisive action" against Israel? after all, some of their nationals died in this latest incident.......?

To be honest, I would'nt blame them for being pro-active!
(but it would escalate then, and worse would happen, so maybe not)


The latest Israeli action has now put tremendous additional diplomatic strain on a violatile situation in a region of the world that is a tinder box.  The world powers, the UN, USA and the rest of the Security Council need to take firm action over this to stop it escalating beyond control.
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cem_devecioglu

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #128 on: 01 June 2010, 13:24:27 »

Quote
Would you think that the Turkish government would ever take "decisive action" against Israel? after all, some of their nationals died in this latest incident.......?

To be honest, I would'nt blame them for being pro-active!
(but it would escalate then, and worse would happen, so maybe not)

I dont expect in the short period.. but in case, a problem arises again, wont hesitate ..

because in international language, attacking a ship when there were many alternatives means humiliation.. that we cant permit..
« Last Edit: 01 June 2010, 13:26:41 by cem_devecioglu »
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #129 on: 01 June 2010, 13:33:12 »

For those interested, this is a long summary of the legal situation in respect of international law surrounding the Palestinians and Gaza written by an international lawyer mentioning Israeli ex-PM Sharon :

[size=24]"[/size]At the Brussels' Palace of Justice on March 6, 2002, Souad Srour El Meri, one of 28 Palestinians filing war crimes charges against Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon for the 1982 massacre of Sabra-Shatila, shows a photo of Arab children killed by Sharon's proxies. A Brussels appeals' court is considering putting Sharon on trial for war crimes he perpetrated in Lebanon.

The International Laws of Belligerent Occupation

Belligerent occupation is governed by The Hague Regulations of 1907, as well as by the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949, and the customary laws of belligerent occupation. Security Council Resolution 1322 (2000), paragraph 3 continued: "Calls upon Israel, the occupying Power, to abide scrupulously by its legal obligations and its responsibilities under the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in a Time of War of 12 August 1949;..." Again, the Security Council vote was 14 to 0, becoming obligatory international law.

The Fourth Geneva Convention applies to the West Bank, to the Gaza Strip, and to the entire City of Jerusalem, in order to protect the Palestinians living there. The Palestinian People living in this Palestinian Land are "protected persons" within the meaning of the Fourth Geneva Convention. All of their rights are sacred under international law.

There are 149 substantive articles of the Fourth Geneva Convention that protect the rights of every one of these Palestinians living in occupied Palestine. The Israeli Government is currently violating, and has since 1967 been violating, almost each and every one of these sacred rights of the Palestinian People recognized by the Fourth Geneva Convention. Indeed, violations of the Fourth Geneva Convention are war crimes.

So this is not a symmetrical situation. As matters of fact and of law, the gross and repeated violations of Palestinian rights by the Israeli army and Israeli settlers living illegally in occupied Palestine constitute war crimes. Conversely, the Palestinian people are defending themselves and their land and their homes against Israeli war crimes and Israeli war criminals, both military and civilian.

The U.N. Human Rights Commission

Indeed, it is far more serious than that. On 19 October 2000 a Special Session of the U.N. Commission on Human Rights adopted a Resolution set forth in U.N. Document E/CN.4/S-5/L.2/Rev. 1, "Condemning the provocative visit to Al-Haram Al-Sharif on 28 September 2000 by Ariel Sharon, the Likud party leader, which triggered the tragic events that followed in occupied East Jerusalem and the other occupied Palestinian territories, resulting in a high number of deaths and injuries among Palestinian civilians." The U.N. Human Rights Commission then said it was "[g]ravely concerned" about several different types of atrocities inflicted by Israel upon the Palestinian People, which it denominated "war crimes, flagrant violations of international humanitarian law and crimes against humanity."

In operative paragraph 1 of its 19 October 2000 Resolution, the U.N. Human Rights Commission then: "Strongly condemns the disproportionate and indiscriminate use of force in violation of international humanitarian law by the Israeli occupying Power against innocent and unarmed Palestinian civilians...including many children, in the occupied territories, which constitutes a war crime and a crime against humanity..." And in paragraph 5 of its 19 October 2000 Resolution, the U.N. Human Rights Commission:"Also affirms that the deliberate and systematic killing of civilians and children by the Israeli occupying authorities constitutes a flagrant and grave violation of the right to life and also constitutes a crime against humanity;..." Article 68 of the United Nations Charter had expressly required the U.N.'s Economic and Social Council to "set up" this Commission "for the promotion of human rights."

