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Author Topic: 3.2 still a little unhappy  (Read 17009 times)

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JamesV6CDX

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #120 on: 11 April 2011, 20:05:10 »
Quote
mail me the logs, ill host em

Email sent, thank you kindly :y
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Jimbob

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #121 on: 11 April 2011, 20:10:20 »
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Jimbob

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #122 on: 11 April 2011, 20:10:42 »
my dinners ready, ill read em in a bit, but here they are
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #123 on: 11 April 2011, 20:12:33 »
Quote
http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/james.csv

http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/noknock.csv

Just to clarify - james.csv is a spirited drive, with all sensors connected.

The other one, is a similar drive, with both knock sensors disconnected, just in case this helps troubleshoot in any way.

Genuine thanks to everyone helping me with this  :y
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Omegatoy

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #124 on: 11 April 2011, 21:03:13 »
Hmm, my initial thought was lazy lambda sensor , as often these will lose some of thier switching i,e top or lower end of the trim levels or voltage
 then i reread the whole thing and 0.3/0.4 on tickover sounds not good to me, would have thought it should be around 0.2/0.3? however i dont play with the v6 to often so i could be totally wrong here
think in the absense of anything else appearing to be wrong i would go back to basics, and do a complete service, i.e plugs filters oil etc then at least you know all is right there,
the fault appears to me also to be similar to tired plug leads, but i think the 3.2 is coilpack on the plugs?
not much help here im afraid just gving ideas that appeared to my mind to be something like the problem :-/
« Last Edit: 11 April 2011, 21:04:09 by Omegatoy »
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Entwood

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #125 on: 11 April 2011, 21:08:37 »
Quote
Quote
http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/james.csv

http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/noknock.csv

Just to clarify - james.csv is a spirited drive, with all sensors connected.

The other one, is a similar drive, with both knock sensors disconnected, just in case this helps troubleshoot in any way.

Genuine thanks to everyone helping me with this  :y


Stupid question... equally stupid thought ...  :(

knock sensors / ECU  ... in the "absence" of the knock sensor .. ie unplugged....  does the ECU "assume" knocking and retard the ignition as a safety feature ???

If it does ... then unplugging will make no difference, but would imply that the bank you are having problems with might well have a power supply problem ?? 

Sort of .. no power = assumed knocking ... if that makes sense ???

Probably a load of rubbish .. but worthy of a moments thought ???

Nah .. thought not .. :)
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CaptainZok

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #126 on: 11 April 2011, 21:21:19 »
Quote
Quote
Quote
http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/james.csv

http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/hosted_for_others/noknock.csv

Just to clarify - james.csv is a spirited drive, with all sensors connected.

The other one, is a similar drive, with both knock sensors disconnected, just in case this helps troubleshoot in any way.

Genuine thanks to everyone helping me with this  :y


Stupid question... equally stupid thought ...  :(

knock sensors / ECU  ... in the "absence" of the knock sensor .. ie unplugged....  does the ECU "assume" knocking and retard the ignition as a safety feature ???

If it does ... then unplugging will make no difference, but would imply that the bank you are having problems with might well have a power supply problem ?? 

Sort of .. no power = assumed knocking ... if that makes sense ???

Probably a load of rubbish .. but worthy of a moments thought ???

Nah .. thought not .. :)
It flicks between active and inactive with the sensors disconnected so it doesn't look like it Nige.

Download the file and it will open in excel then you can have a look yourself.
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Entwood

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #127 on: 11 April 2011, 21:26:46 »
Quote

<snip> ....

It flicks between active and inactive with the sensors disconnected so it doesn't look like it Nige.

Download the file and it will open in excel then you can have a look yourself.

Yeah I looked .. didn't understand a word of it !!!  :)
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Kevin Wood

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #128 on: 11 April 2011, 23:58:10 »
Those logs don't look to bad to me. :-/

Interestingly, when knock sensors are disconnected there is no output from knock sensors shown, but knock retard is going active just as it was with them present. I notice the MIL is on, so the ECU obviously noticed they were unplugged. :-/

A little output from the knock sensor on both banks, coincident with engine load, and mostly from bank 2 with them connected, but I've never seen this logged from a "healthy" vehicle (Tech 2 doesn't report it) :-[ Some output may be perfectly normal.

Maybe we're barking up the wrong tree here?

What else could be disturbed during a 'stat change?

Cam sensor? Might well put it into limp mode as it's essential fro proper knock control. Why no trouble code, though?

Crank sensor? It's original, judging by cable routing, so imminent failure to be expected. Might have been pulled about a bit during recent work perhaps? Why no trouble code, though?

Engine pulled smoothly enough so I would be surprised if there was a misfire.

MAF - output looks good from the live data. Can't find anything I'd regard as suspicious. Ditto the lambda sensors. Toggling away happily. Not excessive fuel trim.

Torque request from Autobox / TC looks OK, so guess that's not holding it back.

Has it been filled with weasel pee? ;D

Kevin
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feeutfo

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #129 on: 12 April 2011, 01:53:37 »
Are we getting into the realm of coincidental failures with this one...?

What would we check if the work had not been done? Blocked exhaust...? Pining usually decreases with rpm afaik(?) yet we seem to have the opposite, certainly worse performance by the sound of it..

Lob some octane booster in? Or injector cleaner, see if any effect...?  :-/

Although some juddering mentioned at higher rpm... Ignition? Water in 246? Windscreen seal loose on both my 3.2's btw. Misfires need to be quite bad before they throw a code ime.

Poor ks connection somewhere up to ecu. Or is it actually knocking, what causes knocking....etc etc.

More related stuff.
Is the vac pipe under the plenum connected at the regulator end?

Inlet wedge seals top and bottom giving air leak.
Re trace steps.... Again  :-/

Ok rambling now...  :-[  ;D

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feeutfo

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #130 on: 12 April 2011, 02:09:25 »
More ramblings...

Injector plug seated correctly?    Mmmm nah
Damage to injector loom  :-/
Fuel regulator working? (how do they work anyway?)
Crank sensor disturbed on the same bracket....   Mmmm probably not.
Trapped cam sensor wire

Fit your plenum on another 3.2.     (not mine ;D )




Re checked for codes I take it?    :-/
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #131 on: 12 April 2011, 13:58:26 »
Jimbob, would you be kind enough to connect your laptop up, look at "measuring blocks" and take it for a quick spin - noting whether "knock control" goes active under any throttle load?

Just wondering if "My Naff Code Reader" reports it, but Tech2 doesn't?  :-/ Worth comparing another 3.2 at any rate.

Kevin - when I was doing the knock sensor under the car - the crank sensor follows the revised route suggested by OOF, it's not the original path up behind the cooler pipes - so I'd suggest it's not that old?

Just reluctant to start changing things when we've not proved them to be faulty, EG introduce more unknowns  :-/

Re the exhaust, I cable-tied a rubber glove onto each of the outlets and fired it up - it burst them in no time  :D
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Jimbob

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #132 on: 12 April 2011, 13:58:56 »
There are a lot of 'invalid' for Throttle position, which Ive never seen before...

Wonder if its worth trying a different TPS  :-/
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Jimbob

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #133 on: 12 April 2011, 14:01:29 »
Yes, Ill take a spin in a bit and put the logs here for comparrison.
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: 3.2 still a little unhappy
« Reply #134 on: 12 April 2011, 14:07:55 »
You cna get odd results relating to the TPS when the buterflies and throttle body are not squeeky clean (clean the edge of the throttle discs to).

Are we certain that the coil packs are firing at max volts?
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