Israel's War Crimes against Palestinians

We all have a general idea of what a war crime is, so I am not going to elaborate upon that term here. But there are different degrees of heinousness for war crimes. In particular are the more serious war crimes denominated "grave breaches" of the Fourth Geneva Convention. Since the start of the Al Aqsa Intifada, the world has seen those inflicted every day by Israel against the Palestinian People living in occupied Palestine: e.g., willful killing of Palestinian civilians by the Israeli army and Israel's illegal paramilitary settlers. These Israeli "grave breaches" of the Fourth Geneva Convention mandate universal prosecution for their perpetrators, whether military or civilian, as well as prosecution for their commanders, whether military or civilian, including Israel's political leaders.

Israel's Crimes Against Humanity

I want to focus for a moment on Israel's "crime against humanity" against the Palestinian People -- as determined by the U.N. Human Rights Commission itself, set up pursuant to the requirements of the United Nations Charter. What is a "crime against humanity"? This concept goes all the way back to the Nuremberg Charter of 1945 for the trial of the major Nazi war criminals. And in the Nuremberg Charter of 1945, drafted by the United States Government, there was created and inserted a new type of international crime specifically intended to deal with the Nazi persecution of the Jewish People.

The paradigmatic example of a "crime against humanity" is what Hitler and the Nazis did to the Jewish People. This is where the concept of crime against humanity came from. And this is what the U.N. Human Rights Commission determined that Israel is currently doing to the Palestinian People: Crimes against humanity. Legally, just like what Hitler and the Nazis did to the Jews".

..c/
« Last Edit: 01 June 2010, 13:33:55 by Lizzie_Zoom »
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Lizzie_Zoom

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #130 on: 01 June 2010, 13:34:46 »

continued from previous post:

[size=24]"[/size]The Precursor to Genocide

Moreover, a crime against humanity is the direct historical and legal precursor to the international crime of genocide as defined by the 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide. The theory here was that what Hitler and the Nazis did to the Jewish People required a special international treaty that would codify and universalize the Nuremberg concept of "crime against humanity." And that treaty ultimately became the 1948 Genocide Convention.

In fairness, you will note that the U.N. Human Rights Commission did not go so far as to condemn Israel for committing genocide against the Palestinian People. But it has condemned Israel for committing crimes against humanity, which is the direct precursor to genocide. And I submit that if something is not done quite soon by the American people and the International Community to stop Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity (and) against the Palestinian people, it could very well degenerate into genocide, if Israel is not there already. And in this regard, Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon is what international lawyers call a genocidaire--one who has already committed genocide in the past.[size=24]"[/size]

Francis A. Boyle / Law Building / 504 E. Pennsylvania Ave. / Champaign, IL 61820 USA
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albitz

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #131 on: 01 June 2010, 13:37:29 »

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If armed Israeli commandos descended on me in the middle of the night, I'm not sure my first instinct would be to put the kettle on and invite them in...what with their usual "shoot first....deny all knowledge later" policy. So yes, they were attacked.....interesting that this flotilla of mercenaries, smugglers and terrorists didn't see fit to bring any guns along - maybe, just maybe they were delivering aid to Gaza?  :o

Why does everyone not see that?? ::) ::) ::) ;) ;)

Israel have a well oiled media spin machine that quickly suppresses all but their own version of events I suppose Liz  :-/
This is Israel attacking a European sovereign state in international waters....it doesn't matter if the flag the ship carried was a Union Jack or a Crescent Moon and Star (sorry Cem - I don't know the name of the Turkish flag) - surely we can't allow this atrocity to be swept under the carpet?  :o
My understandng is that the ship came from occupied  Northern Cyprus, which is not a sovereign state - european or otherwise. ::)

I feel a bit provocation here ;D
Not provocation at all Cem, just simple fact. ;)
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cem_devecioglu

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #132 on: 01 June 2010, 13:37:50 »

 :-?

Lizzie you are amazing :y :y :y :y :y
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Varche

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #133 on: 01 June 2010, 13:46:15 »

Why didn't the UN board the ship when it got to port and have inspectors look for weapons and bombs...?

Too busy debating the wording of resolutions once again. ;D ;D ;D

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albitz

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Re: Israel Again.......!!
« Reply #134 on: 01 June 2010, 13:53:50 »

What the idiotic anti jewish lawyer fails to recognise (or mention) in his long winded nonsensical rant is the fact that in a war against terrorists you are fighting cowards who wont put on a uniform and fight like a proper army. They mix and mingle among the general population in the knowledge that this will almost certainly result in some degree of damage to the innocents. They do this deliberately because they know that they can use it as an effective tool in the PR war which will be waged on their behalf by friendly media types and gullible people with no proper understanding of the issues involved. The problems experienced by the people of Gaza are the responsibilty of the terrorists in their midst, not the fault of he Israelis. ;)
« Last Edit: 01 June 2010, 13:55:29 by albitz »
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